Houserule: Fast Lay

[odigity]

I think a character with one or more levels in Paladin (for Lay on Hands) and three or more levels in Rogue, Archetype Thief (for Fast Hands) should get Fast Lay, which lets them use Lay on Hands as a Bonus Action.

(Alternatively, it'd be nice to be able to heal two people with the Lay on Hands action, including using movement between the two lays, like when using the Attack action with Extra Attack.)

[CaptainSarathai]

It's your campaign, but I wouldn't allow it.
Yeah, a Rogue has fast hands, but I don't think it's just "touch and go."

I imagine it takes longer because there's a level of concentration, and maybe a prayer or little hat-tip involved. It's basically a spell, spells usually take time.

[Arkhios]

you could certainly make a houserule that I wouldn't find at all problematic, but I understand if someone would.

If you have <X> levels in <class Y>, you get to use <Feature A> to do <B>.

For example:

Paladin with 3 levels of sorcerer could use Metamagic feature or features with Lay on Hands if applicable. (Twinned Lay on Hands to have two targets instead of one, Quicken Lay on Hands to use it as a Bonus Action, etc.)

Paladin with 3 levels in Thief could use Cunning Action to use Lay on Hands as a bonus action.

Paladin with 3 levels in Battle Master could expend a Superiority die to cure hit points equal to the amount rolled, or to remove disease or neutralize poison (but probably only on himself).

It could be a feat, actually, if that's your thing.

[odigity]

Yeah, a Rogue has fast hands, but I don't think it's just "touch and go."

I imagine it takes longer because there's a level of concentration, and maybe a prayer or little hat-tip involved. It's basically a spell, spells usually take time.

How about changing the rule to "choose up to two creatures within 5' of you", with the idea being you put one hand on each and say the prayer once for both of them.


For example:

Paladin with 3 levels of sorcerer could use Metamagic feature or features with Lay on Hands if applicable. (Twinned Lay on Hands to have two targets instead of one, Quicken Lay on Hands to use it as a Bonus Action, etc.)

Paladin with 3 levels in Thief could use Cunning Action to use Lay on Hands as a bonus action.

Paladin with 3 levels in Battle Master could expend a Superiority die to cure hit points equal to the amount rolled, or to remove disease or neutralize poison (but probably only on himself).

The last one didn't make quite as much sense to me, but I loved the Metamagic example.

It sure would add some incentive to multiclass, which they didn't really do in this edition. They made it fairly easy and fun, but not particularly incentivized, and with multiclassing-specific boons such as the ones described in your examples.

[Arkhios]

The last one didn't make quite as much sense to me, but I loved the Metamagic example.

It sure would add some incentive to multiclass, which they didn't really do in this edition. They made it fairly easy and fun, but not particularly incentivized, and with multiclassing-specific boons such as the ones described in your examples.

Admittedly it wasn't that consistent to what you could do with Combat Superiority. I just tried to come up with quick examples.

[Arkhios]

Possible example (might need some think-through though):

Paladin with 5 levels of Bard could use his Divine Sense uses as Inspiration Uses if they run out until you can take a short rest.

[Corsair14]

like another guy said, your game but I would not allow it in mine. It supposed to be the paladin concentrating and calling his god for help to heal the target, not "Tag, you're healed."

[tieren]

I thought from the title this was going to be related to sex.

[odigity]

I thought from the title this was going to be related to sex.

And I'm annoyed that it took till post #8 for someone to comment on that angle. :)

[Specter]

Absolutely not. A pally 17/Thief 3 could wreck any other melee combatant in a straight match by recovering 85hp whenever he pleases.

[ClintACK]

Absolutely not. A pally 17/Thief 3 could wreck any other melee combatant in a straight match by recovering 85hp whenever he pleases.

It's only once per long rest...

A Paladin 18/Fighter 2 can do one better -- use Action Surge to Lay on Hands and recover 90 hps, then use his bonus action to do Second Wind for another 1d10+2.

My PalliFie laughs at the notion that your pally 17/thief 3 would break the game with it's inferior 85 hp bonus action self-heal.

[CantigThimble]

I don't think I'd allow it (lay on hands seems like a spell to me) but I WOULD allow you to rifle through their pockets while you restored their life energies through divine grace.

[Biggstick]

It's only once per long rest...

A Paladin 18/Fighter 2 can do one better -- use Action Surge to Lay on Hands and recover 90 hps, then use his bonus action to do Second Wind for another 1d10+2.

My PalliFie laughs at the notion that your pally 17/thief 3 would break the game with it's inferior 85 hp bonus action self-heal.

I totally imagined this image, two level 20 PC's with one laughing at the other.

This gives me an idea...

With the pair of Class vs Class threads we've seen recently, what would a Paladin vs Paladin combat go like? Rather which Oath would come out triumphant over the others? Should we allow multiclass in this sort of thing? Would we have to limit MC'ing to a certain level (3 levels for example?) to keep the essence of the character a Paladin?

The image of the 5 Paladin Oaths at 20th level all meeting on one agreed upon battleground to duke it out sounds pretty epic imo.

As for the OP, it's your game. I think the Thief doesn't get much love as it is compared to Swashbuckler or AT. Let the PC do it.

[Corsair14]

On a side note, you guys play some high flipping levels. I think the highest character I have had in 30 years of playing was a 13 and we started at 6. I try to keep my campaigns centered on the 6-10s with the end game being in the 12-13 area. By then characters are too powerful to really be fun to DM over any more.

[JakOfAllTirades]

I thought from the title this was going to be related to sex.

<Recoils in shock>

He's not that kind of Paladin!

Hmmm, maybe there should be a new Paladin Oath for That Sort of Thing....

[odigity]

<Recoils in shock>

He's not that kind of Paladin!

Hmmm, maybe there should be a new Paladin Oath for That Sort of Thing....

Oath of Aphrodite?

Though in that case I'd prefer a Slow Lay class feature.

[ClintACK]

<Recoils in shock>

He's not that kind of Paladin!

Hmmm, maybe there should be a new Paladin Oath for That Sort of Thing....

Hey, Sune and Lliira need Paladins too...

[Slipperychicken]

Having lay on hands as touch range conflicts with the fact that paladins should be in melee most of the time.

I'd rather just scrap lay on hands and give them something like preserve life channel divinity. They would get so many points (10x level sounds fair), can spend an action to distribute them as they wish among creatures within 30 feet (can't heal anyone to more than half health though), they can use points to clear status effects as per lay on hands, and the points replenish on a long rest.