[3.5] How would you price the 'Unable To Remove' enchant of a Cursed Ring?

[Sarethus]

Hello,

I was wondering if anyone every managed to think up how to handle the 'Unable to Remove' part of cursed items? or the always returning part of cursed weapons etc?

The reason why I am asking is that I want to give one of my players an item reflecting their PC's 'noble house'.

The good part is that he gets an Arcane Signet Ring with some minor magic (Protection +1 maybe and communicate with other nearby family members?) on it. The bad part about it, is that he can't take it off (even if he cuts off the finger it will reappear on his other finger by the next morning) and the oppertunity cost as he is still limited to two magic rings and this counts as one of them.

I found this difficult to price as on one hand it isn't exactly a cursed ring, but it is sub-optimal and might not be what he wants to wear all the time. The best he can do is enchant this one which would be difficult as the enchanter would have to enchant the ring while the PC was wearing it.

[MisterKaws]

You should do that on a case-by-case basis. Decrease(or even increase) the price according to the penalties imposed for not being able to remove it.

For this specific ring, the penalties are the loss of a ring slot, which will only be bad at later levels, and only if the character doesn't look into asking for someone to upgrade it while it's still on his hand. In addition, there's a minor circumstance penalty(maybe -5 or even -10) to disguise for having to constantly hide your hands. Check how that will affect your PC(not much for a character with 6 CHA and untrained Disguise) and price it accordingly.

[Jowgen]

I can sympathize with your troubles here. I've been trying to figure out how to price the alignment-based temporary negative levels effect that certain items (e.g. Holy Weapons) have, and no luck there either.

Not being able to remove it is more of a pro than a con in my book. Loosing gear is a PCs worst nightmare, and while encountering skilled Sleight of Handers or creature-only portals that might mess with the ring is a rarity, what kind of price can you put on peace of mind?

As you said, further enchanting the ring is a bit of a logistical challange, but by no means a real drawback. During downtime, there is no reason the player can't just hang out at the crafter's place. Even during active play, there should be methods by which the player can have a crafter working on the ring while the player gets his 8 hours of rest for the day.

If I had the option of getting a Freedom of Movement ring that I know my character could never loose, I'd jump at it personally, even if it means getting strangely close with the wizard who made it for me.

[Troacctid]

It should not affect the price of the ring at all.

[denthor]

Start here I think it takes a 12th level cleric or mage to take the feat what is close range 25 feet plus 5 per 2 levels 25 plus 30 total 55 feet that is a Zero level message spell or is it the 4th/5th level sending 25 words good on the plane.

If the ring is cursed was it made by mistake with a mage\cleric lower level learning the feat cut the cost. Most of the cost would be the setting and gem. Was it made by a person who had to do a favor resentful in nature. He did it for "free".

More important to me is what is the cost to remove the ring.

[Stegyre]

IMO, this:

It should not affect the price of the ring at all.
If it's a GM-made item, why are you concerned about the pricing at all? If this is some ancient family heirloom, it simply exists. The PC isn't paying for it, and he isn't paying "more" or "less" due to the curse.

If it's actually something the PC wants, and s/he is trying to negotiate a price break on account of the curse, No. An unloseable, unremovable item is as much a boon as a bane.

[Sarethus]

Thanks everyone for responding.


Start here I think it takes a 12th level cleric or mage to take the feat what is close range 25 feet plus 5 per 2 levels 25 plus 30 total 55 feet that is a Zero level message spell or is it the 4th/5th level sending 25 words good on the plane.

If the ring is cursed was it made by mistake with a mage\cleric lower level learning the feat cut the cost. Most of the cost would be the setting and gem. Was it made by a person who had to do a favor resentful in nature. He did it for "free".

More important to me is what is the cost to remove the ring.

It functions like a Drow House Insignia (the transmitting version) except the wearer can choose to send a message to all nearby (1 mile) family members and once a week send a message to the family head.

The family head has a more powerful one that lets them contact the rest more frequently and at a distance.

Also it wasn't made by mistake but functions as a sort of communication device for the House. The negative part comes in where it also serves as a means of tracking and if the family head chooses can inflict a 'curse' spell on bearer.

In other words be a good noble boy & girl and we give you rewards, be a bad noble boy or girl and...

As far as removing it goes, a remove curse spell will temporarily dispel a curse (if the curse is active) for one week. Anti-divination spells can obscure the location of the wearer to different degrees (haven't decided, what is best for the story). To remove it I am thinking of cut off the finger and then cast a limited wish spell (or higher). Finger can not be regenerated but a new ring can now be used on a different finger.

The hard part for this is I am trying to keep the house open ended. If there is 'good' head of the family then the ring becomes a boon, if your in trouble it is great to have backup who can locate you. If there is a 'bad' head of the family or if the player chooses to become a renegade, well then it becomes a curse.

Considering the boon & bane aspects of it balancing each other out I am thinking of just giving it for free and only charging the player for any upgrades he decides to place on it.

[khadgar567]

you know it depends on how you want to use it as macguffin then dont price it as annoyance just make hard side quest to get rid of it

[Telonius]

I can only think of two things where the price matters: sale or creation. I'm assuming your characters aren't going to try to make one of them, so creation is irrelevant. The nature of the curse makes its sale value something like zero until the curse is permanently removed; it's useless to anybody but the original wearer. If the curse is permanently removed, then it's no longer affecting the item's price.

If the player wants to enchant it further, just use the usual rules for enchanting existing items.

[Martimus Prime]

I'm assuming your characters aren't going to try to make one of them, so creation is irrelevant.

If the player wants to enchant it further, just use the usual rules for enchanting existing items.

Bear in mind the epic item rules though - IIRC, if the total price would go over 200000 gp, the price goes up way more than one might expect (ie it might come up if they, say, try to make it a ring of elemental mastery). That's unlikely to be an issue early on, but at high level cost is totally relevant.

[denthor]

Thanks everyone for responding.



It functions like a Drow House Insignia (the transmitting version) except the wearer can choose to send a message to all nearby (1 mile) family members and once a week send a message to the family head.

The family head has a more powerful one that lets them contact the rest more frequently and at a distance.

Also it wasn't made by mistake but functions as a sort of communication device for the House. The negative part comes in where it also serves as a means of tracking and if the family head chooses can inflict a 'curse' spell on bearer.

In other words be a good noble boy & girl and we give you rewards, be a bad noble boy or girl and...

As far as removing it goes, a remove curse spell will temporarily dispel a curse (if the curse is active) for one week. Anti-divination spells can obscure the location of the wearer to different degrees (haven't decided, what is best for the story). To remove it I am thinking of cut off the finger and then cast a limited wish spell (or higher). Finger can not be regenerated but a new ring can now be used on a different finger.

The hard part for this is I am trying to keep the house open ended. If there is 'good' head of the family then the ring becomes a boon, if your in trouble it is great to have backup who can locate you. If there is a 'bad' head of the family or if the player chooses to become a renegade, well then it becomes a curse.

Considering the boon & bane aspects of it balancing each other out I am thinking of just giving it for free and only charging the player for any upgrades he decides to place on it.

Based upon this answer it is a master and slave ring. 11 slave rings keyed to one master ring if someone could look that up it has already been priced.