Idea for testing characters against one another (critiques welcome)

[dascarletm]

I have an idea for a scenario that can be used to practically test characters against one another. (I understand the weakness of this exercise in general, but let's all ignore that for now. I understand DnD is a team game meant to be played cooperatively, however this is more for fun than anything else).


The M Test

Scenario
There is an important artifact on a private demiplane. Due to extraneous circumstances it can only be accessed by entering various points throughout the multiverse. Your characters both happen to be searching for this artifact because reasons. To use it you must perform a ritual that requires an uninterrupted 20 hours to complete. Anyone can do this ritual, and only requires you being within 10 ft. of the object. Both characters start having simultaneously entered one of the portals starting at adjacent edges of the demiplane. Outside the demiplane assume anything reasonable exists, but nothing that would require the character to have played in game.

The Artifact
The artifact for all intents and purposes is immovable, unique, and indestructible.

The Demiplane
Size ranges between 60ft. radius to 120ft. radius. Terrain is determined by the host in secret. The entrances of the plane disappear and reappear every 48 hours. Your characters discovered the entrance 30 hours before opening, and they know how long they have to prepare. The entrances are protected by an effect similar to non-detection/veil. They are likewise only visible to the player that discovered it. Assume a sizable town is within 5 miles of the entrance. Each player's entrance is between 10-100 miles apart on the material plane.

The Multiverse
(Lovingly stolen from ExLibrisMortis)
The entire multiverse only began to exist at the 30 hours before your entrance point, and unless otherwise specified it is set in The Great Wheel. Upon the world existing the characters have whatever spells/etc. prepared that they wish, but not cast.


Victory
The victory condition of this scenario is to activate the artifact.

Additional note: the artifact is known by and sought by many, but only you two happen to have found entrances. The contestants may prepare what their characters would
I know this is not the best structured but I'm throwing it up as a rough idea.

Query: I'm unsure if the game should start at them entering the demiplane simultaneously or the round their entrances open.

[ExLibrisMortis]

I will repost what I put up on the Mackarel thread.

What is the scenario for this 'countering' that the Mackarel is supposed to be doing? Let's set some arena conditions, because this is going nowhere.

Logically, the only person who could set up such a match is Vecna. So that's exactly what we'll be doing: Vecna, the god of secrets, wants his blooded followers to duke it out, so he gets them together pairwise in an arena.

Obvious requirements:
0) If you are unable to cast spells for an indefinite amount of time, you lose.
1) You can't leave the arena during the fight. If you do, you lose.
2) You can't hide the fact that you exist somewhere within the arena. Whatever you do, Vecna will stop that secret from existing.
3) You can't cast spells that would affect things across the boundaries of the arena. That means love's pain and teleport through time to stop a birth are out, I'm afraid.
4) Just to be totally thorough, the whole fight takes zero time and doesn't affect the rest of the multiverse, so you can feel free to wait a billion years, if that's what it takes to win. Your family will still be there, as will your pet dog and your bonsai project. No need to drag anything into this but raw mage-killing capacity.
5) If you lose, Vecna will inform the winner, and end the fight without further delay.

- The arena consists of a small-scale model of the whole Great Wheel. That means all spells that use other planes are fully functional.
- The arena contains no epic spellcasting.
- The arena contains no specific beings, items or places (no relatives/acquaintances of X, no named beings, no specific artifacts, no specific cities), but otherwise examples of every monster, magic item and location (e.g. human towns, dwarf cities, Otyugh holes). You can gate in a wasp swarm or two, but not Asmodeus, and you can buy a power stone or two, but not the Annulus.
- As an exception to the above, there are analogues of all deities, powerful genies and anything else you might want to contact with contact other plane, commune etc., but they're all Vecna. Vecna is an amazing roleplayer and acts - within his arena - exactly as the beings he's emulating would.
- As far as the beings in the arena are concerned, it's the multiverse. You can't, no matter what, convince anyone otherwise.
- The arena comes into existence a year before both fighters are inserted. Time travel within the arena is possible and allowed, but you can't travel further back than the creation of the arena, or further into the future than one year beyond the time that's been reached 'naturally'.

The fighters will be inserted into the arena on random, but always different planes. If you can't handle being inserted into a random plane, you need not apply for the challenge.


Anything to add to this? Corrections, suggestions, expansions, candidates? I will definitely not be DMing this myself, but someone can be found, I'm sure.
I think this makes for a good setting to surround your private demiplane with. Your objective is better than mine (which focused on disabling the enemy caster), because it provides a 'drive forward' that is not dependant on your opponent's hiding skill.

Although these rules are only required for comparing very high-OP builds, as the base assumptions (Vecna-blooded, time travel) show. Doing a ranger versus paladin cagefight won't be as tricky.

[dascarletm]

I will repost what I put up on the Mackarel thread.

I think this makes for a good setting to surround your private demiplane with. Your objective is better than mine (which focused on disabling the enemy caster), because it provides a 'drive forward' that is not dependant on your opponent's hiding skill.

Although these rules are only required for comparing very high-OP builds, as the base assumptions (Vecna-blooded, time travel) show. Doing a ranger versus paladin cagefight won't be as tricky.

I actually based this from your post mostly. I will probably get around to actually integrating your ideas into the premise.

[One Step Two]

I will repost what I put up on the Mackarel thread.

I think this makes for a good setting to surround your private demiplane with. Your objective is better than mine (which focused on disabling the enemy caster), because it provides a 'drive forward' that is not dependant on your opponent's hiding skill.

Although these rules are only required for comparing very high-OP builds, as the base assumptions (Vecna-blooded, time travel) show. Doing a ranger versus paladin cagefight won't be as tricky.

Oh, I missed my chance to say this earlier, but I actually really like this concept of an Arena you made. The fact that it allows for the great wheel, and more than a 240ft by 120ft arena to duel in.

I look forward to seeing how this develops dascarletm!

[ExLibrisMortis]

I actually based this from your post mostly. I will probably get around to actually integrating your ideas into the premise.
Great :smallsmile:.


Oh, I missed my chance to say this earlier, but I actually really like this concept of an Arena you made. The fact that it allows for the great wheel, and more than a 240ft by 120ft arena to duel in.
Thanks, I hope something useful comes of it, because pretty much every high-OP duel I read about is fought theoretically, in general terms. Proposing the arena was never a very likely strategy for getting the Mackarel thread on track, but even ragevillain agreed to the rules, which I consider a great achievement :smalltongue:.


I look forward to seeing how this develops dascarletm!
Me too!

[dascarletm]

Added some additional notes. Do you guys have any ideas or have you noticed anything that I've missed. The purpose is to provide a fairly even playing field that negates most methods of wining by non-fighting. That is, things like going back in time and killing you before you were born.

[ExLibrisMortis]

Added some additional notes. Do you guys have any ideas or have you noticed anything that I've missed. The purpose is to provide a fairly even playing field that negates most methods of wining by non-fighting. That is, things like going back in time and killing you before you were born.
The thirty-hour time travel limit is nice. It means you can time travel to activate the artifact before your opponent even enters the arena, but not much more than that. I mean, time travel deserves to be an instant win, because it's game-breaking, but at the same time, you don't want to have too many points in time you can visit. With a 30 hour limit, you can teleport to t minus 15 hours, and you'll always interrupt the ritual, if there is one.

One important restriction that you haven't explicitly included (but you referenced my post, so that may count), is the 'no unique beings/items/places' rule, which is what stops your opponent from targeting family members (unless said family members happen to be deities or other divination-granting entities, in which case, that's on you).