Help!! Storm atro

[finaldooms]

So i was guna post a picture of a skyrim storm atrnough ( spelled wrong) ...because one of my players wants to be something similar. .

He wants to have electric spells only but he wants to be melee heavy.. ...my idea was to just refluff a human and look similar because im not sure how to do this lol

Help would be wonderful on doing this for a race or idea. ..atm i suggested duskblade ( spells and melee but i dont know if you can buff natural weapons with them)

Btw newish player and none are optimized for anything lol

[barakaka]

It's going to be pretty hard to do this with yours and their experience level.

What you can try is Duskblade class with the Shifter race with claws re-fluffed as a melee storm atronach. The race is described both in Monster Manual 3 and Eberron Campaign Setting. There's a bunch of Shifter feats that let them grow the claws for longer amounts of time as well as the feat's main effects.

Duskblade is pretty easy on newcomers and just wants a few melee focused feats. Keep in mind, that when you cast a Touch spell, you're holding the charge on your hand, so if he claws at something, the natural weapon attack will discharge the spell on the enemy. To use the claws all the time he needs to get a bunch of Shifter feats though, which is impossible at level 1.

I may have better ideas tomorrow though, I just don't have much time right now. He really just needs early access to claws from a race/item and Duskblade class levels.

[Inevitability]

Spells combined with melee is called a 'gish' build. There's several classes in 3.5 that make perfect gishes, so you're in luck!

Arcane:

Hexblade: Think the paladin, but arcane. It doesn't get spells until level 4, and no lightning spells at all, so this is probably not what you're looking for.

Stalwart Battle Sorcerer: A huge spell list, but pretty bad combat ability and crippled versatility. It can work, but it's tricky.

Duskblade: Generally referred to as a 'gish-in-a-can', the duskblade is good at melee, decent at spellcasting, and able to combine the two. Their original list contains only Shocking Grasp and Chain Lightning as far as electricity goes, though.

Divine:

Cleric: Clerics can get pretty good at gishing. However, their list has only one electricity spell; and it's high-level. This can be gotten around with feats (Initiate of Loviatar/Bane grants you Mystic Lash) or domains (Storm, Windstorm, Weather), though.

Paladin: No electricity. Bad casting (without lightning). Hell, bad melee too.

Druid: Perhaps the most interesting of the divine classes here. Druids get more lightning than any other class (except wizards and sorcerers), while also having some of the best melee potential amongst the divine casters. You're not some guy hitting things with a stick, you're LightningBear the Terrible!

Personally, I'd suggest duskblade (perhaps with Arcane Disciple or Extra Spell for more lightning magic) or druid.

[GilesTheCleric]

Follow any of the advice above, and have your player take Energy Substitution (CAr 79). Fiat away the increased cast time. Done.

[mabriss lethe]

A Wilder might be a decent place to start if you want to go for psionics.

[finaldooms]

Oh thank god people replied lol. .i was honestly considering refluffing a monk and changing some things into lightning spells

[Eisfalken]

Duskblade ain't bad, but lacks a lot of good lightning-based magic to make it work very good.

If you have Unearthed Arcana book, look in the Classes chapter for Battle Sorcerer. He'll have more control on choice of spells, and pretty good combat ability. For race, consider going goliath (the Dex penalty hurts a tiny bit, but everything else about these guys is great for a gish), earth genasi (same deal mostly), or possibly even stonechild (if not having 9th-level spells doesn't matter as much as being a big half-elemental warrior does).

Some spells that look good to fill out the theme are as follows:
0 - detect magic, electric jolt (SC), message, prestidigitation, read magic
1st - endure elements, lesser orb of electricity (SC), nerveskitter (SC), shield, shocking grasp
2nd - electric loop (SC), electric vengeance (PH2), resist energy, seeking ray (PH2), shatter
3rd - energy vulnerability (PH2), lightning bolt, primal form (SC), protection from energy, scintillating sphere (SC)
4th - curse of the elemental lords (DM), ice storm, orb of electricity (SC), solid fog, stoneskin
5th - arc of lightning (SC), ball lightning (SC), lightning leap (CM), lord of the sky (DM), overland flight
6th - chain lightning, greater blink (SC), greater dispel magic, greater dimension door (SC), Tenser's transformation
7th - elemental body (SC), energy immunity (SC), glorious master of the elements (DM), greater teleport, limited wish
8th - greater plane shift (SC), greater shadow evocation, lightning ring (SC), mysterious redirection (CM), stormwalk (Storm)
9th - etherealness, shapechange, summon elemental monolith (SC), time stop, towering thunderhead (CM), wish

