Druid Paladin Wombo Combo Going Forward`

[DragonBaneDM]

Hey yinz guys.

So I'm playing a Druid 2/Paladin 2 Dragonborn who turns into dinosaurs and I'm loving life. (I'm really just a bear with the aesthetics of a Utah Raptor, but everyone's cool with it and I can refluff at my own whims.)

I know this is a pretty popular build (race aside, all it did was help with my MC) and was wondering what a lot of people do from this point on.

I'm happy staying at Paladin 2 because I've unlocked Smite and I think that's as far as I wanna go. Heck, Mariner even gives me a workable Combat Style (I call it Adaptive Combat Style and fluff it as spontaneously "evolving" webbed footing or claws). Thematically I'd have to go Oath of Ancients* at Paladin 3 aaaaaand I don't like their features too much. Can anyone prove why investing further in Paladin would be a good thing? Would anyone else consider multiclassing into a third class? Action Surge and Second Wind seem good, so does getting my Kung Fu Panda or Dino Rage on, but I don't want to get to my ASI's/feats too late (And it would take away Beast Spell as a capstone!)

Speaking of which, I was wondering how most folks have handled Feats vs ASI with this build. Are their any feats out there that just really make the "Bear Smites" build tick? Sentinel and Resilient Con seem great, but should pumping my Wis score above the currently passable 15 take precedence?

Thanks folks.

*Edit from previous post!

[Foxhound438]

I don't know how popular it is, as this is the first time I've seen it, but that's beside the point.

Paladin to 6 is always nice for the aura of protection, but if you're planning on being primarily druid, I don't think your charisma will be high enough to incentivize this. Beyond that, you can pick up vengeance paladin for free advantage vs. 1 enemy per fight, but I'd have to agree that anything else from pally would be redundant (ie extra attack doesn't work with beast form multiattack). Ancients doesn't give anything great besides spell options at 3, and you're probably passing on those due to the casting stat, so I would heavily advise against that. Maybe pal 4 for the ASI, but I would like to think that that's not as good as 9th level spells.

If, however, you are high charisma (say something like rolled stats/greedy point buy for 16's in both) a pal 11/ druid 9 wouldn't be awful. Giant scorpion with 3 attacks, all carrying IDS would be pretty cool, but you lose the cool dinosaur fluff.

[Arkhios]

I wouldn't multiclass any further until I've had my first ASI. Depending on your stats I would reconsider paladin for 5 levels at least (extra attack is a blast), +1 if you have a decent charisma too (14 or more) for aura of protection as Foxhound said above. Also, 2nd level paladin spells (at 5th paladin level) do have some goodies in there the druid doesn't have. (Btw, what the heck is "Druid of the Wilds" at paladin 3? Do you mean Oath of the Ancients? If so, 7 levels in Paladin would indeed be quite amazing as well.)

On the other hand. Paladin 2 is just fine if all you want from paladin is the divine smite burst damage. Just get back to being druid, and get better wild shapes (Elementals are crazy good, just look at Earth Elemental!)

[hymer]

You'll have a harder time maintaining your wild shapes at some point fairly soon. Straight moon druid usually start feeling the wild shape fatigue set in around level 7-8, lasting until they get elemental shapes. You'll be better set up for damage from smites, but you still need to deal with the general vulnerability of wild shapes at some point. My rule of thumb would be to fight past those levels, and keep adding druid levels at least until druid10 (and probably 11 for the Investiture of X spells, which can be really good buffs).
After druid 11, you might want to consider adding more levels in something other than druid, but generally speaking you want more spells, and as you mention beast spells beckons ahead. If you really can't maintain wild shapes, barb1 would help by giving you Rage for resistance to most weapons at a pinch, but on the other hand you should have access to that by now (Stoneskin and Investiture of Stone).

Some more thoughts on various druid multiclassing here (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?457532-Druid-Multiclassing-an-addendum-%28WIP%29).

[Arkhios]

On a related note. Paladin knows the spell Aid (a 2nd level spell btw). Would the increased hit point maximum from the spell apply to wild shape hit point maximum as well?

[Foxhound438]

On a related note. Paladin knows the spell Aid (a 2nd level spell btw). Would the increased hit point maximum from the spell apply to wild shape hit point maximum as well?

I would have to guess not, from a RAW perspective, but I could definitely see letting in fly since it's not a huge difference. Heroism could be a fine alternative, again if you have high enough charisma.

[DragonBaneDM]

To address some points!

My stats are Str 13, Dex 14, Con 12, Int 8, Wis 15, Cha 13. Very baseline pointbuy. Needed a wide spread to MC Paladin pretty early, and grabbing the 16 Wis would have cost me either that or losing a +1 to attack and AC.

Doesn't matter too much, I'm a bit of a middle liner, but those are my stats in Dragonborn form and I'm stuck with 'em.

Anyway, trying for Paladin 6 would be a tough move, and the party already has a Vengeance Paladin. Even if we didn't, with the Druid Paladin combo, I think going away from Ancients (Not Wilds, thanks Arkhios!) in favor of a different Oath would be feel-bads as far as lore goes.

I'm not sure on the Aid deal! I know a Concentration free buff is indeed valuable, but I may never see Level 2 Pally spells.

What are some ways to keep my Wild Shape "competitive" when I hit that drag? Probably Druid buffs, yeah? Any magic items I should be aware of? We're pretty wish-listy when it comes to magic items.

[Foxhound438]

Pick up divine favor for a paladin spell to (slightly) improve your sustained damage. Besides that, try for some bracers of defense? Wild shape says you retain the benefits of class, race, and other sources, so there's room within RAW for that to work for you to increase your survivability, as with something like the set con to 19 item (can't recall the name of it) if your chosen beast has a +3 or lower con mod. Maybe the talisman of claws thing from HotDQ, if your DM allows it, for a damage boost.

[Finback]

I have little to add other than

turns into dinosaurs


Adaptive Combat Style and fluff it as spontaneously "evolving" webbed footing or claws).


inb4 the very bizarre, erroneous and outdated Compsognathis corralestris idea.

[hymer]

Going pal6 with +1 charisma is a lot less enticing. Whether pal5 is in any way woth going for has a lot to do with how your DM interprets Extra Attack's interaction with wild shapes. Probably it isn't.
As for keeping wild shape competitive, well... It's possible you just can't. But don't fret too much, as you'll get some excellent druid casting at druid5, even at two levels reduction, to tide you over. Conjure Animals is an excellent spell, in particular.

[Arkhios]

Going pal6 with +1 charisma is a lot less enticing. Whether pal5 is in any way woth going for has a lot to do with how your DM interprets Extra Attack's interaction with wild shapes. Probably it isn't.
As for keeping wild shape competitive, well... It's possible you just can't. But don't fret too much, as you'll get some excellent druid casting at druid5, even at two levels reduction, to tide you over. Conjure Animals is an excellent spell, in particular.

Yeah, with those physical stats it's more recommendable to stay in wild shape as much as you can (when in combat at least). Extra Attack could've been worthwhile if you had better strength or dexterity, for those times when you are out of wild shape uses or for some other reason can't use it. Now, less so. Unless you have, or take, Shillelagh, with which you could continue attacking with wisdom modifier.