Getting the Most of Booming Blade

[CaptainSarathai]

So, BB is definitely more of a 'Controller' thing. If you just want scaling damage, grab GFB, maybe some +Cha to Fire, and be done with it. Booming Blade is different - it has a pretty good 'control' element to it, if you can force the enemy to move.

My question is, what's the best way to do that? Or rather, the best build for it?
By now, everyone knows that BB+Warcaster is good, but that means the enemy needs a reason to move away from you, and those become far more rare when you start threatening not only an OA, but several D8s of damage.
Instead, I think it's better to force the enemy to move towards you. That means hitting them and getting away.

Right now, I'm thinking some kind of combination of Rogue or the Mobility Feat, plus Paladin (for Compelled Duel). This would let you hit the target, step away, and then encourage them to follow you or else strike with Disadvantage.
You could start VHuman with Magic Initiate, or go Elf/VHElf for the racial cantrip, or you could just wait and go Arcane Trickster at Lv3 and poach it off the Wizard list.

Another option would be a TomeLock/Sorcerer, picking up Vicious Mockery and using Quicken to throw it as a Bonus Action. You still want either Rogue or Mobility in there, and in this case, Rogue gets a little bump (imo) for offering Uncanny Dodge as a combo with Armor of Agathys.

How would you guys run the build? Is there anything I'm missing here??

[MeeposFire]

One standard is to use a swashbuckler with it (sometimes adding things like EK 7 so you can get a second attack with a bonus action).


Also note that unlike GFB BB actually deals all of its damage to one target while GFB deals it to several. That is a major difference in damage calculations.

[Arkhios]

Command is also quite neat spell in combination of War Caster and BB.
Let's say you are a sorcadin:
Attack with booming blade -> quicken command: flee -> "boom" triggers -> if the target was next to you, you could also make opportunity attack with BB and IIRC command will still force the target to continue fleeing, effectively doing "boom" twice on same move.

[Fishyninja]

So, BB is definitely more of a 'Controller' thing. If you just want scaling damage, grab GFB, maybe some +Cha to Fire, and be done with it. Booming Blade is different - it has a pretty good 'control' element to it, if you can force the enemy to move.

My question is, what's the best way to do that? Or rather, the best build for it?
By now, everyone knows that BB+Warcaster is good, but that means the enemy needs a reason to move away from you, and those become far more rare when you start threatening not only an OA, but several D8s of damage.
Instead, I think it's better to force the enemy to move towards you. That means hitting them and getting away.

Right now, I'm thinking some kind of combination of Rogue or the Mobility Feat, plus Paladin (for Compelled Duel). This would let you hit the target, step away, and then encourage them to follow you or else strike with Disadvantage.
You could start VHuman with Magic Initiate, or go Elf/VHElf for the racial cantrip, or you could just wait and go Arcane Trickster at Lv3 and poach it off the Wizard list.

Another option would be a TomeLock/Sorcerer, picking up Vicious Mockery and using Quicken to throw it as a Bonus Action. You still want either Rogue or Mobility in there, and in this case, Rogue gets a little bump (imo) for offering Uncanny Dodge as a combo with Armor of Agathys.

How would you guys run the build? Is there anything I'm missing here??

You have covered the basics in one of my IRL games I am an Arcane Trickster and Booming Blade is a great cantrip.
I am acaully a variant Human and I took the Alert Feat meaning a great initiative and I can no longer be suprised.

Cast to prepare for your next attack, attack and hit, disengage and smile as they injure themselves. It's a brilliant Cantrip. A good DM will make the enemy move, it would seem suspicious if every enemy you hit and then moved from suddenly stopped all movement.

[MeeposFire]

Command is also quite neat spell in combination of War Caster and BB.
Let's say you are a sorcadin:
Attack with booming blade -> quicken command: flee -> "boom" triggers -> if the target was next to you, you could also make opportunity attack with BB and IIRC command will still force the target to continue fleeing, effectively doing "boom" twice on same move.

Even better with a few allies next to it as well since they all can get opportunity attacks.

[CaptainSarathai]

Command is also quite neat spell in combination of War Caster and BB.
Let's say you are a sorcadin:
Attack with booming blade -> quicken command: flee -> "boom" triggers -> if the target was next to you, you could also make opportunity attack with BB and IIRC command will still force the target to continue fleeing, effectively doing "boom" twice on same move.

At least aty table (and I think, via Sage Advice) - using Command won't work.
BB only triggers on willing movement. Sage already said that means it doesn't pop on Dissonant Whispers.
'Suggestion' - they won't do it if they know it will cause them harm. Do they know BB will hit?
'Command' - if you rule that they "just do it," even if it causes harm, then it's not any more 'willing' than Dissonant.

[Foxhound438]

probably an easier way is to have an AOE effect active on top of them. think BB as your action, then bonus action move flaming sphere to ram them. On their turn, either they have to move and take damage from BB or stay and take damage from sphere. Other effects could work, but I like flaming sphere since it's relatively efficient (being able to move it around as opposed to having to recast something or otherwise force something back into a set area.)

[Foxhound438]

At least aty table (and I think, via Sage Advice) - using Command won't work.
BB only triggers on willing movement. Sage already said that means it doesn't pop on Dissonant Whispers.
'Suggestion' - they won't do it if they know it will cause them harm. Do they know BB will hit?
'Command' - if you rule that they "just do it," even if it causes harm, then it's not any more 'willing' than Dissonant.

I would have to agree with this.

[Petrocorus]

I believe that for an EK, or any fighting type with BB, PAM + WarCaster + Booming Blade can be a pretty cool combo. You hit the guy with BB during his movement toward you. Then he can whether stop his movement and waste his turn (and exposed himself to your attacks) or finish his movement toward you and get hit by all the bonus damages.

[JAL_1138]

I believe that for an EK, or any fighting type with BB, PAM + WarCaster + Booming Blade can be a pretty cool combo. You hit the guy with BB during his movement toward you. Then he can whether stop his movement and waste his turn (and exposed himself to your attacks) or finish his movement toward you and get hit by all the bonus damages.

You also need Spell Sniper or the Distant Spell metamagic, unless you're using a quarterstaff. The range for BB is still 5ft even if the weapon has reach.

[Petrocorus]

You also need Spell Sniper or the Distant Spell metamagic, unless you're using a quarterstaff. The range for BB is still 5ft even if the weapon has reach.

Oh m.... I didn't see that.

[Waazraath]

I don't think it's the 'best' way (if such a thing excists), but a fun and thematic option is imo using booming with the tempest cleric (minimum level 6).

