Optimizing a Gnome Barbarian

[kalebr]

Hi friends,

I know it's sub-optimal, but I am enamored with playing a gnome with a nepoleonic complex and temperment issues who doesn't realize he's a gnome (raised from a young age with tribal humans). Given that light backstory, how could I optimize the character and/or create a niche role for him. I feel like this combination won't be great for damage, so I need some reason to make this character other than flavor.

Right now, I'm thinking Barb Totem Warrior 5 / Ranger Beast Conclave 3. Though, Beserker probably makes more sense in terms of flavor. Ranger 3 is for fighting style, animal companion and some utility spells.

Questions:

1) Should I go with two weapon fighting or sword and board?
a) If S&B, getting expertise in athletics and shield master feat seem important. And shield master futher improves upon the magic saves.
b) If twf, how could I make it competitive?

2) I like the potential idea of a wizard dip just for flavor to represent the magical affinity of gnomes, but this might be going too far. Thoughts?

3) With Ranger 3, I'm thinking I could ride my animal companion. I don't think I would want to fight this way all the time, but it seems like a nice bit of flavor when traveling and on occasion in combat. Doesn't seem like I could really make much of the mounted combatant feat.

4) That +2 int is practically useless. What should I ask the DM to allow me to trade it for that is fair, balanced and thematically appropriate? Maybe just convert to Wisdom to help with Ranger levels?

5) Are there other multiclass options that are better than ranger?


I guess in short, the idea of a gnome, with anger problems and "nearly immune" to magic, riding into battle on the back of a wolf just seems like a cool concept for a character. Now I need to figure out the mechanics to make it work.

[Squeeq]

Personally, I wouldn't focus too much on ranger; the resistance to spells and bear totem resistance with unarmored defence is going to make you an incredible tank. Being able to ride the wolf will be up to your DM partially, too, so you can't bank on that really. Honestly, it's the magic resistance that plugs up some of the biggest holes in a barbarian build.

[gfishfunk]

Go two weapon fighting.

Drop Ranger. You really don't want to bump Wisdom high enough for it. It's just too MAD.

Maybe multi class fighter Eldrich knight or Rogue trickster, unless you want a total non-magic gnome. Fighter gets you the fighting style bonus and it is much easier on the stats. Rogue can be combined with two weapons sneak attack even if you go STR build.

[JellyPooga]

It's not exactly the concept you're looking for, but hear me out.

Go Barbarian/Arcane Trickster.

The Gnome Int boost means that only a few points will take it to 14, leaving plenty to go around elsewhere. AT by no means requires heaps of Int, so you could even just hard dump it. Focus on utility spells rather than combat ones; the base Rogue features are what synergise with Barbarian in combat, not the Archetype features, so feel free to grab that Expertise in Athletics. Even with low Str, you can still beat most things in a grapple with both Expertise and Advantage. Forest Gnome or Svirfneblin works especially well with the Dex boost for a Dex-based Barbarian.

Take Crossbow Expert and wield a Rapier and Hand Crossbow; particularly suitable if you go Svirfneblin and say you've learned the style (and the napoleon complex) from his Drow enslavers, perhaps he was even a fighting slave or some kind of rebel before escaping.

As for riding a wolf? Riding Dogs are available on the open market and if you're doing anything but dip Barbarian, your animal companion will be horribly sub-par anyway, so don't bother with the Ranger and buy yourself a steed.

[Eladain]

I'm currently running a Halfling barbarian that I'm having a blast with. Dex based, S&B and getting ready to switch to Rogue after lvl 5 (extra attack) for the core rogue abilities and SA to makeup some of my lost damage. I really really debated going Arcane Trickster, but in the end decided on swashbuckler to enabled my own SA dice. A lot of that could depend on your party makeup.

As mentioned above Fighter dips of almost any level are solid. Fighting styles, BM manuevers, Action surge.

[kalebr]

It's not exactly the concept you're looking for, but hear me out.

Go Barbarian/Arcane Trickster.

The Gnome Int boost means that only a few points will take it to 14, leaving plenty to go around elsewhere. AT by no means requires heaps of Int, so you could even just hard dump it. Focus on utility spells rather than combat ones; the base Rogue features are what synergise with Barbarian in combat, not the Archetype features, so feel free to grab that Expertise in Athletics. Even with low Str, you can still beat most things in a grapple with both Expertise and Advantage. Forest Gnome or Svirfneblin works especially well with the Dex boost for a Dex-based Barbarian.

Take Crossbow Expert and wield a Rapier and Hand Crossbow; particularly suitable if you go Svirfneblin and say you've learned the style (and the napoleon complex) from his Drow enslavers, perhaps he was even a fighting slave or some kind of rebel before escaping.

As for riding a wolf? Riding Dogs are available on the open market and if you're doing anything but dip Barbarian, your animal companion will be horribly sub-par anyway, so don't bother with the Ranger and buy yourself a steed.

This is exactly the type of thing I'm looking for. Seems the ranger dip is a bad idea so I'll look at the AT. AT also scratches the itch for me of having the gnome magical talents be a small part of the character. Thanks for the suggestion.

