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Kiero
2007-07-16, 09:52 AM
This is titled the "d20 and General RPG" forum, yet there's precious little of anything besides d20 being discussed. So in the spirit of generating some alternative conversation, what other things are people playing?

Are you demigodding it up with Exalted? Riffing off Reign? Performing acts of derring-do with Spirit of the Century? Trading around the galaxy in Traveller? GURPS-ing your way through a setting or three? A spot of Savage WOrlds?

If you're looking for something non-d20 and haven't had a chance to get some suggestions, here's the thread to pitch your requirements. Maybe someone can match a system up to some or all of them.

If you're just looking to see what's out there, John H Kim's bigass list of RPGs (http://www.darkshire.net/jhkim/rpg/encyclopedia/) is one potential starting point. There's about a thousand games on there.

So what have you got?

Thinker
2007-07-16, 09:55 AM
I play Exalted as well, but what's there to say about that? No one ever has questions about Exalted, thus what is there to talk about? The majority of people play d20 systems because it is more mainstream and seems to have the greatest amount of support for the system.

Kiero
2007-07-16, 09:57 AM
I play Exalted as well, but what's there to say about that? No one ever has questions about Exalted, thus what is there to talk about? The majority of people play d20 systems because it is more mainstream and seems to have the greatest amount of support for the system.

If no one's talking about games you want to talk about, you start threads about them. That said if you did want to talk lots about Exalted, there's always RPGnet for that. :smallwink:

Leon
2007-07-16, 09:59 AM
WHFRP atm, ocasionally Space rat, True20, M&M, among a host of others

Tengu
2007-07-16, 10:01 AM
I never played DND. I think it's an outdated system, good maybe for a computer game.

Games I play or played:
Warhammer Fantasy Roleplay (first edition)
Earthdawn
homebrew (my Final Fantasy game for example)

Games I really want to play one day:
Fading Suns
Exalted
non-emo White Wolf (Mage for example)
Deadlands

Counterspin
2007-07-16, 10:06 AM
I'm playing in an Unknown Armies game, and running a game in Palladium's Nightbane setting using the Unknown Armies rules, because I'll throw myself down a staircase before I use the Palladium system, but they give good setting.

ZeroNumerous
2007-07-16, 10:14 AM
non-emo White Wolf (Mage for example)

You have no idea what anything from World of Darkness is about if you think any of the games aren't 'emo', which in and of itself is a gross oversimplification.

Games I play:
Warhammer 40k(I have D&D for fantasy)
D&D (3.0+)
Star Wars d20
World of Darkness(Everything from new and old)
Exalted

Games I'd like to play:
Star Wars Saga.

Games I refuse to play:
Freakin' GURPS.

Kiero
2007-07-16, 10:17 AM
You have no idea what anything from World of Darkness is about if you think any of the games aren't 'emo', which in and of itself is a gross oversimplification.

Even accepting that "emo" is an oversimplification, given one of the core themes in Mage: the Ascension was hope, it doesn't easily sit with the other lines.

Morty
2007-07-16, 10:23 AM
Warhammer 40k(I have D&D for fantasy)

There is RPG system for W40k?

As for system I play: I once planned to play WFRPG 2nd edition, but potential players turned out to be jerks so I ended up playing D&D -that I like, BTW- with different people. Now I'll have to wait until it's my turn to DM and I'll run WFRPG. I prefer low-powered fantasy, and WFRPG represents it better. Also, I'm playing my homebrewed low-powered d20 system.

Kiero
2007-07-16, 10:27 AM
There is RPG system for W40k?

Not an official one, yet, though Black Industries have one/three in the works. Plenty of fan-made conversions out there, though.

ZeroNumerous
2007-07-16, 10:27 AM
Mage: The Ascension focused on re-designing the 'average' human's belief that magic existed. They existed to literally crush the existing concept of reality.

M0rt: Technically it's homebrew, but it's a Warhammer d20 system that our DM found online. It's floating around somewhere.

Kiero
2007-07-16, 10:29 AM
Mage: The Ascension focused on re-designing the 'average' human's belief that magic existed. They existed to literally crush the existing concept of reality.