Step 1: hit enemy with booming blade.
Step 2: get hit by said enemy, and use wrath of the storm (2nd level ability) for 2d8 lightning damage as a reaction, and thunderbolt strike (move enemy up to 10 feet when using lighting damage).
Step 3: enemy moves and eats extra damage, of wastes other weapon attacks.

It's a bit situational, cause it only works on enemies that have more attacks left when they hit you, and they can't be immune to lighting. Then again, wrath of the storm is max 5/day anyway, so that shouldn't be a problem, enemies start having 2 attacks quite early and immune to lighting isn't that common.



Btw, I don't think I agree with the following statement from the OP:
So, BB is definitely more of a 'Controller' thing. If you just want scaling damage, grab GFB, maybe some +Cha to Fire, and be done with it.
- they do the same 'base extra damage' per attack: +1d8 at lvl 5, +2d8 at 11 and +3d8 at lvl 17
- the damage type from BB is much less resisted
- the amount of extra damage on the rider effect is aprox the same (4d8 or 3d8+stat)
- GFB rider attack will trigger a bit more often than BB rider effect (though you can build for this of course, see this thread)
- the way to increase fire damage with cha to fire that I know of are either a highly overpowered UA class that won't fly in any sane's DM campaign (undying light warlock) or a very heavy 6 level class investment (dragon sorcerer 6). Not exactly for every build.

It isn't that obvious which one is better. I'd just pick the more flavorful one, in most builds.

[JAL_1138]

Oh m.... I didn't see that.

Yeah, there was a Sage Advice (and maybe errata?) on it. It bit me hard for a Paladin/Valor Bard build I'm working on; taking three feats, I'll need two magic items to make the character mediocre in melee.

[Asmotherion]

Not sure if it's 100% Raw legal, but:

-Polarm Master Feat + War Caster Feat
-Proficiency with a Glaive or other 10-foot reach polearm.
-Sorcerer with Distant Spell metamagic

Basically, anyone that enders your 10-foot reach provokes an oportunity attack; You attack with Booming Blade as the reaction, since War Caster allows you to do so; Use metamagic on the reaction cantrip to double the distance of Booming Blade to 10 feet. Then, if the opponent choses to come closer to attack, he takes the extra damage.

This is basically PAM+Sentinel feat, but instead of making the oponent unable to move, you punish him for doing so. It should be noted that both feat combinations cannot work together, and Sentinel negates the possibility that a target hit by BB will move again the same round, since sentinel lasts for the current turn and BB till the start of your next turn, meaning that, after an oportunity attack, the target won't get a chance to move 'till the start of your next turn.

A rogue (AT preferably) can make the most out of this cantrip, as his cunning action allows him to move out of melee unhindered, thus provoking the oponent to go after him, and face concequences. An other good option is Storm Sorcerer, as he can both use his action to attack with BB, and then, when the melee attacker strikes back, he is sent flying with a reaction, making him willingly move if he wants to continue his attack.

[Gignere]

Not sure if it's 100% Raw legal, but:

-Polarm Master Feat + War Caster Feat
-Proficiency with a Glaive or other 10-foot reach polearm.
-Sorcerer with Distant Spell metamagic

Basically, anyone that enders your 10-foot reach provokes an oportunity attack; You attack with Booming Blade as the reaction, since War Caster allows you to do so; Use metamagic on the reaction cantrip to double the distance of Booming Blade to 10 feet. Then, if the opponent choses to come closer to attack, he takes the extra damage.

This is basically PAM+Sentinel feat, but instead of making the oponent unable to move, you punish him for doing so. It should be noted that both feat combinations cannot work together, and Sentinel negates the possibility that a target hit by BB will move again the same round, since sentinel lasts for the current turn and BB till the start of your next turn, meaning that, after an oportunity attack, the target won't get a chance to move 'till the start of your next turn.

Looks legit but you can do this if you nab an additional feat spell sniper without having to be a sorcerer. However even a vhuman fighter can't get this going until level 6. So unless you have generous DM it is hard to make this work at least as a reaction. However a whip wielding vhuman can booming blade at range with just spell sniper.

[Asmotherion]

Looks legit but you can do this if you nab an additional feat spell sniper without having to be a sorcerer. However even a vhuman fighter can't get this going until level 6. So unless you have generous DM it is hard to make this work at least as a reaction. However a whip wielding vhuman can booming blade at range with just spell sniper.

Was my first thought as well, but unfortunatelly spell sniper wording specifies it must be a ranged spell attack, and BB descriptor says it's a melee attack. It even uses the normal physical stat, and not your spellcasting stat, because it's not a spell attack.

[Gignere]

Was my first thought as well, but unfortunatelly spell sniper wording specifies it must be a ranged spell attack, and BB descriptor says it's a melee attack. It even uses the normal physical stat, and not your spellcasting stat, because it's not a spell attack.

Looking at the PHB ATM and spell sniper just say a spell with an attack roll the range is doubled. Nothing about range spell attack. The one with range spell attack is the bullet about ignoring cover. You can even use it to learn BB or GFB because that bullet doesn't specify range either.

[CaptainSarathai]

I believe that for an EK, or any fighting type with BB, PAM + WarCaster + Booming Blade can be a pretty cool combo. You hit the guy with BB during his movement toward you. Then he can whether stop his movement and waste his turn (and exposed himself to your attacks) or finish his movement toward you and get hit by all the bonus damages.


You also need Spell Sniper or the Distant Spell metamagic, unless you're using a quarterstaff. The range for BB is still 5ft even if the weapon has reach.


Yeah, there was a Sage Advice (and maybe errata?) on it. It bit me hard for a Paladin/Valor Bard build I'm working on; taking three feats, I'll need two magic items to make the character mediocre in melee.

Did the errata say that you could use BB on a PAM reaction? Because there is an errata stating that Warcaster+PAM does NOT let you cast a spell with the PAM reaction. The original reason was that you had to make the attack with the PoleArm, but this was before SCAG, so now that BB/GFB is technically "an attack with the PoleArm" people have been trying to ask.
So far, everyone I play with has been ruling that PAM, Sentinel, etc. only allow generic Weapon Attacks.


I don't think it's the 'best' way (if such a thing excists), but a fun and thematic option is imo using booming with the tempest cleric (minimum level 6).

Step 1: hit enemy with booming blade.
Step 2: get hit by said enemy, and use wrath of the storm (2nd level ability) for 2d8 lightning damage as a reaction, and thunderbolt strike (move enemy up to 10 feet when using lighting damage).
Step 3: enemy moves and eats extra damage, of wastes other weapon attacks.

