a guide to Bart the Dart Bard

[plinths]

Bart is a jack of all trades, a Robin Hood, and either a lucky fool or Batman.

Bart likes to wear bandoliers of darts, and throw lots of them with bonus damage from Dragonfire Inspiration.

This is a build that's designed to be more effective than people expect when you tell them you're multiclassing Bard/Fighter/Paladin. Also, thrown weapons are something not seen too often.

Bart does, however, have some disadvantages:
- a reliance on expensive wands
- weak damage against enemies with damage reduction and fire resistance
- multiple attribute dependence
- poor Spot and Listen skills
- requires stuff from various books

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race: Silverbrow Human

classes: Bard 1 / Fighter 1 / Paladin of Freedom 3 / Fighter 2 / Master Thrower 5 / Occult Slayer 2

typical 32-point buy stats: 10 Str, 16 Dex, 14 Con, 12 Int, 8 Wis, 16 Cha

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level 1: Bard 1
flaw: Noncombatant
feats: Dragonfire Inspiration, Point Blank Shot, Rapid Shot
class ability: Inspire Courage

items: Masterwork Tool for Tumble (50 gp, +2 Circumstance to Tumble from something like elbow and knee pads)
weapons: shortbow, some backup melee weapon
armor: studded leather (25 gp)
animals: pack mule (8 gp)
mount: light warhorse (150 gp + 30 gp saddle)

some skills to get while they're cheap:
3 in Perform
4 in Use Magic Device
4 in Sleight of Hand (for Master Thrower)
4 in Balance (you'll want 5 ranks of this eventually)
4 in Knowledge: arcana (for Knowledge Devotion)
1 each in Knowledge: dungeoneering, local, nature, the planes
at least 1 in Tumble

Any extra points can go to Diplomacy and Tumble.


level 2: Fighter 1
bonus feat: Precise Shot
weapon: masterwork composite longbow (with wand chamber, which is +100 gp)
wands: Inspirational Boost (750 gp), Cure Light Wounds (750 gp)

Get a (cross-class) rank in Knowledge: arcana.
Maybe get 1 rank in Ride for mounted archery.


level 3: Paladin of Freedom 1
feat: Knowledge Devotion
items: Badge of Valor (1400 gp)

You want Collector of Stories (skill trick) and a point in Knowledge (religion) for Knowledge Devotion.
You'll also want 5 ranks in Bluff for the synergies.

Badge of Valor can't be activated in the same round as Inspirational Boost, but it uses mental activation so it can be used the next round.


level 4: Paladin of Freedom 2
class ability: add Charisma mod to saves, a little bit of healing
attributes: +1 Dexterity (for Dead Eye)


level 5: Paladin of Freedom 3
class ability: immunity to Compulsion effects

items: Amulet of Tears (2300 gp, uses the same slot as Badge of Valor), Anklet of Translocation (1400 gp), Healing Belt (750 gp), Talisman of the Disk (500 gp)
armor: +1 Mithralmist Shirt (3400 gp)

Going by the magic item creation rules, combining Amulet of Tears with Badge of Valor is only 700 gp extra, and adding +Constitution to it later has no extra cost.


level 6: Fighter 2
feat: Dead Eye (Dragon Compendium)
bonus feat: Weapon Focus (darts)


level 7: Master Thrower 1
6 BAB -> extra attack
bonus feat: Quick Draw
class ability: Palm Throw (double attacks with light thrown weapons, but no strength bonus)
weapons: darts on bandoliers, harpoons (good but heavy, non-proficient exotic weapons)
items: daggers with wand chambers (if needed), Hat of Disguise (1800 gp)
wands: Resurgence (750 gp), Alter Self (4500 gp)
armor: least Iron Ward Diamond (500 gp)

Because throwing weapons only uses one hand, you can get the armor bonus from a buckler. So, you'll probably want a +1 buckler (1165 gp).