He can probably ride battle sorcerer all the way up without a prestige class; it's not terribly sexy, but he'll stay effective with the right feats. Arcane Strike is definitely first on the list: if he runs into anything immune to electricity, this one feat and some good combat buffs will give him the ability to still contribute good to the fight by burn slots for melee bonuses. Improved Initiative should be right behind it; the whole point is to zap them first, before they get a chance to fire back. Tell him to grab Storm Bolt reserve feat, so he can do lightning attacks without burning spells. Somatic Weaponry is a good idea if he wants to cast while using a two-handed weapon.

Does he like the idea of his power coming from dragons somewhere in his ancestry? Consider Draconic Heritage, Draconic Breath, Draconic Vigor, and Draconic Senses, all for a dragon with lightning-type breath weapon.

He may want more melee power, though, and that's a very good idea. Power Attack and/or various charging build feats will do him well, especially with Arcane Strike to fuel up a really good, powerful attack.

Feel free to alter spell and feat selections to back up a particular build. Remind him he doesn't have to know every spell; he could drop endure elements and get an eternal wand for it later (since it's a 24-hour spell, you really only need it twice a day at most, in case you get hit with a good dispel attempt). He can get runestaffs to cover useful spells he may need but doesn't want to memorize, wands for utility, scrolls for spells he may use once in a blue moon.

[finaldooms]

Il have to talk to him tommrow at work. ..i think he wants to do mostly melee? Idk he is very erratic honestly. .so i was thinking of rewriting monk or. Duskblade and giving him only eletric spells and like every 2 lvls.as SLA stuff ( like start off shocking grasp 3x a day and so forth)

[finaldooms]

Also!! Would someone be able to direct me to a ( not as scary) elemental or. Half elemental ? Since he is pretty much lightning around a rock thing i was guna do earth elemental maybe? ....or stonechild i just recall someone mentioned. ..might be easier...and il post later how i was guna redo a monk for him and see if that sounds. ...okish

[Inevitability]

Also!! Would someone be able to direct me to a ( not as scary) elemental or. Half elemental ? Since he is pretty much lightning around a rock thing i was guna do earth elemental maybe? ....or stonechild i just recall someone mentioned. ..might be easier...and il post later how i was guna redo a monk for him and see if that sounds. ...okish

Perhaps a Mineral Warrior (http://archive.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/ex/20031003e) human? It's only +1 LA, and it's incredibly good for about every melee character.

[ShurikVch]

Question: if "he wants to do mostly melee", then, maybe, make him an Electrokineticist (http://archive.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/psm/20040625e) (variant of Pyrokineticist (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/psionic/prestigeClasses/pyrokineticist.htm))?

[A.A.King]

So I don't really know what these Skyrim Storm characters can do, but if you want a Lightning Based Gish there are some things for you in the Dragon Magic Book.

Draconic Heritage (Blue or Bronze) + Power Attack + Dragonfire Assault - Everytime you Power Attack, you deal Electricity damage instead. A dragonblooded sorcerer can get Draconic Heritage for free by trading it's ability to get a familiar and a heavy melee Gish would probably want Power Attack anyway. This means all you really have to do for this 'combo' is to spend a feat the character otherwise wouldn't to get Dragonfire Assault after which he has electric damage all day every day. Dragonfire Assault is usually a rather pointless feat but it adds some nice flavour to the character.

Draconic Heritage (Blue or Bronze) + Sneak Attack/Skirmish Damage + Dragonfire Strike - Everytime you get your precision damage you can have it be Lightning Damage instead. Basically the same combo for a more stealthy based Gish but the difference is that Dragonfire Strike actually adds 1d6 of damage (so unlike Dragonfire Strike it isn't just nice for the flavour). Personally I like this option combined with Scout/Sorcerer/Unseen Seer because you can 'fluff' it as your character moving so fast it creates lighting.

