Making Werewolves more Dangerous/Interesting

[Dr. Cliché]

One thing that always saddens be about D&D is that the werewolves (regardless of edition) are just so... feeble.

Does anyone have any suggestions for making them more dangerous/threatening (or any variant werewolves they'd care to share)?

If possible, I'd prefer solutions that are more than just 'buff attack and damage'. :smalltongue:

[clash]

Start with a vampire and change it appropriately. It should give the right feel for an "Underworld" movie type werewolf.

[TurboGhast]

Increase their speed a lot, to make escaping from them or battling from a distance harder.

Let them call other wolves to their aid that take a different number of turns to arrive each time the ability's used, to both shore up the action economy and add uncertain factors to the fight.

[Fflewddur Fflam]

Ways to make the 5e Werewolf tougher:
1) a much higher AC, AC 11 or 12 is just pathetic
2) higher damage output
3) REGENERATION! That's supposed to be one of the hallmarks of werewolves. These guys should be regenerating 2d8 hp or something at the beginning of their turns.

[Alerad]

http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?486598-The-Cursed-Werewolf-(CR5-Monstrosity)

Try this - the Cursed Werewolf. A combination of dire wolf and a werewolf who is better at hunting alone.

[Dr. Cliché]

3) REGENERATION! That's supposed to be one of the hallmarks of werewolves. These guys should be regenerating 2d8 hp or something at the beginning of their turns.

Glad I'm not the only one who thinks this.

[MrStabby]

Yeah, CR just doesnt strike terror into players for much of the game.

I like the regeneration idea, although you may need some extra HP to make it work well.

I would add to the claw attacks a Con save - if failed the wounds continue to bleed at the start of each turn (further D6 damage) until the player receives healing or a save is made at end of turn.

Give them the rogues cunning action. HP regeneration + Hit and run tactics can make these guys much harder.

You can adjust their combat tactics. Give them athletics skill and let them drag away their enemies. This lets you make environmental features more interesting as you can force players to interact with them.

Finally add blindsight to them - representing their ability to perfectly sense an area through smell.

These abilities should also go alongside some general buffs - +2 Str and +1 to proficiency will just make them hit enough more often to be a threat to less armoured party members.

[Gastronomie]

-Snip-All these are good ideas, especially the part about dragging around people and the environemntal features (those sorts of things are what makes combat most interesting), but to make them feel "threatening", the key is the narration of the DM IMO.

"Your blade cuts through flesh and bone, chopping off the right arm of the beast... but just as quickly, veins and tissue and muscle bulge out from the stump, twisting and churning out, knitting tightly with themselves, and within seconds the arm has already regrown..." is better than "the Werewolf regains 10 HP at the start of each of his turns".

You could also play around with "bleeding damage" and stuff like that.

[JellyPooga]

The problem with werewolves (and lycanthropes in general) is that they're actually quite a well designed monster for a non-fantasy game (at least in 5ed). Straight up immunity to non-magical, non-silvered weapon damage is downright terrifying in a game where Wizards aren't throwing around Firebolts and every level 3 Fighter has a magic sword. In your average D&D game, though? That immunity might as well not exist, leaving you with just another bag of HP and +4/1d8+2 attacks.

Solution? Well, that depends on what you consider the most important/terrifying aspect of werewolves. Is it their resistance to damage/regeneration? Is it their speed and strength? Is it their infectious bite? Is it their animal cunning? Is it something else?

For a quick-fix solution, I'd simply make them immune to all damage except silver and gross physical dismemberment. Magic Sword? Does nothing. Firebolt cantrip? Diddly squat. Disintegrate? Mmmmaybe*. Silver letter opener? Now we're talking. When you literally can't hurt something, defeating it involves more than just another hack'n'slash encounter; it becomes about capture or escape, luring it into a trap or breaking the curse.

A werewolf isn't supposed to be just another monster to kill; it's as much a moral dilemma and a social intrigue as it is (supposed to be) a hard fight. Use those scenario aspects to enhance your werewolf encounters. Sure you can tack on all the bells and whistles, with additional abilities and such, but the important thing is to put them in their place; as the killer you can't identify, the mass-murderer who doesn't even know he's doing it (or maybe he does...), or as the foe you can't just kill when he hulks out, not only because he's all but impervious to harm, but because he's the son of the guy who hired you to solve the problem in the first place.

Werewolves might be lacklustre on paper, but it's the scenario you put them in that makes them special. Time spent developing those scenarios is time well spent compared to time wasted tacking on what is essentially just bigger numbers.

