Storm Sorcerer Multiclass

[Avraks]

Hey! I'm completely new to the game (and forum), and have a couple of questions. I am about to start my first campaign, and have decided with my DM that I want to play a Stormborn Sorcerer. I see that many of the features of the Stormborn requires my character to be in close combat to be used effectively. Therefore I am considering to multiclass into something like Cleric or Warlock to get armor. I really don't want to do more than a two level dip, cause Wind Soul at Stormborn lvl. 18 seems very cool. Warlock only gives me light armor, but I hear Eldritch Blast can be really good for a Sorcerer? Cleric gives me medium armor, or even better, heavy armor if I choose Tempest Cleric, which seems to be the domain that synergizes best with Stormborn anyway, at least RP-wise...

If it matters, I think I rolled pretty well... My Half-Elf ends up with these atribs at first level:

Strength 11
Dexterity 14
Constitution 14
Intelligence 12
Wisdom 14
Charisma 20

At least that's how I've been planning to distribute my rolls...

Are any of these builds viable? Is Stormborn a decent origin? Do you suggest another Stormborn/X multiclass build?

Thanks for any help! :)

[ZanettonBR]

I just shared my opinion on another tread

Can I possibly gish-ify this character and get Booming Blade and Lightning Lure in there?
Ok,i'm actually working im something like this. Its supposed to be a mobile spellcaster which can adapt to enemy movement without suffering AoO. Its not so much a gish, but is a battle-ready almost-ninja sorcerer:

Tempest cleric 3 (Domain spells, proficiencies and Domain features that are awesome with lightning damage)
Elemental monk 3 ( Mobility,lots of it. And using water whip to pull enemies to AoEs is very fun.Gives you a lot of CC over the battlefield. Also, you have unarmored defense and you can punch like a truck if you dont have weapons available.)
Storm Sorcerer 13 (The reasons why i can make rain thunder, i like to take careful spell (i dont remember exactly the name of it in english,sorry) if i think i'll use a lot of AoEs, which i will btw)

Booming blade deals lightning, but it doesn't trigger AotS, because its a cantrip.
Lightning lure is also good,but it has not so much range, and if they are not pulled close enough, they dont take damage.Still kinda good for CC.

To put some warlock in my build,make consider trading monk for warlock and only getting 2 levels in tempest cleric.
Also,War caster is almost vital for this, but i bet you already know that.

Good luck on your build, let me know how it turns out :)

, the tread is also about the same subject,if don't find an answer there, hit me up.I'll try to help
PS: Its called Storm Sorcerer / Warlock - help with some mechanical decisions. (cant post links yet)
Good luck with your build :)

[Saryn]

Hey! I'm completely new to the game (and forum), and have a couple of questions. I am about to start my first campaign, and have decided with my DM that I want to play a Stormborn Sorcerer. I see that many of the features of the Stormborn requires my character to be in close combat to be used effectively. Therefore I am considering to multiclass into something like Cleric or Warlock to get armor. I really don't want to do more than a two level dip, cause Wind Soul at Stormborn lvl. 18 seems very cool. Warlock only gives me light armor, but I hear Eldritch Blast can be really good for a Sorcerer? Cleric gives me medium armor, or even better, heavy armor if I choose Tempest Cleric, which seems to be the domain that synergizes best with Stormborn anyway, at least RP-wise...

If it matters, I think I rolled pretty well... My Half-Elf ends up with these atribs at first level:

Strength 11
Dexterity 14
Constitution 14
Intelligence 12
Wisdom 14
Charisma 20

At least that's how I've been planning to distribute my rolls...

Are any of these builds viable? Is Stormborn a decent origin? Do you suggest another Stormborn/X multiclass build?

Thanks for any help! :)

Hey, I'm the guy that posted the thread the person above just referenced you to. I am looking to this exact idea, basically.

I decided to go with Sorcerer 1/Warlock 1, 2, 3/Sorcerer 2 - 17 (if I get that far) to get access to Pact of the Tome, which greatly increases your utility, I've learned. I'm not planning on getting to 18 with this character, as the sessions are monthly, and that would take a while.

If you're not planning on actually ever hitting the high teens in levels, the Warlock dip to 3 is "free" since you're sacrificing something you wouldn't have attained anyway. Talk with your DM about which levels he expects the party to spend the most time at, and optimize for that range.

Hope you have fun with this build! I am super excited about it.

[Avraks]

Thanks for the replies :)

I am not sure how long we will play, but it seems a pity to give up Stormborn's flight at level 18, which seems both very cool and useful. I was for a while considering doing so for Pact of the Tome when I thought I could also get Book of Ancient Secrets, but was then informed that while I get my first two invocations at level two, I don't get Pact of the Tome til level 3, so I would have to wait till level 5 to get more invocations in order to acquire Book of Ancient Secrets. This seems correct? Some extra cantrips seem nice anyway, but I suppose I already have seven, four from sorc., and three from warlock? I guess what I am really considering is a two level dip in either warlock or a class with better armour, unless you guys convince me otherwise.