It's a bit situational, cause it only works on enemies that have more attacks left when they hit you, and they can't be immune to lighting. Then again, wrath of the storm is max 5/day anyway, so that shouldn't be a problem, enemies start having 2 attacks quite early and immune to lighting isn't that common.
Even better - throw Paladin in there. Pal6, Cler2.
1. Bonus Action: cast Thunderous Smite
Action: Booming Blade
2. Channel Divinity! (Maxes all thunder damage on one attack, so that's the D8s and 2d6 from the Smite spell)
3. Add Smite to Taste!
4. Target hit by Thundering Smite is shoved 10' backwards and Prone on a failed save. Just standing up will shock them.



Btw, I don't think I agree with the following statement from the OP:
- they do the same 'base extra damage' per attack: +1d8 at lvl 5, +2d8 at 11 and +3d8 at lvl 17
- the damage type from BB is much less resisted
- the amount of extra damage on the rider effect is aprox the same (4d8 or 3d8+stat)
- GFB rider attack will trigger a bit more often than BB rider effect (though you can build for this of course, see this thread)
- the way to increase fire damage with cha to fire that I know of are either a highly overpowered UA class that won't fly in any sane's DM campaign (undying light warlock) or a very heavy 6 level class investment (dragon sorcerer 6). Not exactly for every build.

It isn't that obvious which one is better. I'd just pick the more flavorful one, in most builds.

Between the two, I think you get the rider more often from GFB, although for single-target damage BB obviously wins out.

I don't really see the 6-level investment in Sorc to be that bad in the case of GFB. Chances are good that you're a caster anyway, and GFB overrides any martials with Extra Attack. Sorcerer makes the best use of it, thanks to Quicken. May as well go the extra 2 levels and get the +Charisma, slots, etc etc.
----

Build Thoughts
So, further looking at Compelled Duel made me realize that if an ally attacks the target, the spell ends (same as Swashbuckler's 9th level 'Panache' feature) That sort of defeats the purpose - I want to be able to lock down an opponent for the party to wail on. Right now, Vicious Mockery or Protection Style seems the best for punishing an enemy for hitting anyone but me.

So we're looking at either:

VHuman - feat: Mobile
Bard 1
Dragon Sorc 4+
Metamagic: Quicken, Twin
Sorc4 feat: Warcaster
==Online at 2nd, 5th

VHalfElf* - spell: Booming Blade
Rogue 1-2
Dragon Sorc 1-4
Swash 3
Metamagic: Quicken, Twin
Sorc4 feat: Magic Initiate (Bard: Vicious Mockery)
==Online at 2nd, 6th (better at 7th)
*Could technically be any race, as you can snag BB at your first level of Sorc.

So, am I crazy? Missing anything?
In a perfect world, I'd like to create a situation where the enemy has to move to hit, is punished (damage or Disadvantage etc) for hitting anyone else, and possibly even punished for hitting me.
At the very least, force the enemy to move. Either knock it prone, push it out of range, or personally step away.

[JAL_1138]

Did the errata say that you could use BB on a PAM reaction? Because there is an errata stating that Warcaster+PAM does NOT let you cast a spell with the PAM reaction. The original reason was that you had to make the attack with the PoleArm, but this was before SCAG, so now that BB/GFB is technically "an attack with the PoleArm" people have been trying to ask.
So far, everyone I play with has been ruling that PAM, Sentinel, etc. only allow generic Weapon Attacks.


PHB errata v. 1.21 (Oct. 2016) doesn't mention Warcaster (or Booming Blade) at all. The only mention of PAM is to say that the bonus attack uses the same ability mod as the main attack. Only mention of Warcaster I found in the Oct 2016 Sage Advice Compendium is one saying Warcaster is one of the few ways to bypass the fact that cantrips require the Cast A Spell Action and can't otherwise being used as Reactions unless you have such a feature.

The April Sage column (rather than Compendium) has a section on Booming Blade and Greenflame Blade that says that the melee attack is part of the cantrip and thus requires the Cast A Spell Action, so you can't use them to make Reactions unless a special feature allows you to do so. Warcaster allows cantrips as Reactions.

There's a tweet string from Mearls where he starts off saying it's not allowed, then flips and says he misread it and the feat string should work.

EDIT: Sorry for no links; I'm posting from a cell phone and away from my PC. If I'm missing something please point me to it; I can't find any errata saying otherwise on a Google search. I'd like to know if I've misread something before I start picking up Warcaster and Spell Sniper instead of Sentinel and GWM on my current League character.

[CaptainSarathai]

In that case, VHuman Valorbard Sorc looks pretty sexy.
Spell Sniper at L1 (VHuman)
VBard your way to 4 and pick up PAM
Sorc up to 4 and snag Warcaster and boom.

Valorbard is just for Martial Weapons (PoleArms) and Vicious Mockery, really.

Getting the Mobility stuff would be a little less important, since you can keep yourself at range with PAM+BB. Worst case, you need to get out of a bind, Disengage and then Quicken BB. Otherwise, BB and then Quicken VM.
Would it be better to max levels on Bard (Magical Secrets for Armor of Agathys, maybe?) or Sorcerer (for Sorc Points)?

It sucks, because I think our party will already have a Bard. It's a 7-person outfit, but I don't want to step on toes if I can avoid it.

[Toadkiller]

Well, for one thing, the opponent really needs a successful arcana check to know that moving is dangerous. After the first time, sure. But there is no reason for many things to have any clue.

[JAL_1138]

In that case, VHuman Valorbard Sorc looks pretty sexy.
Spell Sniper at L1 (VHuman)
VBard your way to 4 and pick up PAM
Sorc up to 4 and snag Warcaster and boom.

Valorbard is just for Martial Weapons (PoleArms) and Vicious Mockery, really.

Getting the Mobility stuff would be a little less important, since you can keep yourself at range with PAM+BB. Worst case, you need to get out of a bind, Disengage and then Quicken BB. Otherwise, BB and then Quicken VM.
Would it be better to max levels on Bard (Magical Secrets for Armor of Agathys, maybe?) or Sorcerer (for Sorc Points)?

It sucks, because I think our party will already have a Bard. It's a 7-person outfit, but I don't want to step on toes if I can avoid it.

I'd recommend going for it anyway (possibly after talking to the other Bard player to make sure they're ok with it). Bards can work really well with each other in a party, more like starting a band instead of stepping on each others' toes.

I played in a two-Bard tier-2 party in League a while back, and we really increased each other's overall effectiveness. Spammed Hypnotic Pattern to huge effect--one of us would try to hit any enemies that were still active after the other's spell, we could pretty much sweep the field that way. Or ran different Concentration spells simultaneously--e.g., Greater Invisibility from one of us, Hold Person from the other, etc. Used Bardic Inspiration like crazy--I was a Valor and the other Bard was a Lore, so my Combat Inspirations completely freed up all his uses of it for Cutting Words. And of course drove the DM insane with twice the lame jokes, bad puns, and tons of Blues Brothers references.

