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SirBellias
2016-10-24, 11:30 PM
This is going to be an... interesting game.

Background:

The DM has decided that there is no player cap in this game, and to remedy the issues that will obviously emerge from such a setup, he is splitting the party up into multiple groups. There are currently three, and each has a pseudo-DM who is basically acting as a player and prompting the others in their group for rolls when necessary. I am one of those, and the DM immediately put me in charge of the evil group, and made a number of rulings during character creation that made me decide to up my game and play a Mythos Character (By Xefas, check it out if you're into 3.5).

This thread isn't about that.

The point of this thread is mostly about personality.

The story I have so far is that my character was a Deekin-esque type of kobold (Whimsical, Bardish) who happens to have been Very Unwise (WIS 6). During one of his many escapades, probably involving a magic candle and a reptile genie, he ended up in one of the deepest pits of the Abyss. There, he decided to sing of his sorrows, because he felt he had nothing to lose. The Demon Emperor sang back. As the Mythos fluff goes, the Demon Emperor was cast into his own plane once defeated, and the abyss formed from his broken body and malice and hate. So my character's mind broke (Deformity (Madness)). So now I have a WIS 2 Mythic Kobold who empathizes with the entirety of what is known as The Abyss. His overarching goal at this point is to free the Emperor from his unholy prison (and the DM and I have discussed that that would probably collapse the Abyss and kill the Emperor in one fell swoop). I'm going to try to play my character as unobtrusively as possible, though, because there are still others who could break my character on a whim.

The actual question here is this: How would you play a character who is definitely unhinged, good-natured, and inherently diabolical at the same time?

The DM is thinking a twisted mangled evil hybrid of Elan and Belkar, which sounds about right. I just wanted to hear what ideas the Playground has.

Herobizkit
2016-10-26, 05:43 AM
Venom.

Addresses himself as "We". Also appears to be constantly talking to himself.

Takes unnecessary risks, believing that the Demon Emperor will protect him.

Fascinated by non-standard races. The weirder, the better.

Collects fingers from enemies, wears them as a necklace. Or belt. Or whatever.

Mechanically, a few levels of Warlock (if D&D-based) would fit this guy well.

SirBellias
2016-10-26, 09:51 AM
Thanks! I probably won't do the finger necklace, as that would probably cross a few lines that will get me killed, but the rest are pretty cool. I'm definitely going to be taking a lot of risks, and will more than likely get distracted by most things I see.

Geddy2112
2016-10-26, 10:34 AM
There, he decided to sing of his sorrows, because he felt he had nothing to lose. The Demon Emperor sang back. As the Mythos fluff goes, the Demon Emperor was cast into his own plane once defeated, and the abyss formed from his broken body and malice and hate. So my character's mind broke (Deformity (Madness)). So now I have a WIS 2 Mythic Kobold who empathizes with the entirety of what is known as The Abyss. His overarching goal at this point is to free the Emperor from his unholy prison (and the DM and I have discussed that that would probably collapse the Abyss and kill the Emperor in one fell swoop). I'm going to try to play my character as unobtrusively as possible, though, because there are still others who could break my character on a whim.

The actual question here is this: How would you play a character who is definitely unhinged, good-natured, and inherently diabolical at the same time?
I like the idea of singing the sorrow to a literal point-your conviction and ego are near perfect manifestations of the abyss, expressed in every way possible. You don't mean any malice by it, and your not really a scheming diabolical monster about it either. You are just a literal manifestation of the abyss. You have gazed into the darn thing so long you ARE it, and when people gaze into you, they see as much that can be manifested into a single kobold. With such a low wisdom, you probably have trouble differentiating between this world and the abyss, perhaps you can see them as so one and the same or both at the same. Certainly your goal is to free the emperor-to merge the two worlds as one, but you do it by your very sake of being, not with any real plan or thought.

Keep your diabolical goal to truly otherworld and bizarre things, not your garden variety murderhobo or mustache twirling evil, but some inevitable nihilistic force driving the world towards such an end. Let others see you and behold the hurricane. To prevent the party from ganking you, don't get too Lovecraftian, go more Daedra from the Elder Scrolls.

I would suggest the Varelse concept from the chaotic evil (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?446414-No-Limits-No-Regrets-A-guide-to-the-Chaotic-Evil-alignment) guide, even if your character is not chaotic evil.



Takes unnecessary risks, believing that the Demon Emperor will protect him.
Mechanically, a few levels of Warlock (if D&D-based) would fit this guy well.
Second taking risks, but not because he believes the demon emperor will protect him, but because I am unsure that a character with such low wisdom would even be aware they are taking risks. Take risks simply because your character is unaware of danger. Also second warlock for a class.


and will more than likely get distracted by most things I see.
I would argue a character with such low wisdom is largely unaware of interesting or distracting things, and might just be glazed over or distracted by expressing their conviction to the abyss.

SirBellias
2016-10-26, 12:42 PM
Good points all around.

I definitely like the whole "Not distinguishing between the Abyss and the Material" thing, especially since as far as my character knows, he just walked back to the Prime (into the Underdark, no less). I also figured my shear existence would be slowly binding the worlds, as I couldn't possibly come up with a reasonable multi-step plan. As of now, the whole party has similar main goals (Escape the Underdark), and I will be more than willing to let them help me do so. I always have to have a reason to do things with my characters, so I am definitely not going the Murderhobo route.

Yeah, I just assumed that my risk assessment would be basically nonexistent. Which may cause the party to hate me anyways, depending on how I do that... In fact, as far as the DM and I have figured out, there will be one. That is true about the distractions.

I currently am going with the Jagganatha, which is a Mythic Blackguard, basically. I definitely don't look like a Kobold anymore. Probably more like a humanoid, medium sized dragon made of brass and emerald fire. So probably somewhere between a Golden Saint and a Daedroth from Oblivion. With wings. Which does not help with the whole "don't kill me" thing. I don't technically have an evil aura, as I'm going for the "unstoppable juggernaut" ability tree instead of the "Abyssal Herald" ones, but I am pretty sure some assumptions will be made.

Hawkstar
2016-10-26, 12:47 PM
My problem with so many "I'm playing an insane character - how do?" threads is the suggestions that end up just tacking on stereotypical 'Lolcrazy' symptoms onto a character, with no thought or reason for it. (I think the 'collecting fingers" suggestion is the most egregious of these 'crazy for the sake of crazy' ones). From an insane person's warped viewpoint, everything they do is clearly sensible. The problem isn't in the character's output, it's in the input.

He wants to free the Emperor from the Abyss, because he sympathizes with him. That's already enough crazy to fill any nutjob twice over, even if he's otherwise seemingly rational and coherent. But he's also WIS 2 - that means a remarkable lack of awareness of the outside world - What he sees and hears is not necessarily what is there, and probably open up to suggestion - either from those around him, or from his own thoughts (Which are in turn driven by his quest)

As far as Talking to Himself - that's a natural extension of simply talking to himself due to his sensory near-isolation. And, of course, he'd be talking about his plot to free the Emperor.

Inevitability
2016-10-26, 01:04 PM
You're playing this guy (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/member.php?71333-A-Tad-Insane)? :smalltongue:

Spore
2016-10-27, 05:15 AM
My problem with so many "I'm playing an insane character - how do?" threads is the suggestions that end up just tacking on stereotypical 'Lolcrazy' symptoms onto a character, with no thought or reason for it.

I agree. Let us extend on your sensory isolation (Wis 2 means bad BAD Perception and Sense Motive too) and add constant daydreaming, or slipping in and out of the nightmare your patron calls home. Mentally your bard never really left the Abyss. His mind is fragmented between here and there. You are a -2 penalty away from being comatose.

1) He might fear sleeping. The nightmares come back when he sleeps. Constant sleep deprivation adds to the hallucinations. He might think the NPCs are giant demons. He might think an enemy group is a group of weirdly humanoid shaped fluffy bunnies.

Or imagine seeing your living day to day life like this:

http://img15.deviantart.net/55c4/i/2005/328/f/3/sleep_deprivation_part_1_by_lucystar99.jpg

2) He talks to his imaginary friends and his master alike, as if they were standing next to him. He might put certain personality traits of his friends while talking to them (normally Wis 2 would not allow for interacting with the others but you should have that caveat for you). Basically this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M3iOROuTuMA

3) Add small pieces. Fidget around with things all the time due to nervosity. Mumble a few words as if trying to talk to people around you and your friends at the same time. Answer them: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0vvU-Ajwbok

SirBellias
2016-10-27, 08:34 AM
I agree. Let us extend on your sensory isolation (Wis 2 means bad BAD Perception and Sense Motive too) and add constant daydreaming, or slipping in and out of the nightmare your patron calls home. Mentally your bard never really left the Abyss. His mind is fragmented between here and there. You are a -2 penalty away from being comatose.

Fair enough. Makes sense to me. Everything on the Prime is just as chaotic and confusing, for some reason.... He's likely not going to notice real things unless they are trying to acquire his attention, are right in front of him, or he gets attacked. And even then, it is kind of a toss up....


1) He might fear sleeping. The nightmares come back when he sleeps. Constant sleep deprivation adds to the hallucinations. He might think the NPCs are giant demons. He might think an enemy group is a group of weirdly humanoid shaped fluffy bunnies.

This is a good idea, though my character apparently doesn't need to eat, drink, breathe, or sleep. Of course, that doesn't mean he still doesn't feel deprived. He just doesn't require it to function normally (for a given value of normal).


2) He talks to his imaginary friends and his master alike, as if they were standing next to him. He might put certain personality traits of his friends while talking to them (normally Wis 2 would not allow for interacting with the others but you should have that caveat for you). Basically this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M3iOROuTuMA

Good idea! His perception of the outside world is so bad he may actually think they're there.


3) Add small pieces. Fidget around with things all the time due to nervosity. Mumble a few words as if trying to talk to people around you and your friends at the same time. Answer them: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0vvU-Ajwbok

All good ideas! I'll definitely keep up on the mumbling to other people. Staring into the distance as if there was something there is also something that makes sense.

Herobizkit
2016-10-28, 04:47 AM
Another fun quirk could be to refer to the people he meets as concepts rather than their proper name.

Drizzit Sturgeon, Drow ranger with magical swords, might be "Sparkle Elf".
Brewmore Cattlehammer, Dwarven Cow King and Warrior, might be "Redbeard" or "Cowhead".
Wolfguard, Hew-mon Barbarian and worshipper of Tempus, might be "Shoutface".

Or, maybe he calls everyone "Charlie".

A Tad Insane
2016-10-28, 10:53 AM
You rang?

Wisdom is a weird stat, represent a creatures ability to 'perceive', in all aspects. Such a character would be unable to focus on ANYTHING but his goal, and even that would be hazy.

He would probably view the world as nightmarishly dull, his senses so unturned as to barely even count as sensing. He wouldn't be able to tell the trees for the forest, as it were. The world would be a mix of silent hill, the video game limbo, and dead by daylight.

People would either appear as uncanny drones, seeming to act without any emotion or cause, as concepts like hero said, or even as just another part of the scenery, due to the fact he has so little sense of the world.

Now all this would be terrifying, if he actually could feel terror. The dude listen to the abyss and became one with it. All the things people are normally afraid of, (eg pain, death, the unknown, rejection, lose of things they care about, clowns) are either a) Require to much awareness to fully grasp, or b) Not as bad as the literal hellscape that is his mind now. He would walk on the rickety old bridge over murder chasm not out of bravery or belief he'll be saved, but because he literally can't see the ropes fraying, or see how far down it is, or even hold on to the notion that 'falling kobold goes splat at the end'.

SirBellias
2016-10-29, 09:46 PM
All cool ideas. Thanks for chipping in!

Actual implementation is turning out to be a struggle, as I didn't realize I would basically be running a game AND having a character on said game, but oh well. I'm bad at being a player and a DM at the same time, so I'm focusing more on the DM side so that everyone else doesn't get annoyed.

But really, thanks y'all.

Mutazoia
2016-10-30, 02:40 AM
. There are so many kinds and degrees of mental illness, that answering a "how-to" can easily fill up the character limit on a post. Most people tend to play "insane" characters like Murdoc from the A-Team. Which isn't necessarily a bad thing, but it's over done. We'll have to take your 3 listed traits (in a VERY brief overview) seperately.

Playing a character that is "unhinged, good-natured, and inherently diabolical":

First you have to decide in what way is he "unhinged". This is a very loose term and leaves a lot of room for interpretation. So, for the sake of simplicity, we'll use the example of a Murdoc-esk character.

Think of him as a person with extreme ADHD. His mind is a TV with the remote permenantly set on "shuffle". He percieves things just as well as everybody else, but his low wisdom score means that the world he percieves isn't necessairly the same one that everybody else does. Physically, everything is the same, but things like right and wrong, are different, and he just goes with it.

For example: In one game, I had a character named Blake, who was "A tad insane". At one point, left alone on the ship (sci-fi game, btw), Blake spilled Ketchup on his shirt and in his lap, while watching a local TV show broadcast from the planet they were orbiting. Now, a normal person would go and change clothes. Blake started off to his quarters, removing his shirt as he stood up. Then agonized about missing part of the show. Waiting for a commercial, he removed his pants. Now he's standing in the control room, in his boxers. At this point, he reasons that he's already mostly naked, and it would be much easier to take off the one remaining piece of clothing right there, than it would be to walk all the way to his quarters and put on two pieces of clothing. So he stripped, and spend the rest of the time alone aboard ship naked, because it was easier than getting dressed.

Not only did he save time and effort by not re-dressing, but he avoided geting any more clothes dirty in the process. In fact, he thought it was the best idea in the world to never wear clothing (weather permitting) again, for these very reasons. To him, this was the height of logic.

Second, you specified "good natured". Again we can draw a parallel with Murdoc from the A-Team. Most of the time his brand of crazy is harmless, and at times funny (even if it does get old after a while). He's bound to take some statemends quite literally: Ask him if he's paying attention and he may respond "Yes, but not to you.", or tell him to take a seat and he'll do the old "picks up a chair" routine. Sure, it's old, but it's always new (and just as funny) to him. Basically if Murdoc and Curly (3 stooges) had a love child.

With Blake, for example: Upon learning that Blake was running around the ship naked, the captain told him that he "had better have pants on when we get back up there!" When the crew reurned to the ship, Blake was indeed wearing pants. He had the waste band around his head, and the legs dangling like rabbit ears. Otherwise he was still stark naked. His logic/response? "I have pants on as ordered. If you wanted them worn in a particular fashion, you should have specified." And then, being persuaded by another crew member to get dressed properly, strolled down the corridore towards his quarters, singing a jaunty tune:

"Oh, I've got no pants to hold me down,
See my willy bounce around.
It bounces up, and it bounces down,
I got no pants on me!"

Third, Diabolical: This is where it get's a bit tricky. To combine this successfully with the two above traits, your character is going to have to be extremely bi-polar. First, you'll have to decide what mental model to give his evil side, and then decide on a "switch" that causes that side to emerge.

In the case of Blake, his evil side was classified as homisical psycopath. His switch was one of the female crew members. When ever she was in trouble, his dark side shone like...well like a black hole...darkeness doesn't really shine. When the switch was flipped, he went from Murdoc to Hannibal Lechter in nothing flat. He once nuked the entire eastern sea-board of a major continent simply because an NPC broke her arm while holding her hostage. Millions of men, woman and children dead, and several thousand miles of coastline radio-active for a few hundred years, over an injury that the ships med-center could repair in moments. To him, it was well justified and made perfect sense...his personal right/wrong meter reasoned that the natives would much rather return the captured crew, than lose the western seaboard. Eradicating the eastern seaboard was payback for the broken arm.

He did all this, even the video call with the NPC, still completely naked.