Semi-simplified D&D for youngsters and newbies

[andylatham82]

My biggest reason for starting to learn about D&D recently was that I thought it'd be fun to try playing with my wife and two kids. However the kids are young (9 and 6) and would really have a hard time with the complexities of D&D rules. My wife I think would also get fed up of complexity, at least at first.

Thus while I'm learning the rules, I'm also trying to modify them to make them simpler. I've seen several attempts to make a kiddie-friendly D&D which have been great, but I wanted to work something out that was understandable by kids, but without veering too far away from the actual D&D rules. I want to be able to introduce the proper rules gradually over time. The main thing I've done away with for my simplified version are skills and proficiency. If you have a weapon, you know how to use it. Where a skill check would normally be done, the corresponding standard ability check is done. I want to try to make the whole thing work mostly without modifiers, perhaps using advantage/disadvantage more than one normally would. I want an ability check or attack roll or saving throw to be simply a dice roll, with an ability added, nothing else.

The exception to not having modifiers is inspiration. I like this feature as it encourages players to get into their roles. As this is the main focus for me trying to get the kids to play, I want to make sure that incentive is there.

I've also done away with death saves. I'm thinking of getting rid of the concept of death altogether, but I'm undecided on that one. If I get rid of death then reaching 0HP just knocks out the character. If I keep death in then the PCs will get to choose whether a monster dies or is knocked out, and I as the DM will decide if the PC dies or is knocked out.

I'm thinking I might also do away with ability scores, using only the ability modifiers as the only score. One is derived from the other, and the modifier is what gets used in checks, so it seems a good idea to just have one number for each ability.

Doing these things has simplified the character sheet:

https://i.imgur.com/cg1VTdg.png

I just thought I'd share this on here. It'd be great to get some thoughts from people. The system is a work-in-progress as I'm still learning the real rules myself and all this is totally untested at the moment. I just want to get the kids and my wife playing without getting lost in rules!

[andylatham82]

Oh yes and I've also colour-coded the sections of the character sheet to make it a bit easier to look at.

[Arkhios]

personality traits etc. might be yet another additional layer that could be eschewed away from the "kiddie"-version.

I've run a simplified D&D multiple times now as a volunteer at my spouse's workplace for her clients (Daily Activities for Badly Disabled People), people who have a developmental disability or who have been disabled by medical trauma, but are still more or less in one's right mind. The client's ages have ranged from as young as 20 years (I think it was the youngest) to as high as 60 years and above.

What I did was that I chose to use the optional rule to have ability scores represent skills directly, without the actual layer of skills to complicate things.
In addition, I made about a dozen pre-made characters for them to choose from, each one including only the most key abilities that make the classes stand out, and left out everything unnecessary for new players, to better experience the joy of combat, social interaction through character's (in)ability, and simply exploring their surroundings by telling what they wish to do.

I chose to let the players roll for attack and especially damage, as well as ability checks and saves, and pointed out that if they wanted to socially engage the situation at hand, they'd just have to tell me (the DM) their intentions and I would then ask them to roll an ability check. All the players would have to do, would be to find the corresponding ability and it's modifiers (which I had calculated already for them. I tried to put clear instructions to what roll and what would apply to the roll (e.g. an attack, an ability check, or a save would read: "1d20+<ability bonus>", or for a damage roll there would already be, for example with shortsword: "1d6+<ability bonus>").

Edit: also while Inspiration is fun to have, without personality traits etc. it's unecessary, and I chose to leave it out.

So, all I put in their character sheets were:
AC (calculated from what gear they have)
HP (calculated from average + max from first level)
Attack rolls (for simplicity, one bonus for all attacks)
Damage rolls (I tried to give each character weapons that would use only one size dice, such as for a rogue using only d6's)
Ability Scores (to represent how much better or worse they are compared to each other, not for much else)
Ability Modifiers (actually, originally I put them with the pluses, but now I came to think that maybe I should've just put the corresponding "1d20+ability modifier" text in here; to save space and to make the sheet less frustrating to read)
Equipment (basically what the characters seem to be wearing or wielding, some simple tools in their backpacks, like rope and grappling hook, a lantern and the like)

The feedback what I've had from the games I've run has been 100% positive, and they've readily asked for more themselves.

