Is this a good sorcerer spell list?

[NecroDancer]

The sorcerer is shadow sorcerer. It has an AC of 15(with Mage armor) and HP of 44 (14 constitution). The sorcerer is level 7.

Cantrips:
Message
Firebolt
Mage hand
Minor illusion
Shocking grasp
Control flames

1st level spells
Shield
Mage armor

2nd level spells
Mirror image
Scorching ray

3rd level spells
Slow
Fly
Counterspell

4th level spells
Watery sphere

My main questions are should I replace scorching ray with fireball? Should I get polymorph or haste when I level up? Is dimension door any good?

[Sigreid]

I would encourage you to take hypnotic pattern. I've been playing a sorc with hypnotic pattern and careful spell and it has been amazing for turning deadly encounters into a cake walk. To the point were last session one of the other players simply said "that's a great spell".

[Toadkiller]

You have few offensive spells. Note - these don't have to cause direct damage. That can be ok, but make sure you have things to do against various foes. What's the plan for mooks? For boss fights, for when you aren't sure what the bad guy can do yet.

[Gastronomie]

As for the Scorching Ray question: Yes, in every single possible way. In fact you should never take Scorching Ray unless you're a Draconic Sorcerer and your DM is smart/flexible enough to ignore sage (or so they say) advise.

First please tell us your Metamagic options and whether you have War Caster or not, because those aspects really have a lot to do with spell selection. For instance, if you have Careful Spell, Web, Hypnotic Pattern and Stinking Cloud become godly, while with Twinned, Greater Invisibility and Polymorph become boss. Haste too, if you have War Caster - but a trap option without both Twinned and War Caster.

Please tell us more, and we can advise you more.

[Sicarius Victis]

As a general rule, I have to recommend Vampiric Touch if you expect to end up in melee. Its damage isn't the best, but the added survivability is useful, and works rather well with Strength of the Grave.

Also, it just fits awesomely well flavour-wise.

[NecroDancer]

My metamagic options are twinned and quickened. I plan to pick up warcaster at level 8.

[Gastronomie]

My metamagic options are twinned and heightened, I plan to pick up warcaster at level 8.Heightened? Really? ...Doesn't that overlap quite a lot with Hound of Ill Omen? If you wish to optimize, consider asking your DM if you can swap it for something else at next level.

If you took Twinned Spell, make sure to get Greater Invisibility and/or Polymorph. This differs a bit based on party composition (Great Weapon Masters, Sharpshooters and Rogues love Greater Invisibility more, while guys like Barbarians may prefer Polymorph). And since your next level is level 8, Haste as well.

[NecroDancer]

Heightened? Really? ...Doesn't that overlap quite a lot with Hound of Ill Omen? If you wish to optimize, consider asking your DM if you can swap it for something else at next level.

If you took Twinned Spell, make sure to get Greater Invisibility and/or Polymorph. This differs a bit based on party composition (Great Weapon Masters, Sharpshooters and Rogues love Greater Invisibility more, while guys like Barbarians may prefer Polymorph). And since your next level is level 8, Haste as well.

Thanks for pointing out the HoIO and hieghtned overlap, I totally missed it. I'm going to change heightened to quickened (the character starts at level 7 so I can change the metamagic)

[Gastronomie]

Thanks for pointing out the HoIO and hieghtned overlap, I totally missed it. I'm going to change heightened to quickenedWell, there actually is a situation when the two do not overlap, which is when you want to bestow disadvantage on the saves of two enemies at the same time. Then again, this requires 6 Sorcery Points (most of everything you get for the day) and is normally not worth it. So yeah, you should change it. I think most DMs will be reasonable enough to let you do that.

BTW, consider taking Careful instead of Quickened, depending on your focus (in all honesty, you wouldn't use Quickened that much for non-Draconic pure Sorcerers). Quickened is more of a Sorcadin thing. Careful Spell is pretty good with the spells already mentioned in my above post. But then again, you get only a very limited number of spell options, so you might be better off with Quickened for now, leaving Careful for the level 10 Metamagic when you have more spells known.

[Byke]

As a general rule, I have to recommend Vampiric Touch if you expect to end up in melee. Its damage isn't the best, but the added survivability is useful, and works rather well with Strength of the Grave.

Also, it just fits awesomely well flavour-wise.

Didn't think that Sorc got Vamp touch...but I'm not in front of my PB.

