Homwbrew Barbarian Primal Path - Path of the Juggernaut

[WhiteWolf]

I wanted the option to play an armoured dwarf barbarian but the battlerager path seems gimmicky and unrealistic imo, so I created the path of the juggernaut. I wanted to create an unstoppable armoured beast that could wade into hoards of enemies and just destroy. I also tried to balance it with the current paths and just tweaked a few existing abilities to differentiate them and make them fit a bit better. Im currently play testing this path in a game but I'm only at level 4 so far and haven't been able to get my hands on some full plate yet. Im wielding a halberd and took polearm master at 4th level to get a bonus action attack and next feat will be GWM. Anyway, heres the path (with no flavour text), feedback/criticism/comments are welcome :)

Path of the Juggernaut

Heavily Armoured
When you take this path at 3rd level, you gain proficiency with heavy armour and a +1 bonus to AC whilst wearing armour. You also gain the benefits of your Rage class feature whilst wearing heavy armour.

Raging Brute
Starting at 6th level, while raging you are considered one size larger for the purposes of grappling and shoving and your carrying capacity and the weight you can push, drag and lift is doubled. In addition, if an effect moves you along the ground against your will, you can reduce the distance you are moved by 5ft, this increases to 10ft at 11th level and 15ft at 16th.

Unstoppable
Beginning at 10th level, you can’t become incapacitated or stunned whilst raging and you have advantage on saving throws to avoid becoming paralysed. If you are paralysed you can take a bonus action at the start of your turn to make another saving throw with advantage, on a success the effect ends and you can take the rest of your turn normally. If you are incapacitated or stunned while you are not raging you can enter a rage and suspend the effect for the duration of the rage.

Raging Critical
Starting at 14th level, whilst raging your weapon attacks score a critical hit on a roll of 19 or 20.

[N810]

Doesn't seem over powered,
And nothing to fancy.

good job. :durkon:

[BDRook]

Get rid of the +1 bonus to AC in the level 3 feature. You're already getting half-damage from Rage and with the ability to rage in heavy armor. That alone might be overpowered as it is, as the whole point of a barbarian is trading AC for resistance to damage and a crap ton of HP. You don't need the extra +1 AC while also getting heavy armor.

[WhiteWolf]

Thanks for the feedback, the reason I added the +1 to ac is because i wanted this path to have the highest ac of all the paths. at 3rd level the bear totem gains resistance to all damage bar psychic and the eagle gets dash as a bonus action and everyone else has disadvantage on attacks against you. Just being able to wear heavy armour and still use rage didn't seem balanced, especially when you don't get the 10ft speed boost in heavy armour.
Any barbarian who rolled decent stats and picked a race that gives +2 to con or dex could have an ac of 16 by 3rd level using unarmoured defence. By comparison, most characters wont have access to plate armour by 3rd lvl and a barbarian with heavy armour proficiency would most likely be in chainmail, giving them an ac of 16.
So this path is sacrificing the lvl 3 feature of a different path to gain proficiency in heavy armour but ends up with the same ac anyway. And they will be unable to use the level 5 class feature. That doesn't seem balanced to me, thats why i gave them a +1 to ac.

[Jarlhen]

Let's compare it to the champion fighter: Heavy armor - Check. Athletics related bonus - Check. Defensive fighting style - Check. Improved critical range - Check. Essentially all the good parts out of the champion playstyle ON TOP of all the amazing **** the barbarian gets. This is out of line as far as I'm concerned. Sure, it's not identical to the champion, but on the whole it's very clear you wanted the main benefits of playing a champion but didn't want to take the multiclass hit for doing so. On top of that you decided to make grappling, something which is already strangely unbalanced and really weird, even better. And then the level 10 feature is incredible on top of all of this goodness. I wouldn't allow this in my game. It's unbalanced, it's just taking some of the best bits out of one class and putting it on to another, it has no reason for existing other than to avoid the multiclass tax.

[N810]

What he doesn't get from champion,
action surge and 4 attacks...
combat maneuvers.
etc...

[WhiteWolf]

Jarlhen - Yes, it is a mix of the Champion and barbarian, that is what I wanted when I wrote it. I wanted a warrior who wore heavy armour and could go in to a rage. I tried to balance it with the other barbarian path options and I think it compares fairly equally to them. If you have any suggestions then please let me know.

[Jarlhen]

Jarlhen - Yes, it is a mix of the Champion and barbarian, that is what I wanted when I wrote it. I wanted a warrior who wore heavy armour and could go in to a rage. I tried to balance it with the other barbarian path options and I think it compares fairly equally to them. If you have any suggestions then please let me know.

I appreciate that. I think my problem is that I am of the principle that in order to homebrew something there has to be a problem, or there must be something to improve. You don't homebrew just because you want to get around a purposeful mechanic. And I get that that may not be the explicit purpose of this, that is essentially what it boils down to from my point of view. So I think my issue is that the whole concept is unnecessary and shouldn't exist. So with that in mind I feel we may be too far apart as a basis.

I strongly caution you against making grappling better though. It can for all intents and purposes end entire encounters already. Or at the very least completely **** a DM's day up, depending on whether they cheat or not.

[Nifft]

Heavily Armoured
When you take this path at 3rd level, you gain proficiency with heavy armour and a +1 bonus to AC whilst wearing armour. You also gain the benefits of your Rage class feature whilst wearing heavy armour. So I don't have to ever spend a daily Rage usage, since I get all the benefits whilst wearing heavy armour?

Tally-ho, gov'nor.


Unstoppable
Beginning at 10th level, you can’t become incapacitated or stunned whilst raging and you have advantage on saving throws to avoid becoming paralysed. If you are paralysed you can take a bonus action at the start of your turn to make another saving throw with advantage, on a success the effect ends and you can take the rest of your turn normally. If you are incapacitated or stunned while you are not raging you can enter a rage and suspend the effect for the duration of the rage. What kind of action?

I'd suggest "as your reaction".

- - -

Also: "Dost not thou ken whom I art? T'is I, ye Juggernaut, kennel-wench."

(This class should have an Intimidation bonus feature.)

[gfishfunk]

I agree with others about not having the +1 AC. I understand that you wanted it to have the highest AC or provide a non-Dex oriented version, but I don't like it or the multiclassing implications. If you wanted to amend it and keep the basic idea, have it say 'While raging, you gain +1 AC while wearing heavy armor.' That ties up most potential abuses.

Also for that ability that lets you enter a rage when hit with a stun or paralyzing effect, add the text 'by using a reaction.'

Otherwise good.

[WhiteWolf]

Thanks for the feedback, I think that having the +1 to ac only apply while raging is a great idea. And maybe I should re-word it to say you can enter a rage even if you are wearing heavy armour, I had intended for it to use on of your daily rages. And yeah I had meant to add about the unstoppable feature using your reaction to enter a rage

[Vogonjeltz]

Path of the Juggernaut

Heavily Armoured
When you take this path at 3rd level, you gain proficiency with heavy armour and a +1 bonus to AC whilst wearing armour. You also gain the benefits of your Rage class feature whilst wearing heavy armour.

Raging Brute
Starting at 6th level, while raging you are considered one size larger for the purposes of grappling and shoving and your carrying capacity and the weight you can push, drag and lift is doubled. In addition, if an effect moves you along the ground against your will, you can reduce the distance you are moved by 5ft, this increases to 10ft at 11th level and 15ft at 16th.

Unstoppable
Beginning at 10th level, you can’t become incapacitated or stunned whilst raging and you have advantage on saving throws to avoid becoming paralysed. If you are paralysed you can take a bonus action at the start of your turn to make another saving throw with advantage, on a success the effect ends and you can take the rest of your turn normally. If you are incapacitated or stunned while you are not raging you can enter a rage and suspend the effect for the duration of the rage.

Raging Critical
Starting at 14th level, whilst raging your weapon attacks score a critical hit on a roll of 19 or 20.

Initial critique:
The description of the archetype is bland and doesn't call to mind an archetype.

Balance Flaws:
1) Heavily Armored is too good, even the +1 to AC is worth a class option (specifically a Fighting Style).

