[Archetype] Pact Supplicant (Paladin)

[Xuldarinar]

PACT SUPPLICANT (PALADIN)

-While most paladins swear themselves to a deity, or benevolence as their code entails, there are those who offer their service to less wholesome entities. Communing with the unknown, a pact supplicant stands as an uncanny champion of good to some, and a heretic to others.

Prerequisites
-Alignment: Any good.

Code of Conduct
-A pact supplicant must be of good alignment and loses all class features except for proficiencies if she ever willingly commits an evil act.

-Additionally, a pact supplicant's code requires that she respect all things associated with her patron, and punish those who threaten innocents and those associated with her patron.

Class Features
All of the following are class features of the pact supplicant.

-Hexen Rites: A pact supplicant's powers, rather than being drawn from patron or devotion to good in of itself, instead result from communion with the unknown. A pact supplicant uses Intelligence instead of Charisma as her key spellcasting ability score (to determine her spell DCs, bonus spells per day, bonus on concentration checks, and so on), and to determine the effects of smite evil. Additionally, a pact supplicant does not gain Knowledge (religion) as a class skill. A pact supplicant instead gains Knowledge (arcana), Knowledge (nature), or Knowledge (planes) as a class skill, chosen at 1st level.
This ability alters the paladin's Class Skills, Spellcasting, and Smite Evil.

-Patron Sigil: At 1st level, a pact supplicant gains a patron sigil. This sigil can take any number of forms, ranging from a symbol akin to a holy symbol to a small object like a doll or a fetish, but it is always somehow associated with the pact supplicant's patron. A pact supplicant must commune with her sigil each day to prepare her spells. Whenever a pact supplicant would utilize a focus or divine focus when casting a spell, or attempting to detect evil, the pact supplicant must use her patron sigil.

-If a patron sigil is damaged, it is restored to full hit points the next time the pact supplicant prepares her spells. If the sigil is lost or destroyed, it can be replaced after 1 week in a special ritual that costs 200gp per paladin level. This process takes 8 hours regardless of the form it takes. A patron sigil can only be used to prepare spells by the pact supplicant that created it, but it can be utilized as a focus by any pact supplicant who shares the same patron as the sigil's creator. Patron sigils, when sold, typically hold the same value as a wooden holy symbol.
-This ability alters the paladin's Detect Evil.

-Patron Spells: At 1st level, a pact supplicant must select a patron. This functions like the witch class ability of the same name, except as follows;

The pact supplicant acquires their bonus spells at differing levels. The spells normally gained at 2nd, 4th, 6th, and 8th level are instead acquired at 5th, 8th, 11th, and 14th respectively. Patron spells normally acquired at 10th level and above are never gained by the pact supplicant.
The pact supplicant adds the spells directly to their spells known.


-Hasten Hex (Su): At 2nd level, a pact supplicant can expend one use of her smite evil ability to use a hex as a swift action instead of a standard action.
This ability replaces the paladin's Divine Grace.

-Hex: At 2nd level, a pact supplicant gains one hex of her choice. She gains an additional hex at 3rd level and for every 3 levels attained thereafter. A pact supplicant cannot select an individual hex more than once.
-This ability replaces the paladin's Lay on Hands and Channel Positive Energy.

-Pact Boon (Sp): Upon reaching 5th level, a pact supplicant receives a boon from her patron. This bond can take one of two forms. Once the form is chosen, it cannot be changed.

-The first type of boon allows the pact supplicant to enhance her weapon as a standard action by inviting spirits associated with her patron's themes into her weapon for 1 minute per paladin level. This functions identically to the standard paladin's weapon bond except the axiomatic weapon property is only available to lawfully aligned pact supplicants, and is replaced with anarchic for chaotic aligned pact supplicants. With DM permission, other enchantments may be swapped out with others of the same modifier if they would be more befitting of her patron. For example, frost and icy burst may take the place of fiery and flaming burst respectively for a pact supplicant of a winter patron.

-The second type of boon grants the pact supplicant the service of a familiar, treating her paladin level as her witch level for the purpose of this ability. This familiar does not by default store the pact supplicant's spells, nor must this familiar be communed with for the pact supplicant to prepare her spells. The pact supplicant can choose to preform ritual similar to that normally required to replace her Patron Sigil to designate her familiar as where her spells are stored and what she must commune with, or to designate her Patron Sigil as such if her familiar already serves this function. This version of ritual costs 100gp per paladin level. If the pact supplicant chooses to store her spells in her familiar, the pact supplicant must still utilize her Patron Sigil for the purpose of casting spells that require a focus and when she attempts to detect evil.

-This alters the paladin's Divine Bond.

-Major Hex: Starting at 15th level, and every three levels thereafter, a pact supplicant can choose major hexes whenever she could select a new hex.

[inuyasha]

I hath been summoned
Wow, good job posting this right as I start experimenting with Witch stuff, this is amazing!

I don't really have any mechanical concerns, but how from a fluff standpoint would you differentiate this from Sacred Servant? Both of them require the paladin to specifically dedicate himself to a higher power in exchange for more magic than your standard paladin. What do you think would cause someone to go for a witch patron rather than an almighty god or empyreal lord?

Also, I like the idea that theoretically, a paladin can pick any witch patron. I've had the idea for a madness (in this case insanity) or death focused paladin for a long time, but that'd be pretty much impossible without DM fiat and making up a deity, which feels kinda cheaty.

Do the spells have anything to do with a familiar? I don't know if it's a fair trade, but maybe these guys could get a familiar instead of detect evil, as they're much less stringent on alignment.

Overall though, this is seriously cool and I might use it in my current primitive campaign, and/or a horror game within the next few months.

[Xuldarinar]

I hath been summoned
Wow, good job posting this right as I start experimenting with Witch stuff, this is amazing!

I don't really have any mechanical concerns, but how from a fluff standpoint would you differentiate this from Sacred Servant? Both of them require the paladin to specifically dedicate himself to a higher power in exchange for more magic than your standard paladin. What do you think would cause someone to go for a witch patron rather than an almighty god or empyreal lord?

Also, I like the idea that theoretically, a paladin can pick any witch patron. I've had the idea for a madness (in this case insanity) or death focused paladin for a long time, but that'd be pretty much impossible without DM fiat and making up a deity, which feels kinda cheaty.

Do the spells have anything to do with a familiar? I don't know if it's a fair trade, but maybe these guys could get a familiar instead of detect evil, as they're much less stringent on alignment.

Overall though, this is seriously cool and I might use it in my current primitive campaign, and/or a horror game within the next few months.

Glad to see your post.

As far as thematically setting this apart from the sacred servant, I think that in part lends itself to the thematic differences between witches and clerics. Both are sworn to something, but what it is and the way they go about following it are different. Perhaps they could use a bit more to set them apart in theme.. but I am unsure how. As for what would cause someone to go for a witch patron, I think it would be a matter of one's story. Perhaps they are close to a witch, such as their parent. Maybe culturally witches are more common in their society. Perhaps they feel that witch patrons provide them with the powers they need, or perhaps the more orthodox paths are something they could never hold themselves to.

I rather like the various witch patrons and how they could mesh with paladins, though some may take more creativity than others. Madness and death, for instance, are less obvious than ancestors or light.

The spells in their own right normally would be added to a familiar, as a witch's familiar typically serves as their intermediary and is utilized in spell prep. That being said, I don't think any of the patrons provide any that effect the familiar and there are official archetypes that provide Patron Spells or other witch capabilities, but don't involve a familiar. I think a familiar might be a bit strong to replace Detect Evil with, in spite of the detriment it would levy on Smite Evil.

All in all though, Im glad you like it.


Edit: I had a thought. I could swap their casting to arcane, but make it so long as they have a 'symbol' associated with their patron they can cast their spells without ASF and make it so said 'symbol' is required for them to prepare and cast their spells as well as regaining uses of their hex abilities.

[inuyasha]

Glad to see your post.

As far as thematically setting this apart from the sacred servant, I think that in part lends itself to the thematic differences between witches and clerics. Both are sworn to something, but what it is and the way they go about following it are different. Perhaps they could use a bit more to set them apart in theme.. but I am unsure how. As for what would cause someone to go for a witch patron, I think it would be a matter of one's story. Perhaps they are close to a witch, such as their parent. Maybe culturally witches are more common in their society. Perhaps they feel that witch patrons provide them with the powers they need, or perhaps the more orthodox paths are something they could never hold themselves to.