Tie your wand-daggers to a bandolier or belt with cords so you don't lose them when you drop them. If your DM says that you might injure yourself tumbling, you can get them in light hammers or Monk's canes instead. (Or you can just ask if Quick Draw can apply to wands. In fact, it should apply: "Drawing a weapon so that you can use it in combat, or putting it away so that you have a free hand, requires a move action. This action also applies to weapon-like objects carried in easy reach, such as wands.")

Max out Tumble now that it's a class skill again.

Alter Self forms:
Troglodytes have 6 natural armor and Weapon Focus (javelin)
Varags have 60 ft movement
Locathah have 60 ft swimming


level 8: Master Thrower 2
class ability: reflex saves for half damage become full saves
attributes: +1 Dexterity (to 18)

A full attack with darts now does
(2 + 1 (Rapid Shot)) * (1d4 + 3d6 (Dragonfire Inspiration) + 4 (Dead Eye)) * 2 (Palm Throw)
which is 102 average damage.


level 9: Master Thrower 3
feat: Improved Initiative (for Occult Slayer)
class ability: Trip Shot (trip with thrown weapons)

Tumble backwards, trip the enemy, and then they can't hit you with a melee attack on their turn.

items: +2 Dexterity (on bracers), +2 Cloak of Charisma, +2 Constitution (added to amulet)
custom items: continuous Ray of Hope (8000 gp), 1/day command word Tyche's Touch (2160 gp)

Because Ray of Hope gives a saving throw, you can choose not to be immune to it. ("Voluntarily Giving up a Saving Throw")

armor: +2 Mithralmist Shirt of Easy Travel (3400 -> 7900 gp) with +1 natural armor (+2000 gp) and +1 deflection AC (+2000 gp)

weapon: +1 composite longbow (+2000 gp) with lesser Crystal of Energy Assault (3000 gp)

wands:
level 1 (750 gp) -> Inspirational Boost, Resurgence, Feather Fall, Friendly Face, Swift Expeditious Retreat, Protection from Evil
level 2 (4500 gp) -> Alter Self, Divine Insight, See Invisibility, Dimension Leap at CL 4 (6000 gp), Lesser Restoration, Mirror Image
level 2 eternal wands (4420 gp) -> Heroics, Alter Self
level 3 eternal wands (10900 gp) -> Heart of Water, Stinking Cloud

Heroics can give you Martial Study for Child of Shadow or Shadow Jaunt.


level 10: Master Thrower 4
bonus feat: Snatch Arrows

12 ranks in Tumble is probably enough. That lets you get Back on Your Feet (skill trick).


level 11: Master Thrower 5
class ability: Weak Spot (ranged touch attacks with thrown weapons, but no strength bonus)

By my reading, you can use Weak Spot with Palm Throw, but Trip Shot requires a "normal" attack.


level 12-13: Occult Slayer 1-2
class ability: 1/day spell turning

For feats, I'd suggest Endurance -> Steadfast Determination for better saves. You could get Woodland Archer for better hit chances, or Martial Study: Child of Shadow, but you can also get those from the Heroics spell.


weapon: +1 binding, corrosive, dispelling, or magebane composite longbow (+6000 gp)

When you have the money, you might want some special-purpose composite longbows:
- greater dispelling (+2)
- binding (+1)


0 to 10k gp items: Handy Haversack (2000 gp), Bag of Holding I (2500 gp), Rod of Escape (3500 gp, provides Knock), Ring of Shrinking (3600 gp), Circlet of Persuasion (4500 gp), Gloves of Endless Javelins (7000 gp), Bag of Holding III (7400 gp), Horizon Goggles (8000 gp), Necklace of Adaptation (9000 gp)

custom items: +5 Competence to Tumble (2500 gp), continuous Summon Nature's Ally 2: Hippogriff (6700 gp, price based on Bowl of Commanding Water Elementals and Bag of Tricks)

If the Hippogriff-summoning item isn't allowed, you can instead get an item of continuous Summon Monster 1 or Summon Desert Ally 1 (8000 gp). (As written, Desert Ally summons do get the construct HP bonus.)

