Need help picking a class!

[Comoke1024]

I'm going to run into an unusual situation in my group's current campaign. One of our DMs indicated that a deity is going to switch up our classes temporarily.

My character is a gnome illusionist wizard who put a permanent reduce person on himself. As a tiny creature, melee classes are not going to work out too well. Here are his stats:

Str: -6
Dex: 18
Con: 18
Int: 20
Wis: 14
Cha: 10

She said she'll let us switch around our mental stats (Int, Wis, Cha) if we want to, so moving that 20 to wisdom or charisma is do-able.

I'd like to stay away from primary arcane casters since that's what I'm doing currently. Does anyone have any thoughts on their favorite non-melee non-arcane casting class?

I considered doing Scout / Order of the Bow Initiate, but we run into undead a lot and those Skirmish / Precision damage increases wouldn't apply.

Thanks everyone!

[Venger]

That's an interesting idea. Hope you have fun.

Are you picking your new temporary classes or are they being assigned by the DM?

If you've got any choice in it, don't take ootbow, it's an abysmal class for many reasons. the primary reason being its ranged precision ability is a standard action, which means only one attack a round instead of the iteratives you're normally entitled to. as a precision damage user, this is the opposite of what you want.

if you're interested in playing scout and want to pick on undead and deal hp damage to them, you might have fun playing a swift hunter (http://dictummortuum.blogspot.com/2011/09/swift-hunters-handbook.html) the basics of which are laid out in one of dictum mortum's excellent handbooks.

my favorite non-melee non-arcane casting class is chameleon, but it's kind of a lot of bookkeeping. archivist is also a lot of fun, and you only have to worry about divine spells with him.

[Comoke1024]

Thanks! The Swift Hunter feat sounds like what I need. I could still get divine casting from Ranger too.

But the Skirmish feat says you have to move 10 feet away before you get the extra d6 damage. Wouldn't that make all skirmish attacks a standard action anyway? Or is there a way to get a full attack if you move 10 feet?

[Vizzerdrix]

Rogue, with just enough swashbuckler to get Int to damage?

[Venger]

Thanks! The Swift Hunter feat sounds like what I need. I could still get divine casting from Ranger too.

But the Skirmish feat says you have to move 10 feet away before you get the extra d6 damage. Wouldn't that make all skirmish attacks a standard action anyway? Or is there a way to get a full attack if you move 10 feet?

Yeah, I thought so.

Ranger does enable divine casting, yes, but its real use is allowing you to use wands.

No. You can either use a mount or travel devotion (possibly with a cloistered cleric dip depending on your charisma bonus) which again will open up wands of divine stuff for you to play with.

[Vizzerdrix]

You can either use a mount or travel devotion

Skirmish wont work when mounted.

[Venger]

Skirmish wont work when mounted.

Sure it does. Why wouldn't it?

[Vizzerdrix]

Sure it does. Why wouldn't it?

Because the devs are horrid people who dont want non casters to have nice things.

Another option is to use a sparring dummy of the master from A&eg. Turns 5 foot steps into 10 goot steps.

[Venger]

Because the devs are horrid people who dont want non casters to have nice things.

Another option is to use a sparring dummy of the master from A&eg. Turns 5 foot steps into 10 goot steps.

You'll certainly get no argument on that front.

What I more meant to ask was, I don't see anything in the language of skirmish itself saying it doesn't work while mounted, and there's nothing in the RC about it. Was it changed somewhere else later on? Like you said, I'd hardly be surprised, but to my knowledge it hasn't happened.

If your dm thinks scouts, of all things, need to be nerfed by not letting them use mounts, travel devotion (with or without the cloistered cleric dip) still helps out letting you use your meagre class features once in a while.

Oh yeah that's a good idea. one of my favorite items.

[The Viscount]

You'll certainly get no argument on that front.

What I more meant to ask was, I don't see anything in the language of skirmish itself saying it doesn't work while mounted, and there's nothing in the RC about it. Was it changed somewhere else later on? Like you said, I'd hardly be surprised, but to my knowledge it hasn't happened.

If your dm thinks scouts, of all things, need to be nerfed by not letting them use mounts, travel devotion (with or without the cloistered cleric dip) still helps out letting you use your meagre class features once in a while.

Oh yeah that's a good idea. one of my favorite items.
It's not a matter of interpretation. The errata for CAdv adds the following: "away from where she was at the start of her turn.
The extra damage applies only to attacks made after the scout has moved at least 10 feet. The skirmish ability cannot be used while mounted."
Even if you could use it when mounted, you'd have to use some trickery to get your mount to move 10 feet as less than a move action (like an epic ride check).

[Venger]

It's not a matter of interpretation. The errata for CAdv adds the following: "away from where she was at the start of her turn.
The extra damage applies only to attacks made after the scout has moved at least 10 feet. The skirmish ability cannot be used while mounted."
Even if you could use it when mounted, you'd have to use some trickery to get your mount to move 10 feet as less than a move action (like an epic ride check).

Knew it was lurking in there someplace. Thanks.

Dc's only 50. Sounds like a totemist dip is in your future. it's always worth attempting, even before you can reliably hit the DC, since if you fail it just defaults to a move action anyway.

[lylsyly]

Dex and Con 18 with 20 Cha would be good for a Dragonfire Adept.
Breath Weapon and Invocations, why not?

[Darrin]

Or is there a way to get a full attack if you move 10 feet?

Several, but the two most popular are Greater Manyshot (XPH) and Travel Devotion (Complete Champion). For the latter, a Cloistered Cleric 1 dip to pick up Travel Devotion and Turn Undead are frequently recommended.

[Comoke1024]

Thank you all! I think I'll give Ranger 2 / Scout 8 a shot with emphasis on trapfinding to fill that role. Manyshot is likely what I'll do, but those penalties seem to add up. -4 at this point feels like a bit much.

[Darrin]

Thank you all! I think I'll give Ranger 2 / Scout 8 a shot with emphasis on trapfinding to fill that role. Manyshot is likely what I'll do, but those penalties seem to add up. -4 at this point feels like a bit much.

Since Rangers get Manyshot as a bonus feat at 6th (or 4th with the Champion of the Wild ACF), you're probably much better with Scout 4/Ranger 6.

Hmm... this is temporary? So presumably you won't be getting more ranger levels after 10th? Ok, how about:

1) Scout 1. Feat: PB Shot.
2) Scout 2.
3) Scout 3. Feat: Travel Devotion.
4) Ranger 1. Bonus: Track. Favored Enemy = Undead.
5) Ranger 2. Bonus: Rapid Shot.
6) Ranger 3. Feat: Swift Hunter.
7) Ranger 4*.
8) Ranger 5. Favored Enemy = Constructs.
9) Ranger 6. Bonus: Manyshot. Feat: Greater Manyshot.
10) Scout 4. Bonus: Improved Skirmish.

*If you want to get Precise Shot in there as well, take the Champion of the Wild ACF and pick that up at Ranger 4. You lose access to ranger spells/wands, but if this is temporary, you might not miss them all that much.