Neknoh
2016-09-09, 07:44 AM
Ok, so here's the deal.
We're currently running Rise of the Runelords, and we're probably not looking at stopping any time soon, however, our DM is yearning to actually play and not just DM, and I've promised the group that, if the interest is there, I'll sooner or later cook up a very big and amazing adventure path for them to walk down, either as a side-thing for when we don't have enough players for Rise, or as a "other time of the week"-thing. It'll also be a good setting to introduce other people into the game with such as the international exchange student who's lovably nerdy, wears his heart on his sleeve and really, really loves gaming and has turned out to be a good friend of mine.
And, well, fellow DM's and players, the cookup is nearly done. The first major chapter of the story has been planned out for the largest details, and now comes time to fill in smaller things as well as choosing what tables to use, what loot to specifically place in places and what loot to roll for. I'm starting to shape some NPC's as well as deciding on how many random encounters the players will face. Basically, all of the detail building that allows me to move stuff around and let the players really go off on their own stuff, alongside keystone scenes and visions and suchlike.
But, I've never created a dungeon crawl. I've done boss encounters, I've done scenarios and many other things, mostly in Iron Kingdoms, never truly in Pathfinder.
As such, I need help to set up this first small-ish dungeon of mine, and hopefully it'll teach me enough about balancing and crafting interesting Pathfinder dungeons and encounters for future referense, as the story expands and grows.
Now, for the setup.
Level 1, 20 point buy, 3-4 players (for the first scenario, this will probably grow in number, but we're down several people this weekend).
Like most adventures, it doesn't start out too grand, a small hamlet gets attacked and the heroes either get called in from a local inn, or actually all live in the town. But they're not really there for the big attack, rather, their mission is basically to go out and reclaim the village treasure, either for the local governing body (they need their taxes), or because the villages are worried about not being able to buy new seed for next years (why not have the bandits just straight up burn their seed-stores).
But here is where it gets a bit complicated.
You see, I don't want Goblins as the primary "first level encounter" of this battle, I want something more mundane for the start, bandits or suchlike, because the village (and the heroes) will have their views of the world expanded as the story goes on. And I'm just not well versed enough as a Pathfinder DM to know where to look for human brigands/highwaymen/bandits etc. Robbers, weak, essentially goblins but not actually goblins.
The pacing I should be able to do, I just don't know what to use.
And after the bandit camp comes the dungeon, the small crevasse or tiny cave system that the bandits used for their treasure (I'll leave a small pile of loot for the players before going in, and maybe a trap, but only if they actually explore the small place a bit) has apparently fallen in, or something smelled the gold and dug the wall/floor out from under it, revealing a much larger cavern underneath.
And this is where I wonder... how does one go about designing a cave crawl that doesn't bottleneck the players and that is mostly natural? Hell, sure, maybe remnants of an old temple underneath could work, actually, I quite like that, even if it is standard, because that allows me to explain what they'll face at the end of it a bit more (we're getting to that in a moment, but first, more rambling thoughts).
What interesting things and challenges can one put in a natural cavern with some old temple ruins inside of it? I don't want ancient mechanics and traps, I want natural hazards, be it a pool of clear water with a shadow swimming in it, or just flat out giant spiders, or maybe old skeletons (as you see, all of these ideas already exist in Blackfang's cave, any other suggestions for a level 1 cave?)
And at the end of it all, I'm actually going to flat out steal the thought of some sort of young and inexperienced dragon, something that finally grew large enough to get to the bandit's gold, i.e. it's not a huge hoard of items and cash, and the beast should not wipe the party in a round. How do I downsize a young dragon? Is there an even smaller template? Or do you have suggestions for what stats to diminish to adapt it to a mostly non-power-gaming group of 3-4 players?
Because I want a challenge, and I want something that really does do the whole "****, I'm hurt, better fly" that Blackfang does, for, you see, I want the old temple to have had an egg in it, which hatched some time ago, and the youngling, cave-fed dragon that they find really should come back later, stronger as a later boss appearance in the campaign, to leave a nice touchstone on where it all started.
But there are so many things in the Blackfang dungeon that I don't like (the Goblin tribe, the old temple, the highly specialised loot etc, also, it's balanced for 4 lvl 3 players, right?), so I can't just rip that one straight up and put it into the story.
So, I guess, through all my ramblings, I'm asking:
1. Good lvl 1 human group of villains? Suggestions?
2. Interesting things, hazards and monsters to throw into a shorter lvl 1 dungeon crawl.
3. A fitting, weakened dragon to put at the end of it that'll give them **** and can't really be killed, but can be driven off or caught under/behind falling rocks and beaten that way. But won't be a straight up TPK encounter.
