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View Full Version : Skill Trees Are Weird...



JBPuffin
2016-10-21, 10:16 PM
I've been wondering about this today, but you know how MMOs often have (and some other games likewise utilize) a system of ability acquisition wherein you invest points into a group of abilities, and when you get enough points you get new stuff? Diablo has a pretty standard skill tree, from what I understand - each class has three trees they can invest in, and combining those trees in different ways gives you fundamentally different experiences. Final Fantasy 13 does skill trees, too, and I think 12 did? Not sure on that one, didn't play much more than a demo that came with a Dragon Quest game...Point being, it's a thing quite a few video games have done in the past.

Why am I posting this in the general tabletop group? Because some tabletop systems - Pokemon Tabletop United, Edge of the Empire, Star Wars Saga edition, maybe others - explicitly use tree mechanics, and I want to know how a person would go about structuring one. I think there's a way to eliminate most dead levels by reducing the amount of times you get "tree points" (some kind of set progression shared across all characters) and incorporating stat increases somewhere else. Anyone else been thinking about this lately, or would be willing to muse on it for a post or two?

Pauly
2016-10-21, 11:09 PM
Well the first question is whether you have a set tree where the result is predetermined or a more randomized tree, which reflects reality better. Think Germany in WW2 where they came up with some pretty advanced stuff, a lot of which wasn't really that useful for their situation at the time.
Or you. Could have a mix where it costs more resources to choose a tech or skill than to randomly roll for it.

The choice you make about the type of tree (set/randomized/blended) determines how you build the tree.

evangaline
2016-10-22, 04:47 AM
If you are thinking about skill tree's you should check out path of exile's version of the skill tree. I personally think it is pretty interesting and awesome. Every class has access to the same massive skill tree, but they start at different locations due to their starting knowlegde. I do not think it is that suitable for a tabletop rpg because of the dead levels, but it remains interesting nonetheless.

Screw random skill tree's by the way. Why would I need to know how to chop down tree's in order to understand expirimental nuclear fission. That stuff always bummed me out.

JBPuffin
2016-10-22, 06:43 AM
Well the first question is whether you have a set tree where the result is predetermined or a more randomized tree, which reflects reality better. Think Germany in WW2 where they came up with some pretty advanced stuff, a lot of which wasn't really that useful for their situation at the time.
Or you. Could have a mix where it costs more resources to choose a tech or skill than to randomly roll for it.

The choice you make about the type of tree (set/randomized/blended) determines how you build the tree.

If I'm using a skill tree, reality will be the last thing on my mind...what games use randomized skill trees? Like, did you come up with that yourself, or are there games that use that as a core mechanic?


If you are thinking about skill tree's you should check out path of exile's version of the skill tree. I personally think it is pretty interesting and awesome. Every class has access to the same massive skill tree, but they start at different locations due to their starting knowlegde. I do not think it is that suitable for a tabletop rpg because of the dead levels, but it remains interesting nonetheless.

Screw random skill tree's by the way. Why would I need to know how to chop down tree's in order to understand expirimental nuclear fission. That stuff always bummed me out.

I do like that idea - I'd call it more of a grid, but I can get behind making something like that. Dead levels wouldn't be part of the tree itself in the currently hypothetical game I want to set up, as there are some other areas to do stuff with outside the tree, but I'm actually comfortable with the idea that characters aren't constantly getting something new to do. Stat increases would be constant, but getting points to stick into the tree come at specific levels. Also thinking abilities would scale, so you're not getting three different fireball spells which only differ in how much damage/area they have, but you would have a fire fountain, flame bowling ball (flaming sphere's just a fun spell :smallbiggrin:), and a firewall in roughly the same path which cost "mana" and deal damage depending on a level-based formula (Spell X follows the high-damage chart, Spell Y the mid-damage chart, et cetera.)

In reality, there is a game in my head I'd like to give a shape to that would use these ideas, but making it will take a group effort I'm not sure I'm ready to start.