Monk Unarmed Damage using actual weapons

[Yogibear41]

Is their anyway for a high level monk who is not fighting unarmed to gain the benefit of his unarmed strike damage when using an actual weapon?

For example say I am a 20th level monk so my unarmed strike deals 2d10 base damage, but the character in question wants to use a quarterstaff or other melee weapon, is there a way to make the quarterstaff do 2d10 damage like the unarmed strike does?

[Stewzors]

Pretty sure Monk's using monk melee weapons use their unarmed dmg by default if it's higher?

[Gruftzwerg]

Pretty sure Monk's using monk melee weapons use their unarmed dmg by default if it's higher?

pretty sure that is not 3.5 by default. maybe PF?

[Necroticplague]

There's a specific magic weapon that has this as an enchantment. Scorpion Kama.

[Stewzors]

pretty sure that is not 3.5 by default. maybe PF?

My bad, just double checked - confusing dmg with flurry.

[Eladrinblade]

gain the benefit of his unarmed strike damage when using an actual weapon?


This is true with gauntlets; you just can't flurry.

[Darrin]

There's a specific magic weapon that has this as an enchantment. Scorpion Kama.

Dragonfang Gauntlets (8610 GP, MIC) can do this as well.


This is true with gauntlets; you just can't flurry.

The Unorthodox Flurry feat (Dragon Compendium) can fix this for the gauntlets, Dragonfang or otherwise.

[MisterKaws]

Dip Drunken Master.

[illyahr]

Brass Knuckles from d20 Modern. They also got ported to Pathfinder.


Brass Knuckles: These pieces of molded metal fit over the outside of a character’s fingers and allow him or her to deal lethal damage with an unarmed strike instead of nonlethal damage.
A strike with brass knuckles is otherwise considered an unarmed attack.
When used by a character with the Brawl feat, brass knuckles increase the base damage dealt by an unarmed strike by +1 and turn the damage into lethal damage.


Brass Knuckles

These close combat weapons are designed to fit comfortably around the knuckles, narrowing the contact area and therefore magnifying the amount of force delivered by a punch

Benefit: Brass knuckles allow you to deal lethal damage.

Drawback: You may hold, but not wield, a weapon or other object in a hand wearing brass knuckles. You may cast a spell with a somatic component while wearing brass knuckles if you make a concentration check (DC 10 + the level of the spell you’re casting).

Note: Monks are proficient with brass knuckles.

[Psyren]

Pathfinder also has Ascetic Strike (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/feats/combat-feats/ascetic-strike-combat) and Monastic Legacy (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/feats/combat-feats/monastic-legacy-combat).

[Âmesang]

I would at least like to see this with quarterstaves for a Sun Wukong-type build.

[CharonsHelper]

Brass Knuckles from d20 Modern. They also got ported to Pathfinder.

There is a Pathfinder FAQ which says specifically that Brass Knuckles don't get increased monk unarmed damage.

[Psyren]

There is a Pathfinder FAQ which says specifically that Brass Knuckles don't get increased monk unarmed damage.

This is correct - you need the feats I listed (or a different method e.g. Brawler) to overcome this.


I would at least like to see this with quarterstaves for a Sun Wukong-type build.

Unchained Monk can not only get the damage bonus (again, via the feats I listed), but will also get the full 1.5x Str bonus while flurrying and 3:1 ratio with their (full-BAB) Power Attack too. All while getting 7 attacks before haste and style strikes.

[Requiem_Jeer]

But yeah, the usual way is to use a Scorpion Kama and then move it's enchantment onto some other monk weapon, either through custom magic item rules or a magic item of weapon shift.

[illyahr]

There is a Pathfinder FAQ which says specifically that Brass Knuckles don't get increased monk unarmed damage.

Why? Why make a note that the weapon allows you to deal lethal damage with your unarmed strike if you weren't actually using your unarmed strike? :smallconfused:

To me, either you are using your unarmed strike and the weapon allows you to deal lethal damage or you are using the weapon, which deals lethal damage. If the second one is the case, why make a note of the difference?

Oh well. I'm not one of the developers.

[MaxiDuRaritry]

There's a specific magic weapon that has this as an enchantment. Scorpion Kama.Weapons are objects, which are immune to [mind-affecting] effects, and thus, enchantment spells don't affect them.