Just my opinion.

*(does no HP damage, but if your damage roll is equal to current HP, still get disintegrated)

[Hopeless]

You could always just rule only silver can actually kill them so you could fireball them to ash but they'll still regenerate it just takes longer...

I'd say they can assume their werewolf form if their regeneration talents comes into use when not under the influence of a full moon so they suffer brief amnesia so have no idea they're actually a lycanthrope which is actually their body's instinct for self survival kicking in rather than them becoming a CE killing machine.

[Fflewddur Fflam]

The problem with werewolves (and lycanthropes in general) is that they're actually quite a well designed monster for a non-fantasy game (at least in 5ed). Straight up immunity to non-magical, non-silvered weapon damage is downright terrifying in a game where Wizards aren't throwing around Firebolts and every level 3 Fighter has a magic sword.

If every level 3 fighter has a magic sword, then your DM is doing 5e wrong. Magic weapons are and should be pretty rare to come by in this game.

[Joe the Rat]

The regeneration (as troll, except Silver and Radiant) would make a big difference, particularly in the "come back from 0" part.
You could borrow some elements of the Rakshasa - boosted resistances or flat-out immunities would make a more fearsome monster, and one that may play a bit more cleverly before the fangs come out.

[Brendanicus]

A Werewolf/lycanthrope of your choice is selling its blood as a potion for those seeking strength, spreading its curse to those who partake. Can you track down the infected and the person crafting these?

[MrStabby]

The regeneration (as troll, except Silver and Radiant) would make a big difference, particularly in the "come back from 0" part.
You could borrow some elements of the Rakshasa - boosted resistances or flat-out immunities would make a more fearsome monster, and one that may play a bit more cleverly before the fangs come out.

How would shrugging off small amounts of damage work as an ability? When damage is rolled reduce it to zero unless it is 10 or more? This can reflect the ability to quickly regenerate all but the most serious wounds.

Classes in the level 5 to 10 range should be able to do this, but not reliably. A 2d10 firebolt for example would be more likely than not to do this, likewise a greatsword + strength mod is similar. Anything with sneak attack is also likely to have an impact. What it would do is force parties to spend resources if they wanted to be sure of taking it down quickly. Being able to ignore spike growth or a few low rolls for damage could spread out the HP quite nicely.

[JellyPooga]

If every level 3 fighter has a magic sword, then your DM is doing 5e wrong. Magic weapons are and should be pretty rare to come by in this game.

That's a matter of personal taste, to be fair, but Magic Weapon is a 2nd lvl spell, accesible at 3rd level. Immunity to damage that's bypassed by magic at 3rd level may as well not exist.

[Temperjoke]

Couple of ideas:

1. Ultra-virulent: This particular strain of lycanthropy is particularly nasty, with a higher rate of infection (harder con save to avoid infection) and the ability to infect with any claw or bite attack

2. Thick-skinned: These lycanthropes have a tougher hide than normal, making them resistant to all damage, including silvered weapons and magic

3. Giant: I don't know how they managed it, but someone has managed to infect a group of Hill Giants with Lycanthropy

[Slipperychicken]

Yeah, CR just doesnt strike terror into players for much of the game.

Players have been trained to expect that the DM has calculated all hostile encounters to deplete a lot of their hp, but are ultimately supposed to be fought and defeated in a single encounter without casualty or loss of anything important. I think that combat in general could be much scarier and more dangerous without that idea on either side of the screen.


I recently started GMing an OSR game with enemies that do not have to be resolved through combat (the players could just as easily bribe an orc patrol as slaughter them), are not balanced for the players' level (they don't even have guidelines as to which encounters are supposed to be manageable), and also injuries that can happen on KO. One of the PCs had been oneshotted by a very lucky skeleton (rolled 19 to hit, maximum damage), taking him out of commission for a week and giving him a damaged-but-usable eye. The other PCs fled the remaining skeletons in abject terror and proceeded to freak out and bail when they saw a large number of kobolds approaching.

I would never have seen that kind of behavior in a game like 3.5 or 5th edition dnd. Running away from an enemy is usually the last thing they would think to do. I think the reason is what I said before: players are conditioned in those games to expect all encounters to be scripted, balanced, enjoyable, winnable fights. Moreover, combat in modern dnd lacks the natural consequences of fighting that make even the most mundane violence terrifying in real life. A fear response to violence simply is not warranted when it is always winnable and carries no risk of injury, death, or loss. That's why GMs constantly need to bend over backwards in an attempt to make fights interesting or risky: because the game systems they play have stripped out all the normal risks of fighting and left them without much to work with.

