Fun at the Expense of a New Player (Fun for Him Too)

[Someone Else DM]

I DM for a group of new players (5 of the 6 are playing in their 1st Campaign and still learning). A series of bad decisions and ill fated dice rolls led the party to Hell (a bit off tangent from the game, but fun in its own right). During their fun-filled days and nights of trying to find/divine/negotiate/bribe their way out, they were attacked and captured. To provide them with some shock & awe, dramatic flair, and a moment to remember (hopefully), I had them interrogated by a particularly linguistic Archdevil.

The intent was to have each of them think about the situation they were in, carefully plan together for what would be acceptable terms, discuss together what alternate plans could be, and to have each of the characters negotiate / bargain for passage out of Hell (or collectively bargain).

After a discussing it among themselves for a while, the party Barbarian (in true Leeroy Jenkins fashion) blurts out, "I will slay the innocent for you if you give me a hell steed to ride out on!" I ended the session on that statement.

He enjoys playing the Barbarian he wrote up, and I don't want to take it away from him (it really fits his personality). However, what he said is too damn serious (funny) not to have consequences.

Now, understanding that he is a new player, what ideas does the community have to handle this situation???? I want to have it as fun and memorable for not only him, but the rest of the party! Suggestions...

[Venger]

Well, if you don't want to derail your game by having him honor his part of the bargain, and want him to keep his hellsteed, the next time the opportunity to kill an innocent presents itself (e.g. you save some people from monsters) and he doesn't do it, the hell steed could vomit out a number of CR-appropriate devils for the party to fight and while they fight they could shout at the barbarian for trying to cheat them.

or the devils could just teleport in with magic or find the party in the wild. sounds like your circle's having a lot of fun.

[Nettlekid]

Well, as the DM of a group of new players, you have a decision to make. Do you prove to your players that D&D is a wonderful fantasy game in which anything that you can imagine can happen and anyone who gets into the world can enjoy themselves, or do you show them that they're only allowed to have fun in a certain way?

If I read the OP correctly, you're suggesting having the Archdevil kill off the Barbarian for being so blunt, having that player roll up a new character, and having the rest of the party try to meekly creep out of Hell. You really shouldn't be counting on the party to take any specific course of action. When you say "the intent was to have each of them think about the situation" and so forth, that means you're thinking "What I want the party to do is think about the situation," but that might not be what they want to do. And really, if you're flexible enough with your story to let them accidentally get to Hell, then you should be flexible enough to take it a little further.

If you want to be more immersive about it, think from the Archdevil's point of view. Devils love collecting souls, it's like currency to them. A small band of low-level adventurers isn't really worth an Archdevil's time, which means any use he can make of them is better than just killing them. But, killing them is more useful to him than just letting them go for free. Honestly, what the Barbarian has proposed is almost exactly what the Archdevil should want from them, since one soul being let go temporarily (the Barbarian is condemning himself to Hell by dealing with an Archdevil like this; be it in six seconds or at the end of the Barbarian's natural lifespan the Archdevil will claim his soul) could bring in dozens or even hundreds of souls, that's pure profit. The innocents that the Barbarian kills probably won't be doomed to Hell normally, so maybe have the Archdevil instruct the Barbarian to feed the gifted (well, borrowed, it'll come back sooner or later) hell steed the hearts of the slain or have it drink their blood in a ritual that binds their souls to either the Archdevil directly or the Barbarian so that when the Barbarian dies (or when the Archdevil sends lesser Devils as assassins ten levels later) the souls are collected.

Now obviously, you don't want to leave the rest of the party out. The Archdevil can figure out that if the whole party is on board with this then he'll get all the more souls in the end. Perhaps he'd grant a small boon to each party member, like access to the Diabolic domain for the party Cleric, a Devil's ability to see in magical darkness for the Rogue, the Fiendish template for the Druid or Ranger's animal companion, free Improved Familiar to an Imp for the Sorcerer or Wizard, something like that. The Barbarian should get the nicest present for being the one to take initiative and make the proposition, but the rest of the party shouldn't be resentful of him for doing so. And the Barbarian's gift is a double-edged sword; a Nightmare is an intelligent Outsider, not some horse, and it'll be acting in accordance with the Archfiend's wishes rather than the Barbarian's. It shouldn't use its Etherealness or Astral Projection abilities (too broken for low level adventurers) and shouldn't be an active combatant unless saving someone's life.