[andylatham82]

The feedback what I've had from the games I've run has been 100% positive, and they've readily asked for more themselves.

Thanks so much for explaining your method, and it's great to know that it was so well received by lots of different people. It gives me encouragement that I'm on the right track.

I chose to leave personality stuff in there because I want to encourage the kids to act in a way that they might not choose to themselves. I basically thought that they would by default just play themselves in the game and I wanted them to put more imagination into it than that. Given that they're kids though, perhaps I shouldn't worry about them using their imaginations....they are very good at that!

[Ninja_Prawn]

I chose to leave personality stuff in there because I want to encourage the kids to act in a way that they might not choose to themselves. I basically thought that they would by default just play themselves in the game and I wanted them to put more imagination into it than that. Given that they're kids though, perhaps I shouldn't worry about them using their imaginations....they are very good at that!

Mhm. Sometimes it's easier for beginners to 'roleplay' as themselves (or some idealised version of themselves) for their first time anyway. It lets them get a grip on how the game is played so that they can branch out into other characters later.

[andylatham82]

Mhm. Sometimes it's easier for beginners to 'roleplay' as themselves (or some idealised version of themselves) for their first time anyway. It lets them get a grip on how the game is played so that they can branch out into other characters later.

That's an interesting thought. I hadn't looked at it like that. I shall have a think about it and maybe alter the character stuff. I'm keen to make the character sheet as simple as possible, while still being D&D and not veering into some totally custom RPG. As I said above, I want to set a framework in place with the kids that I can build upon once they know what they're doing.

[Arkhios]

For my defense, I must add, that I aimed for "easily approachable one-shots" where everyone could join with as little preparation as possible. And, well, some of the people suffered from forgetfulness due to their trauma or disability so it's been better to keep the characters easy to remember.

You're right about kids and imagination, though, so maybe it's uncalled-for to remove background traits in your version, indeed. :)

[andylatham82]

I removed the character stuff, at least for the kids' first go at the game. I thought the logic behind doing that was sound.

Here's my new character sheet:
https://i.imgur.com/nSuIR5t.png

It's starting to approach a Fighting Fantasy sheet now!

The only thing I'm undecided on at the moment is whether to include hit dice. I want to allow healing, but I'm not sure whether to make a simpler method.

[BiPolar]

Have you seen this (http://www.wizards.com/dnd/files/MS_HeroesHesiod.pdf)? Wizards put it out in 2010, but it may be what you're looking for.

Personally, I can't wait to try this with my kids in a couple of years.

[andylatham82]

Have you seen this (http://www.wizards.com/dnd/files/MS_HeroesHesiod.pdf)? Wizards put it out in 2010, but it may be what you're looking for.

Personally, I can't wait to try this with my kids in a couple of years.

That looks interesting, I'll have a closer look at it later, thanks!

I'm quite keen to keep as close to D&D as possible and ideally I'd like to be able to play through any adventure written for D&D with minimal alterations. If the adventure says to do something then I'd like to be able to easily do it rather than have to spend too much time translating it to another system.

[BiPolar]

That looks interesting, I'll have a closer look at it later, thanks!

I'm quite keen to keep as close to D&D as possible and ideally I'd like to be able to play through any adventure written for D&D with minimal alterations. If the adventure says to do something then I'd like to be able to easily do it rather than have to spend too much time translating it to another system.