I rather like the various witch patrons and how they could mesh with paladins, though some may take more creativity than others. Madness and death, for instance, are less obvious than ancestors or light.

The spells in their own right normally would be added to a familiar, as a witch's familiar typically serves as their intermediary and is utilized in spell prep. That being said, I don't think any of the patrons provide any that effect the familiar and there are official archetypes that provide Patron Spells or other witch capabilities, but don't involve a familiar. I think a familiar might be a bit strong to replace Detect Evil with, in spite of the detriment it would levy on Smite Evil.

All in all though, Im glad you like it.

Good point on the familiar front, and as for the patron/sacred servant thing I just remembered something that I learned recently. Nowhere does it actually say that a patron has to be a deific being, or even a demon lord or anything, so someone on another message board said that it could be just a powerful outsider or even a powerful dragon that's noticed the PC.

I kind of want to make a light/medium armored, scimitar wielding Paladin with a desert focus whose secret patron is actually a djinn or brass dragon.

EDIT to address your edit: I don't know if arcane casting would be a good idea, because that presents a problem with the spellcasting failure, and with armored casting being a very special class feature for magi, and the fact that most people are still going to want a shining heavily armored paladin (my above example is a very niche build), I don't think people would go with it as much. A unique focus of some sort would be really cool though, that I could certainly get behind.

[Xuldarinar]

Good point on the familiar front, and as for the patron/sacred servant thing I just remembered something that I learned recently. Nowhere does it actually say that a patron has to be a deific being, or even a demon lord or anything, so someone on another message board said that it could be just a powerful outsider or even a powerful dragon that's noticed the PC.

I kind of want to make a light/medium armored, scimitar wielding Paladin with a desert focus whose secret patron is actually a djinn or brass dragon.

EDIT to address your edit: I don't know if arcane casting would be a good idea, because that presents a problem with the spellcasting failure, and with armored casting being a very special class feature for magi, and the fact that most people are still going to want a shining heavily armored paladin (my above example is a very niche build), I don't think people would go with it as much. A unique focus of some sort would be really cool though, that I could certainly get behind.


Before adding it to the original post, how about this?


-Patron Sigil: At 1st level, a pact supplicant gains a patron sigil. This sigil can take any number of forms, ranging from a symbol akin to a holy symbol to a small object like a doll or a fetish, but it is always somehow associated with the pact supplicant's patron. A pact supplicant must commune with her sigil each day to prepare her spells. Whenever a pact supplicant would utilize a focus or divine focus when casting a spell, or attempting to detect evil, the pact supplicant must use her patron sigil.

[inuyasha]

I think the only thing missing is a statement that it can't be just sold for money, and how to regain one if it's lost. Otherwise that looks good! Perhaps a statement on whether or not paladins with the same patron can share sigils too.

[Xuldarinar]

I think the only thing missing is a statement that it can't be just sold for money, and how to regain one if it's lost. Otherwise that looks good! Perhaps a statement on whether or not paladins with the same patron can share sigils too.



Alight. Lets see... How about this?


-Patron Sigil: At 1st level, a pact supplicant gains a patron sigil. This sigil can take any number of forms, ranging from a symbol akin to a holy symbol to a small object like a doll or a fetish, but it is always somehow associated with the pact supplicant's patron. A pact supplicant must commune with her sigil each day to prepare her spells. Whenever a pact supplicant would utilize a focus or divine focus when casting a spell, or attempting to detect evil, the pact supplicant must use her patron sigil.

If a patron sigil is damaged, it is restored to full hit points the next time the pact supplicant prepares her spells. If the sigil is lost or destroyed, it can be replaced after 1 week in a special ritual that costs 200gp per paladin level. This process takes 8 hours regardless of the form it takes. A patron sigil can only be used to prepare spells by the pact supplicant that created it, but it can be utilized as a focus by any pact supplicant who shares the same patron as the sigil's creator. Patron sigils, when sold, typically hold the same value as a wooden holy symbol.