My current plan for BB+PAM+Warcaster+Spell Sniper is to combo it with Spirit Guardians, so there's no way for anything to approach me or stay near me without at least taking Spirit Guardians damage (and potentially getting slowed) and possibly getting BB'd (if I still have my Reaction and can hit), and even leaving runs the risk of yet more damage if I've already hit with BB or haven't already spent my Reaction. Then at Bard 14, on my turn I can hit with BB and a standard weapon attack on my turn via Battle Magic. And with two levels of Paladin, I can Smite with any of the attacks (including the ones made as part of BB) if I need to.

[Fishyninja]

A rogue (AT preferably) can make the most out of this cantrip, as his cunning action allows him to move out of melee unhindered, thus provoking the oponent to go after him, and face concequences. An other good option is Storm Sorcerer, as he can both use his action to attack with BB, and then, when the melee attacker strikes back, he is sent flying with a reaction, making him willingly move if he wants to continue his attack.

I am actually about to turn my rogue into an AT and I was thinking of this but I am a tad unsure of the mechanics. I understand the attack with bb and then disenage to make them come after me but I cant cast BB and make a weapon attack in the same round right?

[JAL_1138]

I am actually about to turn my rogue into an AT and I was thinking of this but I am a tad unsure of the mechanics. I understand the attack with bb and then disenage to make them come after me but I cant cast BB and make a weapon attack in the same round right?

It's weird. Booming Blade is a cantrip that uses the "Cast A Spell" Action. As part of the cantrip, during the "Cast A Spell" action, you make a melee weapon attack. Sneak Attack can apply to it since Sneak Attack triggers off weapon attacks rather than the "Attack" Action. However, you can't make a Two-Weapon Fighting Bonus Action weapon attack after using it, since the TWF bonus action triggers off the "Attack" Action rather than melee weapon attacks. You also can't use it as a Reaction unless a class feature or feat allows you to cast a cantrip as a Reaction.

[Fishyninja]

It's weird. Booming Blade is a cantrip that uses the "Cast A Spell" Action. As part of the cantrip, during the "Cast A Spell" action, you make a melee weapon attack. Sneak Attack can apply to it since Sneak Attack triggers off weapon attacks rather than the "Attack" Action. However, you can't make a Two-Weapon Fighting Bonus Action weapon attack after using it, since the TWF bonus action triggers off the "Attack" Action rather than melee weapon attacks. You also can't use it as a Reaction unless a class feature or feat allows you to cast a cantrip as a Reaction.

Ok I'm ignoring TWF as I am a dueller.
So when I cast BB I HAVE to make a melee weapon attack, which could be a sneak attack.......NICE!

[RulesJD]

From personal experience, the best best ways to maximize BB:

1. My Swashbuckler build that is Swashbuckler/BM Fighter/Sorcerer. Sentinel feat. Precision, Riposte, Pushing attack for BM maneuvers.

2. Monks. You need a class with lots of mobility. It's a pretty decent choice for Shadow Monks who like to Shadow Step alot.

[CaptainSarathai]

Ok I'm ignoring TWF as I am a dueller.
So when I cast BB I HAVE to make a melee weapon attack, which could be a sneak attack.......NICE!
Yep! Any single-class Rogue can still make good use of BB, since it prevents you from using your Bonus Action each turn for an offhand hit. Just use your Bonus to disengage.
Go AT, or start Elf/VHelf, or VHuman(MI) for BB.
I'm just trying to take it that next step, and make them follow me, instead of standing there and continuing to whack away at the party.



My current plan for BB+PAM+Warcaster+Spell Sniper is to combo it with Spirit Guardians, so there's no way for anything to approach me or stay near me without at least taking Spirit Guardians damage (and potentially getting slowed) and possibly getting BB'd (if I still have my Reaction and can hit), and even leaving runs the risk of yet more damage if I've already hit with BB or haven't already spent my Reaction. Then at Bard 14, on my turn I can hit with BB and a standard weapon attack on my turn via Battle Magic. And with two levels of Paladin, I can Smite with any of the attacks (including the ones made as part of BB) if I need to.
Do you use a PoleArm or Quarterstaff? I think it would be pretty good even without Sentinel/Sniper. Just walk up with Spirit Guardians, hit them with a dual-wield like a standard Rogue, and then Boom them if they try to run.
It would work, very similar to moving Flaming Sphere around with your Bonus. I'm not as concerned with damage though - I'm trying to defend the party a bit, basically give the monster a choice between running after me, or having a hard time hitting the party.


From personal experience, the best best ways to maximize BB:

1. My Swashbuckler build that is Swashbuckler/BM Fighter/Sorcerer. Sentinel feat. Precision, Riposte, Pushing attack for BM maneuvers.

2. Monks. You need a class with lots of mobility. It's a pretty decent choice for Shadow Monks who like to Shadow Step alot.
Monk not so much, they're Wis dependent, so you have to be MAD to get a caster with BB, unless again, you get it through a racial.

I like that Swash build though. I'm guessing you add Pushing Attack when you BB, so they have to move back into you? Riposte for when they miss, Uncanny Dodge when they hit. I imagine you burn up dice in a hurry though.

[RulesJD]

Yep! Any single-class Rogue can still make good use of BB, since it prevents you from using your Bonus Action each turn for an offhand hit. Just use your Bonus to disengage.
Go AT, or start Elf/VHelf, or VHuman(MI) for BB.
I'm just trying to take it that next step, and make them follow me, instead of standing there and continuing to whack away at the party.


Do you use a PoleArm or Quarterstaff? I think it would be pretty good even without Sentinel/Sniper. Just walk up with Spirit Guardians, hit them with a dual-wield like a standard Rogue, and then Boom them if they try to run.
It would work, very similar to moving Flaming Sphere around with your Bonus. I'm not as concerned with damage though - I'm trying to defend the party a bit, basically give the monster a choice between running after me, or having a hard time hitting the party.


Monk not so much, they're Wis dependent, so you have to be MAD to get a caster with BB, unless again, you get it through a racial.

I like that Swash build though. I'm guessing you add Pushing Attack when you BB, so they have to move back into you? Riposte for when they miss, Uncanny Dodge when they hit. I imagine you burn up dice in a hurry though.

Bunch of different ways to get it on a Monk because BB is not stat dependent.

Meh, you can burn through the dice if you want, but they're short rest anyways. Sentinel usually triggers your off-turn Sneak and Shield spell also eats reaction. What it does is give you a ton of options for being super Tanky, or super DPR.

[Fishyninja]

Yep! Any single-class Rogue can still make good use of BB, since it prevents you from using your Bonus Action each turn for an offhand hit. Just use your Bonus to disengage.
Go AT, or start Elf/VHelf, or VHuman(MI) for BB.
I'm just trying to take it that next step, and make them follow me, instead of standing there and continuing to whack away at the party.