But seriously, you should be able to lift the scorpion weapon property off of the kama and add it to another weapon, or you could add morphing and sizing to the kama to turn it into halfway decent weapon, instead.

[ShurikVch]

Also, Ward Cestus from Arms and Equipment Guide (it's Exotic Weapon, but still...)

[CharonsHelper]

Why? Why make a note that the weapon allows you to deal lethal damage with your unarmed strike if you weren't actually using your unarmed strike? :smallconfused:

To me, either you are using your unarmed strike and the weapon allows you to deal lethal damage or you are using the weapon, which deals lethal damage. If the second one is the case, why make a note of the difference?

Oh well. I'm not one of the developers.

Its still potentially useful for someone who isn't a monk. (Monks already can deal lethal damage unarmed anyway.)

I'm guessing it was so that it didn't invalidate the Amulet of Mighty Fists since it costs 1/2 as much to enchant a weapon as the amulet and doesn't use up your neck slot.

Though of note - you can do the Allying weapon trick as a monk to eventually save gold on enchantments. (Wield an Allying weapon which, as your own ally, you have it buff your own fist or foot each round. Use the Allying weapon for pure enchantment and the AoMF for specials such as Agile/Flaming/etc. Though some GMs may make you waste an iterative with the weapon to count as 'wielding' it due to the Defending weapon FAQ, though it doesn't apply directly.)

[Psyren]

Huh, I wasn't aware of that Allying trick. *scribbles*

[MaxiDuRaritry]

Huh, I wasn't aware of that Allying trick. *scribbles*Doesn't work on non-enhancement bonuses, though. Want to add collision to your headbutts? Well too bad!

[Psyren]

Doesn't work on non-enhancement bonuses, though. Want to add collision to your headbutts? Well too bad!

Indeed but you can always still wear the AoMF for those - especially since it doesn't need a +1 minimum to hold them :smallsmile:

[Thurbane]

But yeah, the usual way is to use a Scorpion Kama and then move it's enchantment onto some other monk weapon, either through custom magic item rules or a magic item of weapon shift.

Is Weapon Shift a PF thing? I've been searching all over 3.5 to find a way to move enchantments and properties from one weapon to another, so if it's not PF specific, colour me interested!

[Psyren]

Is Weapon Shift a PF thing? I've been searching all over 3.5 to find a way to move enchantments and properties from one weapon to another, so if it's not PF specific, colour me interested!

It looks like a 3.5 spell - SpC pg. 237

[CharonsHelper]

Huh, I wasn't aware of that Allying trick. *scribbles*

As far as I know I came up with it a couple years ago. Though, I likely wasn't the first in the entire world to think of it.

Also of note - if your GM is one who will make you burn an iterative on it, you can have your Allying weapon be a Body-wrap of Mighty Strikes (in Pathfinder) since it already applies to unarmed attacks (though it's more expensive than a weapon and precludes wearing a Monk's Robe, so you might be better off wasting the iterative and getting Pummeling Charge so that you can use Allying when you move).

[Requiem_Jeer]

Is Weapon Shift a PF thing? I've been searching all over 3.5 to find a way to move enchantments and properties from one weapon to another, so if it's not PF specific, colour me interested!

Psyren has the right of it. It's a spell, and if you could get it from a wand or schema, it could be a way.

Less moving enchantments and more shapeshifting the kama into a not-kama.

[Yogibear41]

Other than crit ranged, if the kama is doing the unarmed strike damage and not its normal damage why shift it to something else? If you flurry of blows it you only get your strength bonus not 1.5x even if you using a 2 hander or a 1 hander two handed anyway right?

[Necroticplague]

Other than crit ranged, if the kama is doing the unarmed strike damage and not its normal damage why shift it to something else? If you flurry of blows it you only get your strength bonus not 1.5x even if you using a 2 hander or a 1 hander two handed anyway right?

Correct to the second part.

To the first: obviously, there's the crit and crit range, which you already mentioned.
2nd, weapons may have other useful properties. One of the ones I can think of off the top of my head is reach. Daggers are easy to hide on your person.
3rd, taking advantage of properties of handedness. Two-handed weapons are better when it comes to sundering and disarming, or resisting such.

[Thurbane]

It looks like a 3.5 spell - SpC pg. 237

Thank you.

Reading the spell, short duration and quite limited in it's scope. Not exactly what I was looking, but good to know nonetheless.