Nifft
2016-10-23, 10:52 PM
I'm looking at two different entry paths to everyone's favorite theurge. I'd like advisory feedback on RAW-legality, RAI-legality, and optimization advice.
Paragon Oracle Fanner
Human Paragon 1 (take Able Learner feat here)
Druid 1
Wizard (Filidh Conjurer) 1
Human Paragon 2 & 3 (advancing Conjurer)
Divine Oracle 2 (advancing Conjurer)
Heartfire Fanner 3 (advancing Conjurer)
Fochlucan Lyrist 10
Human Paragon 1 -> nabs Sleight of Hand and Perform as class skills, plus whatever
Druid 1 -> Druid casting and Language requirement; casting gets advanced to level 11
Conjurer 1 -> The main class which is advanced to casting level 18
Filidh -> from Dragon #324, it grants Filidh Knowledge at level 1 ("This ability functions as the Bardic Knowledge ability." -> meeting the FL entry prerequisite is an important function for me, is this good enough to count?)
Divine Oracle -> Prescient Sense. ("This form of evasion works no matter what armor the divine oracle wears, unlike the evasion ability used by monks and rogues." -> implies that Prescient Sense is Evasion, is this good enough to count?)
Heartfire Fanner -> from Dragon #314, it grants Bardic Music as a level 5 Bard at class level 1, for a total of level 17 music at character level 20.
Discussion: It's kind of aesthetically pleasing that there are zero Bard levels and zero Rogue levels. However, there's a bunch of Dragon content, and there are some features which seem RAI-compliant but might not be RAW-legit. It has a relatively large number of open feats: the Conjurer can use the Combat variant for +1 Fighter bonus feat, the Human Paragon gives +1 bonus feat at L2, and the three PrCs require a total of 3 feats between them:
- Skill Focus (religion)
- Skill Focus (perform)
- Negotiator
The other thing that I like about this build is how dramatically the character goes from zero to hero. At level one he has NOTHING but skill points and potential. At level 20 he can Inspire like a Bard 17, dodge fireballs like Neo, Reincarnate his foolish friends like a Druid 11, and cast 9th level Wizard spells like a GOD.
Two Feats for Two Feets
Bard 1 (+ Able Learner)
Druid 1
Wizard (Conjurer) 3
Mystic Theurge 5 (via Heighten Spell / Versatile Casting trickery)
Fochlucan Lyrist 10
Bard 1 -> legit Bardic Knowledge, plus Sleight of Hand and Perform
Druid 1 -> yeah
Conjurer 3 -> yeah
Mystic Theurge 5 -> nets out level 16 casting for Druid, level 18 for Conjurer.
1 feat for skills (Able Learner)
2 feats to buy 2nd level Divine casting: Heighten Spell & Versatile Spellcaster (prereq met by Bard 1)
2 feats to buy Evasion before level 11: Shape Soulmeld (impulse boots) at level 3+ and Open Least Chakra (feet) at level 6+
The Feats just barely fit:
Level 1: Able Learner, human bonus Versatile Spellcaster
Level 3: Heighten Spell
Level 6: Shape Soulmeld (Impulse Boots)
Level 9: Open Least Chakra (Feet) -> Evasion until unshaped, which will be never.
I think this build is entirely legit.
Discussion: In terms of modification, I could see this going a few different ways:
- Add flaws (i.e. Precocious Apprentice at Bard L1 which allows early entry into MT at level 4 for 18/18 casting).
- Drop two levels of MT and nab Spontaneous Divination for the Conjurer casting side. High cost, is it worth the loss?
- Drop one level of MT in favor of Druid 2, and use the Totem Druid ACF to have Natural Spell. This costs 1 level of Wizard casting so the Wizard side is only casting at level 17, but he's casting in the form of an eagle. Probably better on an Arcane Heirophant.
For Both Builds
What are the best Druid ACFs for being mostly a Wizard?
Taking both of the UA variants looks good: Fast Movement (nice), Rage 1/day (heh), Wisdom to AC (very nice), Improved Unarmed Strike (yay free feat), Track (yay free feat), and Favored Enemy (not bad) -- in trade for no Animal Companion (which would never advance anyway) and no Wildshape (which he'd never get anyway) -- but also in trade for no spontaneous animal summons. How bad is that?
Paragon Oracle Fanner
Human Paragon 1 (take Able Learner feat here)
Druid 1
Wizard (Filidh Conjurer) 1
Human Paragon 2 & 3 (advancing Conjurer)
Divine Oracle 2 (advancing Conjurer)
Heartfire Fanner 3 (advancing Conjurer)
Fochlucan Lyrist 10
Human Paragon 1 -> nabs Sleight of Hand and Perform as class skills, plus whatever
Druid 1 -> Druid casting and Language requirement; casting gets advanced to level 11
Conjurer 1 -> The main class which is advanced to casting level 18
Filidh -> from Dragon #324, it grants Filidh Knowledge at level 1 ("This ability functions as the Bardic Knowledge ability." -> meeting the FL entry prerequisite is an important function for me, is this good enough to count?)
Divine Oracle -> Prescient Sense. ("This form of evasion works no matter what armor the divine oracle wears, unlike the evasion ability used by monks and rogues." -> implies that Prescient Sense is Evasion, is this good enough to count?)
Heartfire Fanner -> from Dragon #314, it grants Bardic Music as a level 5 Bard at class level 1, for a total of level 17 music at character level 20.
Discussion: It's kind of aesthetically pleasing that there are zero Bard levels and zero Rogue levels. However, there's a bunch of Dragon content, and there are some features which seem RAI-compliant but might not be RAW-legit. It has a relatively large number of open feats: the Conjurer can use the Combat variant for +1 Fighter bonus feat, the Human Paragon gives +1 bonus feat at L2, and the three PrCs require a total of 3 feats between them:
- Skill Focus (religion)
- Skill Focus (perform)
- Negotiator
The other thing that I like about this build is how dramatically the character goes from zero to hero. At level one he has NOTHING but skill points and potential. At level 20 he can Inspire like a Bard 17, dodge fireballs like Neo, Reincarnate his foolish friends like a Druid 11, and cast 9th level Wizard spells like a GOD.
Two Feats for Two Feets
Bard 1 (+ Able Learner)
Druid 1
Wizard (Conjurer) 3
Mystic Theurge 5 (via Heighten Spell / Versatile Casting trickery)
Fochlucan Lyrist 10
Bard 1 -> legit Bardic Knowledge, plus Sleight of Hand and Perform
Druid 1 -> yeah
Conjurer 3 -> yeah
Mystic Theurge 5 -> nets out level 16 casting for Druid, level 18 for Conjurer.
1 feat for skills (Able Learner)
2 feats to buy 2nd level Divine casting: Heighten Spell & Versatile Spellcaster (prereq met by Bard 1)
2 feats to buy Evasion before level 11: Shape Soulmeld (impulse boots) at level 3+ and Open Least Chakra (feet) at level 6+
The Feats just barely fit:
Level 1: Able Learner, human bonus Versatile Spellcaster
Level 3: Heighten Spell
Level 6: Shape Soulmeld (Impulse Boots)
Level 9: Open Least Chakra (Feet) -> Evasion until unshaped, which will be never.
I think this build is entirely legit.
Discussion: In terms of modification, I could see this going a few different ways:
- Add flaws (i.e. Precocious Apprentice at Bard L1 which allows early entry into MT at level 4 for 18/18 casting).
- Drop two levels of MT and nab Spontaneous Divination for the Conjurer casting side. High cost, is it worth the loss?
- Drop one level of MT in favor of Druid 2, and use the Totem Druid ACF to have Natural Spell. This costs 1 level of Wizard casting so the Wizard side is only casting at level 17, but he's casting in the form of an eagle. Probably better on an Arcane Heirophant.
For Both Builds
What are the best Druid ACFs for being mostly a Wizard?
Taking both of the UA variants looks good: Fast Movement (nice), Rage 1/day (heh), Wisdom to AC (very nice), Improved Unarmed Strike (yay free feat), Track (yay free feat), and Favored Enemy (not bad) -- in trade for no Animal Companion (which would never advance anyway) and no Wildshape (which he'd never get anyway) -- but also in trade for no spontaneous animal summons. How bad is that?