[khadgar567]

when I first read the class name i think vestige paladin not witchadin arctype

[Xuldarinar]

when I first read the class name i think vestige paladin not witchadin arctype

Under 3.5's format, I entirely agree. Under pathfinder though, where vestiges only get a 3rd party representation, or have their reflection in the medium class.. it stands a little different. I drew part of the naming convention from the Pact Wizard (HHH). That being said, if you've any suggestions for perhaps a differing name, I'd love to hear them.

[khadgar567]

Under 3.5's format, I entirely agree. Under pathfinder though, where vestiges only get a 3rd party representation, or have their reflection in the medium class.. it stands a little different. I drew part of the naming convention from the Pact Wizard (HHH). That being said, if you've any suggestions for perhaps a differing name, I'd love to hear them.
no name idea just in my mind xuldarinar + any class = binder gish

[Lemmy]

Really cool idea, creating a Paladin of witch patrons.... Using Smite Evil to get Hasten Hex seems harsh... Paladins get just a few Smites before mid/high levels.

In any case, I really like the archetype. I think it's a near perfect fit for a character one of my players has in mind. :smallsmile:

[Xuldarinar]

Really cool idea, creating a Paladin of witch patrons.... Using Smite Evil to get Hasten Hex seems harsh... Paladins get just a few Smites before mid/high levels.

In any case, I really like the archetype. I think it's a near perfect fit for a character one of my players has in mind. :smallsmile:


Im glad you like it.

As far as Hasten Hex goes, I wanted to remove Divine Grace as I felt it especially ran contrary to the theme and sought something to replace it. With the Oath of Savagery's Holy Reach and the Sword of Valor's First into battle, I figured something that spent Smite uses made the most sense.

That being said, it could be altered or replaced.

As an aside to that, I considered altering or replacing several higher level class features, but ultimately kept them as they were. If anyone does have any suggestions, by all means suggest. Most of them I am content to leave as they are mechanically, and I don't think it quite worth changing their names to more witchy things just for the sake of it.







By the way, one consideration I had was make it so they could form a Weapon Bond, or a Familiar Bond. If people think that is a good notion, I'll add that entry.

[inuyasha]

I think a weapon bond/familiar bond choice would be good. One of the main benefits of Pathfinder over other editions is the immense number of options, and being able to have a tiny adviser or a magically powered sword would fit this archetype pretty well I think.

I somehow hadn't even noticed hasten hex, that's amazing! I can use the slumber hex and swing a greatsword (hereafter labeled "stabby hex") in the same round?! Awesome!

[Xuldarinar]

I think a weapon bond/familiar bond choice would be good. One of the main benefits of Pathfinder over other editions is the immense number of options, and being able to have a tiny adviser or a magically powered sword would fit this archetype pretty well I think.

I somehow hadn't even noticed hasten hex, that's amazing! I can use the slumber hex and swing a greatsword (hereafter labeled "stabby hex") in the same round?! Awesome!

I have changed Pact Boon to allow the choice between weapon and familiar. Additionally, I gave them an option; With DM permission, a pact supplicant may have a different list of enchantments. Fiery and Flaming Burst don't fit with all patrons, for example. Winter and water might want to offer their cold equivalents, storm might want to deal with electricity instead, and Plant might even consider acid damage. Meanwhile elements might want to throw out others in exchange for more elemental options. I wanted there to be an option, and a rule of thumb to go by, but nothing mandated.



And as for that combo. Yes, you could do that. Hasten hex allows for better integration of Hexes and swordplay, without making it so you deliver them through the blade. (...maybe...) That seems more territory for a Magus.

[Knitifine]

This looks pretty need. I feel the ability to store spells known is... weird, and you should just change the Paladin to prepared caster in this case. But really it seems pretty balanced all in all. Maybe a little abusable because of hex access, but that's not different from several of Pathfinder's own archetypes.

[Xuldarinar]

This looks pretty need. I feel the ability to store spells known is... weird, and you should just change the Paladin to prepared caster in this case. But really it seems pretty balanced all in all. Maybe a little abusable because of hex access, but that's not different from several of Pathfinder's own archetypes.

Paladins are prepared casters normally. This simply means that typically they must have their Patron Sigil to prepare their spells, and when that isn't the case they have a familiar instead they must have around to commune with to prepare their spells.