Oh look I'm a Variant Human with Alert and planning on going to Arcane Trickster....hmmmmmmm :smallbiggrin:

[Davemeddlehed]

At least aty table (and I think, via Sage Advice) - using Command won't work.
BB only triggers on willing movement. Sage already said that means it doesn't pop on Dissonant Whispers.
'Suggestion' - they won't do it if they know it will cause them harm. Do they know BB will hit?
'Command' - if you rule that they "just do it," even if it causes harm, then it's not any more 'willing' than Dissonant.

I would argue that they don't know what's actually happened to them with BB unless they're also a caster of some kind with experience with BB, unless your character is saying "Booming Blade!" as they strike.

I usually have my character say something like "Thunder bomb goes off in 10!" as he strikes with BB, or goad them with something like "you might not want to be standing there when this goes off".

[Davemeddlehed]

It's weird. Booming Blade is a cantrip that uses the "Cast A Spell" Action. As part of the cantrip, during the "Cast A Spell" action, you make a melee weapon attack. Sneak Attack can apply to it since Sneak Attack triggers off weapon attacks rather than the "Attack" Action. However, you can't make a Two-Weapon Fighting Bonus Action weapon attack after using it, since the TWF bonus action triggers off the "Attack" Action rather than melee weapon attacks. You also can't use it as a Reaction unless a class feature or feat allows you to cast a cantrip as a Reaction.

Paladin with MI feat can make great use out of BB/GFB since it stacks with Divine Smite. Up to 1d8(warhammer/waraxe)+2(dueling fighting style)+1d8(+1d8 if they move afterward)+1d8(divine smite) for 20 average damage isn't bad for a level 4.

[JAL_1138]

Yep! Any single-class Rogue can still make good use of BB, since it prevents you from using your Bonus Action each turn for an offhand hit. Just use your Bonus to disengage.
Go AT, or start Elf/VHelf, or VHuman(MI) for BB.
I'm just trying to take it that next step, and make them follow me, instead of standing there and continuing to whack away at the party.


Do you use a PoleArm or Quarterstaff? I think it would be pretty good even without Sentinel/Sniper. Just walk up with Spirit Guardians, hit them with a dual-wield like a standard Rogue, and then Boom them if they try to run.
It would work, very similar to moving Flaming Sphere around with your Bonus. I'm not as concerned with damage though - I'm trying to defend the party a bit, basically give the monster a choice between running after me, or having a hard time hitting the party.



For idiosyncratic reasons I hate the Qstaff+shield combo, and use a halberd. Even though I know staff+shield is technically stronger because of the AC and the +2 damage from Dueling style, it just feels wrong. I do like having the extra reach the halberd gives though; it's been useful. That it's a +1 weapon certainly helps the decision, too—I'm not likely to find another +1 weapon so easily. Maybe if I can find a really good magic staff that a bard can actually make decent use of.

One of the nice things Spell Sniper does for the Palabard build I'm working on, though, is give me a decent-ish ranged-damage option that it's otherwise mostly lacking. Since I need to use a Magical Secret to pick up Booming Blade if I want it to qualify for Battle Magic (the spell has to count as a Bard spell if I'm going to get a bonus-action weapon attack in the same turn; spells gained from feats don't work for it), I might pick up either Ray of Frost (reducing an enemy's speed by 10ft from up to 120ft away is useful, even if damage is lower), Eldritch Blast (since not much resists Force damage, the range would be 240ft, and it's the best damage I can get at range unless I spend a Secret on yet another cantrip, which is tough on a Valor Bard), or Chill Touch (240ft range as well, and blocks HP recovery for a round).

[BillyBobShorton]

Make them willingly flee chase you or someone/thing else.

I use a wood elf Arcane Trickster w/mobile feat. 45' movement. No need to disengage with feat. So bonus action is used to dash. 90'. Run in, hit bad guy, run away. If DM tries to make them remain stationary, have my familiar (owl-also no need for disengage) goad them, and/or also drop something on the ground and, as stated before, say something like, "That's gonna hurt!" or, "Are you just gonna stand by that thing? Guess you don't need your feet!" or, "I thought you wanted a fight?"

And if I didn't need to use cunning action to dash, I'd use mage hand to pilfer something off them and float it away where they can see it.

You can always fart right near them as you attack. Eat cabbage, cheese, and garlic at inns.

[JAL_1138]

You can always fart right near them as you attack. Eat cabbage, cheese, and garlic at inns.

I thought that was how you cast Stinking Cloud.

[ElLey]

Most classes can use this well just by taking the mobile feat, there are some classes that don't need it such as tempest cleric (push 8th lvl), or stormborn sorcerer (bonus action fly, that doesn't provoke opportunity attacks at 1st lvl), or rogue with cunning action (swashbuckler ftw).

A really crazy build i was thinking about using would be Sorcerer 18/Paladin 2 (could go to 3 if you want the oath features). You'd have access to thunderous strike almost every turn if you use your flexible casting to grab a bunch of 1st level slots. Very dependant on one die roll, but damn can you use that nova. You also have access to divine smite if you feel like you need to kill something quickly. Which you may due because all though you can get good AC your hit points will still be lacking. To top it off 6th level sorcerer's heart of the storm will allow you to add half your level worth of damage to the attack of thunderous smite.

So at 11th
weapon die+mod+5d8+2d6+lvl/2(+divine smite)

Have a good day. :)

[Degwerks]

I've thought about Booming Blade and Greenflame Blade for some time now. After reading this thread I started thinking of using the Protector Aasimar race and going with Tempest Cleric 6, Storm Sorcerer ?, Paladin 2, and maybe adding in Tomelock for shenanigans with short rest refill of sorcerer points.

Let say the above: Pally 2/Stormy 9/Tempest 6/Tomelock 3 Undying Light. Your race gives you a 1/per long rest for 1 minute ability to deal radiant damage equal to your level when you deal damage with an attack or spell, once on each of your turns. Heart of the Storm from 6th level on from Sorcerer gives you the ability to do lightning damage equal to 1/2 your sorcerer level when you cast a 1st level or higher spell dealing Thunder or Lightning damage. Thunderbolt Strike from Tempest cleric gives you the ability to push a target 10ft if you deal lightning damage to it. Using Thunderous Smite from the Paladin along with Booming Blade or Greenflame Blade will allow you to do the Cantrip damage + Thunderous Smite damage + 1/2 your Sorcerer level in Lightning damage, and push the enemy back 10ft, allowing you to move if needed as well and maybe Smite along with that and possibly extra radiant damage from being a Protector Aasimar.