There is also the Unbridled Fury of the Storm Dragonpact you can look at. You trade it one Spell Slot (and some GP) and gain a number of Electric based Spell Like abilities.

[finaldooms]

We dont really use psionics ( thanks alot though im glad yall are trying to help) ..i ended up sleeping untill work so rewritting monk is guna have to wait. ...or i could just rewrite duskblade spells into lightning only for him ..but he still needs a natural attack( that or im guna get annoyed and just tie some logs to his arms ans say there you have a slam) ...for mineral warrior i could say he has perma enlarge right?( he really wants to be bigger but i told him large is the biggest im letting him be) .....ugh this was supposed to be a simple thing to reintroduce him and a few others back into the game ( with a few new players)

[finaldooms]

So I don't really know what these Skyrim Storm characters can do, but if you want a Lightning Based Gish there are some things for you in the Dragon Magic Book


From what i recall. These things are made of stone and lightning and all they do really is either A. Smash you with their fists or B. Throw lightning anything at you while getting closer to smash you

[Ludic]

Snip.

This is where the fine art of re-skinning is done. Just because the spell isn't electrical, doesn't mean it can't look it. If the player is superbent on electrical. Just skin the spells to look like lightning, or do their damage as lightning. There's nothing saying Vampiric Touch can't be an electrical current you create by touching your target, draining them, and charging you.

Granted we all know Lightning resistance is fairly common, but if they're wet first it's environmental and not subject to resistance.

Or better, be a Eldritch Claw Warlock with an Eldritch Blast that is skinned as electrical effects. Touch AC ftw,

[finaldooms]

Ok so finally got some progress with him. ..he is guna be a human mineral warrior and after showing him option he wants me to redo a monk. .for the ac boost im probly guna do half con mod for the boost ( he is guna be slow)

[Ludic]

Ok so finally got some progress with him. ..he is guna be a human mineral warrior and after showing him option he wants me to redo a monk. .for the ac boost im probly guna do half con mod for the boost ( he is guna be slow)

Player gonna do as player gonna do. But did you explain that quite a few of these options here are far better than trying to rig up a monk?

A reskinned Duskblade or Warlock with the Eldritch Claw Feat (not the invocation, the feat in Dragon 358) are both superior options to monk class adjustments. If you go that route, you might be better off to build a Fairy Tail Dragonslayer for him.

[Inevitability]

This is where the fine art of re-skinning is done. Just because the spell isn't electrical, doesn't mean it can't look it. If the player is superbent on electrical. Just skin the spells to look like lightning, or do their damage as lightning. There's nothing saying Vampiric Touch can't be an electrical current you create by touching your target, draining them, and charging you.

Granted we all know Lightning resistance is fairly common, but if they're wet first it's environmental and not subject to resistance.

Or better, be a Eldritch Claw Warlock with an Eldritch Blast that is skinned as electrical effects. Touch AC ftw,

I know reskinning is a thing, but I figured a player who wants electric spells would like to deal electrical damage.

Then again, I suppose Elemental Substitution could do that too.

[Ruethgar]

Could just take Redhead for a Persistent Twin Concussive Thundering Energy Sub Produce Flame and go all melee. Add Sanctum and you can pick Thunderhead with Rain side effects and pretty much anything with a Windstorm side effect. Can also do that on a Gnome with Magically Adept or a high Int character with Magical Affinity. The Gnome has the benefit of being able to take Magic in the Blood for more castings, but with that produce flame you can focus entirely on unarmed melee or throwing or mix them with Bloodstorm Blade.

[Ludic]

I know reskinning is a thing, but I figured a player who wants electric spells would like to deal electrical damage.

Then again, I suppose Elemental Substitution could do that too.

If you go that route instead of just re-skinning the way the spells look you end up with a player that is going to find himself hating his choice once he starts hitting the energy resistance monsters. By actually making everything electrical damage that first monster is going to invalidate him. By simply skinning some of the spells to look electrical you keep his relevance and end up with a less disappointed player. And that's really part of the fun is imagining it right?

Besides, you wouldn't actually need energy sub for the energy type spells. Fireball becomes Electrical Discharge, same spell, but it deals electrical damage instead. Now your player needs energy sub to make Electrical Discharge become a ball of fire to be sure. Don't let him have both on this custom spell-list.

[Inevitability]

If you go that route instead of just re-skinning the way the spells look you end up with a player that is going to find himself hating his choice once he starts hitting the energy resistance monsters. By actually making everything electrical damage that first monster is going to invalidate him. By simply skinning some of the spells to look electrical you keep his relevance and end up with a less disappointed player. And that's really part of the fun is imagining it right?

Besides, you wouldn't actually need energy sub for the energy type spells. Fireball becomes Electrical Discharge, same spell, but it deals electrical damage instead. Now your player needs energy sub to make Electrical Discharge become a ball of fire to be sure. Don't let him have both on this custom spell-list.

This is not a thread named 'what houserules should I implement to support this character'. My advice is limited to that covered by the rules.

[Ludic]

This is not a thread named 'what houserules should I implement to support this character'. My advice is limited to that covered by the rules.

Reskinning isn't a houserule, reskinning is being imaginative. Neither is the idea of an electrical version of fireball. The electrical discharge idea is simply replacing every instance of 'fire damage' with 'electrical damage' in the fireball spell. It's the same spell with a different energy-type, exactly what you get from Energy Subsitution. You're simply giving the player what you would get from using metamagic instead of the standard fireball because it supports his concept. As Energy Substitution doesn't increase the spell slot of the spell, you're making a one for one swap to support a player. Not building a houserule.

Improved Feint is worthless, everyone can do that without needing a feat. That's a houserule. You're physically changing a game mechanic.

What I suggested is well within the rules and exactly what you wanted to do three posts ago.



I know reskinning is a thing, but I figured a player who wants electric spells would like to deal electrical damage.

[Inevitability]

Reskinning isn't a houserule, reskinning is being imaginative. Neither is the idea of an electrical version of fireball. The electrical discharge idea is simply replacing every instance of 'fire damage' with 'electrical damage' in the fireball spell. It's the same spell with a different energy-type, exactly what you get from Energy Subsitution. You're simply giving the player what you would get from using metamagic instead of the standard fireball because it supports his concept. As Energy Substitution doesn't increase the spell slot of the spell, you're making a one for one swap to support a player. Not building a houserule.

Improved Feint is worthless, everyone can do that without needing a feat. That's a houserule. You're physically changing a game mechanic.

What I suggested is well within the rules and exactly what you wanted to do three posts ago.

I don't think anything is going to come from continuing this discussion, so let's do the thread a favor by ending it.

[finaldooms]

Thanks for stoping that lol. ..i dont mind either way ....but he has some weirdly definate ideas on magic in dnd ( even though i dont mind eletric " fireball" ..i believe neverwinter nights has that anywaya) and yup. .he is dead set on redoinf a monk. .so il use this thread ( or make a new one if that helps) posting my changes and seeing if it sounda ok
..stupid phone

[Ludic]

Thanks for stoping that lol. ..i dont mind either way ....but he has some weirdly definate ideas on magic in dnd ( even though i dont mind eletric " fireball" ..i believe neverwinter nights has that anywaya) and yup. .he is dead set on redoinf a monk. .so il use this thread ( or make a new one if that helps) posting my changes and seeing if it sounda ok
..stupid phone

Lets start by making your life a bit easier then, look at the Sohei from Oriental Adventures. You'll have to bring it up to 3.5 from 3.0. It's a Monk version of a paladin (to include spells, in fact they have the same spell progression), so that update isn't too hard. I'd give it full BAB (like the Paladin) instead of 3/4th BAB, might have to rework some of the class abilities and reflavor the spells.

It likely never got mentioned because it's 3.0, but it might be up the alley you're looking for. Or at least give you a base to start with.

[finaldooms]

Eventually i will stay awake after work long enough to do this thing. ..getting my books from my computer back in texas is a bit of work but i should have them tommrow ( yay) ..aside from this surprisingly complicated player. ..everyone else is loving the game at least
.even the new player who was sure he wouldn't like it( although roleplaying makes him feel awkward. ..we work it into his half-elf and it gets rather hilarious)

[barakaka]

Duskblade ain't bad, but lacks a lot of good lightning-based magic to make it work very good.

If you have Unearthed Arcana book, look in the Classes chapter for Battle Sorcerer. He'll have more control on choice of spells, and pretty good combat ability. For race, consider going goliath (the Dex penalty hurts a tiny bit, but everything else about these guys is great for a gish), earth genasi (same deal mostly), or possibly even stonechild (if not having 9th-level spells doesn't matter as much as being a big half-elemental warrior does).

Some spells that look good to fill out the theme are as follows:
0 - detect magic, electric jolt (SC), message, prestidigitation, read magic
1st - endure elements, lesser orb of electricity (SC), nerveskitter (SC), shield, shocking grasp
2nd - electric loop (SC), electric vengeance (PH2), resist energy, seeking ray (PH2), shatter
3rd - energy vulnerability (PH2), lightning bolt, primal form (SC), protection from energy, scintillating sphere (SC)
4th - curse of the elemental lords (DM), ice storm, orb of electricity (SC), solid fog, stoneskin
5th - arc of lightning (SC), ball lightning (SC), lightning leap (CM), lord of the sky (DM), overland flight
6th - chain lightning, greater blink (SC), greater dispel magic, greater dimension door (SC), Tenser's transformation
7th - elemental body (SC), energy immunity (SC), glorious master of the elements (DM), greater teleport, limited wish
8th - greater plane shift (SC), greater shadow evocation, lightning ring (SC), mysterious redirection (CM), stormwalk (Storm)
9th - etherealness, shapechange, summon elemental monolith (SC), time stop, towering thunderhead (CM), wish

He can probably ride battle sorcerer all the way up without a prestige class; it's not terribly sexy, but he'll stay effective with the right feats. Arcane Strike is definitely first on the list: if he runs into anything immune to electricity, this one feat and some good combat buffs will give him the ability to still contribute good to the fight by burn slots for melee bonuses. Improved Initiative should be right behind it; the whole point is to zap them first, before they get a chance to fire back. Tell him to grab Storm Bolt reserve feat, so he can do lightning attacks without burning spells. Somatic Weaponry is a good idea if he wants to cast while using a two-handed weapon.

Does he like the idea of his power coming from dragons somewhere in his ancestry? Consider Draconic Heritage, Draconic Breath, Draconic Vigor, and Draconic Senses, all for a dragon with lightning-type breath weapon.

He may want more melee power, though, and that's a very good idea. Power Attack and/or various charging build feats will do him well, especially with Arcane Strike to fuel up a really good, powerful attack.

Feel free to alter spell and feat selections to back up a particular build. Remind him he doesn't have to know every spell; he could drop endure elements and get an eternal wand for it later (since it's a 24-hour spell, you really only need it twice a day at most, in case you get hit with a good dispel attempt). He can get runestaffs to cover useful spells he may need but doesn't want to memorize, wands for utility, scrolls for spells he may use once in a blue moon.

Really good stuff here, but just so you're aware; Stormwalk is a level 6 Sorcerer/Wizard spell if you look at the spell's text, not the table. Super cool spell.

[gr8artist]

He wants to play a monk. That's generally considered a bottom-tier class in mid/high optimization.
Your group seems to focus on low optimization levels. Which means the monk is viable and probably average for the group.
My suggestion would be to look at Pathfinder's (think of PF as D&D 3.75) "Qinggong Monk (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/core-classes/monk/archetypes/paizo---monk-archetypes/qinggong-monk)" for inspiration. Basically he swaps out monk tricks (ie Slow Fall) for spell-like powers.
Houserule that any damaging abilities he gains deal electric damage where thematically appropriate (Scorching Ray becomes Shocking Ray, Power Attack becomes Shocking Attack, etc). This is actually a nerf to the character as others have said; he'll suffer when (if?) Electric-resistant enemies come around.
Build options: Monk of the Iron Mountain (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/core-classes/monk/archetypes/paizo---monk-archetypes/monk-of-the-sacred-mountain), Student of Stone (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/races/other-races/featured-races/arg-oread/student-of-the-stone-monk-oread), Amulet of Mighty Fists (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic-items/wondrous-items/wondrous-items/a-b/amulet-of-mighty-fists) (Shocking Property)