I completely get that, but I'm not sure what the difference is between a homebrew 5e light and using something like this. All that being said, I haven't tried to play this and it may be better to homebrew a 5e light :D

[Naanomi]

I modified a 'quick and dirty' for kids once that was essentially just to give average HP, standard array, and all other rolls were either D20 or D6 with no other dice (with 2d6 replacing d10/d12). In the long run I'm sure it would have created some imbalances but for a few-session games it really made things simpiler... I'm amazed at how confusing the multiple types of dice aspect can be for new gamers

[andylatham82]

I completely get that, but I'm not sure what the difference is between a homebrew 5e light and using something like this. All that being said, I haven't tried to play this and it may be better to homebrew a 5e light :D

Just had a quick skim-through of this and while I like how simple it is, I wish there was more of a story to it rather than it just being a battle. I appreciate that a full-length D&D adventure might be too much for a young child, but I'd like there to be something more there than a fight.

I do like that there's a board and pieces, and that's something I hope to use to some degree in my version. I'll certainly use them for combat, but I'd like to try putting a big piece of paper on the table and having the kids map out the areas they're exploring.

[BiPolar]

Just had a quick skim-through of this and while I like how simple it is, I wish there was more of a story to it rather than it just being a battle. I appreciate that a full-length D&D adventure might be too much for a young child, but I'd like there to be something more there than a fight.

I do like that there's a board and pieces, and that's something I hope to use to some degree in my version. I'll certainly use them for combat, but I'd like to try putting a big piece of paper on the table and having the kids map out the areas they're exploring.

You can always add story/roleplaying to it. The character's and action are defined, but the Adventure Start could be fleshed out more to build to it.

[andylatham82]

You can always add story/roleplaying to it. The character's and action are defined, but the Adventure Start could be fleshed out more to build to it.

Very true :)

[Daishain]

One other thing you can do to simplify matters would be to get rid of raw ability scores and just have the basic modifiers. The former is pretty much only there in 5E due to tradition anyways, only being directly used for things like jump distance and carry weight.

[andylatham82]

One other thing you can do to simplify matters would be to get rid of raw ability scores and just have the basic modifiers. The former is pretty much only there in 5E due to tradition anyways, only being directly used for things like jump distance and carry weight.

Yeah that's one of the things I've been thinking of doing, and I've made up my mind that I'm going to do it. :)

[lordarkness]

When I introduced my family including a 9 year old, I ran a campaign as 0 level humans where they had challenges to overcome and problems to figure out but no actual combat. This introduced them to the concept, the ability to think in that way and creatively problem solve. Then I introduced character sheets and rule and moved them up to 1st level. While I kept skills (because it allows them to specialize and define the unique traits of their characters), I did simplify and ignore many other aspects including some mentioned here already.

I recommend a role play only adventure to start. Assume they're all unarmed farmers or something and can't possibly fight their opponents but instead must think their way through.

I kept the guidelines simple at first and even after introducing the rules. If their ideas make sense or are clever then they succeed. If it there are glaring oversights then the action fails.

[WereRabbitz]

So my kids are 4 & 6 and we play D&D with them.

here is the base character sheet i stole from online:
https://www.wired.com/wp-content/uploads/blogs/geekmom/wp-content/uploads/2012/12/kids-1.dnd_.sheets.daughterofhulabaloo.png

For my younger kids i dropped it down to just 2 skills per character
AC & Saves are just 2 numbers vs 4 like on this sheet.
I also tried to bring damage & hp to a lower range for them to easily handle say 8hp vs 44hp. so weapons tend to do something like 1d4 vs 1d8 ect...

Son uses a Fighter:
Skill 1: Sword Slash
Skill 2: Shield Bash
Special: Grows Big and Becomes Invincible for 1 turn


Daughter Plays a Bard:
Skill 1: Princess Fire
Skill 2: Heal Boo Boo
Special: All monsters fall asleep for 1 round


It's simple and a little goofy i try to make it education as possible.

I try to make it involve more skills then normal:

Sometimes monsters are flying and they have to use catapults to physical hit them

Color & Math puzzles to answer to open secret doors

We have a Traveling Song we use when moving from 1 place to another.

Instead of Inspiration Dice I hand out Reese's Pieces

ect...

