Ideas for a Duskblade/Rouge build?

[CaPtMalHammer]

I am thinking about a Duskblade/Rouge build adding sneak attack the Duskblades spellcasting through weapon..

Few ideas I have had so far are knowledge devotion and arcane strike feats for sure.

was thinking human and maybe the able learner feat at 1st level.

maybe taking a feat for domain casting as well to supplement the poor spell choices.

Question more rouge or more Duskblade? dip into Duskblade for 3 levels or so then take rouge etc from there? or dip into rouge for Sneak and go tank based? Thoughts?

Core books, completes, race books allowed only.

Thank you in advance.

[CaPtMalHammer]

PS also open on race etc:) just none with LA:) DM wont allow.

[Khedrac]

To start with can I suggest a rogue not rouge? As a class a "rouge" is strictly homebrew.

OK, with that out of the way, the problem is that there is very little synergy between rogue and duskblade, however duskblades can only channel touch spells so their higher level (3rd+) spells offer very few channelable spells (vampiric touch and not much else). This does mean duskblades are usually willing to use arcane strike a lot, but they only get 5th level spells so if you are giving up casting levels you won't necessarily have the spells to bother with arcane strike. (Yes they get lots of spells, but you will be restricted to lower level slots.)
From this point of view, against the right opponents, a few levels of rogue can be a nice damage boost.

So, what level are you building this for? At low levels it will be a poor combination - both classes getting in the way of the other's abilities = but at higher levels by dipping rogue you may be able to make this work reasonably. Not particularly high-powered, but should be playable (and potentially fun).

If you just dip duskblade you will have virtually nothing to channel, the duskblade's SLAs will probably be more useful to a rogue than the channel, particularly as channelling a spell is a standard action (including the attack) so if you use it you will be losing out on full attacks (or spring attacks).

With only very low level spells I don't think gaining a domain is worth the feat - you only get half the benefits form it that everyone else gets.

Oh yes:

Core books, completes, race books allowed only.
This means Duskblade itself (PHB2) is not on the table for use...

[ComaVision]

Rogue 1/Duskblade X is OK for expanding the skill list, without taking too much away from Duskblade.

I've wanted to play a Duskblade 13/Chameleon 7 for a while now, which has kind of the same feel despite no actual Sneak Attack.

[CaPtMalHammer]

Sorry yeah Rogue I misspell all the time lol,. fingers don't always type as fast as the brain works. lol

Yeah I have been going back and forth with the domain spells. the granted power would be nice if its the right domain but may be a waste of a slot. When I get to 3rd level casting was thinking extra spell to pick up hunter's eye to improve sneak attack etc.

Was also thinking of Scout instead of rouge, Although Scout pushes the full attack channel back even further because you would want 5 levels to get improved skirmish lol.

I do know its not the most overpowered build but was looking for fun over optimal. Just trying to make it as good as it can be lol :)

And yeah we include PH2 with core books now, so I always forget to mention it here as available.

With scout you will want those levels early pushing Duskblade back but giving more skills etc for tumble fun.

the rogue you could take 1 level and then duskblade till level 14 and get full channeling then take a few other rogue levels if you wanted for evasion etc.

not sure which is better:)

[Dread_Head]

If you want to use scout you could do Scout 1 / Duskblade 3 / Scout +2 / Unseen Seer (CM) 10 / ... With Improved Skirmish you are throwing out 7d6 bonus damage a turn, you can cast as a duskblade at level -3 and although you never get full attack channel, it doesn't synergise that well with skirmish anyway as its hard to move + full attack.

Alternatively unseen seer would work for a Rogue / Duskblade build as well. Rogue 1 / Duskblade 3 / Rogue +1 / Unseen Seer 10 / ... to maximise sneak attack or Rogue 1 / Duskblade 13 / Unseen Seer 6 for full attack channeling. Either way look to pick up the Hunters Eye spell (PHB 2) with your bonus divinations for extra sneak attack.

Unseen Seer is good fpr this build as it progresses casting while keeping up your skill points and precision damage and expanding your spell list with a few choice divinations.

[CaPtMalHammer]

Unseen seer is interesting:) it does synergize well with the build of course. The only down side is it's hit die being only a d4 and losing a little bit of saves.

I still might take that route... is interesting to play with this build a bit lol

Currently I have Scout 1/Dusk 3/Scout 4/Dusk 12..

at end with a practiced spellcaster feat has CL 19 casting, BAB of +18, Fort and Will save +10 and Ref. +9. A little growing pains in casting early but it ramps ok.. not optimal but not bad either.

Spending skill points in knowledges for Knowledge devotion helps add to it.

Improved skirmish gives 4d6 skirmish damage and +3 AC when I move and attack.

Took Extra Spell feat and got Hunter's Eye that way. so Sneak attack of 6d6 at end of build.

Took Arcane disciple and the Celerity domain and added some spells including haste late level but added 10 more move speed for a total of 50ft of move speed.

not over powered but maybe fun...

will rebuild with unseen seer and see how that works out.

[Jack_McSnatch]

This is actually my favorite build, but it takes a while to get off the ground. A 3 level dip into duskblade isn't really worth it unless you have another, better, casting class, and rogues aremeant for full attack melee, so its best to just bite the bullet and take those 13 duskblade levels.

Invest in TWF feats early on. You'll play mostly like a TWF rogue, but you've got that nice big arcane channelling sneak attack for a finishing move. Using a polearm might be an interesting option if your dm is allowing Dragon Compendium and the feats within, but otherwise stick to dual swords or a double weapon. It really pays off when you finally get that full attack channelling and just shred an encounter.

In a noncombat capacity, you are a rogue with (basically) free detect/read magic. Pick up arcane thieve's tools to supplement your slightly lower open lock and disable device checks, and abuse that detect magic SLA. Your knowledge skills are going to come in handy, take all of them. Just all of them, even the seemingly useless ones like nobility, and architecture. The collector of stories skill trick stacks very nicely will all those knowledges, and that devotion feat.

Don't bother with arcane disciple. You don't have the spell levels, and it's only one spell per spell level. It'd be a better idea to focus on combat feats. Pick up a martial stance and manuever if you want to be cheesy and just can't think of other feats. Expertise is your friend mr glass cannon.

[Darrin]

I'd recommend Rogue 3 over Scout 5. Without Swift Hunter, you don't have a way to deal precision damage to crit-immune creatures. (However, Scout 4/Ranger 1 can get you Swift Hunter.) Rogue 3 gets you the Penetrating Strike ACF. Also, Arcane Disciple does not grant you the domain power, just the spells. Consider:

Stub: Rogue 3/Duskblade 13/Unseen Seer 4
Feats: Craven (1st), TWF (3rd), Combat Casting (5th), Arcane Disciple (6th), Staggering Strike (9th), Improved TWF (12th), Greater TWF (15th), Minor Shapeshift (18th)

[CaPtMalHammer]

Wish I could take craven but that book is not in the allowed books list for this game:) I am thinking of using a pole arm reach weapon build for this. be able to help flank with the tank but not be in right up close to the pointy end of the enemy.

yeah after building that scout. not getting full channel till like level 18 is rough. I think im going to go with rogue,. I will get rid of arcane disciple but not sure what I will replace it with:) maybe quick reconnoiter for a buff to my inititative and free spot listen each round.

If I had the feats I was thinking about spinning halberd as well but not a reach weapon and requires three feats prior. just didn't seem economical enough.

still looking at unseen seer. if it wasn't for that drop in hit die I would be all over it lol:)