[MrStabby]

I would never have seen that kind of behavior in a game like 3.5 or 5th edition dnd. Running away from an enemy is usually the last thing they would think to do. I think the reason is what I said before: players are conditioned in those games to expect all encounters to be scripted, balanced, enjoyable, winnable fights. Moreover, combat in modern dnd lacks the natural consequences of fighting that make even the most mundane violence terrifying in real life. A fear response to violence simply is not warranted when it doesn't carry any risk of injury, death, or loss.

I think you attribute to the system what should be attributed to the DM. 5th offers the ability to create overwhelming challenges but also offers a spectrum of ways to escape through invisibility, faster speeds/teleport, charm spells and so on. I would say that 5th edition is one of the best games for not winning combat in that I know.

[Gastronomie]

3. Giant: I don't know how they managed it, but someone has managed to infect a group of Hill Giants with LycanthropySo like, the giant swallowed a Werewolf and got infected.

The Werewolf is still alive inside the Giant's stomach, constantly being digested but at the same time regenerating with its powers. It's clawing at the flesh of the Giant from the inside, but the Giant is also regenerating constantly so he can never get past the walls of fat and muscle.

If the infected Giant dies, the Werewolf comes crawling out of its mouth.

[JellyPooga]

So like, the giant swallowed a Werewolf and got infected.

There was an old woman giant who swallowed a fly werewolf...

[Temperjoke]

So like, the giant swallowed a Werewolf and got infected.

The Werewolf is still alive inside the Giant's stomach, constantly being digested but at the same time regenerating with its powers. It's clawing at the flesh of the Giant from the inside, but the Giant is also regenerating constantly so he can never get past the walls of fat and muscle.

If the infected Giant dies, the Werewolf comes crawling out of its mouth.

We should go full turducken though.

Giant stuffed with werewolf, who has a gnome inside his belly? :D

[CursedRhubarb]

Changing their equipment so you have a variety of armed and armored werewolves that fight in hybrid form. A hybrid in heavy armor with a shield and sword or axe could be scary, especially if you add some regeneration to the high AC.

Another that could be interesting is to play on the variation of werewolves where it's not the bite itself, but the saliva in the wounds that carries the curse and give them an extra ability like:

Tainted Blade - the Lycanthrope uses an action (or bonus action to be even worse) to lick it's weapon, leaving it coated in saliva for up to 1 minute or until the weapon hits with an attack. On a hit the target must make a DC save as if bitten or be cursed with Lycanthropy.

[SillyPopeNachos]

First, remove the "non-magical" qualifier for weapons from every monster's stat block in your monster manual. Next, make it so that they have resistance to magic (advantage on saves, ignores spells of level x and below, or however you feel is most appropriate). Then, follow they already-given advice about increasing speed and summoning wolves. Regen is optional.

[TripleD]

That's a matter of personal taste, to be fair, but Magic Weapon is a 2nd lvl spell, accesible at 3rd level. Immunity to damage that's bypassed by magic at 3rd level may as well not exist.

Magic Weapon requires concentration. So if you have a melee-heavy group there's no way you could reliably arm them all. That is of course assuming your magic user actually has the spell and is willing to give up concentration for it.

The first TPKO I had in 5e was when my group was teleported to the moon and accidentally ended up in a lycanthrope temple. They had no silver or magic weapons, and even the wererats ended up as a major challenge. They ended up holing up in a room while the bard desperately flung cantrips at them before eventually being overwhelmed.

[Sigreid]

If every level 3 fighter has a magic sword, then your DM is doing 5e wrong. Magic weapons are and should be pretty rare to come by in this game.

That's purely a matter of table taste.

More on topic, what I find most disappointing is how easy it is to get rid of the curse. In 1e the terrifying part of werewolves wasn't defeating the beast, any mid level party could do that easily enough. It was that if you got bit, you might find out at the next full moon you were infected. And if you were, it was expensive, difficult and dangerous to try to cure yourself...with a relatively small chance of success.

[Dr. Cliché]

Thanks for all the ideas, chaps. You've been a great help. :smallsmile:


Yeah, CR just doesnt strike terror into players for much of the game.

I like the regeneration idea, although you may need some extra HP to make it work well.

