Finesse Fighting Style?

[WhiteWolf]

What do you lot think to this alternative Fighting Style?

Finesse
Choose 1 melee weapon that does not have the two-handed or heavy property, this weapon gains the finesse property when you wield it.

Is it balanced with the other fighting styles or does it need another benefit like maybe
+1 to attack rolls with that weapon to represent the skill and precision of the wielder?

Thanks

[Grod_The_Giant]

I'm having trouble seeing how it could be useful; the rapier already does 1d8 damage, so I think the best you could do is get a different damage type?

[WhiteWolf]

Its mainly to allow players to wield a weapon more appropriate to their character thematically, and so a dex based character can reasonably dual wield 2x1d8 weapons without looking ridiculous with two rapiers. I just feel there should be an option to be able to use a longsword, spear or battleaxe with dex

[Snig]

Its mainly to allow players to wield a weapon more appropriate to their character thematically, and so a dex based character can reasonably dual wield 2x1d8 weapons without looking ridiculous with two rapiers. I just feel there should be an option to be able to use a longsword, spear or battleaxe with dex

I just refluff. I usually call my rapier a boarding sword, or cutlass.

[Llama513]

I like the idea, and I think the +1 addition is a good idea, however I'm not sure if I would call it finesse fighting style, I might call it Elven training or something like that

[TundraBuccaneer]

This would also allow you to use versatile weapons, also when you put finesse on ranged weapons you can use strength (like dart).

Is this intended?

[Grod_The_Giant]

I'd do +1, then; give it some reason for existing besides thematics-- those should be a matter of refluffing, not something as significant as a fighting style choice.


This would also allow you to use versatile weapons, also when you put finesse on ranged weapons you can use strength (like dart).

Is this intended?
There's no real reason to swing a Versatile weapon two-handed and it's only +1 average damage if you do, so no fear there. You can already use Str with thrown weapons like darts; interesting catch that you can do it with bows, though probably not intended.

[WhiteWolf]

It does specify that it has to be a melee weapon so it's not usable with a bow.

I'll add +1 to attack if thats seems more balanced?

Also, would it be better to change it to 2 weapons, not just one or is that too much?

[Arkhios]

I'll add +1 to attack if thats seems more balanced?

Also, would it be better to change it to 2 weapons, not just one or is that too much?

I don't see the need for +1 to attack rolls in melee.
The +2 for Archery is mainly to mitigate the bonus to enemies' AC from having soft cover which is often a problem with ranged attacks. With melee attacks there is no need for that.
+1 to attack rolls for no real reason seems a bit odd. I would shift the bonus (if neccessary) to damage rolls instead. Still not breaking, since you could take Dueling and have +2 to damage when attacking with a one-handed melee weapon in one hand.

Might as well be three choice melee weapons, I guess.
As long as they don't have Heavy or Two-Handed properties, it shouldn't be broken in my opinion.

Being able to use versatile weapons as finesse isn't that bad, especially since Great Weapon Fighting Style has been confirmed that the reroll was intended for weapon damage only.

[WhiteWolf]

Updated version

Finesse
Choose 3 melee weapons that do not have the two-handed or heavy property, these weapons gain the finesse property when you wield them.
You also gain +1 to damage with these weapons.

Sound Good?

[JungDeviant]

I'd add one more modification: make it so that the weapons only gain the finesse property when wielded with one hand. I agree with the +1 attack bonus, it makes sense. I can see the benefit of having finesse on certain weapons, as some weapons get specific benefits for their weapon type. It's a nice perk that gives you more variety as a Dex-based fighter. You want that enchanted hammer or longsword? You can add Dex instead of Str now.

My other idea is that when you wield the weapon with one hand and no shield, maybe give a +1 to AC instead of attack. I assume you're going for a Duelist type, but if you want the option of a shielded finesse fighter, then no need.

[WhiteWolf]

I don't want to restrict it to one handed, I like the idea of wielding a spear in two hands using dex like an elven war dancer.
I'm also torn between +1 to attack and +1 to damage, what do you think

[Arkhios]

I don't want to restrict it to one handed, I like the idea of wielding a spear in two hands using dex like an elven war dancer.
I'm also torn between +1 to attack and +1 to damage, what do you think

I think that since NPC/Monster AC can only get so high (highest is around 20-21 iirc), adding a constant +1 bonus to attack for absolutely no reason (=unlike Archery style, as I mentioned before) would make a rather big difference. Too big in my opinion.

I get the wish to use dexterity with a spear in melee; a monk can do it. To a certain degree it does even make sense. However, I would restrict it from Heavy Weapons at the very least. Finesse movements require that a weapon is relatively light to wield, and a weapon with the heavy property most definitely is not.
Dueling Fighting Style adds +2 to damage rolls, which makes up to 1d8 weapon's average damage increase from 4.5 to 6.5, which is equal to a 1d12 weapon (all of which are heavy two-handed weapons). However, Dueling only works when a one-handed weapon is held in one hand only and no other weapons in the other hand. No, you cannot get the bonus to damage if you hold a versatile weapon in two hands.

Let's consider the +1 bonus to damage with a weapon that you could use with Finesse. If held in one hand, that would increase the average damage to equal with a versatile weapon held in two hands (1d8 -> 1d10 = 4.5 -> 5.5).
Now, if you wielded a versatile weapon in two hands, a +1 to damage would increase the average damage to equal with Dueling Style, which also works with finesse weapons (1d10+1 = 6.5). Really, not too bad.

Two-handed weapons which are not Heavy tend to deal around 1d8 to 1d10 damage, so it's actually fair to allow them to benefit from the Finesse Fighting Style, as well.

Balance-wise, considering all of the above, I would use the +1 bonus to damage - not to attack. Besides, being able to deal more damage with finesse is a better way to represent precision and skill, imho.

[Tempest Critic]

It's a great idea. There are plenty of real world historical fighting styles that utilized two handed weapons with an emphasis on precision instead of force - The katana, or spear for example. I would however agree that heavy weapons by nature should not be included.

[WhiteWolf]

It's a great idea. There are plenty of real world historical fighting styles that utilised two handed weapons with an emphasis on precision instead of force - The katana, or spear for example. I would however agree that heavy weapons by nature should not be included.

That was my thinking. And heavy weapons aren't included on purpose, I get that that would be a bit too much. Here's the final version;

Finesse Fighting Style
Choose 3 melee weapons that do not have the two-handed or heavy property, these weapons gain the finesse property when you wield them.
You also gain +1 to damage with these weapons.