There was a big old grab-bag of themes in the corebook for both 1st and 2nd edition (less so Revised) which basically said pick the ones you're interested in. "Crushing existing reality" was by no means the only way in which it could be played, nor the only theme that could be explored.

ZeroNumerous
2007-07-16, 10:30 AM
There was a big old grab-bag of themes in the corebook for both 1st and 2nd edition (less so Revised) which basically said pick the ones you're interested in. "Crushing existing reality" was by no means the only way in which it could be played, nor the only theme that could be explored.

Yet without doing so, your magic would be disbelieved rather easily.

Morty
2007-07-16, 10:31 AM
M0rt: Technically it's homebrew, but it's a Warhammer d20 system that our DM found online. It's floating around somewhere.

Well, I've once seen rules for 40K set in D20 Modern. Is that it?

ZeroNumerous
2007-07-16, 10:38 AM
Yes. Ten character limit..

new1965
2007-07-16, 10:38 AM
So what have you got?

Use to play the non d20 Call of Cthulhu

The most dreaded two words to players - "Sanity Check"
Do NOT get attached to your characters because if you play long enough. your character will go insane

clockwork warrior
2007-07-16, 10:38 AM
how is arcana unearthed / evolved not on the list?

HOW!?!?

Pronounceable
2007-07-16, 11:17 AM
I almost always play homebrew. Every gameplay issue aside, DnD is just too much paperwork.

What I'd love to play (in spite of DnD) however, is Planescape. And White Wolf Mage, primarily because I want to see that in action.

Tharivol123
2007-07-16, 11:30 AM
Outside of D&D, the only games I've played more than once are the old Star Wars D6 (I like it better than the D20 Star Wars) and Metabarons.

psychoticbarber
2007-07-16, 11:56 AM
Use to play the non d20 Call of Cthulhu

I very much want to try that. Very very much. Anybody in SW Ontario with the original Call of Cthulhu game?

Tzekan
2007-07-16, 02:01 PM
I have never played DnD. Ever.

Our group is totally and solely interested in GURPS, they find the classes of DnD make it too linear and uninteresting to play, and make character stereotyped.

It's served us well, we play rather rules-lite sometimes, storyline first (didn't used to be that way, long story [shudders]) and rules serve it. Despite this GURPS always seems to contain the rules for what we need, and caters well to whatever we seem to want to run, which is pretty much everything you can think of!

mikeejimbo
2007-07-16, 02:12 PM
My group has played Mage and GURPS. Apparently we're eventually going to play some Exalted, too.

Omniplex
2007-07-16, 02:27 PM
I play GURPS. I bought GURPS 4th edition early this summer, and now I'm running a Sci-Fi adventure with a couple friends. I don't own any other books (having deleted all of the illegally downloaded D&D books, for ethical reasons), though I played in a couple of really weird and short lived D&D campains, and one Star Wars D6. I liked that system, because it was simple, but I do like GURPS, on account of it's versatility, and more freedom with characters than D&D. (though maybe my players would complain less about not having enough character points.)

Renx
2007-07-16, 02:34 PM
Old WoD, 7th sea, Exalted, Cyberpunk, FL4... thought that's in the past, mostly. Nowadays just War of the Ring and some MUDs ;)

Indon
2007-07-16, 02:47 PM
You have no idea what anything from World of Darkness is about if you think any of the games aren't 'emo', which in and of itself is a gross oversimplification.


I'd say the Technocracy material isn't the least bit emo. You could play it a bit dystopically, I guess, but that's not the same thing.

That said, I'm presently running an Exalted (1ed) campaign, I'm in a D10 zombie-survival campaign (don't remember the ruleset name) and I've played Old WoD in the past, as well as a few other excellent games such as Kobolds Ate My Baby! and Ninja Burger.

