No one fights like Gaston

[Pefgis]

I'm brainstorming an idea to create a campaign based off pop culture characters, preferably Disney,preferably rivals and villains.

I'm going to try to make a character based off Gaston from Beauty and the Beast as a proof of concept/fun experiment. I don't know if this will be player character, npc, or even used, I'd just like to see if the concept has legs, plus it sounds fun.

Gaston seems like a lvl 1 character to me. He is exceptional among his village but untested. I hear there is a ravening Beast in the countryside worth investigating, perhaps his first true quest.

Gaston is human, of course. There are also some potential good feats justifying variant human. Inspiring leader, tough, and sharpshooter look promising.

It's tempting to see Gaston as a fighter, but as an experienced and accomplished hunter with numerous trophies to his name, I see ranger as fitting well.

I'm not going to dwell too much on equipment, but I will probably swap out Gaston's guns for crossbows. If so, the crossbow expert feat looks promising if we go variant.

I'm actually not sure on Gaston's alignment. He's a massive, selfish jerk, but is he evil? He's not trying to kill villagers or doom a town, but he's not above misogyny, bribery, extortion, manipulation, and inciting a mob to violence for personal gain.Maybe Neutral Evil?

Stats is where I'm bogged down a bit, as of now I'm more concerned with conceptually capturing the character over mechanical balance or picking an array and applying it. Here's generally my thoughts...

Strength-14- Gaston is a strong, buff guy. Biceps to spare. I see him primarily dealing damage at range, but Gaston canonically excels at wrestling (where he isn't above biting.), athletic derring do, and grappling. A feat could capture this, but I'd like his Strength to be decent.

Dexterity-16- Gaston isn't the typical wiry, sneaky skulker,not scraggly or scrawny, no, but he's been shown to be an excellent shot and superb marksman. No one shoots like Gaston. As ranged attacks will be his primary form of damage, I'd like him to be pretty good at it. And no one's quick as Gaston, so his initiative should be pretty darn good.

Constitution-18- Roughly the size of a barge, as a Specimen, yes, he's intimating. Burly, brawny, covered in hair,incredibly thick necked, capable of eating five dozen eggs...no one's half as as manly, I dare say he's a pure paragon. I don't know if excelling at spitting is dex or con based, but heck, he's especially good at that too. A Gaston without high Constitution is frankly no Gaston at all.

Int-10- Here's where it gets tricky. Gaston is clearly no intellectual or scholar, certainly not enamored of reading, at least without pictures. He considers thinking a dangerous past time...and yet...no one matches wits like Gaston. He possesses a cruel, sharp cunning that belies his boorish, brainless facade. I'm not saying he'll be passing INT saves or casting wizard spells, but I don't think this score should be negative.

Wis-12 to 14- Again, Gaston doesn't seem too cerebral, but I'd say he's surprisingly insightful, when he chooses to be. As an accomplished hunter and tracker, he's skilled at trail blazing and sussing out quarry and weaknesses and chances to strike. I don't think he'd be busting out a whole lot of ranger spells, that's not his style, he's hands on, but I don't think he'd be a slouch if he did. Hunter's mark seems up his alley.

Cha-16- No one in town is as admired,he awes and inspires everyone, Gaston is everyone's favorite guy. Girls, save for the rare, bookish, oddball, want to be with him and guys prefer to be on his team. I's say Gaston excels at charisma.

Skills- Survival, Athletics, Insight, and Stealth and Perception seem well suited for Gaston. As tempting it is to give him Nature knowledge, I don't think Gaston knows much about Nature, he just shoots what's coming right for him. I don't think he cares what it is.

As a background, I'd say it's only fitting for Gaston as Folk Hero. I'm not going to delineate the flaws, ideals, bonds and traits right here, I think Gaston's motivations are clear. He's...not complicated. Watch the movie

Gaston's favored enemy , naturally, would be Beasts.

Any ideas or thoughts to add?This is kind of a rough outline. At further levels, I'm thinking of going archery fighting style, what Spells would Gaston learn or feats would he take? What does does the revised Ranger offer and what conclave should he take. Hunter seems most obvious.

Lastly, any other Disney Characters that might be fun?

[Jjj111]

There was a thread recently in the 3d6 subreddit about gaston. I can't post links but if you google "3d6 Reddit gaston", it will come up.

[pwykersotz]

I personally feel that he would be a level 5 character, spell-less Ranger does sound good. I also think that his Wisdom is a bit lower than you suggest and his Strength is a good bit higher.

Still, other than that, I like your build. Quite a lot, actually. :smallsmile:

Edit: And as said below, he'd definitely Evil. I think Neutral Evil is a good fit.

[Shining Wrath]

Gaston is the kind of evil who thinks he's good because he deserves what he wants - he literally says that's why he wants Belle. She's prettiest, that makes her best, and he deserves the best.

I'd say he's also got Tavern Brawler, so maybe he's not going to be built according to PC rules. You certainly can't get there with a 27 point buy...
Definitely Ranger more than Fighter. Level is probably higher than 1, otherwise he'd never have taken more than one or two swipes from the Beast.

Now, for his first opponent - Quasimodo, the eponymous Hunchback of Notre Dame. Go!

[Segev]

Just remember that every morning he eats 5 dozen eggs, so he's roughly the size of a barge.

[Pefgis]

yeah, I was contemplating whether Wisdom should be lower and Strength higher. I just figured such an accomplished hunter wouldn't be completely clueless. I definitely considered Tavern Brawler as a feat, it's kind of what he does. With decent stats that he has, I see no reason not to level him up more feat heavy anyway.

You all make good points, Gaston is probably a higher level than1. Five seems a good fit and could justify his good stats and/or give him two feats.

As for Quasimodo, hmm, that's tricky. A variant human or maybe even a dwarf would work. Hermit, acolyte, or possibly a variant on urchin as a background. I'm having a hard time thinking of class. He's physically capable, unattractive but good hearted, and surprisingly inspiring, as well as associated with musical instruments, well, bells anyway. Valor Bard may work. I think he's neutral or chaotic good.
Strength-14-guy rings bells all day long
Con-16, but maybe lower-he's unattractive physically and has a hunchback, which had to be uncomfortable-
Dex-14-he's pretty good at sneaking and jumping around anyway
Int-12-he's educated and might have surprising knowledge of history and religion, but not a genius or anything
Wis-14-16- he seems insightful and has hidden depths of character and an outsider's perspective
Cha-12- it's tricky because he's Disney Ugly and socially awkward, but still a sweet, likable protagonist with (eventually)a strong will.

I'll have to think more on this. Skills could include Acrobatics, Stealth, history and or religion, animal handling (birds), and insight or perception. Maybe he is a bit of a rogue. For these experiments I'm trying not to multi class. This is a tricky one.

[Jamesps]

Cha-12- it's tricky because he's Disney Ugly and socially awkward, but still a sweet, likable protagonist with (eventually)a strong will.



He's likeable, sure, but when did he ever convince anyone to do anything? Charisma, mechanically, is more like social intelligence than actual likeability. You use it to actively change people's mind, but there's no check to see if people find you likeable described in game. In the movie most people treated him like dirt when he interacted with them.

Given that the entire point of the character is that he's a pariah, I think you'd need to ignore how the audience is meant to feel about him and go with how the townspeople react to him.

[JeenLeen]

Alignment
You can find commentary on how Gaston is actually a good/neutral guy, just an egotistical prick. Cracked.com has some good commentary.

Pros:
1. In a town that makes fun of Belle for reading, he is someone who actually values her. (For shallow reasons, mainly, I warrant.)
2. To his knowledge, she is held captive in a castle by a monster. He is willing to lead the villagers to save her, fighting a monster and an army of small constructs.

I'm not saying he's nice or pleasant, but I can see saying he's not evil. A rather egotistical Neutral seems appropriate.

Stats

I could see negative Int, and his 'sparing wits' be reflected by Wisdom or (probably more appropriate) Charisma.

[Pefgis]

He's likeable, sure, but when did he ever convince anyone to do anything? Charisma, mechanically, is more like social intelligence than actual likeability. You use it to actively change people's mind, but there's no check to see if people find you likeable described in game. In the movie most people treated him like dirt when he interacted with them.

Given that the entire point of the character is that he's a pariah, I think you'd need to ignore how the audience is meant to feel about him and go with how the townspeople react to him.

I'm convinced. Quasimodo should have a 10 in Cha, maybe even an 8. I'm not against him having hidden depths though. Somehow gargoyles were willed to life, simply because he was lonely. That sounds like a cha spell to me, he certainly did't read it, just wanted it. Throughout the movie, a lot of the things he wants come true, mostly through strength of character and earning the friendship of reliable and skillful allies. Also, I don't know how he'll learn it, but it would be a shame if one day he didn't know Sanctuary.

For the record, I see Gaston beating quasi. He''d whip up a mob of anti-freak sentiment and turn a crowd against him, and he's no slouch in a fight. The only way I see quasi winning if they are alone up high in a cathedral or castle tower, as Gaston has a bad track record with heights.

[pwykersotz]

He's likeable, sure, but when did he ever convince anyone to do anything?

He had the town eating out of the palm of his hand when he convinced them to "Kill the Beast!" That was a pretty great charismatic display right there.

[Grey Watcher]

I'd say Gaston's best stat should be Charisma. While he's reasonably skilled, the song is less an accurate catalog of his abilities are more reflects that he's sold this overblown image of himself to the villagers and they all believe it (and to large extend Gaston himself believes it, too). So 18 Charisma, before level ups and racial mods, and, if using Variant Human, put one of those +1's to Charisma as well.

For the rest of his stats, I'll defer to people who have seen the movie more recently than I. :smallredface:

Of course, what I'm really curious about his how Prince John comes out. "Mommy!"

(Actually, if you did write up PJ, I'd use the non-canonical original ending to justify giving him a level of Rogue for some sneak attack. Said ending is basically that, rather than getting away from the big jailbreak-at-Nottingham-Castle unscathed, Robin does get shot while swimming through the moat, limps his way back to the church, where he gets ambushed by Prince John and almost killed, but for the timely intervention of King Richard.)

[Biggstick]

Alignment
You can find commentary on how Gaston is actually a good/neutral guy, just an egotistical prick. Cracked.com has some good commentary.

Pros:
1. In a town that makes fun of Belle for reading, he is someone who actually values her. (For shallow reasons, mainly, I warrant.)
2. To his knowledge, she is held captive in a castle by a monster. He is willing to lead the villagers to save her, fighting a monster and an army of small constructs.

I'm not saying he's nice or pleasant, but I can see saying he's not evil. A rather egotistical Neutral seems appropriate.

Stats

I could see negative Int, and his 'sparing wits' be reflected by Wisdom or (probably more appropriate) Charisma.

Totally agree with this. Gaston is the only person in town who tells the townsfolk to back off on making fun of Belle. The only people in town who are fine with her are her father and the dude at the library. Everyone else thinks she's a weirdo.

In any other story, Gaston would be our hero. The only villainous act he commits is at the very end of the story when

The Beast spares his life after beating him in combat. Gaston takes the opportunity to attack while the Beast's guard is down. This is a tactic any PC would take should they think their life was on the line. Who's to say Gaston didn't think the Beast would strike him down once he tried to leave the castle?

Other then this one moment, Gaston for the most part is a good guy with a bit of an egotistical streak and some outdated thoughts on taking what's his (but cmon, it's a pretty early time period the movie takes place in), but he's overall someone the entire town likes.


I also agree that Gaston's Int is negative. His Wisdom could be 10 or 12, but definitely no higher. His wit would definitely be covered by Charisma.

While some people are voting for Ranger, I think Rogue with the Outlander or Folk Hero background would fit Gaston better. Getting Expertise in Athletics would represent his wrestling capabilities, and he does get off a couple pretty sweet sneak attacks.

[pwykersotz]

Totally agree with this. Gaston is the only person in town who tells the townsfolk to back off on making fun of Belle. The only people in town who are fine with her are her father and the dude at the library. Everyone else thinks she's a weirdo.

That, to me, is a really weird way of looking at that.

Gaston is a self-centered egomaniac who wants a trophy wife and is willing to forcefully commit her father to an insane asylum for the rest of his life just so he can have his prize. And creatures who he deems inhuman, regardless of evidence otherwise, he's willing to demonize and kill with minimal provocation. Thinking Belle is "worth" him because she's pretty is not exactly worthy of the moniker "Good". At best I would say he's the bottom side of Neutral.

Actually, now that I think about it, statting up Gaston as a PC makes a lot of sense. :smallamused:

[Gastronomie]

The popularity of this thread shows how much everyone really loves Gaston.

I personally think something like 15-15-18-8-12-16 will fit what he's depicted as. Perhaps Fighter 1, or Fighter 1/Rogue 1 if he's level 2. Tavern Brawler as a V-Human feat?

Either way, it might even be fun to actually play a character based off Gaston.

EDIT: I just realized my username can be abbreviated as Gaston.

[JeenLeen]

That, to me, is a really weird way of looking at that.

Gaston is a self-centered egomaniac who wants a trophy wife and is willing to forcefully commit her father to an insane asylum for the rest of his life just so he can have his prize. And creatures who he deems inhuman, regardless of evidence otherwise, he's willing to demonize and kill with minimal provocation. Thinking Belle is "worth" him because she's pretty is not exactly worthy of the moniker "Good". At best I would say he's the bottom side of Neutral.


I'm going off my memory of Cracked.com's review more than the actual movie, but:
Gaston had him committed because Gaston thought he was insane, or at least bad for Belle. Either he believed there was an imaginary monster (crazy) or he was willing to give his daughter to a real monster (worse).
Now I do admit his main motivation may have been the father being in the way of him getting what he wants (can't recall), but the reasoning was not evil.

I do agree that he is selfish and wants Belle as a trophy wife. I forget whether or not anything notes that he appreciates anything but her beauty. But that is neutral territory, not evil. Being selfish or shallow is not necessarily an evil trait (even if it more easily fits with evil personalities.)

[Shining Wrath]

yeah, I was contemplating whether Wisdom should be lower and Strength higher. I just figured such an accomplished hunter wouldn't be completely clueless. I definitely considered Tavern Brawler as a feat, it's kind of what he does. With decent stats that he has, I see no reason not to level him up more feat heavy anyway.

You all make good points, Gaston is probably a higher level than1. Five seems a good fit and could justify his good stats and/or give him two feats.

As for Quasimodo, hmm, that's tricky. A variant human or maybe even a dwarf would work. Hermit, acolyte, or possibly a variant on urchin as a background. I'm having a hard time thinking of class. He's physically capable, unattractive but good hearted, and surprisingly inspiring, as well as associated with musical instruments, well, bells anyway. Valor Bard may work. I think he's neutral or chaotic good.
Strength-14-guy rings bells all day long
Con-16, but maybe lower-he's unattractive physically and has a hunchback, which had to be uncomfortable-
Dex-14-he's pretty good at sneaking and jumping around anyway
Int-12-he's educated and might have surprising knowledge of history and religion, but not a genius or anything
Wis-14-16- he seems insightful and has hidden depths of character and an outsider's perspective
Cha-12- it's tricky because he's Disney Ugly and socially awkward, but still a sweet, likable protagonist with (eventually)a strong will.

I'll have to think more on this. Skills could include Acrobatics, Stealth, history and or religion, animal handling (birds), and insight or perception. Maybe he is a bit of a rogue. For these experiments I'm trying not to multi class. This is a tricky one.

I'm going to vote for class= Life Cleric without the armor and weapons (or maybe he's proficient but doesn't have access to them). The whole "Quasimodo is a better man than Frollo" thing, though, could be played up. One of the main points of the story is that you cannot judge based on appearances ....

[Biggstick]

That, to me, is a really weird way of looking at that.

Gaston is a self-centered egomaniac who wants a trophy wife and is willing to forcefully commit her father to an insane asylum for the rest of his life just so he can have his prize. And creatures who he deems inhuman, regardless of evidence otherwise, he's willing to demonize and kill with minimal provocation. Thinking Belle is "worth" him because she's pretty is not exactly worthy of the moniker "Good". At best I would say he's the bottom side of Neutral.

Actually, now that I think about it, statting up Gaston as a PC makes a lot of sense. :smallamused:

I mean, would most PC's try to reason with a shape shifted Werewolf? Would you believe someone most of the town thinks is crazy anyways (Belle's Father) about a permanently shapeshifted Werewolf as being someone not to kill? This "thing" has now had prey in its clutches (Belle's Father and Belle) and allowed it to escape. Who's to say the "thing" didn't follow them back to town and now know where everyone is? The only "evidence" existent is the ravings of a mad man and his daughter who's been in the creature's captivity for a few days.

If he plans on marrying Belle, which you can see he pretty much does, he probably doesn't want to take care of her insane father. He is willing to put Belle's Father into an asylum so that he's taken care of and still in a place Belle can visit. It's pretty much an old folks home.

Again, he's bragging about her being "worth" him openly. Most Disney movie Princes are initially attracted to the Princess's because of their beauty. That is one of the major reasons they're so likely to go to the ends of the earth for their Princess, because of how "beautiful" she is. Just because he's up front about how he feels makes him Evil? The main point I'm trying to make is Gaston definitely has selfish tendencies, but objectively to everyone else around him (other then Belle, her Father, and the Beast), he's a pretty stand up pillar of the community.

[pwykersotz]

I'm going off my memory of Cracked.com's review more than the actual movie, but:
Gaston had him committed because Gaston thought he was insane, or at least bad for Belle. Either he believed there was an imaginary monster (crazy) or he was willing to give his daughter to a real monster (worse).
Now I do admit his main motivation may have been the father being in the way of him getting what he wants (can't recall), but the reasoning was not evil.

I do agree that he is selfish and wants Belle as a trophy wife. I forget whether or not anything notes that he appreciates anything but her beauty. But that is neutral territory, not evil. Being selfish or shallow is not necessarily an evil trait (even if it more easily fits with evil personalities.)

Yeah, I like Cracked too, but they're reasoning is shoddy at best. They conveniently ignore large swaths of information and selectively choose what makes their point. It's incredibly entertaining, just not really grounded.

I would argue what truly tips him over the edge of evil is the willingness to kill the Beast who does nothing to resist or fight. He recognizes him as a person too, he talks to him, taunts him for loving Belle, and tries to finish him off. Admittedly he was looking for a bit of a fight, but that was just to show off his hunting prowess.

Also, the scene where they discuss committing Maurice is pretty clear. The caretaker tells Gaston that he's harmless, and Gaston straight up bribes him to do it anyway so he has leverage on Belle. He's using the fact that he thinks her father is crazy as an excuse to do what he wants, not caring that he's hurting him. A Neutral party would leave him alone, like the rest of the townsfolk have, or if they were actually concerned, would go about it a vastly different way.

My personal vote is still on Evil, but I could see conceding Neutral under certain viewpoints.

Edit: I'll leave off here, because I get the feeling this is a bit of a thread derail. The alignment seemed to be a minor point. I'm more interested in seeing other characters or the mechanics of Gaston.

[Beleriphon]

Totally agree with this. Gaston is the only person in town who tells the townsfolk to back off on making fun of Belle. The only people in town who are fine with her are her father and the dude at the library. Everyone else thinks she's a weirdo.

In any other story, Gaston would be our hero. The only villainous act he commits is at the very end of the story when

Other than lying about Belle's father being a nutter to get him locked up?


I also agree that Gaston's Int is negative. His Wisdom could be 10 or 12, but definitely no higher. His wit would definitely be covered by Charisma.

While some people are voting for Ranger, I think Rogue with the Outlander or Folk Hero background would fit Gaston better. Getting Expertise in Athletics would represent his wrestling capabilities, and he does get off a couple pretty sweet sneak attacks.

I was going to say Gaston would make a pretty decent rogue.


I do agree that he is selfish and wants Belle as a trophy wife. I forget whether or not anything notes that he appreciates anything but her beauty. But that is neutral territory, not evil. Being selfish or shallow is not necessarily an evil trait (even if it more easily fits with evil personalities.)

Oh he really doesn't have any appreciation for Belle beyond the way she looks. As I recall outright says she shouldn't be reading, since it might give her ideas.

[Biggstick]

I was going to say Gaston would make a pretty decent rogue.

Right?! Swashbuckler imo to take advantage of the obviously high Charisma.

[Beleriphon]

Right?! Swashbuckler imo to take advantage of the obviously high Charisma.

Yeah, with a focus on strength rather than dexterity like one would expect.

[CursedRhubarb]

I used just standard stats (15,14,13,12,10,8) for this build and it actually looks like he would be fun. Have him at level 5 and took a feat for his ASI.

Variant Human. Neutral or Neutral Evil. He's a prick and only cares about himself but he did try to save Bell, thinking she was still held against her will *cough* Stockholm Syndrome *cough* even if it was for purely selfish reasons so not necessarily completely Evil. Start with Tavern Brawler. At lvl 5 grabbed Athlete to show his skills developing. Folk Hero background, and background with >10 Cha let's him work the villagers but not being super exceptional is why Bell sees right through him.

Stats at lvl 5

Str - 16
Dex - 14
Con - 15
Int - 8
Wis - 10
Cha - 13

AC of 15 for a Chain shirt and max Dex.

Skills:
Animal Handling, Survival, Athletics, Stealth, Investigation (he can track his prey and +prof helps with the -1 mod)

Favorite Enemy = Beasts
Fighting Style = Dueling
Went with dueling since stats make him a better shot than other villagers, but where we really see him fight is with just a single large knife as he tackles and grapples with The Beast.

Hunter Conclave with Colossus Slayer

Fluff a Shortsword for his knife. And while decent with his gun (Heavy Crossbow), his main method of fighting is to go in with his "knife" and use that for his main attack

Possible Future Progression:
6th - GFE = Aberrations
7th - Multiattack Defense
8th - ASI for Grappler feat
12th - ASI Str +2
16th - ASI Str +2
19th - ASI Con +1 Cha +1
(Possibly switch 8th and 12th)

Starting off he will go in all "knife" and fists, but as he gains experience he learns to use a shield and bigger blade on more dangerous enemies and upgrades his armor eventually to a Breastplate with Half-Plate in storage for when a real monster is about. His strength grows with time and eventually he can eat another dozen eggs and gets better at bragging.

[Rainbownaga]

If I were to do it, I would go valor bard, bumping cha as high as I could and dumping Int. After all, he only seems to be a badass when he's singing and illusions are basically the only way to build a character that seems to have high scores in everything except int (and even then, there seems some element that he is pretending to be stupid just to look cool in front of the villagers).

Alignment could be anything non-good, non-neutral. He's obviously a massive jerk, but he acts more like a spoilt 3 year old than a sociopath.

The guy is all talk and ego. He needs to be the best, expects to be the best, and when he's not, he sulks or gets vindictive.

The three times we see him act like a jerk are when he's humiliated: He knocks her book in the mud because she prefers it to him, getting her dad committed is after he is completely humiliated, and backstabs the beast because he got his ass kicked in front of the girl (the beast's mercy probably made this worse, if anything).

The problem is how you could possibly play a character like this without coming across as a bad player.

[Beleriphon]

Possible next, um, victims?


Peter Pan
Captain Hook
The Mad Hatter
Alice
Maleficent
Any character from Robin Hood
Tigger
Bernard and Ms Bianca

[Coffee_Dragon]

Truly no one fights like Gaston. Here we see him launching a couple of exploding bunnies from a ranged contraption.

http://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/me_amor.jpg

[Shining Wrath]

Truly no one fights like Gaston. Here we see him launching a couple of exploding bunnies from a ranged contraption.

http://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/me_amor.jpg

OK, now that's a blast from the past (and a different country).

I will concede that Gaston could be a rogue, but he's oddly statted for a rogue - I'd say CHA > CON > STR > DEX > WIS > INT.
He casts no spells, which leaves out most of the charisma-based classes. Maybe he's a multi-class build that hasn't gotten spells yet - Ranger 1 / Paladin 1 / Rogue 2 or some such.

[p_johnston]

On the idea of quasimodo the dwarfs strength is straight 20. Quasimodo is superhumanly strong in both the movie and the book. For instance in the movie he picks up a large armored man in one hand with no effort.

[Pefgis]

Really good ideas so far everyone! I'm glad everyone seems to be having fun with this, and there are lots of cool, viable builds floating around.