**Edit Favored Soul with Death Domain?***

[Ashrym]

The sorcerer is shadow sorcerer. It has an AC of 15(with Mage armor) and HP of 44 (14 constitution). The sorcerer is level 7.

Cantrips:
Message
Firebolt
Mage hand
Minor illusion
Shocking grasp
Control flames

1st level spells
Shield
Mage armor

2nd level spells
Mirror image
Scorching ray

3rd level spells
Slow
Fly
Counterspell

4th level spells
Watery sphere

My main questions are should I replace scorching ray with fireball? Should I get polymorph or haste when I level up? Is dimension door any good?

It would caution against loading up low level spells known with defensive spells while moving your offensive spells into high levels. That only works if the DM let's players long rest at will to recover the limited slots. Otherwise your encounters are going to be a lot of opening with a defensive spell and cantrip spamming more often than spreading the spells out more uniformly.

As it is, you don't seem to have much you can twin outside of cantrips. Was that the plan? It is feasible.

I would be more inclined to drop mirror image for enhance ability, scorching ray for web or suggestion or alter self, and picking up hypnotic pattern. Those open up versatility.

Dimension door is useful but I wouldn't grab it on a sorcerer with the limited spells known. Haste or polymorph would be good with twin. So would greater invisibility.




Didn't think that Sorc got Vamp touch...but I'm not in front of my PB.

**Edit Favored Soul with Death Domain?***

It isn't on the sorcerer list that I recall.

[PeteNutButter]

As for the Scorching Ray question: Yes, in every single possible way. In fact you should never take Scorching Ray unless you're a Draconic Sorcerer and your DM is smart/flexible enough to ignore sage (or so they say) advise.


It isn't just sage advice. It's eratta. My phb specifically says you can add your cha mod to ONE damage roll...

[Gastronomie]

It isn't just sage advice. It's eratta. My phb specifically says you can add your cha mod to ONE damage roll...Well then. I'm still going to allow Elemental Affinity to all 2d6's in my games. Not like it's broken or anything.

Hell, the reason they made that errata was prolly because they were sick with all the people complaining about sage advice.

[Foxhound438]

maybe broaden the damage types of your cantrips? you get a ton of cantrips, if you're fine having just 1 ranged at-will option that's cool, but I would recommend grabbing at least 2 different damage types- so fire bolt for fire, maybe chill touch for necrotic? ray of frost is also solid.

past that, I highly recommend misty step, even if you forego dimension door. Bonus action mobility is pretty solid.

[TheUser]

The sorcerer is shadow sorcerer. It has an AC of 15(with Mage armor) and HP of 44 (14 constitution). The sorcerer is level 7.

Cantrips:
Message
Firebolt
Mage hand
Minor illusion
Shocking grasp
Control flames

1st level spells
Shield
Mage armor

2nd level spells
Mirror image
Scorching ray

3rd level spells
Slow
Fly
Counterspell

4th level spells
Watery sphere

My main questions are should I replace scorching ray with fireball? Should I get polymorph or haste when I level up? Is dimension door any good?

1) without knowing your metamagics it's hard to evaluate the efficacy of this list.

2) if nobody else has chill touch you should pick it up to dump on healing by dropping control flames, drop mirror image for misty step;it's a bonus action and is a much better get out of jail free card, drop slow for Fireball and if you get twin spell take polymorph instead of watery sphere

3) if you decide to be a tricksy little devil and take "Subtle Spell" Suggestion becomes the most broken thing in the game and is worthy of dumping counter spell (since you can charm a caster into blowing up all his comrades anyway).

4) ask your DM for Spell Points variant (DMG 288-289)

[Sicarius Victis]

Didn't think that Sorc got Vamp touch...but I'm not in front of my PB.

**Edit Favored Soul with Death Domain?***

Now I feel stupid. I was AFB at the time, and I was using 3.PF thinking to try to remember the spells. I completely forgot about how much smaller the Sorcerer list was in 5e compared to the Wizard list.

Took me a few minutes to figure out WHY it's not on the Sorcerer list, as well. Using Distant Spell would let you do it at a 30-foot range, and Extended Spell lets you double the duration. Those can be quite powerful with Vampiric Touch.


But then again, since it doesn't specify SORCERER spells, they can still be used by a multiclass caster. So I'm honestly not sure why the Sorcerer can't cast it normally.