2) Raging Brute shouldn't be scaling, it isn't in line with the Barbarian archetype.

3) Raging Brute is flatly superior to Bear Totem. This needs to be addressed.

4) Paralyzed and Stunned also Incapacitate, so if a creature can't be incapacitated, they necessarily can't be stunned or paralyzed. This is far too powerful.

5) Raging Critical is simply providing the benefits of another subclass without the requirement to multiclass, worse one that has major synergy with Brutal Critical.

Recommendations:
1) Heavily Armored - Pick one, or better come up with a different unique benefit.
2) Raging Brute - Don't copycat another feature from another subclass. Define a more unique benefit. This level is mostly ribbon.
3) Unstoppable is too powerful giving immunity to status effects. Advantage on saving throws against those effects would be better.
4) Raging critical should be replaced with something balanced as regards the Barbarian class abilities.

[WhiteWolf]

Thanks for the recommendations, I'll add the flavour text once I finalise the features as I don't want to have to redo it if amendments change the feel of the path. Any suggestions on an alternate 14th level feature would be welcome.

[ruy343]

Not to be that guy, but this should be transferred to the homebrew forum. Sorry.

[djreynolds]

But I'm glad it's here. I like it.... it needs work.

1. Why rage? for half damage. You want to get hit.
2. Rage is special, it's basically stoneskin at 3rd with no concentration.
3. You have made a zombie killing machine because no one alive in their right mind is going to near you... let alone fight you
4. Upwards of 21ac, and then half damage if I do hit you.... no one would attack you
5. People want to attack barbarians, because they're running around in a banana hammock. And hence the unknown damage reduction. Hence they draw agro.
6. You have 3rd level tarrasque.

My suggestion, make this fighter who can rage but instead of damage resistance while raging this fighter cannot frightened charmed or paralyzed or stunned. You still want hit this guy in plate, because thick skilled and doesn't get the message.

Take plate and heavy armor master, juggernaut.

[GlenSmash!]

Interesting. There is a Heavy Armour wearing Barbarian in Adventures in Middle-Earth called the Foe-Hammer, but I don't know how well balanced it is with the PHB classes.

[Jerrykhor]

My suggestion is this:

3rd level - Cannot be slowed or knocked prone while raging

6th level - Cannot be restrained or grappled while raging

10th level - (No change)

14th level - You only gain 1 level of exhaustion for every 2nd rage. Plus, you remove all levels of exhaustion on long rest.

You can't tell me you're a juggernaut without all these.

[djreynolds]

My suggestion is this:

3rd level - Cannot be slowed or knocked prone while raging

6th level - Cannot be restrained or grappled while raging

10th level - (No change)

14th level - You only gain 1 level of exhaustion for every 2nd rage. Plus, you remove all levels of exhaustion on long rest.

You can't tell me you're a juggernaut without all these.

This is all good alternative as well.

Heavy armor and rage are fine, its basically the same as an Eldritch Knight using stoneskin. But a barbarian want's to be hit, he feeds off of it.

Try to capture that, perhaps when he rages he takes damage as normal but gives it back, maybe he takes more.

That's my humble suggestion, a juggernaut wants to be in the thick of battle, he longs for it.

A fighter is about tactics and defense. A barbarian is about destruction, blood lust.

[Foxhound438]

This may just be my way of imagining things, but I'd say that a juggernaut should have some kind of "if I run fast at someone that hurts them" feature. the SCAG totem ability that lets you trample over something as a bonus action comes to mind.

[Jerrykhor]

This may just be my way of imagining things, but I'd say that a juggernaut should have some kind of "if I run fast at someone that hurts them" feature. the SCAG totem ability that lets you trample over something as a bonus action comes to mind.

Good idea. How about: While raging, if the Barbarian moves at least 10 ft, creatures of the same size or smaller have to make a Str saving throw or are knocked prone and take 1d4 bludgeoning. Creatures of 1 size larger have advantage on saving throw, and creatures of 2 sizes larger auto succeed. For every extra 10 ft he moves, deal an additional 1d4. If the Barb moves over targets that are already prone, he tramples them and deals 1d6 bludgeoning.