Edit: Oh! And Mechwarrior and Shadowrun. I could never forget you, FASA.

mostlyharmful
2007-07-16, 02:56 PM
our lot is having fun in the dark ages mage (WoD) game, same general themes as DnD with about a gazzillionth of the paperwork, plus a magic system that makes some kind of intergrated sense.

have also played WoD most games, Serenity, Angel/Buffy (not anywhere near as bad as some people on this forum seem to think) and Shadowrun (yay working for Dragons!!!!!)

Dizlag
2007-07-16, 03:03 PM
ALL HAIL KING TORG!

Yes, from Kobolds Ate My Baby ... a very good tongue in cheek roleplaying game. =) Has anyone played Land of Og (http://wingnutgames.com/landofog.htm) before? Fun times, fun times!

I've been playing the following RPGs:


Savage Worlds' 50 Fathoms campaign - we just killed Blackbeard, my character died but we're going after the Sea Hags anyways! :smalltongue:
d20 D&D - just finished DMing the Red Hand of Doom module (excellent, btw!) and playing in a Rappen Athuk campaign
Hackmaster - just dropped out of this group, but it was a blast!


Dizlag

Nevar
2007-07-16, 03:09 PM
I've played

Rolemaster
Most of White Wolf setting
Harn
WHFRPG
Deadlands
Gurps
Palladium Heros

selfcritical
2007-07-16, 03:13 PM
how is arcana unearthed / evolved not on the list?

HOW!?!?

It's a d20 game, and is for all intents and purposes, a reskinned dnd. It's a good game, but when asked what non d20 games i play, I would have no reason to mention it.

talsine
2007-07-16, 03:44 PM
mostly GURPS, though i'll be running a Shadowrun 4th ED gaem soon, and we have an Arcanis game that we play twice a month.

Diggorian
2007-07-16, 04:00 PM
I play M&M and in Alternity's StarDrive setting aside from D&D.

OverdrivePrime
2007-07-16, 04:14 PM
I'm currently running an Immortal 3rd edition play by post game. Somehow I was stupid enough to think that it "wouldn't be too tough" to manage 17 players. Thankfully my players are very patient for the most part. Immortal's been my favorite game system since 1st edition came out way back in '95, so thankfully I know the system and the setting quite well, but it's still a struggle to manage all those actions.

I'm playing in a friend's 3rd edition Shadowrun game, and I'm working on a 4th edition campaign to run.

Over the years, I've played in most major systems and a few oddballs as well:
Star Wars by West End Games (hail the bucket o' d6's!)
Shadowrun 1st, 2nd & 3rd edition
Rifts, Palladium, Heroes Unlimited
AD&D 2nd edition
World of Darkness / White Wolf - Vampire, Werewolf, Mage, Changeling, Mummy, Wraith. I'm apparently the only person on the Internet who intensely dislikes Exalted.
Paranoia
Hol
GURPS
a friend's hyper-detailed homebrew simply called "the Ghayme"

RedScholarGypsy
2007-07-16, 04:50 PM
I've played DnD 2.0 and 3.5, Wheel of Time, Spycraft, Deadlands 1.5 (and hopefully reloaded soon), Exalted, Gurps space, CoCth, and old Mage, Werewolf, and Vamp.

Yea, WoD games defintly lean towards emo, but my WoD storyteller (and me when I've run them) definitly do our best to purge it from our games.

Winterwind
2007-07-16, 04:57 PM
Well, let's see... I'll list only the games I have played somewhat extensively, not the ones I gave a try once or twice at a con, or something. I also have to make a disctinction between games I have played in a conventional way and those I played only without dice and rules.