It seems both Heart of the Storm and Storm's fury pretty much requires me to be in close combat, or nearly. We have a tank, so what I'm considering is standing behind him, being close enough to our enemies that I can use the Stormborn abilities, while hopefully not being targeted too much. Is this viable, and what is the best way to go about it? Warlock has several tempting features at the first two levels, but I only get light armor. Tempest Cleric gives me medium, or even heavy (not sure which would be best), and a shield, which I could utilize with War Caster, but the spells I get from the Tempest domain overlap completely with the ones I get from Stormborn. Also, I am unsure how Destructive Wrath works. If I cast chain lightning, would it enable me to maximize damage on all hit targets? Is this good, even though I could only do it once per long rest? How about Wrath of the Storm? It does not scale, so is it valuable even at higher levels, although I will only be able to use it twice a long rest?

Also, both Wrath of the Storm and Storm's fury require me to "be hit". Does this involve me taking damage, or does it only require that I am attacked?

Sorry about the wall of text, guys... This is all a little confusing to a newbie.

[Sir cryosin]

First off you will take a penalty to your movement speed if you try to wear plate armor without a strength of 15. The tempest cleric is a fun to play just it self.

[Saryn]

I was for a while considering doing so for Pact of the Tome when I thought I could also get Book of Ancient Secrets, but was then informed that while I get my first two invocations at level two, I don't get Pact of the Tome til level 3, so I would have to wait till level 5 to get more invocations in order to acquire Book of Ancient Secrets. This seems correct?

I was under the impression you could retrain invocations, and that upon taking Level 3, you could retrain one of your previous invocations to grab Book of Ancient Secrets, since it doesn't have a strict level prerequisite. It just has a "soft" level prereq due to needing Pact of the Tome.

Does anyone have clarification on this?

EDIT: Found it. PHB page 107.

"Additionally, when you gain a level in this class, you can choose one of the invocations you know and replace it with another invocation that you could learn at that level."

[Oramac]

Are any of these builds viable? Is Stormborn a decent origin? Do you suggest another Stormborn/X multiclass build?

Thanks for any help! :)

Once again, I'll recommend the Tempest Sorcerer (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?493427-Tempest-Sorcerer-Tank&p=20954743#post20954743) (which you've already thought about anyway).

With an 11 Str you can't use heavy armor (unless it's Mithral), but that doesn't really matter much. Even with half-plate and your 14 Dex you'll only be 1 AC behind full plate. Be sure to grab a shield too, but don't bother with a melee weapon unless you take War Caster. In my experience (currently 7th level) you don't need a melee weapon at all. I think I've used my dagger once in those 7 levels, and it was to cut a rope.

It's a very fun character to play. You really only need a few damage spells. Everything else can be control/buffing. Also remember you can take a few Cleric spells too. I like picking up Bless and Healing Word (the latter can be Twinned as well).

Your domain spells from Tempest are in addition to all your other spells, so you basically get a couple free spells, which is awesome since a sorcerer doesn't know as many spells as a wizard.

Destructive Wrath is effing awesome. Yes, it would maximize a Lightning Bolt against ALL targets hit, though they can still make their save for half damage. One trick I really love that takes a bit of setup but pays off massively is to use Hold Person/Monster for auto-crits. The key here is that the paralyzed condition makes ALL attacks made in melee range an auto-crit, not just melee attacks. And you get advantage to offset the disadvantage from using a spell in melee, so all you have to do is hit the target and you can do a max damage crit with an upcast Chromatic Orb. I've literally one-shot the big bad guy using this method. Fair warning: your DM will be pissed. :D

[Avraks]

Ahh, thanks, Saryn. I see you are right :)

That looks really cool, Oramac! Is your endurance in close combat good enough to utilize the Stormborn features to good effect?

How do you guys think the build Oramac describes measures up against a 17 Storm Sorc/3 Warlock? I do hate to let that flight at level 18 go, but tons of rituals and eldritch wielding sorcerer might be worth it...? Both builds seem awesome thematically!

[Oramac]

That looks really cool, Oramac! Is your endurance in close combat good enough to utilize the Stormborn features to good effect?

It's pretty good, yes. You're going to have low HP no matter what you do if you're taking the majority of your levels in a full caster, which is why I focused on good AC and saving throws.

The real kicker is mobility. Using Tempestuous Magic to your fullest advantage pays off bigtime. Basically just keeping mind that it works in 3 dimensions, and can be used before or after the spell is cast.

Also keep an accurate list of the spells you can Twin. There's some really good ones in there. Haste and Greater Invisibility come to mind.

[Avraks]

Awesome! Do you know if Storm's Fury triggers every time you are attacked, or only when you are hurt?

[Oramac]

Awesome! Do you know if Storm's Fury triggers every time you are attacked, or only when you are hurt?

Only when you're hit by an attack. Depending on the tactical situation, it might be better to use Wrath of the Storm from the Tempest Cleric since it's more damage. That said, the pushback from Storm's Fury could be awesome if you can push a guy off a cliff or something.

[Avraks]

Hmm... Yeah. It's a pity that Wrath of the Storm and Storm's fury overlap. At least one seems to be good at early levels, while the other is good at late levels.

What if I decide to go Warlock? Is it better to go level two and retain flight at level 18, and gain known spells faster, or is it better to go warlock three, gain rituals but give up flight and learn spells slower?

[Oramac]

Honestly, I don't know **** about warlocks. Sorry. :(

Just on the face of it, I'd probably go Warlock 3 for the ritual casting. But take that with a massive grain of salt.

[Avraks]

Alright, thanks a lot for all the help, Oramac! Tough decision!

What do you say, Saryn? You clearly ended up deciding on three warlock levels, but did so disregarding higher levels. What would your choice be if your campaign would continue to level 20?

[Saryn]

The real kicker is mobility. Using Tempestuous Magic to your fullest advantage pays off bigtime. Basically just keeping mind that it works in 3 dimensions, and can be used before or after the spell is cast.

So you can use Tempestous Magic to move straight up?

Since it says "whirling gusts of air briefly surround you" (emphasis mine), I assumed that you couldn't just fly straight up and hover there for a round.


Here is the text from SCAG, for reference:

"TEMPESTUOUS MAGIC

Starting at 1st level, you can use a bonus action on your turn to cause whirling gusts of elemental air to briefly surround you, immediately before or after you cast a spell of 1st level or higher. Doing so allows you to fly up to 10 feet without provoking opportunity attacks."



What do you say, Saryn? You clearly ended up deciding on three warlock levels, but did so disregarding higher levels. What would your choice be if your campaign would continue to level 20?

I think I would still take the Warlock Levels. If you get to Warlock level three and grab Pact of the Tome, you can pick up Shillelagh. The combination of Shillelagh and Booming Blade sounds so sweet to me that I couldn't resist. You can gain the ability to fly with a spell, so I don't think I would be losing out on too much.

If you were to get some decent armor, you could theoretically wade into melee range (or more likely, be somewhat proficient if you get caught in melee combat).

[Oramac]

So you can use Tempestous Magic to move straight up?

Since it says "whirling gusts of air briefly surround you" (emphasis mine), I assumed that you couldn't just fly straight up and hover there for a round.


Here is the text from SCAG, for reference:

"TEMPESTUOUS MAGIC

Starting at 1st level, you can use a bonus action on your turn to cause whirling gusts of elemental air to briefly surround you, immediately before or after you cast a spell of 1st level or higher. Doing so allows you to fly up to 10 feet without provoking opportunity attacks."

It never says you can't move vertically, just that you can only move 10 feet. I've used it to hop up staircases mid-combat or to jump 10 feet up/down a cliff to make a bad guy chase me. It's not always super useful, but when it works it's glorious.

[Saryn]

It never says you can't move vertically, just that you can only move 10 feet. I've used it to hop up staircases mid-combat or to jump 10 feet up/down a cliff to make a bad guy chase me. It's not always super useful, but when it works it's glorious.

Oh, ok. So you're not hovering, you're "jumping" for lack of a better term. Sounds cool. I will have to keep that in mind.

[Falcon X]

I have played a Tempest Cleric1/Storm SorcerX to great effect and would recommend it. The armor goes a long way.

[Draco4472]

I asked a similar question semi-related which led to discssions on optimization. It may help, may not, but here's the link to the thread:

http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?498241-How-important-is-AC-for-a-spellcaster

I hope it helps somewhat.

[Oramac]

Oh, ok. So you're not hovering, you're "jumping" for lack of a better term. Sounds cool. I will have to keep that in mind.

Ahh. Yes, I suppose that is an important distinction. You can't hover, though going up and down 10 feet every turn could be entertaining. haha.

[Avraks]

Thanks, guys!

Can I use Tempestuous Magic to get out of close combat before I cast the spell that triggers it? I saw someone talking about that, somewhere...

[Oramac]

Thanks, guys!

Can I use Tempestuous Magic to get out of close combat before I cast the spell that triggers it? I saw someone talking about that, somewhere...

