Leadership feat in E6

[heavyfuel]

Since I only have two players in the current game, I was thinking about allowing them to take the leadership feat.
But the feat is very strange in an E6 game, because by a strict rules reading, they would be forever lv 4, which sucks.

So my idea was to let them be lv 6, but with one of two extra rules:

1 - no extra feats

2 - lower the point-buy from the 32 the players have to 25, but allowing some XP given to the cohort depending on the Leadership Score of the players (20% what the players get per point above 6 on leadership score, to maximum of 80%)

Maybe even a mix of the 2.

What do you think?

[Gwazi Magnum]

I assume by 'they' you mean the cohorts?

Well, usually cohorts are supposed to be side characters. Competent in their own right, but their the Robin to the PC Batman so them staying at level 4 makes perfect sense. It's not like anything will ever be beyond their capability of handling in an E6 setting either.

That being said, there's the argument of a class just doesn't feel that complete below level 6. And if that's the case then a lower ability score array or point buy would be fine. As for XP Gain? Personally I tend to fudge those rules with Cohorts anyways and simply say that they level when the players do (or in E6's case, get a new feat). It's simpler that way, and the power balance between PC's and Cohorts remain the same.

[CharonsHelper]

In Pathfinder there is the Squire feat - though it's only available to martials. It's basically a low level version of Leadership. (turns into Leadership when you hit 7)

Either that or just house-rule something.

[Gwazi Magnum]

In Pathfinder there is the Squire feat - though it's only available to martials. It's basically a low level version of Leadership. (turns into Leadership when you hit 7)

Either that or just house-rule something.

This would work too if you didn't want to wait until end levels.

[Tvtyrant]

If you limit the cohorts and followers to npc classes you can let them level to six without overshadowing normal characters.

[dascarletm]

Make a feat called improved cohort (writing that sounds familiar it may already exist), and make it an E6 epic feat that increases the cohort level by 1. The feat can be taken 2 times.

[ComaVision]

Make a feat called improved cohort (writing that sounds familiar it may already exist), and make it an E6 epic feat that increases the cohort level by 1. The feat can be taken 2 times.

Yeah, that already is a thing. It can normally only be taken once though.

[Yogibear41]

They can take improved cohort to increase the cohorts max level to 5. They can also find ways to boost their leadership score eventually getting up to that 25 or higher on the chart (pretty sure given enough feats they could do this eventually) in which case they would have 6th level followers. (they start to get them at a leadership score of 21)

[Gemini476]

Level 4 cohorts aren't that bad in an E6 environment, y'know.

Although if you want it to scale into E6 you might want it to either let you have cohorts with two less feats than the character or (if going with the scaling CR/level thing) ten less feats than the character.

Letting them keep levelling with the half XP thing they've got going might work as well?

But anyway, level 4 cohorts still aren't that bad in E6.

[Ashtagon]

Better solution. Dont use leadership. Let them play two full characters each.

[Chronikoce]

I'd be inclined to have them take leadership and let the cohorts level to 6. They will reach 6 two levels later and then each player can run two characters. If you're already fine with them running two characters you might as well just let them eventually run two full characters and get the enjoyment of having two completed builds.

[Gemini476]

Note that IIRC the RAW is that the Cohorts are run by the DM - much like animal companions, the players don't have complete control over them. Or get to choose what class or alignment or race or feats they have - in fact, if you just use the DMG's (somewhat unhelpful and insufficiently detailed) random NPC creation tables they'll be fairly unoptimized with all types of race and alignment. Which is probably the one way to balance the feat, really, since just straight-up letting the players optimize a second PC breaks it to pieces.
But even an unoptimized Weapon Specialization+Cleave Fighter two levels lower than you is better than what you'll get from many feats. And an E6 character is nothing but feats.

It's completely understandable if you let them control them, though. DMing's hard enough as-is.

[Lord Vukodlak]

They can take improved cohort to increase the cohorts max level to 5. They can also find ways to boost their leadership score eventually getting up to that 25 or higher on the chart (pretty sure given enough feats they could do this eventually) in which case they would have 6th level followers. (they start to get them at a leadership score of 21)

Lets start with a Charisma of 18(or 17 and one ability point mod), add a cloak of charisma+2 giving us 20.

This gives us a base leadership score of 11.
Various modifiers within the feat can give us another 7 in terms of followers for a total of 18.

The Noble Born feat(Dragon Magazine) adds another 2 for a total of 20.
The feat "Extra Followers" will double the number of followers you receive but won't increase the score.
Might Makes Right(Races of Faerun) lets you add strength in ADDITION to charisma for the purposes of followers only. Lets assume you're a sorcerer and only add +1.
You now have 21.

This being E6 you MIGHT or might NOT be able to get more powerful charisma boosting items or something like The Breastplate of Command further increasing the score.

But yes under E6 rules getting to a leadership score of 21 is doable. But even at a score of 18 you have 35 1st level followers, 3 2nd level and 1 3rd and 4th level follower

[thorr-kan]

You could use the Minion and Sidekick feats from d20 Past instead. They basically break Leadership into two separate feats.