Games I have played conventionally:
- DSA (Das Schwarze Auge, "The Black Eye") - most popular German fantasy RPG, probably the reason why D&D is so vastly unpopular here - the niche was taken already. It uses d20ies for check resolution, but not in a way anyhow related to THE d20-system. I guess that's why the entire d20-mechanic is not as popular here (matter of fact, I've never ever met a single roleplayer who played D&D or d20 in my life, save for cons, though I guess they are not that rare, it was probably just coincidence)
- ShadowRun (3rd edition) - not much to say about that. Somewhat too heavy on rules and equipment for my taste, but I like the world, both the cyberpunk setting (Gibson's Neuromancer is awesome, by the way!) and the magic/fantasy aspect. Too bad so many people play it as if the only kind of adventure a ShadowRunner could have was intruding into some heavily secured con structure. I don't think this should even amount to the majority of an adventure's content.
- Call of Cthulhu (d%-version) - well, I like Lovecraft's stories (does this make me... sick, somehow?), and a good friend of mine simply loves them, so it's just a natural choice. I also like how it's rather light on rules and focusses a lot more on the characters. Well, it has to, it's a horror game after all - if it's not about the psychology of the characters when confronted with sheer terror, what is it about then?
- Endland - German postapocalyptic RPG, discontinued by now. It had a pretty nifty check system and an atmosphere of utter despair and decay I found quite interesting (the premise is, basically, that within the next century, but possibly already within the next few years, the world will end ultimately.). It was somewhat... zany, though. For instance, characters accumulated... I have no idea how to translate it, a special kind of points anyhow, which caused them to randomly mutate over time. It is available for free download here (http://www.dimension7.ch/endland/downloads/endlandv2.zip), though it's only available in German.
- DeGenesis - another German postapocalyptic RPG (yes, I like this stuff :smallcool: ), which I consider the by far best RPG I have ever encountered. It contains a very compelling and detailled background, full of indications and hints for something... big going on, without ever saying as much as to limit one's imagination. It's also very light on rules, the first RPG I have seen I would consider truly focussed on the world instead of the mechanics. The basic story is that a meteor eradicated the civilisation, and the story takes place 500 years after - a phase of rebuild and hope, but also of great danger, since the meteor brought something onto the world which causes mankind to slowly mutate into its own worst enemy. It's available for free download here (http://www.degenesis.de/download/DEGENESIS_Grundregelwerk.pdf) in German and is currently being translated into English.
- and the RPG I play most is a fantasy RPG I created with friends for ourselves, being displeased with certain aspects of DSA.

Games I played, but without rules and dice:
- Vampire/Magus/Werewolf - our GM has created a very long and complex story for us in his version of the World of Darkness. I have never read the books, so I can't say for sure how much it has to do with the game as it is played usually, even though we have played this campaign for quite a while now. It's quite compelling though.
- Fading Suns - I love Dune (the books, not the movies), and our campaign here is quite interesting so far, too. Plus, I really enjoy the characters we play. :)
- Paranoia - Whoever has not played it yet, do so. Funniest thing I ever encountered in roleplaying games. Are you happy, citizen?
- KULT - seems like a very interesting setting to me. Unfortunately, I haven't had all that much opportunity to play it so far.

Games I would like to play:
- Unknown Armies. Seems like a game I would enjoy, not to mention I've heard the way the books are written is highly atmospheric, too, which makes it perfect in my eyes.

I had a short encounter with D&D and Earthdawn on conventions, though not long enough to be able to say much about them. Both seemed rather fun to me, though.

Kiero
2007-07-16, 05:50 PM
It's a d20 game, and is for all intents and purposes, a reskinned dnd. It's a good game, but when asked what non d20 games i play, I would have no reason to mention it.

I think clockwork warrior was talking about John Kim's massive list.

Ravyn
2007-07-16, 08:21 PM
Exalted primary--1E, as anyone who has put up one of the mythical Exalted threads quickly finds out, and I rewrite things and design artifacts anytime I get bored (out of curiosity, if I were to post such things in Homebrew, would I have an audience?). It's also the only system I run, period. Aberrant secondary (the real thing, not the d20 ripoff)--okay, currently tertiary, but we're only mentioning "other" games and right now I play what I can get. Did a toe-dip into PDQ's Dead Inside for a little while, but the game kinda fizzled, and I was one of two designers of Yet Another System That Never Got Off the Ground--though not for lack of determination on my part! (Darn lazy primary designers....)

Xuincherguixe
2007-07-17, 03:44 AM
I have much more experience with Shadowrun then D&D. 2nd and 3rd edition. People seemed to vanish without a trace and so I couldn't really justify getting more books. Even if they were quite awesome.