[CursedRhubarb]

Kids can be scary smart so don't be afraid to reduce the simplification and get closer to playing without any simplification if they find they enjoy the game. There are some kids that will catch on quick and some may figure it out as well, if not better than, adults that have been playing for years.

The hard part I would foresee is kids being more willing to get creative and you will be trying to keep up with them.

[Cyan Wisp]

Great to hear the youngsters are getting involved.

I'm a primary (elementary) school teacher and have been running lunchtime games for 4 years. Currently, I have 3 games running with groups of 6 each. The players are 7-10 year olds.

We started on 3.5e, but 5e has been a real boon. These guys (actually more girls than boys) cope remarkably well with full 5e PHB rules and a standard 5e character sheet. The only thing they have trouble with sometimes is the skill list, just because it is long with tiny writing. Newbies often need help finding their initiative mod for some reason, so I've started colour coding the boxes.

I don't expect system mastery, of course, and encourage them to tell me what they want to do, not say things like "I make a Perception check!" This way, they get into the narrative a bit more. The first adventure was a Little Red Riding Hood inspired tale. It was familiar and they noticed that they could change the outcome of the story by their actions. Happy to send it to you.

As for the violence inherent in the game, I try to make it more slapstick and comical, with lots of monsters opting to run back to their mummy.

tl;dr: don't underestimate their capacity for coping with full rules!

If simplification is the way to go for your kids, then some great ideas from other posters. Maybe go with average damage too? And a revelation to me has been "round the table initiative" starting with the highest score and going clockwise. Much easier to have actions prepared when you can see your turn coming. Also ignore minutiae like ammunition, spell components, switching weapon cost, OA. Maybe just use the Basic Rules to start with. :smallsmile:

[2D8HP]

I've heard how complicated previous versions have been. I obviously have no experience of them but I do like the advantage system's simplicity.
This edition is extremely simple compared to older ones.Don't believe the blarney.
What 5e D&D is, is fun, maybe even the most fun game I've played, but don't be misled by the well meaning people (that make you doubt your eyes, and powers of reason) who tell you it's "simple". It is not simple.
Gloriously fun and well worth learning?
Yes!
Simple?
No!
The 48 page 1977 Basic rules I learned the game from, or any of the 20th century "Basic", or "Classic" rules were far simpler (but since PC's were less likely to survive an adventure, those rules will likely be less fun for your kids if you don't tip the scales).
When people say "simpler than earlier editions", I think they mostly mean 21st Century versions of the game, most probably the 2003 rules which seems to be the most popular of the earlier editions (see Editions of Dungeons & Dragons (https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Editions_of_Dungeons_%26_Dragons)).

Thanks a lot for the responsesDungeons and Dragons is a simple game really," said a friend of mine. Simple in concept maybe, not when you get into the rules! :smalltongue:Yes exactly!

I know for me only using the Starter set rules and some of the free basic rules (http://dnd.wizards.com/articles/features/basicrules) and excluding much of the PHB makes it easier for me to DM the game, and you can always try:


Fortunately when I need to GM settings that D&D is inappropriate for I have an alternate truly multi-setting RPG rules system I made up in the 1980's based on a careful reading of the 1975 Greyhawk supplement for D&D, the 1978 Runequest rules, and the 1981 Call of Cthullu rules, which I now name "Gut check the RPG", and I will share with you:

1) GM describes a scene.
2) Player says an action that their PC attempts.
3) GM decides if the PC has no chance of success, no chance of failure, or a partial chance of success.
4) If a partial chance of success, GM makes up on the spot a percentage chance of success.
5) Player rolls D100 (two 0-9 twenty-siders back then).
6) If the player rolls under the made up number their PC succeeds in attempting the task, if over the PC fails.
7) GM narrates the immediate consequences until it's time to again ask, "what do you do".
8) Repeat.

It seemed to work.

Check out these threads, and see that your not alone in not finding 5e DnD "simple".

http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?500951-Is-there-a-DM-shortage-What-can-or-should-be-done

http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?479299-What-is-your-worst-roleplaying-game&p=21235846Re: