Giving the paladin a good death

[NerdHut]

I've got a player with a paladin who wants to do a new character. We both want to play out the paladin's death so it's not like one character pops out and a new one pops in, y'know?

So we've decided he will go out in battle, and die a good paladin's death. The trouble is I'm not quite sure how to set it up. The only thing I can think of is dropping a character to below 0 and cuing him to step in and fall in battle before a coup de grace. The problem with that logic is that as soon as he's down, the other character can easily be killed.

Has anyone else scripted out a heroic death with a player? How did you make it work?

[stanprollyright]

I was the player in this one. I had a monk/druid who had to be lawful neutral and had to dump Int and Cha. So I never figured out how to RP his character because I'm used to playing basically the opposite (bards and such). Mostly he never really said much, so I got bored and asked to make a new toon.

I don't remember where I got it, but that character had a scroll of Dimension Door that he'd been saving. We had talked about killing him off during the final boss fight, but never got into specifics. So after a couple rounds when things are getting harry, I asked, "Can I telefrag him?"
"What?"
"Telefrag. Teleport into him. I have this Scroll of D. Door..." I motion with my hands.
"...Oooohhh. Umm...sure? Roll UMD. OK, uhh...Fort save. *he rolls one too* Nope. You both explode."

I found that a pretty satisfying way to go.

EDIT: I guess that wasn't exactly scripted.

[NerdHut]

EDIT: I guess that wasn't exactly scripted.

Not scripted, but I enjoyed the story anyway!

[Crake]

I was the player in this one. I had a monk/druid who had to be lawful neutral and had to dump Int and Cha. So I never figured out how to RP his character because I'm used to playing basically the opposite (bards and such). Mostly he never really said much, so I got bored and asked to make a new toon.

I don't remember where I got it, but that character had a scroll of Dimension Door that he'd been saving. We had talked about killing him off during the final boss fight, but never got into specifics. So after a couple rounds when things are getting harry, I asked, "Can I telefrag him?"
"What?"
"Telefrag. Teleport into him. I have this Scroll of D. Door..." I motion with my hands.
"...Oooohhh. Umm...sure? Roll UMD. OK, uhh...Fort save. *he rolls one too* Nope. You both explode."

I found that a pretty satisfying way to go.

EDIT: I guess that wasn't exactly scripted.

That's a pretty permitting DM to completely ignore the clearly states rules in dimension door as to the effects of attempting to arrive in a creature's location, which is to say, only you were supposed to take damage, and only a measly 2d6, before being shunted into a random square.

Regarding the paladin's predicament, he could put himself in harms way as he lay on hands his fallen comrade, then holding the line as his friend escaped, eventually succumbing to overwhelming forces. Really though, a scripted event doesn't work unless all the players are in on it, because it just takes one unexpected action by a player to ruin the whole plan. And if it's completely scripted, then you don't even need game mechanics to explain it all, simply write a short piece on what happens and how it goes down.

[Kelb_Panthera]

Explain to me again why the Pally can't just have his calling call him away from the group? Some senior member of the church tells him his service is needed for something elsewhere and he needs to drop whatever he's doing and hop to, on pain of excommunication if necessary. He can write up whatever the heck he wants about his papadin dying on that mission without disrupting the game and simply slide his new character in wherever you agree is appropriate.

Attempting to script a death to happen in game just rubs me the wrong way for some reason.

[NerdHut]

Explain to me again why the Pally can't just have his calling call him away from the group? Some senior member of the church tells him his sergice is needed for something elsewhere and he needs to drop whatever he's doing and hop to, on pain of excommunication if necessary. He can write up whatever the heck he wants about his papadin dying on that mission without disrupting the game and simply slide his new character in wherever you agree is appropriate.

Attempting to script a death to happen in game just rubs me the wrong way for some reason.

His paladin isn't part of a holy quest or order. He upholds law and goodness in general. So being called away isn't sufficient. The character dying a heroic death was his idea, and I'm inclined to give it to him because I love a good heroic death.

[Kelb_Panthera]

His paladin isn't part of a holy quest or order. He upholds law and goodness in general. So being called away isn't sufficient. The character dying a heroic death was his idea, and I'm inclined to give it to him because I love a good heroic death.

I can dig a heroic death. I've got no problem with the death part, it's the scripting bit that bugs me. If I were in his position, and just retiring the character wasn't an option (maybe a herald of his deity tells him of a dire need for him elsewhere?), then I'd just let you know I was gonna "fall on my sword" at the first opportunity so I can make a new character and start fighting wreckless as hell when combat rolled around. Maybe he's cocky, maybe he feels guilty about a past failure, doesn't matter. It'll happen when it happens at the mercy of the dice. Maybe it's heroic, maybe it's hillarious. Either way room is made for the new character.

[Crake]

I can dig a heroic death. I've got no problem with the death part, it's the scripting bit that bugs me. If I were in his position, and just retiring the character wasn't an option (maybe a herald of his deity tells him of a dire need for him elsewhere?), then I'd just let you know I was gonna "fall on my sword" at the first opportunity so I can make a new character and start fighting wreckless as hell when combat rolled around. Maybe he's cocky, maybe he feels guilty about a past failure, doesn't matter. It'll happen when it happens at the mercy of the dice. Maybe it's heroic, maybe it's hillarious. Either way room is made for the new character.

I assume the problem with this (which is honestly how I would play it, but I can understand why not) is that "when it happens" could potentially be several sessions down the line, and I assume the player would like to start playing their new character right away.

[stanprollyright]

That's a pretty permitting DM to completely ignore the clearly states rules in dimension door as to the effects of attempting to arrive in a creature's location, which is to say, only you were supposed to take damage, and only a measly 2d6, before being shunted into a random square.

That would have been a lot of unforeseen bookwork, plus we did talk about killing that character in that particular fight. It also might not have been Dimension Door per se.

[BaronDoctor]

The general sort of good heroic death is either a (Caution: TV Tropes Links!) "Go, I'll hold them off" (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/DrawAggro) or a "I'll take them with me (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/TakingYouWithMe)" sort of death. If you find a scenario where either of those makes sense, do it. Play it up, maximum dramatics.

The one that still gets me is from Serenity. The group is trying to get to a broadcast base to get a signal out. This one actually LAYERS the "Go, I'll hold them off": the group sets up to block for their captain who's going to get the signal out. They meet the enemy and fight. They sustain wounds and fall back to a hall with a door. Their medic's bag is outside the door. THIS (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XuKpvyO3-qE) is the end result.

...I mean, my last paladin-esque character did the whole cavalry charger thing and blocked an army at a bridge. Dared the evil army's commander to face him in single combat on horseback. "After all, if you can't beat me, what chance could you possibly have against the group aligned to stop you?" He rode out, killed the commander, and then was dogpiled by the hostile forces.

My last Heroic Sacrifice character was a Large beatstick who had magnetic gloves, Strength to attack rolls for throwing, and proficiency with lightsabers. He blocked an elevator for the group when a Sith attacked and bought them some time. Way more than he had any right to for not actually being able to do anything special with the lightsaber, but he made the Sith THINK he was a Jedi, and made the Sith go through him rather than around.

[stanprollyright]

The general sort of good heroic death is either a "Go, I'll hold them off" or a "I'll take them with me" sort of death. If you find a scenario where either of those makes sense, do it. Play it up, maximum dramatics.

This^

Make an encounter that's a couple CR above your party's typical boss fight; make sure the heroes have an escape route that can be turned into a bottleneck.

Example: make a nice challenging encounter with several mooks and a couple bad guys that have PC levels comparable to the party. Have it seem like that's the last encounter of this particular dungeon/arc. After roughing up the heroes a bit and running them low on spells and resources, "releases the kraken". Have them make Listen or Spot checks to hear/see the angry Tarrasque (or something similarly fearsome) barreling down the tunnel/hallway/etc. a round before it shows up. When it does, it attacks the remaining bad guys first to give your heroes time to organize the retreat. Pally stays behind to hold it off for a few seconds.

Could also "Hold the Door" from infinite mooks.

Or even simpler: An evil Paladin challenges the good Pally to single combat. His honor forces him to accept. Make the NPC like 2 levels higher with poisoned weapons and diseased touches, so even if the good Pally wins he can still succumb to his wounds shortly thereafter.

[DarkEternal]

I'd advise a Bottleneck thing as well. Paladin stays behind to hold the throng of enemies off while the rest of the party escapes. Would be great if you talk with him outside of the game to prepare some spell that might add a benefit.

Like this one (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic/all-spells/b/blaze-of-glory). Fluff it that the unleash of divine energies toppled and buried the enemies chasing after you as the paladin exploded. Everyone is happy.

[ledod126]

Maybe it could a "stall" narrative. There is an insurmountable horde threatening to kill "everyone." However, the altruistic, heroic paladin intervenes, allowing everyone (minus one paladin) the opportunity to escape, but sealing his fate. He falls valiantly, and allows the story to progress. :smallfrown: