What is the best system for guns, swords, undead and orcs?

[Perch]

I'm planning a urban fantasy game.

The players are going to fight hordes of orcs and undead using guns and other modern warfare weapons but also swords, spears and axes.

What is the best system for this kind of game?

[Joe the Rat]

Savage Worlds will cover your bases pretty well.

[TheTeaMustFlow]

D20 Modern is highly underrated, in my opinion.

As always, Fate and GURPS work for everything.

Feng Shui could also do nicely.

[Berenger]

D20 Modern is highly underrated, in my opinion.

Especially the Urban Arcana campaign setting which operates under the assumption that D&D-style creatures randomly spawn into the modern world, unnoticed by most humans because of the built-in weirdness censor in their brains (dragon attacks = "Must have been an attack helicopter.", elf = "Yes, that girl is really cute, but why are you so fascinated with her ears?", armored knight on horseback appearing from nowhere = "Hey, buddy, the LARP is three miles over there. Nice armor, looks almost real.").

http://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/weirdness_censor.jpg

Of course, the weirdness censor can be switched off for your setting, it's not embedded in the rules.

[Mastikator]

I don't know about spears and axes but machete is the only sword that is still used in this day and age. You should allow players to use modern kevlar armor and riot shields, which I imagine are better than Renaissance era full plate armor, if I knew I was going up against undead monsters and orcs I would buy modern body armor.

Instead of horseback riding you can let the players ride motorcycles too. That would be pretty cool actually, doing rideby attacks with a machete against undead monsters on a motorcycle while wearing modern kevlar bodyarmor.

[The Glyphstone]

I don't know about spears and axes but machete is the only sword that is still used in this day and age. You should allow players to use modern kevlar armor and riot shields, which I imagine are better than Renaissance era full plate armor, if I knew I was going up against undead monsters and orcs I would buy modern body armor.

Instead of horseback riding you can let the players ride motorcycles too. That would be pretty cool actually, doing rideby attacks with a machete against undead monsters on a motorcycle while wearing modern kevlar bodyarmor.

Wouldn't you want to know what weapons they were using first? Even modern body armor comes in two flavors - ballistics-resistant and stab-resistant. Undead monsters with claws, or orcs with swords/axes, will shred your fancy modern body armor if it was made to block bullets. Stab-resistant armor will work better, but pound-for-pound you would be better off with the Renaissance era full plate. The reason it eventually went out of style was the advancement of guns to the point where it stopped being a viable defense against them. Take the guns away, and your plate armor is good again.

And of course, if your orcs or zombies are toting AK-47s, then you want the Kevlar ballistics vest.

[Anonymouswizard]

I'm planning a urban fantasy game.

The players are going to fight hordes of orcs and undead using guns and other modern warfare weapons but also swords, spears and axes.

What is the best system for this kind of game?

It depends on quite a bit.

Do you want something relatively realistic and gritty? This is where GURPS shines, I played in a game with fantasy races and WW2-era weapons, and it worked great. There were no orcs or undead, although GURPS handles them about as well as humans, and lower-tech weapons would have handled well if everyone wasn't carrying around a pistol (or generally dart rifles for our skaven foes).

Do you want something more pulpy and cinematic? Fate does this well, either in the standard system (use Fight for all melee attacks, Shoot for all ranged attacks, and equipment might give a situation aspect), or with one of the several systems for weapons giving bonuses.

I don't know much about d20 Modern, so listen to the others on that.

Mutants and Masterminds would also work, especially if you let players take spells/psionics/powers in order to use the meaty powers system, probably at a lower power level than the standard (because by the time you hit PL 10 anything weaker than a longarm is unlikely to make a difference, my battlesuit-user has dual gattling guns mounted on his arms as his weakest attack, being a Damage 8 multiattack).

[the OOD]

Universal Decay is my top recommendation. it is a brilliantly designed d20 system with a custom weapons and amour system (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showsinglepost.php?p=21399103&postcount=9) that is perfect for what Glyphstone discussed, and is my go-to system for a modern setting(and many others). even better, Universal Decay is a SYSTEM, not a setting, while the system can be used to run a modern game, it can also run sword-and sorcery, superhero, psionics, sci-fi, and more. the additional rules for witch are included in the main PDF, and interact beautifully.
my group just finished a modern paramilitary/X-com game that featured magick, genetic alteration, cybernetics, dwemor, sapient AI, psionics, aliens, various types of future tech, Faustian pacts, super-powers, undead, and more. literally every set of setting-specific rules in the system(except steam/radiopunk), and it worked great, the extra rules build off of each other well, strengthening the game rather than weakening it.
the catch is that it is mechanics-heavy, and learning it can take a bit effort(and some maths skill). it's probably worth it, but if your group has math-adverse players, or prefers rules-light gaming, you should take a pass on this one.
Price: $5 for PDF, $30 hard copy. contains setting and all settings/extra mechanics

the runner up is D20 Modern with the Urban Arcana supplement. not my cup of tea, as I find UD can do everything it does, and far more, and the limited customization isn't my thing. but if you want a dead-simple d20 system without the rigorous mechanics and customization of Universal Decay, this it the system to use. the fluff is definitely interesting, and the magik items section is bloody brilliant.
D20 Modern + Urban Arcana: not sure, got mine used.

on the other hand, if D20 is not your thing, and mechanics-light story-heavy is your goal, FATE is one of the best. it makes roleplaying into a core mechanic, and play revolves around playing character with a mix of traits that can be seen as flaws, benefits, or both. while real-life tactics or detailed mechanics are not going to be found here, it is a fantastic roleplay tool and game system rolled into one.
one extra piece of advice, if you have any familiarity with the Dresden Files books, pick up the Dresden Files RPG. it is the best of FATE, already adapted into an urban fantasy environment, and the PDF is a treasure to read.
FATE: $5 for core PDF, $25 for core book+PDF.
Dresden Files RPG: $25 for Core PDF, $50 for Core book+PDF.

hope this helps, and good gaming.

[othaero]

...You should allow players to use modern kevlar armor and riot shields, which I imagine are better than Renaissance era full plate armor, if I knew I was going up against undead monsters and orcs I would buy modern armor...

Kevlar is useless against arrows and swords and whatnot, It's easily cut.


But to answer OP question: D20 modern is a good choice. Most 3.5 monsters can be ported over wothout to much difficulty. My only problem with it is written kinda weird to me.

[dps]

And of course, if your orcs or zombies are toting AK-47s, then you want the Kevlar ballistics vest.

Functionally, orcs with guns aren't really any different than humans with guns. Zombies with the intelligence to use guns would be well-nigh unstoppable.

[sengmeng]

I'd take the system that you like best that has orcs and zombies, and just stat then guns how you want.

[Martin Greywolf]

And of course, if your orcs or zombies are toting AK-47s, then you want the Kevlar ballistics vest.

Only if you want to die looking tacticool. Against rifles, you need much, much heavier gear (ablative ceramic plates are the usual solution) - incidentally, that kind of bulletproof vest weights a good 10 kilos more than proper full plate.

[Perch]

Well, they will be fighting hordes! At first using guns againts medieval orcs and undead is going to be easy... But ammo won't last forever.

Also, I plan to have a legendary artifact for each player, something like Excalibur, Masamune, Lance of Longinus etc.. So that they won't be dependent on guns.

[Beneath]

In that case, if the guns are something they're gonna run out of and magic swords are going to be the mainstay, D&D could almost work, though it expects a higher fraction of the party to be magic-users than might be ideal. You could also maybe hack together some hybrid of Dungeon World and Apocalypse World to handle it.

Though "which system" is less about "I want a system that models these objects" and more about feel and the kind of stories that come out; guns can be put into most systems. GURPS plays differently from D&D plays differently from Dungeon World plays differently from FATE plays differently from Shadowrun.

[Nifft]

You could also have a mechanic whereby a PC can use magic to generate a quantity of temporary ammo.

Alternately, be sure you use something abstract enough that a PC won't get screwed over for being good at guns, since "good at modern combat" seems like a pretty natural party role in an urban fantasy game.

[gkathellar]

Honestly, if you're going for a combat-heavy miniatures skirmish game, I'd recommend 4e with a martials-only cast and firearms represented as a limited treasure trove of level-inappropriate attacks. If there's one thing 4e does well, it's skirmish combat.

Also, weighing in on the IRL armor and weapons vs. zombies argument, Max Brooks has basically got this one: you want heavy, long-to-medium length polearms and trench axes or hatchets as emergency backup weapons, combined with accurate, reliable semi-automatic rifles with decent magazine size. Explosives and automatics are wasted against the undead, who don't fall to organ or muscle damage and don't go into shock. Swords, flails, maces and the like are designed for human opponents and weapon-to-weapon combat, but the axe and spear are our old standbys. As for armor, old-school plate would have its advantages, although hands and arms would be the really critical bit and you could probably afford to drop parts of the suit if you knew there was no human threat.

[Berenger]

You could also have a mechanic whereby a PC can use magic to generate a quantity of temporary ammo.

Or a miniquest to obtain the service of master artisans (alchemist, whitesmith) that can craft small quantities of ammunition from hand (enough to supply a hero or two for emergencies, but not enough to start equipping normal soldiers).

[Anonymouswizard]

Well, they will be fighting hordes! At first using guns againts medieval orcs and undead is going to be easy... But ammo won't last forever.

Also, I plan to have a legendary artifact for each player, something like Excalibur, Masamune, Lance of Longinus etc.. So that they won't be dependent on guns.

Can we get more details about this scenario?

For example, is the horde fight one giant combat encounter? Because if it's a horde but you don't face them all at once then the problem of ammunition becomes significantly less important if you're near somewhere that sells bullets.

If they're stuck in a world without access to ammunition, at that point I suggest talking about that with the players beforehand so they can focus on other combat skills (or use a system like Fate, where shooting a gun and using a bow work fundamentally the same, because really there's no need to differentiate between one way to kill at range and another).

Don't count on the players necessarily wanting the legendary artefacts, or even using them if they take them. I can see one player being given all the close combat artefacts while the others focus on guns, or them only being taken out for 'special' foes.

[The Glyphstone]

You can always straight-up invent 'gun' artifacts too, if your players seem inclined towards using them over the melee ones. Wild Bill's Six-Shooter, the Rifle of the White Death, Murphy's Thompson, etc.

[Knaight]

Savage Worlds seems to suit this. It's built for pulp, and this sounds pulpy. More than that it's built to have tactical combat which handles a lot of participants well, thus fitting the hordes situation. It already has rules for an extensive variety of more modern weaponry, so that won't need to be recreated the way it would for a more typical fantasy game.

If you want more of an organizational conflict focus, the ORE blend of REIGN and Nemesis would also work.

[Joe the Rat]

I rechecked this. I see writeups for orcs, zombies, axes, and AK-47s, and the Weird War genre for your battle horror needs. Yer covered.

Character building takes a bit of learning, but actual play is really straightforward.