Bite: str or dex based?

[Drizztguen]

Is the Bite attack based on strength or dexterity?

[ClintACK]

Quick glance at the entry for Bronze Dragon (Ancient) shows a Strength modifier of +9, a Dex modifier of +0, a proficiency bonus of +7, and a Bite attack of +16.

Conclusion: Bite is Strength based.


Quick glance at the entry for Pseudodragon shows a Strength modifier of -2, a Dex modifier of +2, a proficiency bonus of +2, and a Bite attack of +4.

Conclusion: Bite is Dexterity based.


Revised Conclusion: Dealer's choice. Like when using a Finesse weapon, you can use either.

[Tanarii]

For creating your own monster/NPC, DMG p277 say either just use the bonus for the CR you want, or calculate using ability score. For ability score based it says "A monster usually applies its Strength modifier to melee attacks and its Dexterity modifier to ranged attacks, although smaller monsters sometimes use Dexterity for both."

For players it's an unarmed attack, or based on whatever the feature or feat that grants it says.

If you're making it up for players, up to you, but I'd go STR personally.

[Drizztguen]

Thanks. I was looking into some of the ranger companions and how I might apply some ASIs to improve their attacks, and the Bite attack confused me. I looked at several monsters in the MM and couldn't figure out which stat was tied to it.

[Tanarii]

Ah yeah, they totally need to provide clarification on what improving stats actually improves. It may be they only intended for it to apply to ability checks, but IMO that's unlikely. (Also I can't recall what the UA doc actually said regarding ASIs off the top of my head.)

You can possibly work it backwards by subtracting prof bonus for its HD from bonus, and matching to scores. But they don't always follow those rules, so sometimes it may be a shot in the dark.

[R.Shackleford]

This is why my creatures have...


Physical modifier = X
Mental modifier = Y

(X may = Y)

Skill/save profs to show specialties.

[Klorox]

It depends how into it she is.

[NecroDancer]

I'd say strength.

[Foxhound438]

It depends how into it she is.

https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/564x/45/4e/4f/454e4f972fdfbc586a8933f83449ff37.jpg




To answer the question, I'd say it depends on the creature. The wolf in the MM uses dex (strength is only +1, wolf bite damage is +2), but most things do use str.

As a side note, a lot of the things in the MM are pretty easy to reverse engineer the calculations for, such as a dragon't breath attack DC keying off of constitution, while its wing attack is strength based... But I do wish there was a comprehensive document that showed what stats are used where, because there are a few things that absolutely escape me.

[Arkhios]

The wolf in the MM uses dex (strength is only +1, wolf bite damage is +2), but most things do use str.

This fact has bothered me for quite a while.

While the wolf clearly attacks with dexterity, it clearly uses strength for the "tripping" attack rider's DC. I wonder if monsters' natural attacks actually are "finesse" weapons since there are variance even between medium creatures using either strength and/or dexterity for their attack & damage rolls.

I think that if I were to improve a wolf's strength, it would increase both the DC and attack values once strength rises above dexterity.

[NNescio]

Case-by-case basis. Most monsters use Str, but some use Dex. You have to reverse-engineer the math to find out.

[Foxhound438]

This fact has bothered me for quite a while.

While the wolf clearly attacks with dexterity, it clearly uses strength for the "tripping" attack rider's DC. I wonder if monsters' natural attacks actually are "finesse" weapons since there are variance even between medium creatures using either strength and/or dexterity for their attack & damage rolls.

I think that if I were to improve a wolf's strength, it would increase both the DC and attack values once strength rises above dexterity.

I agree with this.

The problem comes when a DM says "no, the DC never changes with stats", which is technically fair since no where in the books does it say how that and similar effects' DC are determined. Me DM'ing, yes increasing STR increases that DC, someone else that may not be the case.