The big drama would arise if a party member either doesn't accept the Archdevil's gift then and there, or tries to go back on the deal afterward. If they don't accept the gift the Archdevil can pretty easily pressure them, saying either they do it or they die. If they choose to die then you didn't really force them into that situation, and you gave them an out, so it's not unreasonable for the Archdevil to make good on that threat. If they betray the Archdevil afterwards, that's what the Nightmare is there to watch out for and return to the Archdevil with the information, who can then start sending lesser Devils to plague the party.

[Knitifine]

What system are you using? In Pathfinder there's a corruption called Hell Bound from Horror Adventures that could fit this situation.

[Troacctid]

Sounds like the barbarian just offered to enter into a Faustian Pact. Check out the rules in Fiendish Codex II.

If I were the devil, I'd immediately attempt to isolate the barbarian from his companions in order to begin the bargaining process, as they might try to convince him not to sign the contract. Get him alone. Then get him to agree to an open-ended favor in exchange for his hell-steed. Terms of the agreement state that if the barbarian fails to comply, he revokes all benefits of the agreement, so no more hell-steed. (Also, he is dragged back to Hell, forfeits any treasure earned since he left, and has to make his own way out alone. But the devil would conveniently fail to elaborate on this point.)

Personally, I don't normally offer Faustian Pacts to PCs, because the drawback of being un-resurrectable isn't very harsh in my eyes. It's not as if I can kick you out of the game if your character dies. It sucks for the fictional character to be doomed to eternal torment, but for the player, it's like, sure, whatever, dead character is dead, I think I'll try rolling up a wizard this time. So the incentives are a little misaligned between the player and the character.

[Friv]

If I read the OP correctly, you're suggesting having the Archdevil kill off the Barbarian for being so blunt, having that player roll up a new character, and having the rest of the party try to meekly creep out of Hell.

I think the primary concern is that the rest of the party is basically heroic, and that if one member of the party goes full evil the reasonable end-state is that character becoming an NPC because the others won't let him go around murdering innocents for personal power.

So my first question - how heroic is this party? To what degree are they going to boggle, and to what degree will just signing the pact mean the others turn on the barbarian?

Now, if there's only one innocent involved, and the rest of the party is morally grey, they might be willing to go along with it. One death for great power, after all. In that case, you've got a corruption arc on your hands...

[Someone Else DM]

Well, as the DM of a group of new players, you have a decision to make. Do you prove to your players that D&D is a wonderful fantasy game in which anything that you can imagine can happen and anyone who gets into the world can enjoy themselves, or do you show them that they're only allowed to have fun in a certain way?

I am all for showing them how much fun and joy can come from a gaming table. I may not have adequately stated my intentions in the OP; I am NOT looking to kill off the Barbarian. I AM looking for ideas such as the ones you suggested "like access to the Diabolic domain for the party Cleric, a Devil's ability to see in magical darkness for the Rogue..." and the ones suggested by Venger ...


Well, if you don't want to derail your game by having him honor his part of the bargain, and want him to keep his hellsteed, the next time the opportunity to kill an innocent presents itself (e.g. you save some people from monsters) and he doesn't do it, the hell steed could vomit out a number of CR-appropriate devils for the party to fight and while they fight they could shout at the barbarian for trying to cheat them.

or the devils could just teleport in with magic or find the party in the wild. sounds like your circle's having a lot of fun.



What system are you using? In Pathfinder there's a corruption called Hell Bound from Horror Adventures that could fit this situation.

3.5e All characters are level 7 (or so)


Sounds like the barbarian just offered to enter into a Faustian Pact. Check out the rules in Fiendish Codex II.

I did read up on that. Maybe Pact Insidious with some Homebrew variation entwined...I think I should allow them (force on them) the adage, "My character has a 17 Intelligence, I don't." Perhaps allow them to review the Fiendish Codex II and other material that would help them to understand their predicament.



Now, if there's only one innocent involved, and the rest of the party is morally grey, they might be willing to go along with it. One death for great power, after all. In that case, you've got a corruption arc on your hands...

I believe they could be convinced that one death for the "Greater Good" is a legitimate rationalization...poor souls.


No matter how this plays out, I see the party pouring their blood, sweat, and tears into working their way to the upper levels of their respective character classes, only to have Dispater claim their souls in the end. Well, at least I have a few months to think of a vivid description of how each of them will have their soul claimed. :smallbiggrin:

EDIT: Maybe that will be the next thread...creative ways for each character to have their soul collected...:smallwink: