How Would One Create a Self Sustaining Freshwater Fish Farm in a Portable Hole?

[Celaya]

As the title suggests, I need help creating a fish farm so my "Vegetarian" Vampire can have a sustainable food source on the go. Ideally it would be able to lose a fish per day. No 3rd party and Ideally no DragMag. Price Range 20k-40k gp. Thanks in advance!

[unseenmage]

Build it elsewhere and use Ring Gates (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/magicItems/wondrousItems.htm#ringGates) to access it.

To my knowledge fish farming is pretty dodgy in our world and our fish farms are rather quite a bit larger than a Portable Hole.

Better off mind controlling a fishermen to keep the other end of the Ring Gates or similar transport method on hand when they fish.

Teleportation Circle in a wagon or on the inside of a really big cloak the other end of which leads to a fully stocked fishpond could work too.

[ryu]

Build it elsewhere and use Ring Gates (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/magicItems/wondrousItems.htm#ringGates) to access it.

To my knowledge fish farming is pretty dodgy in our world and our fish farms are rather quite a bit larger than a Portable Hole.

Better off mind controlling a fishermen to keep the other end of the Ring Gates or similar transport method on hand when they fish.

Teleportation Circle in a wagon or on the inside of a really big cloak the other end of which leads to a fully stocked fishpond could work too.

Actually that varies by type of fish. Some are really inefficient in terms of food in/food out ratio while others simply produce poor results when farmed or similar. He could easily make use of catfish though. Relatively easy to farm and produce workable results. Doubly so considering he just needs blood not meat quality. Incidentally this is one of the main reason catfish is so cheap compared to many forms of seafood.

[BilltheCynic]

If your goal is simply to feed the vampire without feeding on thinking creatures, here are my suggestions, as well as possible objections to each:

Ring of Sustenance (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/magicItems/rings.htm#sustenance)
Only 2.5k gold, and never have to worry about feeding again. However, because it says "life-sustaining," a GM might argue that it would not work to sustain an undead creature. In that case I would ask for a custom-built Ring of Sustenance that works for vampires, perhaps increasing the cost by 50% or (if your DM is particularly cruel) double, which is still only 5k gold. There's no real reason why that wouldn't work, since presumably a RoS would also work on a carnivore, which also requires animal-products to survive.

Hiring a chicken-infested warforged commoner to follow you around
By far the funniest option, but it is also very cheesy and silly. Doubt your GM would allow it.

Reliable Access to Plane Shift (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/planeShift.htm)
Perhaps the most...interesting option. Fun fact: there's an Elemental Plane of Blood (https://www.wizards.com/dnd/article.asp?x=dnd/sb/sb20030208a). And it's inhabited solely by evil monsters made completely out of blood. You'll have to fight for your food every time, but food that fights back is the most appetizing. Or so I've heard. Anyway, an obsidean steed or custom item of Plane Shift that works, say, once per week should be enough.

[WhatThePhysics]

As the title suggests, I need help creating a fish farm so my "Vegetarian" Vampire can have a sustainable food source on the go. Ideally it would be able to lose a fish per day. No 3rd party and Ideally no DragMag. Price Range 20k-40k gp. Thanks in advance!

You don't need the fish farm.

1) Get Wands of Cure Minor Wounds, or Cure Light Wounds if your DM fiats them out.

2) Go to a temperate fresh water lake, and fill the Portable Hole with its water, soil, and low maintenance microorganisms and autotrophs.

3) Get some salamanders. The animals, not the outsiders, you fiend. :smalltongue:

4) Rip off one or more tails and enjoy.

5) Accelerate their natural regeneration with a wand charge.

6) Resume adventuring until hungry, then go to step 4.

[Inevitability]

Purify Food and Drink should keep the water clean, though getting enough castings to cover the entire hole should be trickier.

[Jowgen]

Love the idea, big fan of this sort of stuff :smallsmile:

First off, you'll be wanting an Enveloping Pit (MIC) rather than a portable hole. Way bigger, cheaper, and the only trade-off is that you either have to match the alignment or UMD it successfully.

For the actual farm, I would go the route of creating a micro-biome. The main challenges I think will be to a) keep the water clean/oxygenated and b) keep the fish fed in a self-contained manner.

My suggestion for keeping the water fresh: make the whole container a massively oversized "Barrel of Preserving Pine" (FoE). This 500 gp item prevents any sort of contamination, fermentation, evaporation, and coagulation of the liquids in it. It doesn't remove already present contaminations, but so long as the water is suitable when it goes into the massive barrel and doesn't leave, it should be perfectly fine for the fish to breathe in and not get dirty over time. Add some spheres of Liquid Sunlight to keep the fish (and whatever plants you're using) happy.

How to feed the fishes will probably depend on the species you use, and I am no expert on fish. An alternative would be to use the Hallow spell and tie a Sustain (BoED) spell to it. Similar alternatives might exist.

[daremetoidareyo]

Dissolved oxygen is the name of the game. Use air gulpers, and you'll be fine, albeit limited to fish that only get 6inches long at most. Other wise...you're gonna need air elementals or something. Air elementite swarm?

[The_Iron_Lord]

I'm not sure if this is what you want, but according to the MM1, anyway, vampires have no need to feed on blooded creatures or to drain Con. This might be different in the Libris Mortis, though I am uncertain.

[Thurbane]

Maybe consider a Bag of Tricks (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/magicItems/wondrousItems.htm#bagofTricks) instead?

[AnonymousPepper]

If your goal is simply to feed the vampire without feeding on thinking creatures, here are my suggestions, as well as possible objections to each:

Ring of Sustenance (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/magicItems/rings.htm#sustenance)
Only 2.5k gold, and never have to worry about feeding again. However, because it says "life-sustaining," a GM might argue that it would not work to sustain an undead creature. In that case I would ask for a custom-built Ring of Sustenance that works for vampires, perhaps increasing the cost by 50% or (if your DM is particularly cruel) double, which is still only 5k gold. There's no real reason why that wouldn't work, since presumably a RoS would also work on a carnivore, which also requires animal-products to survive.

Hiring a chicken-infested warforged commoner to follow you around
By far the funniest option, but it is also very cheesy and silly. Doubt your GM would allow it.

Reliable Access to Plane Shift (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/planeShift.htm)
Perhaps the most...interesting option. Fun fact: there's an Elemental Plane of Blood (https://www.wizards.com/dnd/article.asp?x=dnd/sb/sb20030208a). And it's inhabited solely by evil monsters made completely out of blood. You'll have to fight for your food every time, but food that fights back is the most appetizing. Or so I've heard. Anyway, an obsidean steed or custom item of Plane Shift that works, say, once per week should be enough.

I'm not gonna lie - while woefully impractical, that last option sounds freaking amazing for a vampire PC.

Actually, I'm now headcanoning a world where vampires are aware of the plane and the spell and some, particularly those few of non-evil alignments, use it in lieu of live human/elf/dorf/etc. prey.

[King539]

Just... the title... so... ridiculous...

[ryu]

Just... the title... so... ridiculous...

Welcome to 3.5. How are you enjoying your early experiences?

[PacMan2247]

Maybe consider a Bag of Tricks (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/magicItems/wondrousItems.htm#bagofTricks) instead?

Love the idea of a hungry vampire getting side eye from a rhino.

Summoning monsters would also work here, if you're a caster (or are reliably friendly with one); no material components beyond the cheap, reusable foci makes it cost nothing more than a first-level spell.

As has been stated, the fish farm thing is potentially dicey and pretty difficult to manage in your price range. Thurbane's bag of tricks suggestion is probably your best bet here. Could also try to get your DM to approve a variant on the everful mug if your vampire is, for whatever reason, that intent on avoiding harm to creatures.

[Jack_Simth]

Does it have to be freshwater (http://eco-sphere.com/)?

1) Get an Enveloping Pit (Magic Item Compendium, you'll need to either be of a particular alignment or have UMD, see the item's description).
2) Build a spiral staircase in it out of something that won't rot, rust, or poison the water.
3) Put dirt along all the stairs (from the bottom of a lake, ideally).
4) Fill it with lake water (for the algae, to both create air and be a source of food for the fish).
5) Suspend a few liquid sunlight pellets (Complete Scoundrel) in it (on the bottoms of the stairs).
6) Put in some fish that feed on algae.
7) Leave it be until you're hungry.

The whole thing will cost less than ten grand... but there's some issues:
1) It takes a few years for many fish to reach full size. You can STORE them live effectively this way, but if you feed on 1/day, you'll need a LOT more than just one enveloping pit set up this way.
2) It requires either UMD or one of a small set of specific alignments.
3) The Bag of Tricks, Gray (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/magicItems/wondrousItems.htm#bagofTricks) has a market price of 900 gp, can produce 10 animals a week. It's both less expensive and significantly more straightforward.

[BilltheCynic]

Maybe consider a Bag of Tricks (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/magicItems/wondrousItems.htm#bagofTricks) instead?

Would that work? In the BoT entry is says:

The animal serves the character who drew it from the bag for 10 minutes (or until slain or ordered back into the bag), at which point it disappears. It can follow any of the commands described in the Handle Animal skill

If the animal disappears, would any blood the vampire drained disappear with it?

[ryu]

Would that work? In the BoT entry is says:


If the animal disappears, would any blood the vampire drained disappear with it?

You don't necessarily have to kill the creature to obtain blood, after which point the blood is no longer part of the disappearing creature.

[Jack_Simth]

Would that work? In the BoT entry is says:


If the animal disappears, would any blood the vampire drained disappear with it?

Unclear in the rules as written, so it would be up to the DM in question. The aura is Conjuration, but not Conjouration(Summoning), so the Summoning school rules don't necessarily apply. Sure, a Conjouration(Summoning) spell is used in the creation of the item (for the all of a day it takes for the basic one), but it doesn't act much like the source spell (the animal is random, the activation is a standard rather than 1 round, it comes fully trained, the duration is ten minutes, and there are animals on each list not found in the base spell). That all adds up to "There is no RAW answer" so one must ask the DM in question.

[Thurbane]

Would that work?

If the animal disappears, would any blood the vampire drained disappear with it?

If the DM rules it not to work, use the Survival Pouch (MIC p.187) instead. It can summon up to 5 mules/day, with no time restriction or mention of it disappearing.

Scratch that, it lasts 8 hours.

Still, that may be long enough for your undead "metabolism" to get what it needs out of the blood...

[Inevitability]

I'm not sure if this is what you want, but according to the MM1, anyway, vampires have no need to feed on blooded creatures or to drain Con. This might be different in the Libris Mortis, though I am uncertain.

Libris Mortis says that vampires have an Inescapable Craving for life force (meaning they don't need it, but go mad without) and are Diet Dependent on blood (meaning they lose mobility if they don't drink it).

However, for player characters the rules seem to be slightly differently. There, both needs have to be regularly met to avoid wisdom damage leading into ravenous madness.