Absolutely. The text specifically says you can use it before or after casting your spell. The only caveat is that you can't use it with cantrips. It must be a spell of 1st level or higher.

[Avraks]

Oh? That's great news :) I must have a dated source...I would link to it, but don't have enough posts to do that yet.
Which do you use?

[Oramac]

Oh? That's great news :) I must have a dated source...I would link to it, but don't have enough posts to do that yet.
Which do you use?

At work I use this link (http://imgur.com/a/KCOSD), but I did buy the SCAG so during a game I just pull out the book.

[ES Curse]

In addition to the stuff suggested here:
-Paladin 2/Storm Sorc X (I AM THOR)
-Swashbuckler Rouge 3/Storm Sorc X for an effective seafarer, Booming Blade + reaction denial is a great escape

[Avraks]

Great, thanks!

Did the Stormborn loose his bonus spells in SCAG?

[Draco4472]

Did the Stormborn loose his bonus spells in SCAG?

Yes. It was found to be unbalanced as none of the other Sorcerer archetypes had bonus spells, and the sorcerer is a class that has more versatility as a spellcaster at the cost of fewer spells they can know.

[Limited Gish]

Personally I love the Storm Sorcerer 6/Tempest Cleric X. Armor up, wade into the fight, and booming blade and shocking Grasps for funsies. Quicken and Twin were my metamagic choices. Booming Blade, quicken Maximized Lightning Bolt out of the highest slot available. Fun times.

[Avraks]

If you get to Warlock level three and grab Pact of the Tome, you can pick up Shillelagh.

Saryn, why do you like the idea of shillelagh and booming blade so much? Shillelagh will add your wisdom modifier, not charisma? Won't an eldritch blast do more damage? You can get out of close combat with tempestous magic?

[Biggstick]

The key here is that the paralyzed condition makes ALL attacks made in melee range an auto-crit, not just melee attacks. And you get advantage to offset the disadvantage from using a spell in melee, so all you have to do is hit the target and you can do a max damage crit with an upcast Chromatic Orb. I've literally one-shot the big bad guy using this method. Fair warning: your DM will be pissed. :D

You're actually making that Chromatic Orb attack with advantage instead of disadvantage and advantage cancelling each other out. Here is text from the book supporting it.

From the PHB, page 195

Ranged attacks in Close combat: When you make a ranged attack with a weapon, a spell, or some other means, you have disadvantage on the attack roll if you are within 5' of a hostile creature who can see you and who isn't incapacitated.
Both the Hold Person and Hold Monster spell cause the target to be paralyzed. Here is a listing from the book as to what the paralyzed condition entails.

From the PHB, page 291
-A paralyzed creature is incapacitated (see condition) and can't move or speak.
-The creature automatically fails Str and Dex saving throws
-Attack rolls against the creature have advantage
-Any attack that hits the creature is a critical hit if the attack is within 5' of the creature.
Since the paralyzed condition also incapacitates the enemy, you don't suffer the disadvantage from using a ranged spell or weapon attack if you're within 5' of it. Since you gain advantage on the attack roll from the paralyzed condition and being within 5' of the target, you're making the ranged attack roll for Chromatic Orb with advantage. If you hit, you're guaranteed to critical.



For the OP, go with 2-3 levels of Tempest Cleric. Sit on the Medium armor (it's only 1 AC lower then heavy, and you're 4 Str away from using Plate) and enjoy your nice little Armor boost, Bless, twinned Cleric spells, and of course that sweet sweet Channel Divinity.





Edit: For anyone that might bring up the incapacitated and not being seen portion of the ranged attacks in close combat, I'd say that I'm attacking the enemy from a side which they can't see me. Very few creatures are going to be able to see 360 degrees around themselves.

[Specter]

Tempest. Half-Plate and a shield give you an AC of 17, and the bonus spells really help Sorcs, who learn very few.

[Oramac]

snip

Since the paralyzed condition also incapacitates the enemy, you don't suffer the disadvantage from using a ranged spell or weapon attack if you're within 5' of it. Since you gain advantage on the attack roll from the paralyzed condition and being within 5' of the target, you're making the ranged attack roll for Chromatic Orb with advantage. If you hit, you're guaranteed to critical.

Holy crap! Good catch! I'd missed that little gem.


Tempest. Half-Plate and a shield give you an AC of 17, and the bonus spells really help Sorcs, who learn very few.

Half-plate and a shield will actually give you AC 19 assuming you have a 14 Dex (which you absolutely should).

[Specter]

Half-plate and a shield will actually give you AC 19 assuming you have a 14 Dex (which you absolutely should).

Oh yeah, even better.

[Avraks]

Thanks for all the good information! Trying to soak it all up :) Difficult decisions!