Thank you for your patience, and I'm looking forward to your answers.
We're currently running Rise of the Runelords, and we're probably not looking at stopping any time soon, however, our DM is yearning to actually play and not just DM, and I've promised the group that, if the interest is there, I'll sooner or later cook up a very big and amazing adventure path for them to walk down, either as a side-thing for when we don't have enough players for Rise, or as a "other time of the week"-thing. It'll also be a good setting to introduce other people into the game with such as the international exchange student who's lovably nerdy, wears his heart on his sleeve and really, really loves gaming and has turned out to be a good friend of mine.
And, well, fellow DM's and players, the cookup is nearly done. The first major chapter of the story has been planned out for the largest details, and now comes time to fill in smaller things as well as choosing what tables to use, what loot to specifically place in places and what loot to roll for. I'm starting to shape some NPC's as well as deciding on how many random encounters the players will face. Basically, all of the detail building that allows me to move stuff around and let the players really go off on their own stuff, alongside keystone scenes and visions and suchlike.
But, I've never created a dungeon crawl. I've done boss encounters, I've done scenarios and many other things, mostly in Iron Kingdoms, never truly in Pathfinder.
As such, I need help to set up this first small-ish dungeon of mine, and hopefully it'll teach me enough about balancing and crafting interesting Pathfinder dungeons and encounters for future referense, as the story expands and grows.
Now, for the setup.
Level 1, 20 point buy, 3-4 players (for the first scenario, this will probably grow in number, but we're down several people this weekend).
Like most adventures, it doesn't start out too grand, a small hamlet gets attacked and the heroes either get called in from a local inn, or actually all live in the town. But they're not really there for the big attack, rather, their mission is basically to go out and reclaim the village treasure, either for the local governing body (they need their taxes), or because the villages are worried about not being able to buy new seed for next years (why not have the bandits just straight up burn their seed-stores).
But here is where it gets a bit complicated.
You see, I don't want Goblins as the primary "first level encounter" of this battle, I want something more mundane for the start, bandits or suchlike, because the village (and the heroes) will have their views of the world expanded as the story goes on. And I'm just not well versed enough as a Pathfinder DM to know where to look for human brigands/highwaymen/bandits etc. Robbers, weak, essentially goblins but not actually goblins.
The pacing I should be able to do, I just don't know what to use.
And after the bandit camp comes the dungeon, the small crevasse or tiny cave system that the bandits used for their treasure (I'll leave a small pile of loot for the players before going in, and maybe a trap, but only if they actually explore the small place a bit) has apparently fallen in, or something smelled the gold and dug the wall/floor out from under it, revealing a much larger cavern underneath.
And this is where I wonder... how does one go about designing a cave crawl that doesn't bottleneck the players and that is mostly natural? Hell, sure, maybe remnants of an old temple underneath could work, actually, I quite like that, even if it is standard, because that allows me to explain what they'll face at the end of it a bit more (we're getting to that in a moment, but first, more rambling thoughts).
What interesting things and challenges can one put in a natural cavern with some old temple ruins inside of it? I don't want ancient mechanics and traps, I want natural hazards, be it a pool of clear water with a shadow swimming in it, or just flat out giant spiders, or maybe old skeletons (as you see, all of these ideas already exist in Blackfang's cave, any other suggestions for a level 1 cave?)
And at the end of it all, I'm actually going to flat out steal the thought of some sort of young and inexperienced dragon, something that finally grew large enough to get to the bandit's gold, i.e. it's not a huge hoard of items and cash, and the beast should not wipe the party in a round. How do I downsize a young dragon? Is there an even smaller template? Or do you have suggestions for what stats to diminish to adapt it to a mostly non-power-gaming group of 3-4 players?
Because I want a challenge, and I want something that really does do the whole "****, I'm hurt, better fly" that Blackfang does, for, you see, I want the old temple to have had an egg in it, which hatched some time ago, and the youngling, cave-fed dragon that they find really should come back later, stronger as a later boss appearance in the campaign, to leave a nice touchstone on where it all started.
But there are so many things in the Blackfang dungeon that I don't like (the Goblin tribe, the old temple, the highly specialised loot etc, also, it's balanced for 4 lvl 3 players, right?), so I can't just rip that one straight up and put it into the story.
So, I guess, through all my ramblings, I'm asking:
1. Good lvl 1 human group of villains? Suggestions?
2. Interesting things, hazards and monsters to throw into a shorter lvl 1 dungeon crawl.
3. A fitting, weakened dragon to put at the end of it that'll give them **** and can't really be killed, but can be driven off or caught under/behind falling rocks and beaten that way. But won't be a straight up TPK encounter.
Thank you for your patience, and I'm looking forward to your answers.