10k to 20k gp items: Ring of Invisibility (10000 gp), Belt of Battle (12000 gp), Boots of Speed (12000 gp), Vest of Free Movement (12000 gp), Cloak of Mysterious Emergence (13000 gp)

custom items: 1/day command word Polymorph (10080 gp), 1/day command word CL 14 Phantom Steed (15120 gp), 1/day command word Teleport (16200 gp)

If you have Inspire Courage active, then Polymorph into a Darktentacles, you can throw 24 darts in a turn, all with bonus damage. You could attach darts along a long cord that's in a Bag of Holding or on a Floating Disk, and use it like a belt of machine gun ammo.
Or, you can just turn into a War Troll and use a greatsword with Wraithstrike in a wand chamber.

My rules for custom magic items are:
- "self only" spells can't be items
- "1 round" duration spells can't be continuous because they don't have a pricing rule
- unlimited use items of a spell with a persistent effect can only maintain one of that effect at a time


wands requiring Use Magic Device:
level 1 (750 gp) -> Lesser Vigor, Guided Shot, Shield at CL 3 (2250 gp), Nerveskitter, Obscuring Mist, Entangle, Arrow Mind, Blockade
level 2 (4500 gp) -> Wings of Cover, Tyche's Touch, Web, Heroics, Wraithstrike (in a greatsword wand chamber)
level 3 (11250 gp) -> Heart of Water, Stinking Cloud
level 4 (21000 gp) -> Polymorph, Heart of Earth

With 18 Charisma (+4), Circlet of Persuasion (+3), and continuous Ray of Hope (+2), you only need 10 ranks in Use Magic Device to always succeed using a wand.

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items for higher levels:

weapons: +1 Warning dagger (8320 gp, holds a Nerveskitter wand), lesser Crystal of Truedeath (ghost touch, 5000 gp), +1 Spellblade (Dispel Magic) dagger (8320 gp, holds Wings of Cover)

items: Ring of Negative Protection (36000 gp)
wands: Plane Shift (33750 gp), Resist Energy at CL 11 (16500 gp)

armor: Aporter (20000 gp) armor, +1 Soulfire buckler (25000 gp) with a lesser Clasp of Energy Protection (fire) (1500 gp)

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At level 13, Bart could potentially win a fight vs a level 13 Wizard.
- Binding longbow stops teleportation
- Greater Dispelling longbow removes buffs
- Paladin levels give good saves and compulsion immunity
- Wings of Cover blocks targeted attacks
- Dimension Leap teleports you out of a forcecage
- Occult Slayer lets you reflect a spell
- See Invisibility counters invisibility
- Guided Shot and Horizon Goggles allow for long-range attacks
- Heart of Water for freedom of movement

As for melee enemies:
- tumble prevents full attacks and attacks of opportunity
- a horse or Hippogriff or Phantom Steed lets you kite enemies
- Anklet of Translocation lets you escape grapples
- Alter Self gives you +6 AC as a Troglodyte, or lets you outrun enemies as a Locathah
- Blockade stops charges
- Wings of Cover can block an attack
- Back on Your Feet stops tripping

[Inevitability]

I don't have the time to go through all this right now, but have you considered taking another feat and using it for Draconic Heritage if you're worried about fire resistance/immunity? Electricity is far less common a resistance, for one.

[plinths]

have you considered taking another feat and using it for Draconic Heritage if you're worried about fire resistance/immunity?

Electricity would be better than fire, but you'll still find something that resists it eventually.

IMO, the problem isn't that it's fire damage, the problem is that most of your damage is coming from a fixed type of energy damage that you can't change.

That's part of why I included an energy assault crystal, Dead Eye, and Gloves of Endless Javelins (which ignore damage resistance).

[Darrin]

That's part of why I included an energy assault crystal, Dead Eye, and Gloves of Endless Javelins (which ignore damage resistance).

Actually... if you want to be pedantic, [force] is not actually defined as an energy type by the rules, so it doesn't automatically bypass DR. Most [force] effects are spells, so they bypass DR that way, but there are a couple non-spell effects that do [force] damage without mentioning that they bypass DR. Gloves of Endless Javelins are one of those effects. (Crystal Helm soulmeld is the other one.) However, I have a hard time imagining most DMs would insist on such dedication to pedantry.

