RKV final 5 levels

[Belzyk]

Hello guys. I know I've asked alot of help the last few days. I have one final question. One of my players is building a paladin type character. Not a paladin just a holy knight. He is going cleric 4 crusader1 RKV10 what should he go for for the last 5 levels. He wants to be more martial then magic. I'm having a hard time because I am unsure with tome of battle. I'm not very experinced.

Also would I have been better for them to do cleric 2 crusader 3?

[Endarire]

What about homebrewing an extra 5 levels to the RKV? Even just full BAB, full casting progression, and full maneuver/stance progression would likely suffice.

[nedz]

At level 16 spells are all that matter — so Cleric 5 or a full casting PrC (there are several good choices).

As to your question about cleric 4 / crusader 1 or cleric 2 / crusader 3:
This really all depends upon your party's playstyle/power level.
Cleric > Crusader because Spells > Melee, but which you should choose depends upon the above question.

That said Cleric 4 / Crusader 1 would give you IL 3 at Crusader 1, which means 2nd level manoeuvres.

Crusader 1 / Cleric 3 / Warblade 1 is also an interesting entry — again IL3 for the Warblade dip. RKV could then be used to advance either dependant upon your preferred recovery technique.

[Efrate]

I'm not 100% on this, but don't martial adept PRCs advance ALL initiator level simultaneously? I saw something a while back in a thread about Master of the Nine that did, but I cannot for the life me remember where or what the ruling is.

Just keep with crusader if he wants to be more martial for the last 5. Abjurant champion if you can fit an arcane caster level in somewhere isn't bad either, so cleric 1/wizard 1/crusader 3/RKV 10/Abjurant Champion 5 is nice. Swift action abjurations are nice, and Abjurant Champion does not specify they must be arcane. You could take champion to 2 or 4 to fit more cleric casting in, getting to 6th level spells easily enough, a level in crudaser gets you 9th level manuevers. You cast as 11th cleric, initiate as as 17th level crusader, cast as a 3rd level wizard, and use most any magical item ever without any UMD cause its on your list, with all your abjurations quickened with your bonus swift actions.

[nedz]

I'm not 100% on this, but don't martial adept PRCs advance ALL initiator level simultaneously? I saw something a while back in a thread about Master of the Nine that did, but I cannot for the life me remember where or what the ruling is.

IL (initiator level) yes — the choice is where you stick your manoeuvres and stances.

[Belzyk]

I'm not 100% on this, but don't martial adept PRCs advance ALL initiator level simultaneously? I saw something a while back in a thread about Master of the Nine that did, but I cannot for the life me remember where or what the ruling is.

I'd very much like to know this as well because if warblade has a way better manuver recharge. Also this is a fairly low power game

[nedz]

Hmm, a ninja post and edit.

I think I've answered your question already, but just to be sure I'll clarify.

There is a variable called IL (Initiator Level) which controls what manoeuvres and stances you can take as well as the effects of many of them. It's a bit like caster level, except that you get +1 IL per level in an initiator class and half that per level in other classes. The PrCs in ToB grant full IL, though other PrCs generally don't.

You can only obtain new manoeuvres and stances by taking a level in an initiator class or with a feat.

E.g.
Cleric 4 / Crusader 1 gives you 5 manoeuvres and stances at level 5: where your IL = 3. So you can pick 5 level 1 or 2 manoeuvres.

Crusader 1 / Cleric 4 gives you 5 manoeuvres and stances at level 1: where your IL = 1. So you can pick 5 level 1 manoeuvres.

When a PrC gives you an extra manoeuvre (known or readied) or stance you get to choose which initiator base class you apply them too (assuming you have more than 1).

[TheTeaMustFlow]

The Ordained Champion (from Complete Champion) or Fist of Raziel (from Exalted Deeds) might both do nicely.

[ExLibrisMortis]

Prestige Paladin is always good for a one-level dip, and the second level (plus the third) can be nice, if you're after Divine Grace. You need Mounted Combat to qualify, unfortunately, but the other requirements are easy.