I would add to the claw attacks a Con save - if failed the wounds continue to bleed at the start of each turn (further D6 damage) until the player receives healing or a save is made at end of turn.

Give them the rogues cunning action. HP regeneration + Hit and run tactics can make these guys much harder.

You can adjust their combat tactics. Give them athletics skill and let them drag away their enemies. This lets you make environmental features more interesting as you can force players to interact with them.

Finally add blindsight to them - representing their ability to perfectly sense an area through smell.

These abilities should also go alongside some general buffs - +2 Str and +1 to proficiency will just make them hit enough more often to be a threat to less armoured party members.

Thanks, there's a lot of good ideas here.


You could always just rule only silver can actually kill them so you could fireball them to ash but they'll still regenerate it just takes longer...



For a quick-fix solution, I'd simply make them immune to all damage except silver and gross physical dismemberment. Magic Sword? Does nothing. Firebolt cantrip? Diddly squat. Disintegrate? Mmmmaybe*. Silver letter opener? Now we're talking. When you literally can't hurt something, defeating it involves more than just another hack'n'slash encounter; it becomes about capture or escape, luring it into a trap or breaking the curse.

I think regeneration is an important aspect of werewolves, so I might well do something along these lines. Cheers.



A werewolf isn't supposed to be just another monster to kill; it's as much a moral dilemma and a social intrigue as it is (supposed to be) a hard fight. Use those scenario aspects to enhance your werewolf encounters. Sure you can tack on all the bells and whistles, with additional abilities and such, but the important thing is to put them in their place; as the killer you can't identify, the mass-murderer who doesn't even know he's doing it (or maybe he does...), or as the foe you can't just kill when he hulks out, not only because he's all but impervious to harm, but because he's the son of the guy who hired you to solve the problem in the first place.

Werewolves might be lacklustre on paper, but it's the scenario you put them in that makes them special. Time spent developing those scenarios is time well spent compared to time wasted tacking on what is essentially just bigger numbers.

I know what you mean, but even with a scenario like that, I'd still want a werewolf that can pull its weight in combat.


So like, the giant swallowed a Werewolf and got infected.

The Werewolf is still alive inside the Giant's stomach, constantly being digested but at the same time regenerating with its powers. It's clawing at the flesh of the Giant from the inside, but the Giant is also regenerating constantly so he can never get past the walls of fat and muscle.

Hah, I like that idea. Although, I'd probably want to have the giant be . . . wrong in some way. Like the transformation isn't quite right or he has a more diseased look to him.

Regardless, do you think the bigger threat would be the giant itself, or the immortal werewolf inside him?


If the infected Giant dies, the Werewolf comes crawling out of its mouth.

Surely the werewolf should burst out of his (now non-regenerating) stomach?

I mean, how many opportunities do you get to reenact the scene from Alien with werewolves? :smallwink:

[Skitcher]

I think regeneration is an important place to start. But, just remember that the traditional werewolves were cunning. They didn't just go toe-to-toe with a warrior band, that's how they were often defeated. To use a werewolf right they need to surprise, they need to come at you from nowhere. First, I would make them have some levels, no reason that your werewolf needs to be a 0-level human, he could be a 9th level barbarian, with all the same powers and abilities in addition to his werewolf abilities. Second, he's smart, he singles out individuals when they are alone. You can play it as they remember who they are in each form, or have the split personality, the strategies are different for each. He may draw an individual off as a human with the intent to kill, or beg an individual for protection not realizing that he is the werewolf. The werewolf looks just like everyone else, maybe he's a party member. Maybe they are trouping werewolves that travel in packs. One werewolf, not a problem, a dozen... a bit harder, especially when half of them are rangers and warlocks the same level as the party...

Werewolf variant that I have had lots of fun with:
The Black Sheep: Just like other werewolves but its natural form is a sheep instead of a human. I'm telling you, no-one ever suspects the sheep. Talk about a surprise attack!
Farmer: "Please protect my sheep from the roving band of werewolves..."
Party: "Ok, we set a perimeter around the sheep facing out. No matter where they come from, we'll see them..."
Sheep: "I transform silently and sneak up behind Bjorn, I slit his throat with my claw"
The sheep spook and then stampede the PCs....

[numerek]

In the white wolf game where werewolves are playable there is a lot of different things werewolves can do.

They have different breeds, tribes, auspices, caerns, camps, artifacts, gifts, and rites.

They also had a concept of Delirium.