[ExLibrisMortis]

I don't get what the paladin (especially paladin 3) and occult slayer levels are supposed to be doing for you. For a palm thrower build, I'd sooner expect some SA damage, such as a swordsage 1/assassin 1/rogue 1 sequence, and maybe going into Unseen Seer to pick up hunter's eye.

You could try divine bard into prestige paladin (of freedom), which is solid. Requires Mounted Combat and Turn Undead, so the feat/dip load is annoying. Still, the Elf domain can provide PBS, for example, and the War domain can do some useful work. Cloistered cleric 1/divine bard 4/hit-and-run exoticist fighter 1/prestige paladin 3/swordsage 1/master thrower 5 could be nice. If you're happy to take TU later, you can get it from Sacred Exorcist.

Either way, you're losing a fair bit of DFI. Iirc Chaos Music can provide some bonus there.

[plinths]

I don't get what the paladin (especially paladin 3) and occult slayer levels are supposed to be doing for you. For a palm thrower build, I'd sooner expect some SA damage, such as a swordsage 1/assassin 1/rogue 1 sequence, and maybe going into Unseen Seer to pick up hunter's eye.

You could try divine bard into prestige paladin (of freedom), which is solid. Requires Mounted Combat and Turn Undead, so the feat/dip load is annoying. Still, the Elf domain can provide PBS, for example, and the War domain can do some useful work. Cloistered cleric 1/divine bard 4/hit-and-run exoticist fighter 1/prestige paladin 3/swordsage 1/master thrower 5 could be nice. If you're happy to take TU later, you can get it from Sacred Exorcist.

Sneak Attack + Master Thrower seems workable, but that's a completely different build. You need Sneaky Shot, Palm Throw doesn't help, and you need to max Sleight of Hand. Hit'n'Run Fighter seems good for that, but it seems like it's for Drow only...?

I don't see the advantage of going Divine Bard. Not only do you lose arcane wand usage, you also need Wisdom, and you still need Charisma too for the Paladin save bonus.

Swordsage is a good class, but I don't think it gives you Weapon Focus to qualify for Master Thrower, it just gives you the "benefit" of it....?

What does Thug give you? More skill points for losing a feat seems like a bad trade to me.

Cloistered Cleric is good for pretty much everything, but I wanted to get Palm Throw as soon as possible (which requires good BAB) and I guess I didn't think it fit thematically. YMMV there.

[ExLibrisMortis]

My problem overall is that you're going into bard, getting casting and Inspire Courage, and end up dropping it for no less than ten non-casting non-bardic music levels. I'd like to see a more bard-like DFI bard (your title promised bards! I'm all for bards!), with Song of the Heart/Words of Creation, more bardic casting, and so forth. You could even use From Smite to Song and Sword of the Arcane Order to drop the bard levels entirely (which, incidentally, would be awesome). As-is, it's more like a Master Thrower/wand user with a bunch of dips.


Sneak Attack + Master Thrower seems workable, but that's a completely different build. You need Sneaky Shot, Palm Throw doesn't help, and you need to max Sleight of Hand. Hit'n'Run Fighter seems good for that, but it seems like it's for Drow only...?
It doesn't say anywhere it's drow-only, just that drow train fighters like this.

As for SA not working on both PT hits, "both damage rolls resolve separately" sort of seems to indicate all bonus damage is applied twice, but I can definitely see that being ruled the other way. If so then yes, it's not useful. SS is never useful; it takes a move action to use. You force SA by hiding, surprise, that sort of thing. Bards are masters of illusion, after all.

You're still right, of course, it's a different build.


I don't see the advantage of going Divine Bard. Not only do you lose arcane wand usage, you also need Wisdom, and you still need Charisma too for the Paladin save bonus.
You gain divine wand usage, Serenity can switch over Divine Grace to wisdom, and you get extra casting (at least two levels, possibly more) & special mount (as paladin 6, mostly for fun). It comes down to how many feats you're willing to spend to improve casting. It does contradict something else I mentioned (Words of Creation relies on cha/int), so maybe arcane bard is preferable.


Swordsage is a good class, but I don't think it gives you Weapon Focus to qualify for Master Thrower, it just gives you the "benefit" of it....?
Probably. Swordsage is in there for Shadow Blade (throw daggers, get dex to damage), maneuvers, and save replacers, which can make Divine Grace a lot less critical. Wisdom to AC can be decent if you're going wis-SAD.


What does Thug give you? More skill points for losing a feat seems like a bad trade to me.
Err, I never mentioned thug. I'm not sure what you mean, the exoticist variant fighter maybe? That's just in there to get free EWP, you still get a bonus feat from that level.


Cloistered Cleric is good for pretty much everything, but I wanted to get Palm Throw as soon as possible (which requires good BAB) and I guess I didn't think it fit thematically. YMMV there.
Yeah, cleric is a bit of a necessary evil for the prestige paladin prereqs. As said, Sacred Exorcist can do much the same: bard 8/SE 1/MT 1/PP 3 will get 10th-level bard casting, and, using Song of the Heart (replaces suggestion at bard 6), +3 IC before spells or items.

To get Palm Throw relatively early, and still benefit from good casting (which equals power), you'll want no more than a single level of Master Thrower. You lose the ability to make touch attacks, but you gain the ability to be really big (Weak Spot doesn't work on targets smaller than yourself), boosting damage.


There are a lot of things to be said about such an extensively written-out build (this is a good thing), and even if three-quarters of my suggestions take the build in an unintended direction, we'll eventually stumble on something that will improve the execution of the concept.

[plinths]

> As-is, it's more like a Master Thrower/wand user with a bunch of dips.

Right, I was trying for a non-caster thrown weapons user. There are plenty of caster builds, and bards aren't very good at magic unless you go Sublime Chord.

> As for SA not working on both PT hits

Palm Throw explicitly says: "This ability counts as a volley attack, and only one instance of precision-based damage applies to the attack roll."

Also, I checked Sneaky Shot and it requires a move action. So you'd only get one attack a turn, which is pretty weak. Probably better to just be a ninja and turn invisible or turn into a tiger.

> You gain divine wand usage

I was actually forgetting how wands work: you just need to have the spell on your list of spell choices. Divine Bard doesn't really affect wands at all, except you can't use eternal wands. (Not a big deal, really.)

> Swordsage is in there for Shadow Blade

Hmm, it says it only adds damage to melee attacks...?

> Err, I never mentioned thug

Huh. Now I don't remember what happened there.

> exoticist variant fighter

But why do you want exotic weapon proficiency? For shurikens? You can enchant them at ammunition prices, but shurikens have half the range of darts. (Also, Dragon Magazine.)

> You lose the ability to make touch attacks, but you gain the ability to be really big (Weak Spot doesn't work on targets smaller than yourself), boosting damage

Boosting damage? Palm Throw means you don't get any strength bonus.

For bonus strength damage, you'd probably want Brutal Throw + Phylactery of Change, and probably Bloodstorm Blade instead of Master Thrower.

> even if three-quarters of my suggestions take the build in an unintended direction, we'll eventually stumble on something that will improve the execution of the concept

That's true. I do appreciate getting comments in any case.

[ExLibrisMortis]

Palm Throw explicitly says: "This ability counts as a volley attack, and only one instance of precision-based damage applies to the attack roll."
It doesn't in my copy of Complete Warrior. Is there an errata for Palm Throw?


Also, I checked Sneaky Shot and it requires a move action.
Yes, I mentioned that. That's why you would use other means than SS to force SA.


Hmm, it says it only adds damage to melee attacks...?
Apologies, forget about that, then. Unless you're going Bloodstorm Blade with Weapon Finesse, or something like that (could be funny).


But why do you want exotic weapon proficiency? For shurikens? You can enchant them at ammunition prices, but shurikens have half the range of darts. (Also, Dragon Magazine.)
Why do you not want EWP, when you get to pick four weapons for free? Skiprocks can get you a bonus attack (and ammo prices, 1d6 damage, 15' increment), annulat have great stats: 1d6/19-20/x2, 30' range increment.


Boosting damage? Palm Throw means you don't get any strength bonus.
Bonus damage from size, but now I realize the size increases for such low-die weapons don't really add up to much. For annulat, or other 1d6 medium weapons, it'd be 1d6 extra damage for two size categories, but at -2 to hit, so that's pretty meh, unless you use Brutal Throw (you don't get STR to damage, but you can get it to attack, compensating for size attack penalties).


If you were going for a non-magical thrower, I'd suggest adding Bloodstorm Blade. The ability to treat thrown attacks as melee attacks is huge, including bonus damage from Power Attack on each Palm Throw dart. It doesn't really bite the Master Thrower, which only forbids strength bonus, not any other bonus. Paladin 3 and Occult Slayer 1-2 are still mediocre, especially the latter. Targeteer fighter is great, if exoticist is not your cup of tea.

Maybe try adding some incarnum, with Incarnate Avatar (chaos) and Sighting Gloves? A two-level incarnate dip will get you three melds with three essentia (your capacity will be 2, at level 6+, and 3, at 12+). Though a bit short on essentia, that's +3 to ranged damage rolls, +1 to ranged attack rolls, and Planar Ward, which provides immunity to compulsion and other mental control.

[plinths]

It doesn't in my copy of Complete Warrior. Is there an errata for Palm Throw?


I was looking at this (http://alcyius.com/dndtools/classes/master-thrower/index.html).
I assume there was errata, that site usually includes it.



Why do you not want EWP, when you get to pick four weapons for free? Skiprocks can get you a bonus attack (and ammo prices, 1d6 damage, 15' increment), annulat have great stats: 1d6/19-20/x2, 30' range increment.
...
Targeteer fighter is great, if exoticist is not your cup of tea.


Fair enough - if your DM allows Dragon Magazine or the Drow Fighter variant, then there's really no downside to taking those instead. Targeteer is the better option IMO. I was just trying to stick to pure 3.5 with no magazine stuff.



If you were going for a non-magical thrower, I'd suggest adding Bloodstorm Blade. The ability to treat thrown attacks as melee attacks is huge, including bonus damage from Power Attack on each Palm Throw dart. It doesn't really bite the Master Thrower, which only forbids strength bonus, not any other bonus. Paladin 3 and Occult Slayer 1-2 are still mediocre, especially the latter.


That's true, Power Attack + Bloodstorm Blade + Palm Throw would work.

However, I have to disagree with you about Occult Slayer being bad. Spell turning is pretty useful, and it has full BAB.

[Inevitability]

looking at this

I suggest not posting links to that site: it's against the forum rules.

[ExLibrisMortis]

I waslooking at this.
I assume there was errata, that site usually includes it.
I found the errata, and the site is correct. No double precision damage :smallfrown:.


Fair enough - if your DM allows Dragon Magazine or the Drow Fighter variant, then there's really no downside to taking those instead. Targeteer is the better option IMO. I was just trying to stick to pure 3.5 with no magazine stuff.
Drow fighter isn't magazine, so that's well in. Dragon Magazine, sort of on the fence. A guide should include all options, though.


However, I have to disagree with you about Occult Slayer being bad. Spell turning is pretty useful, and it has full BAB.
It doesn't do anything for your throwing, and the reflection is 1/day only - why not get a ring of spell-battle, instead? There are better ways to become resistant to magic; you already have Divine Grace, so it's not like your defences were lacking.

With your build, you could take two levels bard instead, getting the same base attack, and the prerequisite for Song of the Heart. You could get the incarnum dip I mentioned, adding 3 damage to each ranged attack and making paladin 3 obsolete, opening up other dips in that space. You could dip something for Evasion, and trade it for the Complete Mage Spell Reflection ability, which works 1 + DEX times per day; that's probably 5+ times per day, given that dex is your primary attack skill (it's weaker than Mind over Magic, but usable all day). You can use ToB counters to stop spells, with Diamond Mind save replacers or Child of Shadow concealment (stack with Fellmist Robe for fun). There are a lot of options here. Occult Slayer is one of the least interesting/powerful ones.