Tomelock 3 Undying Light nets you cantrips and Charisma to Fire/Radiant damage spells. For cantrips I'd take Shillelagh, Thorn Whip and whatever, short rest spells mean you can sacrifice them to get more sorcerer points or to use on Smites. Sacred Flame cantrip for free that runs off Charisma.

All in all your Nova round is doing something along the lines of Weapon die+ Charisma mod + 3d8 Booming+ 2d6 thunderous smite+ 4 lightning+ 20 radiant+ smites and can use your Channel Divinity to max out the Booming/Thunderous damage if you want. And doing something along the lines of moving the enemy back up to 20ft and knocking him prone.

Plus you get Resistance to Lightning/Thunder/Necrotic/Radiant damage. Also you can get Armor of Agathys to buff yourself up and do more damage with your Tempest's Wrath of the Storm.

[CaptainSarathai]

DegWerks, that's pretty close to a build I've for a lightning engineer type character I'm running right now:
Pal6, Cler2, Sorc12
I wasn't gonna take Pal/Cleric to 8, but wanted to hit 6 for 2x Channel Divinity uses. Pally gets more from those levels (more HP, Extra Attack, Oath features, better Lay On Hands, Aura, etc)
I don't use UA stuff, and run the whole "PHB+1" thing, so some of what you did is off the table for me.
---

For the build in question, I think I've moved away from BB somewhat. Current plan feels a mess, but whatever:

BatMaster 3
Rogue 5
Lock 12ish

Probably Fiend+Blade on the Lock. Not sure on the Rogue, probably AT for extra spell slots. Only really want Rogue for Uncanny Dodge - everything else is just extra perks.

Probably going Duellist or Protection for Fighting Style.

Sentinel Feat for sure. Probably Heavy Armor Master and Warcaster too.

Plan being to basically just make everything the monster can do, hurt.

Throw Agathys on self. Throw Hex on target.
Attack: Boom
If it moves - booming triggered, plus OA
If it attacks an ally - Sentinel attack
If it attacks me -
--hit means I Dodge for half, and AoA triggers
--miss means I Riposte

My Bonus is still open, so I was thinking of Dual-Wielding instead of BB, for more damage and shots at SA and Hex. Basically just gonna latch onto the boss like a tick and pummel him for damage.
As far as getting the build "online," it will all pop at L9 at the earliest, which is kinda late, but the "combo" is spread over the whole progression to that point, and is just a matter of me locking down more and more options as the character levels.

VHuman: Sentinel
L1 Fighter - for Con, Armor
L2 Warlock - BB, AoA, Fiend
L3-4 Fighter - Riposte (now have enemy locked into hitting me and taking damage)
L5-9 Rogue (ends with Uncanny Dodge to extend AoA)
L10+ Warlock
Might go to Fighter 4, to grab Warcaster or HAM earlier. Progress really depends on how AoA holds up. Lock6 (instead of Lock1/Rogue5) I'd have AoA at 15THP/Dam, instead of "10"THP/5Dam with Uncanny, so Rogue probably isn't even worth it, other than maybe the scaling SA damage.

[Talionis]

I've thought about Booming Blade and Greenflame Blade for some time now. After reading this thread I started thinking of using the Protector Aasimar race and going with Tempest Cleric 6, Storm Sorcerer ?, Paladin 2, and maybe adding in Tomelock for shenanigans with short rest refill of sorcerer points.

Let say the above: Pally 2/Stormy 9/Tempest 6/Tomelock 3 Undying Light. Your race gives you a 1/per long rest for 1 minute ability to deal radiant damage equal to your level when you deal damage with an attack or spell, once on each of your turns. Heart of the Storm from 6th level on from Sorcerer gives you the ability to do lightning damage equal to 1/2 your sorcerer level when you cast a 1st level or higher spell dealing Thunder or Lightning damage. Thunderbolt Strike from Tempest cleric gives you the ability to push a target 10ft if you deal lightning damage to it. Using Thunderous Smite from the Paladin along with Booming Blade or Greenflame Blade will allow you to do the Cantrip damage + Thunderous Smite damage + 1/2 your Sorcerer level in Lightning damage, and push the enemy back 10ft, allowing you to move if needed as well and maybe Smite along with that and possibly extra radiant damage from being a Protector Aasimar.

Tomelock 3 Undying Light nets you cantrips and Charisma to Fire/Radiant damage spells. For cantrips I'd take Shillelagh, Thorn Whip and whatever, short rest spells mean you can sacrifice them to get more sorcerer points or to use on Smites. Sacred Flame cantrip for free that runs off Charisma.

All in all your Nova round is doing something along the lines of Weapon die+ Charisma mod + 3d8 Booming+ 2d6 thunderous smite+ 4 lightning+ 20 radiant+ smites and can use your Channel Divinity to max out the Booming/Thunderous damage if you want. And doing something along the lines of moving the enemy back up to 20ft and knocking him prone.

Plus you get Resistance to Lightning/Thunder/Necrotic/Radiant damage. Also you can get Armor of Agathys to buff yourself up and do more damage with your Tempest's Wrath of the Storm.

I like all of this a lot but I'd try to get sixth level Sorcerer spells because Chain Lightning maybe the best spell to maximize. I'd also start out Sorcerer for the proficiency in Con saves.

[Isitaris]

What about using Darkness ? With either Devil Sight from the Warlock or the UA sorcerer bloodline lv1 feature.
With opponents blinded, you can take some distance without provoking any opportunity attack, thus forcing them to either waste a turn doing nothing (if they're melee) or taking BB extra damage.

Against at least two enemies, a move could be :
twinned BB as an action, then move far enough for them having to move to attack you, and continue with quickened Lightning strike on them (you just happened to position yourself so that they're are aligned with you). Or just a quickened GFB, the move out of reach.

Doesn't require any multiclassing, and darkness seems to be both a good offensive and defensive option (advantage on your attacks and disadvantage on your opponents' (assuming you can see through them).

[Degwerks]

The Darkness/Devil's Sight or Shadow Sorcerer trick would work fine, but it would also hamper your allies as well.

[Fishyninja]

You can always fart right near them as you attack. Eat cabbage, cheese, and garlic at inns.

Stealing this, I'll let you know how it goes down!

[EduWendigo]

If you like gish read OP-gish-booming-blade-build on this forum.

[LudicSavant]

One interesting corner case for Booming Blade is the Arcana Cleric. They can get Booming Blade and Green-Flame Blade from their domain feature. And they get Potent Spellcasting at 8th level, which lets them apply to Wisdom to damage for a cantrip.

Now here's the interesting part: Potent Spellcasting doesn't have the "applies once" limitation of, say, the Evoker's ability. It applies your wisdom to damage twice. Both on the melee hit, and on the booming blade "movement" damage triggering (or Green-Flame Blade's second target). Potent Spellcasting triggering on each damage event is confirmed to work by Jeremy Crawford. (http://www.sageadvice.eu/2016/08/13/does-the-arcana-clerics-potent-spellcasting-add-wis-mod-damage/)

As it turns out, this results in a lot of damage. For example, a level 8 Vhuman with magic initiate (shillelagh) and both ASIs in Wisdom can get 4d8+15 on a Booming Blade breaking, and 3d8+20 on a Green-Flame Blade with two targets. That's more than enough to exceed the damage output of most characters with Extra Attack at that level... and you're a full casting Arcana Cleric on top of that. So, for example, you can walk in with Spiritual Weapon and Spirit Guardians and be dishing out 8d8+20 per round against people trying to flee from your Spirit Guardians death zone.

Another tactic is to add War Caster onto that, take the Dodge action, and wade into melee. Enemies now can't hit your AC20+ disadvantage, and you are still getting your spirit guardians + spiritual weapon damage every turn, and enemies who try to get away from you take the full 4d8+15 booming blade punish... and walk through difficult terrain.

http://www.sageadvice.eu/2016/08/13/does-the-arcana-clerics-potent-spellcasting-add-wis-mod-damage/

[djreynolds]

You know someone mentioned a nature cleric grabbing thorn whip and pulling the enemy into their spirit guardians. Now that's cool.

[LudicSavant]

You know someone mentioned a nature cleric grabbing thorn whip and pulling the enemy into their spirit guardians. Now that's cool.

Magic initiate for shillelagh and thorn whip. Pull people into your death zone. Hit like a full-attacking martial if they try to move away from you. Fun on a bun.

[AttilatheYeon]

PHB errata v. 1.21 (Oct. 2016) doesn't mention Warcaster (or Booming Blade) at all. The only mention of PAM is to say that the bonus attack uses the same ability mod as the main attack. Only mention of Warcaster I found in the Oct 2016 Sage Advice Compendium is one saying Warcaster is one of the few ways to bypass the fact that cantrips require the Cast A Spell Action and can't otherwise being used as Reactions unless you have such a feature.

The April Sage column (rather than Compendium) has a section on Booming Blade and Greenflame Blade that says that the melee attack is part of the cantrip and thus requires the Cast A Spell Action, so you can't use them to make Reactions unless a special feature allows you to do so. Warcaster allows cantrips as Reactions.

There's a tweet string from Mearls where he starts off saying it's not allowed, then flips and says he misread it and the feat string should work.

EDIT: Sorry for no links; I'm posting from a cell phone and away from my PC. If I'm missing something please point me to it; I can't find any errata saying otherwise on a Google search. I'd like to know if I've misread something before I start picking up Warcaster and Spell Sniper instead of Sentinel and GWM on my current League character.

I think it was in the errata, but it is definitely a thing that Polearm Master and Warcaster can't be used together for OAs.

[MeeposFire]

I think it was in the errata, but it is definitely a thing that Polearm Master and Warcaster can't be used together for OAs.

No it was a Sage pronouncemtn and it was that you could not use the polearm master opportunity attack unless you used the polearm in the attack. At the time of that pronouncement there were no weapon based cantrips so that put a stop to things at the time but with booming blade that is no longer an issue and you can use that and still fill the requirement relayed in that sage announcement.

[joaber]

I can't agree with jeremy about dissonant whisppers. Ok, command obviusly isn't willingly, but dissonant whisppers say that target fell pain and run, the ryn part isn't a direct command, is consequence of the pain. Same with fear, target is scared and dash, is a natural reaction, as I see "willingly".
But ok, probably one more RAI and RAW conflicts, like GWF reroll smites and so.
Spirit guardians is probably the best single guy use for BB, moon beam is two man combo, mobile is a great feat too. And obvisously twin it with metamegic. Favored soul sorcerer is the one that can do spirit guardians + twin better.

[Xetheral]

Don't forget the Twilight Druid's Harvest's Scythe (which can apply because Booming Blade explicitly refers to the thunder damage as "[t]his spell's damage"). It's usually a complete waste to spend it on Booming Blade, but if you all you care about is maximizing Booming Blade damage, it's available (if UA is in the picture anyway). So are the super-smites from the UA Pact of the Blade invocations.

Purely as a theoretical exercise (because maximizing single-attack damage is usually pointless) we can actually put this all together, although it requires Tavern Brawler(?!) of all things...

Half-Orc Twilight Druid 14/Assassin Rogue 3/Feypact Bladelock 3
Invocations: Moon Bow, (Any)
Warlock Cantrips: Booming Blade, (Any)
Warlock Spells: Hex, (Any)
Expertise: Stealth, (Any)
ASIs: Alert, Tavern Brawler, STR +2
Stats: STR 20 (15 Base + 2 Race + 1 Tavern Brawler +2 ASI), DEX 13+, CON (Any + 1 Race), INT (Any), WIS 13+, CHA 13+ (3 points left to spend)

We're going to be attacking with a Ranged Weapon (longbow), so we qualify for Sneak Attack, but we're going to using it to make an improvised Melee Attack (just like you can make an improvised Ranged Attack with a Melee Weapon by throwing it), so we can still use Booming Blade. It's both a spell and a weapon attack, so we can add both Harvest's Scythe and Moon Bow's smite. Here's the damage breakdown:

Weapon: d4 (doubled to 2d4) bludgeoning
Savage Attacks: d4 (doubled to 2d4) bludgeoning
Hex: d6 (doubled to 2d6) necrotic
Sneak Attack: 2d6 (doubled to 4d6) bludgeoning
Booming Blade: 3d8 (doubled to 6d8) thunder
Moon Bow (7th level slot): 14d8 (doubled to 28d8) radiant
Harvest's Scythe: 7d10 (doubled to 14d10) necrotic
Strength: 5 bludgeoning

For a total of 14d10+34d8+6d6+4d4+5 = 266 Average
(Note that this just barely edges out a Greatsword build with Curse Bringer and without Sneak Attack. That comes in at 263 average damage. I'm ignoring GWM, since that would reduce average damage dealt.)

(Alternate build: drop Druid to 11 and lose Alert, take Battlemaster 3 with Archery Style, Precision Attack, and any Maneuver that adds to damage. Your odds of hitting go WAY up, but you lose a bunch of damage. Specifically, you lose (after doubling) 4d10 necrotic from Harvest's Scythe and 4d8 radiant from Moon Bow, for a total of 40 average damage if you need to use Precision Attack to hit. If you don't need it to hit you can use a damaging maneuver which adds back 2d8 bludgeoning, so you only lose 31. Which build does more average damage on a single attack depends on the enemy AC.)