So basically not all werewolves are the same think of how you would like your werewolves to be.

[TheTeaMustFlow]

Surely the simplest solution would be to apply the PCs as Werewolves template to a higher level NPC - a Werewolf Gladiator would be pretty nasty.

[Primus Beno]

I'm going to look at this from a non-mechanical perspective instead of a mechanical. Mechanics are all quickly grasped by players and I think ruin some of the more fun, horrifying and fear generating elements that a werewolf is supposed to represent. Also, you asked for a generic "dangerous and interesting" so, I'll look at playstyles and settings.

The first question I would ask is "why am I introducing a werewolf?" I don't think they fit well in random encounters or "because it would be cool to fight one". We all know that 99% of the fights our PC's get into, the PC's will win, or at least, that's the expectation. I think that's why people don't run in D&D. We assume that if it is put in front of us, we're supposed to figure out how to beat it.

But a werewolf exists as a story telling device. It's a way to look at the beast within ourselves, the savage attacker who is part man and part animal, driven to kill those whom we love most. We get a horrified thrill looking at that beast and wondering if we are like that or a sense of relief that we are not.

Ideally, the best plot is to have a PC stricken with lycanthropy but they don't know it at first. It could come from fighting off dire wolves. It could have come from a drunken bar fight where that guy tried to bite off an ear. It could come from a curse or any where. What matters is that the unsuspecting PC comes down with it.

Imagine being handed a note that just reads "You wake up in your inn room, your mouth tasting of rust. Your hands and feet are dirty. There is a torn dress at the foot of your bed. There might be bits of blood on it. There doesn't seem to be any body or other blood and you don't have any wounds"

Lead the PC's into a story of a local prostitute who was killed in what looks to be a thieves guild hit. She was found decapitated and naked, which seems to be their prefered method of killing. So, the PC's will probably think someone is out to frame the infected PC, who really was targeted for recruitment by the gang. As they try to solve the mystery, more people begin to die. Once the PC's figure out what is going on, they may have to subdue an enraged werewolf, not so easy when you can't pull punches with firebolts and fireballs.

Then they have to wonder, did the PC infect anyone else? If they cure the PC but the deaths continue, do they start to slaughter random townsfolk who may be unaware of their curse, or who might be aware, but are too afraid to come forward? I would make the decision hard for the PC's, especially in a fight when they might see a blue bow on the werewolf that looked exactly like the blue bow on a young girl who pleaded with them to save her fathers life. Choices should be hard in dealing with werewolves. It makes the fight harder.


Another way to make them interesting it to cloud what the PC's think they are fighting and how the werewolves fight. Wolves are pack animals and it makes sense for a werewolf to get into a pack as well. Wolves wear down their prey, nipping and biting, chasing it down to exhaust it before going in for the kill on the weakest member. So, werewolves should do that to. 5 or 6 circle the party, 2 darting in for an attack on the rear (wizards and bards are so tasty) before disengaging and running at full speed the next round, when two more come in to attack characters pulled out of position trying to protect the more squishy of characters.

I think this type of scenario should be done without a grid system. If your players are very used a grid, this can yank the safety blanket away and leave them feeling vulnerable since they can't see and plan for the next attacks. All they have to go on are your descriptions of a dark forest at night, sudden attacks, howling and then attackers who disappear. The werewolves would attack at night to take advantage of their perception bonus's for hearing and smell while the PC's may be relying on one or two party members who can only see 30 feet in *front* of them with darkvision (more if drow). The key word here is front, since the two who are attacking are probably disengaging so that two more can attack from the rear. And each attack forces that Con save against the curse....

If I was running something like this, I would have the pack trying to exhaust the players, making one or two attacks every hour before melting back into the forest. Keep the group from ever resting and let the exhaustion penalties start to pile up, especially if they are deep in the wilderness. The pack would use the forest for dense cover if the party ever went nuclear, which would help with their low AC's considerably and could pull back for short rests individually while the other pack members keep on the pressure. Slowly but surely, those spells slots would deplete, hit points would be worn down and charges would be exhausted. That's when player start getting scared.

I'd give the PC's disadvantage on perception checks due to the howling of the pack, the darkness and the unfamiliarity of the terrain.

I honestly don't think you need to change mechanics of the werewolves. I think we need to change how we use them. I don't think they are ever meant to be used in a slug fest with the PC's. That makes them boring and under powered. Add some flavor, some ethical dilemmas and some tactics to spice them up.