Don't know much about 4th edition. I've heard mixed opinions.

I wouldn't mind giving WoD a stab, if it could stay away from the whinny. I don't actually mind angst, but there's a difference between "My god, my very existence only serves to hurt everything around me." and "I've just been slapped and now the tears are making my mascara run." Still, could stand a good tossing of the angst. There's some good stuff there.

Exalted I've heard good things about too, much from 8 bit theater. Brian was saying that he created a combat librarian. In that he used libraries as weapons. I like systems that encourage creativity.

Dark Corners of the Earth really stuck for me, and has gotten me thinking about running a Call of Cthulhu game or two. Even more depressing then 'Monster: The Angst'. Hmm. Maybe white wolf should do a Shoggoth book :P

Rasumichin
2007-07-17, 08:04 AM
- DSA (Das Schwarze Auge, "The Black Eye") - most popular German fantasy RPG, probably the reason why D&D is so vastly unpopular here - the niche was taken already.

I wouldn't say that D&D is unpopular in Germany.

Back in the 90s, okay, but nowadays?
With most of the SR4 stuff not yet being published, the latest DSA edition being utterly broken, overcomplicated crap ruleswise and NWoD being cancelled?
It just isn't as big as in the rest of the world, but it's the second most succesful game currently on the market, at least over here in Cologne.

ChrisMcDee
2007-07-17, 08:16 AM
I play WHFRP when I get the chance but it's tough to find the players.

I'm a fair way into working on a homebrew setting based around the Powergame (http://www.uta.fi/~trmika/gameindex.html)rules at the moment, so soon I'll be playtesting that. Powergame's worth checking out if you like your rules light and your combat fast and lethal.

I couldn't get into GURPS so much, the character sheets are quite intimidating for a ruleslite fan, but I love their sourcebooks, they're often very handy even if you're not running GURPS!

Dhavaer
2007-07-17, 08:23 AM
There is RPG system for W40k?

There's Inquisitor, which is much closer to an RPG than Mordheim. It gives only the most token of nudges towards play balance, though, and it's not a very good nudge at that. A psyker with a power rating under 100 should not be able to ice a space marine, an Inquisitor and a guardsman in two turns.

Winterwind
2007-07-17, 12:33 PM
I wouldn't say that D&D is unpopular in Germany.

Back in the 90s, okay, but nowadays?
With most of the SR4 stuff not yet being published, the latest DSA edition being utterly broken, overcomplicated crap ruleswise and NWoD being cancelled?
It just isn't as big as in the rest of the world, but it's the second most succesful game currently on the market, at least over here in Cologne.I admittedly haven't been following the market closely, and in my roleplaying shop of choice there are indeed quite a lot of D&D books (even though they are still no more than a small minority as compared to the rest).
I just got this impression due to pretty much every German roleplayer I ever encountered, or discussed with in a forum, mentioned playing DSA, SR, CoC, WoD, other stuff, but never D&D.
I have met a lot of people ranting about D&D instead.

Rasumichin
2007-07-17, 01:29 PM
Well, i have perceived quite the opposite, both on the internet and IRL, starting with AD&D2 in the mid 90s after one of the players from my DSA/SR-group kept talking about how he played it with another group from a parallel class at school and i discovered the Dark Sun and Planescape settings.
Nowadays, there's this poll by a guy from the university in Mainz that claims D&D to be the second most played RPG in Germany, way before SR (which i also would have thought to be more popular, every group i know loves it).
Some regional difference, maybe.

horseboy
2007-07-17, 02:30 PM
Currently I'm GM an Earthdawn campaign.
I also play in a Rolemaster campaign.

Other games I enjoy would be:
Harn
Traveller
WHFB
Shadowrun (FASA editions, those no talent hacks have COMPLETELY destroyed it with 4th edition)

RamrodTheWizard
2007-07-17, 02:50 PM
Played DnD 3.5, Castles and Crusades, and non saga edition D20 star wars.