[kalebr]

I'm currently running a Halfling barbarian that I'm having a blast with. Dex based, S&B and getting ready to switch to Rogue after lvl 5 (extra attack) for the core rogue abilities and SA to makeup some of my lost damage. I really really debated going Arcane Trickster, but in the end decided on swashbuckler to enabled my own SA dice. A lot of that could depend on your party makeup.

As mentioned above Fighter dips of almost any level are solid. Fighting styles, BM manuevers, Action surge.

I've read swashbuckler is a good combo with barbarian, but for whatever reason, it's not something I'm in to. If I go S&B, I'll get shield mastery to help with the sneak attacks (shield -> prone -> advantage = sneak attack, right? )

[kalebr]

Go two weapon fighting.

Drop Ranger. You really don't want to bump Wisdom high enough for it. It's just too MAD.

Maybe multi class fighter Eldrich knight or Rogue trickster, unless you want a total non-magic gnome. Fighter gets you the fighting style bonus and it is much easier on the stats. Rogue can be combined with two weapons sneak attack even if you go STR build.

EK is a good suggestion which I totally overlooked.

What's the case for TWF? I feel like it's inferior in every way, except stylistically, to S&B.

[Eladain]

I've read swashbuckler is a good combo with barbarian, but for whatever reason, it's not something I'm in to. If I go S&B, I'll get shield mastery to help with the sneak attacks (shield -> prone -> advantage = sneak attack, right? )

Yup! Should work just as well. Being dex based shield mastery wasn't quite as reliable an option for me. I'll still snag it after some Rogue expertise though. It also helps that our campaign is a lot of sea voyages so Swashbuckler was pretty thematic.

[gfishfunk]

EK is a good suggestion which I totally overlooked.

What's the case for TWF? I feel like it's inferior in every way, except stylistically, to S&B.

The case for two weapon fighting (posted from phone if anything reads weird):

You really cannot do great weapon fighting with heavy weapons. If you do, you'll have disadvantage on every attack, but reckless attack puts it back to normal. Not great because you are giving up on advantage permanently and making it easy easier to get attacked instead.

Two weapon fighting becomes the next best thing. You get a bonus action to do one more attack, and you get to add your rage damage as well so long as you have a strength build. Two weapon fighting works better for barbarians than for most of the other classes due to bonus rage damage.

Sword and board really is great, though. I never thought that it was barbarian-esque. That is my own perception though. And if you go AT or EK, you probably don't need it due to Shield spell and rage resistances.

And there is nothing wrong with going sword and board while you are not raging and switching to two weapons while you rage.

[Eladain]

I think when most people think of a barbarian in D&D they go straight to the sort of uncivilized savage warrior stereotype. I'm guilty of it as well. When I think of a S&B barbarian I tend to picture more of a viking esque fighter. It's not as refined as someone whose received formal training, and still has that primal nature/instinct tied into it.

[Foxhound438]

Stat spread should look something like 15/13/15/10/13/8 for this, although that's a bit rough as far as stat value goes. Split ASI 1 between str and con for best value.

S+B is neat, but in my opinion redundant for you. If there's another fighter in town and you want to give them free advantage, by all means, but otherwise I feel that you'd be best off twf or using a quarterstaff with polearm master.

Getting a feat is a bit taxing here, since your important stats are all odd, but none the less it can be good. A straight 8 barbarian would be recommended there, in order to get you both even stats and the feat you need. In the mean time, however, 2wf does seem a bit better.



If you do decide to go for beast master in there, S+B with shield master looks a lot better- especially with good old crab companion! knock the enemy down, then your crab attacks with advantage. On a hit, the target is grappled, and since their speed is 0 they can't stand back up. This means that they have to either attack at disadvantage, or spend their action trying to break free.



In either case, it shouldn't be awful. A bit sub-par, but not awful.

[MeeposFire]

Quarter staff and polearm master tends to bring us back to sword and shield.

Two weapon fighting is ok for barbs because the bonus action attack gets rage bonus damage and advantage on the extra attack. That can add up and even more so if you multiclass with something with the fighting style. Also unless you are using a staff with poelarm master then dueling style gives less damage than two weapon fighting.

All this being said if you are willing to use a staff with a shield then that overall wins over TWF since it gets the best stuff from it.

[Klorox]

I'd recommend building just like any other barbarian, but using a long sword or other versatile weapon with two hands.

[eastmabl]

When I ran my stout halfling barbarian, I used TWF shortswords when I wasn't raging. I kept a shield for those occasions where the off-hand attack wasn't great and I needed AC.

When I raged, I switched up to a battle axe (two handed).

[kalebr]

When I ran my stout halfling barbarian, I used TWF shortswords when I wasn't raging. I kept a shield for those occasions where the off-hand attack wasn't great and I needed AC.

When I raged, I switched up to a battle axe (two handed).

I've been thinking on this a bit and it makes sense. Basically having a dps mode and a tank mode. I don't know what the other folks in my party are going to be so having tihs flexibility is probably the right choice. Thanks for the suggestion.