[JellyPooga]

Awesome post

This is how to do it. Everything this guy said in this post is solid gold.

[Dr. Cliché]

I honestly don't think you need to change mechanics of the werewolves. I think we need to change how we use them. I don't think they are ever meant to be used in a slug fest with the PC's. That makes them boring and under powered.

You say that, yet your second scenario involves just that.

The werewolves still have to get into a fight with the PCs. And, whilst their attacks might wear the PCs down to some degree, what you're missing is that these attacks are likely to wear down the werewolves even more. Bear in mind that they have pitiful AC (making them at least as squishy as the casters), not to mention a pathetic attack bonus. More importantly though they don't regenerate. So even using hit and run tactics (and assuming none of the pack just gets straight up killed), they'll still be suffering from all the wounds the players inflicted on them last time.

The whole 'attack the players at night' thing loses its edge somewhat when you realise that a single cantrip completely cancels whatever piddling advantage they might have had. Also, looking at the rules, I'm don't think the werewolves even gain any advantage from their perception. As far as I can see, they still suffer the normal effects of being blinded. Maybe they can find the rough location of the PCs via hearing/smell, but they still have disadvantage on attack rolls and any PCs with darkvision have advantage against them.

Are you sure it's the PCs who'll end up scared after this encounter? If anything, it looks like it will be the werewolves who'll quite literally be going home with their tails between their legs.

[JellyPooga]

I think it's an important point that (as contradictory to my previous posts as this might be) it's only adventurers that find werewolves lacklustre with their weapons and armour worth a lifetime of labour and abilities beyond the ken of ordinary folk. Your average villager or town guardsman doesn't have a silver or magical weapon and the only non-weapon damage he has easy access to is a flaming torch (the traditonal accompaniment to a potchfork in mob situations) and thus can't even hope to fight off a wetewolf.

Want to make a werewolf scary for the players? Put them in that boat. Confiscate their magic/silver weapons, limit their ability to utilise magic somehow and hit-and-run tactics do work when you don't slavishly follow the combat rules (with or without regeneration); it's important to note that you don't have to use the combat rules every time someone wants to hit another and guerilla tactics are an example of where I'd avoid their use.

The PC's are special in that they are among the few even capable of fighting these untouchable monsters. Emphasise this by having the wolf prey on those weaker than them. If the wolf is halfway smart, he should be avoiding the dangerous looking people with the shiny swords. It should only be when it's most desperate that it considers attacking them directly or trying to infect one of them. Beasts they may be but they're far from mindless and that's what makes them scary and dangerous.

[Kryx]

Start with a vampire and change it appropriately. It should give the right feel for an "Underworld" movie type werewolf.
This is what I'd do as well.

[Dr. Cliché]

Start with a vampire and change it appropriately. It should give the right feel for an "Underworld" movie type werewolf.


This is what I'd do as well.

So, what would you actually do to the vampire? I mean, it seems like you'd have to start by stripping out most of its powers:
Bat form - no.
Mist form - no.
Misty escape - no.
Spider climb - no.
Vampire weaknesses - definitely not.
Summon bats and rats - no (wolves are fine though).
(Blood-draining) Bite - no.
Charm - no.


I think it's an important point that (as contradictory to my previous posts as this might be) it's only adventurers that find werewolves lacklustre with their weapons and armour worth a lifetime of labour and abilities beyond the ken of ordinary folk. Your average villager or town guardsman doesn't have a silver or magical weapon and the only non-weapon damage he has easy access to is a flaming torch (the traditonal accompaniment to a potchfork in mob situations) and thus can't even hope to fight off a wetewolf.

Granted, but this isn't exactly much consolation for werewolves in a high fantasy game. :smalltongue:

Also, this applies to virtually every monster in D&D. The difference is that most of the others are also a serious threat to an actual adventuring party.

[Kryx]

So, what would you actually do to the vampire? I mean, it seems like you'd have to start by stripping out most of its powers:
Bat form - no.
Mist form - no.
Misty escape - no.
Spider climb - no.
Vampire weaknesses - definitely not.
Summon bats and rats - no (wolves are fine though).
(Blood-draining) Bite - no.
Charm - no.
Take the vampire template and merge it with the werewolf. Largely taking the ability scores, ac, hp, legendary resistance, legendary actions of a vampire while bringing in the werewolf actions. Change multiattack and damage of each attack as appropriate.

Basically scale werewolf to somewherr around CR 13 depending on what challenge you desire.