I'm interested in GURPS, CoC, and some others...but i really don't have the money to get them.

talsine
2007-07-17, 03:00 PM
Currently I'm GM an Earthdawn campaign.
I also play in a Rolemaster campaign.

Other games I enjoy would be:
Harn
Traveller
WHFB
Shadowrun (FASA editions, those no talent hacks have COMPLETELY destroyed it with 4th edition)

SR4 isn't that bad, unless you want to play a Rigger, cause they don't exist anymore. Which makes me sad. I can't convert my old SR3 character over and not have him nuetered because of the changes. 2 years down the pooper since the group doens't want/like to play SR3. Off to NPC land he goes.

Xuincherguixe
2007-07-17, 03:27 PM
Yeah. What's with that? Riggers though cumbersome are a great archetype. Not only that, but they're probably much easier to include in events then deckers. (Which are also cool, but if any archetype should have to go...)

....
2007-07-17, 03:54 PM
Werewolf (The most oft overlooked WW game that isn't utterly foolish like Wraith or Mummy) is not emo.

Its screamo. :smallbiggrin:

Flawless
2007-07-17, 04:32 PM
I mostly play DnD and I like it. Other games I played include;
-DSA
-Shadow Run
-Cyberpunk
-Midgard
-Mage
-Earthdawn
-Everquest PnP

Btw, DSA is "The Dark Eye" in English. Black eye stands for blaues Auge...

horseboy
2007-07-17, 05:52 PM
SR4 isn't that bad, unless you want to play a Rigger, cause they don't exist anymore. Which makes me sad. I can't convert my old SR3 character over and not have him nuetered because of the changes. 2 years down the pooper since the group doens't want/like to play SR3. Off to NPC land he goes.

Yes, yes it is bad. I was afraid it was going to be bad when I opened the book and saw that painful matrix crap all over every page. But I gave it the benefit of the doubt and got it anyway. Not only does the matrix scrawl make reading the book physically painful, but it turns it into some, cheap matrix knock off want to be system instead of the glorious thoroughbred that it is.

Third is the fact that the "fluff" parts of the game are devoid of anything even remotely Shadowrunish. They range from rip offs of Master Card commercials to bad Tek Wars (is there such a thing as good Tek Wars) wanna be moments.
There was NO slang used, everybody in it talked exactly like people do in the modern era. They called them Hackers! Hackers haven't existed (as a word) in Shadowrun in over 100 years! Suddenly they're going to go back and call themselves "hackers"? What's next? Samauri are going to be called "desperadoes"?

While the idea of the "wireless web" was a good idea, the fact that EVERYTHING is now tied into it would make deckers GODS. You may as well get a female cybernetic body and call yourself "The Major".

Then there were the mechanical problems. You know like elves need not use cover, since they'd get no benefit for it. The whole "beginning characters are PAINFULLY first level." Clearly, they're meant to model suburbanites who spent too much time on RP servers on their Shadowrun MMO and thought they could do it IRL, instead of "Redhawk" veteran of Desert Wars XII.

It may have had the rules of being a Shadowrunner, but it lacked the heart, soul and spirit of being a Shadowrunner.

Driderman
2007-07-17, 06:09 PM
I played a lot of World Of Darkness back when 2nd Edition was the hip new thing and I don't believe it was ever anything close to emo. Our vampires were either nasty, cunning and somewhat inhuman, with the occasional glimmer of humanity inside, with lots of scheming, backstabbing and politicking. Oh how we weaved some intriguing webs of deceit, betrayal and hunger for power. No killing other vampires unless absolutely necessary, thats really not cricket.

As for a Warhammer 40K rpg, I guess the closest thing you'll find until something is released is the old Rogue Trader game from way back when

horseboy
2007-07-17, 06:18 PM
As for a Warhammer 40K rpg, I guess the closest thing you'll find until something is released is the old Rogue Trader game from way back when

http://www.blackindustries.com/?template=40k&content=dh-press-release
They're late.

Winterwind
2007-07-17, 06:39 PM
Well, i have perceived quite the opposite, both on the internet and IRL, starting with AD&D2 in the mid 90s after one of the players from my DSA/SR-group kept talking about how he played it with another group from a parallel class at school and i discovered the Dark Sun and Planescape settings.
Nowadays, there's this poll by a guy from the university in Mainz that claims D&D to be the second most played RPG in Germany, way before SR (which i also would have thought to be more popular, every group i know loves it).
Some regional difference, maybe.Maybe, though it would surprise me. Why should it vary so much?
I always thought it went like 1. DSA, 2. ShadowRun, nothing for a long time, and then the rest. Guess I stand corrected.

Btw, DSA is "The Dark Eye" in English. Black eye stands for blaues Auge...Er... yeah, of course. I always get this wrong. :smalleek:

... The whole "beginning characters are PAINFULLY first level." Clearly, they're meant to model suburbanites who spent too much time on RP servers on their Shadowrun MMO and thought they could do it IRL, instead of "Redhawk" veteran of Desert Wars XII. I can't speak for the rest of the issues you have brought up, since I never read any 4th edition book, but this specifically seems very appealing to me. 3rd edition characters were always so incredibly hi-powered, the notion of them being lowlives struggling for survival on the streets seemed all too often ridiculous.
The rest of your comments however indicates to me I did the right thing when I never got myself interested in 4th edition.

Breaon
2007-07-17, 06:57 PM
A heavily modified version of Fantasy Hero, once a week. Mmmm, Hero...

horseboy
2007-07-17, 09:25 PM
I can't speak for the rest of the issues you have brought up, since I never read any 4th edition book, but this specifically seems very appealing to me. 3rd edition characters were always so incredibly hi-powered, the notion of them being lowlives struggling for survival on the streets seemed all too often ridiculous.
The rest of your comments however indicates to me I did the right thing when I never got myself interested in 4th edition.

Well, it's a believability thing in Shadowrun. What Mr. Johnson wants you to do is ultimately illegal. If you're not good at what you do, why should he run the risk of hiring you? What's going to make the most sense to hire, Redhawk, the vetran, or xXxPwnzrxXx with his 37th level beast lord on his resume?

Woops, you might not catch that reference, sorry.

Raum
2007-07-17, 09:27 PM
That depends entirely on his budget. :)

Winterwind
2007-07-18, 09:18 AM
This depends on both his budget, as Raum pointed out, and on the general power level of the campaign. No need to hire vastly overqualified people if lesser (and cheaper) ones would do.
All I'm saying is ShadowRun 3rd edition seems to advocate a power level much above what I personally prefer. I'm not saying that's inferior somehow, it just doesn't fit my taste precisely (close enough though to be easily modified into what I like, if need arise), because I'd like it somewhat more "grim&gritty".
My players have very different preferences about this aspect, and since we usually play with small groups and varying participants I just adjust the power level corresponding to the players currently playing.

horseboy
2007-07-18, 11:58 AM
This depends on both his budget, as Raum pointed out, and on the general power level of the campaign. No need to hire vastly overqualified people if lesser (and cheaper) ones would do.
All I'm saying is ShadowRun 3rd edition seems to advocate a power level much above what I personally prefer. I'm not saying that's inferior somehow, it just doesn't fit my taste precisely (close enough though to be easily modified into what I like, if need arise), because I'd like it somewhat more "grim&gritty".
My players have very different preferences about this aspect, and since we usually play with small groups and varying participants I just adjust the power level corresponding to the players currently playing.

Oh I know, we've touched on this topic before. I'm just saying if I was Mr. Johnson I wouldn't hire these guys to pick up my dry cleaning much less a slot-n-run. That sort of power you can play, but you really don't have much options. Something like a gangland-style with some West Side Story and Clockwork Orange overtones. But that's about it.

Prustan
2007-07-18, 05:14 PM
I've tried Shadowrun (blend of 2nd Ed, with some 3rd Ed material), Mage, AD&D, and am currently running a PbP Buffy game. I'm also playing a couple of D&D PbP games, and have made characters for Marvel Universe, Call of Cthulhu, WHFRP and Shadowrun 4th Ed (which I never really got into).