Dominate Monster

[Arvin Natsuko]

The spell Dominate Monster says in the description that:

"If you or creatures that are friendly to you are fighting it, it has advantage on the saving throw."

But if a creature you are fighting becames unconscious, it still get the advantage on the save?

Thanks,

Arvin

[Ninja_Prawn]

The spell Dominate Monster says in the description that:

"If you or creatures that are friendly to you are fighting it, it has advantage on the saving throw."

But if a creature you are fighting becames unconscious, it still get the advantage on the save?

Thanks,

Arvin

By RAW, it looks like it still has advantage. If it was knocked unconscious while fighting you, it's fair to assume it would be hostile towards you when it woke up, even if you had declared that you were no longer fighting it while it was down. So I'd give it advantage.

[Addaran]

Not sure for RAW, i could see it going either way.

I'm rule that he doesn't get advantage. At that point, you already won*, so you're mostly using resources for the exploration/social aspect of the game. Probably want to question it, use him to reach something (special movement or size), for tripping traps or for the next fight but you need to use even more resources to heal it.

*except very rare cases like a troll when you don't have fire

[RogueGuy]

I would rule that it doesn't get advantage, seeing as you had already won. However, you would have to wake it up to get any effect out it. Otherwise, you are wasting a spell slot.

[Ninja_Prawn]

I don't think it's safe at all to assume that the players have 'won' because a monster is unconscious. What if they're fighting more than one monster? They could knock one out, Dominate it, Heal it and then use it to overpower its former allies. If you removed the 'hostility' advantage, that might even be a sensible use of resources (especially if the party has some way to impose disadvantage). From a metagame perspective, you have to treat this as a 'combat' situation, not a social or exploration one.

[Addaran]

I don't think it's safe at all to assume that the players have 'won' because a monster is unconscious. What if they're fighting more than one monster? They could knock one out, Dominate it, Heal it and then use it to overpower its former allies. If you removed the 'hostility' advantage, that might even be a sensible use of resources (especially if the party has some way to impose disadvantage). From a metagame perspective, you have to treat this as a 'combat' situation, not a social or exploration one.

Even with lots of enemies, it's extremely rare in my experience that enemies will have healing to bring him back. Using dominate is high lvl slot (5 or 8) and then healing, which usually isn't that effective ( the best healing spells work overtime). I find it it's a creative and more complicated way of summoning a creature and if it takes damage, it gets more saves. The absolute best situation for this trick is if you fight two very equally powerful enemies. I don't see it breaking much.



The OP didn't mention if it was for a fight or a social/exploration situation and if it was the last enemy or not. If it's the last enemy/used in a non-combat situation for a social/exploration purpose, would you be okay with not giving advantage for the save?

[Arvin Natsuko]

The OP didn't mention if it was for a fight or a social/exploration situation and if it was the last enemy or not. If it's the last enemy/used in a non-combat situation for a social/exploration purpose, would you be okay with not giving advantage for the save?

There's not an actual situation. I was chosing the 8º level spell for my now level 15 Bard and came up with the doubt.

Thanks you all for the responses. I'll bring it to my GM.

[Ninja_Prawn]

If it's the last enemy/used in a non-combat situation for a social/exploration purpose, would you be okay with not giving advantage for the save?

Once I've set a precedent, I stick to it, so it'd still have advantage.

It's probably not broken either way, but I just don't feel this situation is compelling enough to deviate from the RAW. For me, the monster is hostile, whether it's conscious or not.

[SharkForce]

Once I've set a precedent, I stick to it, so it'd still have advantage.

It's probably not broken either way, but I just don't feel this situation is compelling enough to deviate from the RAW. For me, the monster is hostile, whether it's conscious or not.

but it isn't about hostility, it's about whether you're fighting it.

if you come across a group of enemies that hate your guts, but they're not yet certain they can win, and the sorcerer casts a subtle dominate on one of them, they wouldn't get advantage.

[Arvin Natsuko]

SharkForce came up with a good point. It's the same problem with a invisible caster. The enemy can't know you are fight him, or that you are friendly to another PC ho is on combat. If you are invisible sinse the start of the combat...

[Ninja_Prawn]

I was using the word hostile to mean 'in combat with you'. Obviously it's a different situation if combat hasn't started yet or the monster never knew you were there (though invisibility does not guarantee that).