It's possible to go higher with another character's assistance (via Elemental Weapon, for example), or by relying on a failed save against a paralyzing spell to provide the autocrit (letting us hit Druid 17 by dropping the rogue levels and going with a greatsword). Otherwise that might be the maximum damage possible on a single attack, assuming I didn't miss anything. If I didn't, I'm highly amused that the maximum comes from smacking someone with a longbow.

Again, maximizing single-attack damage (as opposed to single-turn damage) is almost completely pointless, even in Nova calculations. So treat this as the silly thought-exercise that it is.

[Rysto]

I just came up with this, so it may not work as well as I think, but how about a Favoured Soul sorcerer with Booming Blade, Lightning Lure and Spirit Guardians? Lightning Lure to pull them into Spirit Guardians AoE, triggering its damage, move 5 ft to get to melee range, and Quicken Booming Blade. They have the choice of staying in range of Spirit Guardians and taking that damage every round, or trying to move away and triggering BB.

It might work better with a Sea Sorcerer to get the additional movement for Lightning Lure (then the Lightning Lure damage would trigger too), but it would require 5 levels of Cleric to get Spirit Guardians.

Add the Mobile feat, and then when they are already in melee range, you can do this: Quicken BB, move away (doesn't trigger AoO because of Mobile), Lightning Lure them back into Spirit Guardians (triggering the damage).

What other spells create a moveable AoE damage? There's Flaming Sphere -- you might be able to do a Wizard build around it. As a bonus action, move Flame Sphere into an enemy's space, hitting them with damage, then walk up to them and hit them with Booming Blade. If they move, they take BB damage. If they don't, they take Flaming Sphere damage.

[Arkhios]

9th level High Elf Mystic with Brute Force and Psionic Weapon Disciplines could pull quite an impressive stunt with 14 Psi points and one Booming Blade.

Bonus Action (Lethal Strike), 7 pp: +7d10 extra damage for next damage roll you make.
Action (Booming Blade) +1d8 extra damage
Reaction (Knock Back), 7 pp: knock the target you hit 70 feet away from you.

[joaber]

9th level High Elf Mystic with Brute Force and Psionic Weapon Disciplines could pull quite an impressive stunt with 14 Psi points and one Booming Blade.

Bonus Action (Lethal Strike), 7 pp: +7d10 extra damage for next damage roll you make.
Action (Booming Blade) +1d8 extra damage
Reaction (Knock Back), 7 pp: knock the target you hit 70 feet away from you.

Brutal force has a 1d6/psi point that apperently you can use after the hit (before the damage) and can be thunder damage, when you crit, thus can reach 14d6, add 2 lvls of tempest cleric to max the damage.

[LudicSavant]

I just came up with this, so it may not work as well as I think, but how about a Favoured Soul sorcerer with Booming Blade, Lightning Lure and Spirit Guardians? Lightning Lure to pull them into Spirit Guardians AoE, triggering its damage, move 5 ft to get to melee range, and Quicken Booming Blade. They have the choice of staying in range of Spirit Guardians and taking that damage every round, or trying to move away and triggering BB.

The thing about Lightning Lure is that the range is only 15 feet. Spirit Guardians flit around you out to a distance of 15 feet. Basically, Lightning Lure is grabbing people who are already in range of you. Thorn Whip, on the other hand, has a range of 30 feet.

If you want a really efficient version of this, try Arcana Cleric with Magic Initiate (Shillelagh, Thorn Whip, Find Familiar) using Booming Blade, Spiritual Weapon, and Spirit Guardians. Adding War Caster helps too. You get Green-Flame Blade and Booming Blade from the Arcana Domain.

The real upshot of Arcana Cleric is that you get +10 to Booming Blade thanks to the level 8 ability, Potent Spellcasting (it deals +5 each of the two times Booming Blade deals damage). You also can get advantage on your attacks from your familiar using the Help action, making your attack highly reliable.

So, let's say you have (Level 2) Spiritual Weapon and (Level 3) Spirit Guardians up, are level 8, and have 20 Wisdom (you rolled a 16+ for at least one stat) and War Caster. You have a lot of options here, all of which are efficient and deal considerable damage.

Option 1: You use Thorn Whip to pull an enemy into the Spirit Guardians, making an attack with advantage thanks to your familiar helping. If you hit (which you are highly likely to), they take 2d6+6d8+5 damage, and are stuck next to you. And then you get a swat with your Spiritual Weapon for 1d8+5. If they try to move away, you can hit with Booming Blade for 4d8+15 damage, for a grand total of 11d8+2d6+25 (81.5) damage... which you can repeat next turn for no resources if they actually manage to move out of your death zone.

If they don't move, you still get 2d6+7d8+10 (48.5) damage that round... and of course continue to deal damage next round. The fact that your familiar's helping out means you also have a double chance of critical hits.

Option 2: You walk right up to them and using Booming Blade (with your familiar helping you on the attack). They take 3d8 damage from spirit guardians, 2d8+10 from your initial booming blade hit, and 1d8+5 from spiritual weapon. If they try to move out of your death zone, you get an OA, and also proc the first booming blade... adding 6d8+20 damage. A grand total of 6d8+15 (42) if they don't move, and 12d8+35 (89) if they do.

Option 3: You take the Dodge action! You give them disadvantage on their attacks, making you a very undesirable target (since you've got a high AC *and* they have disadvantage), making them even more likely to try to leave the difficult terrain death zone. You still deal 4d8+5 (23) from maintaining spirit guardians / bonus action on spiritual weapon, and 8d8+20 (56) if they try to move... all while they quite possibly cannot really do damage to you.

Option 3 can be really effective for clearing hordes of mooks while taking very little to no damage. Heck, you can use just Spirit Guardians, no Spiritual Weapon, and do "run up to them and Dodge" all the way to running out the 10 minute duration to clear multiple encounters from a dungeon with just one spell slot.

This is resource-efficient enough that you can do it pretty much all day, given a 6-8 encounter adventuring day. And even when you run out of spells, you've still got advantage-to-hit, 4d8+15 damage Booming Blades and 3d8+20 damage Green-Flame Blades.

[Arkhios]

Brutal force has a 1d6/psi point that apperently you can use after the hit (before the damage) and can be thunder damage, when you crit, thus can reach 14d6, add 2 lvls of tempest cleric to max the damage.

I forgot the Knock Back damage if the target hit an object when knocked back. But the damage is bludgeoning

Brute Strike (which deals same damage type) takes a Bonus Action, and is used before you hit, in which case Lethal Strike is arguably better - except maybe for a Tempest dip.

[joaber]

I forgot the Knock Back damage if the target hit an object when knocked back. But the damage is bludgeoning

Brute Strike (which deals same damage type) takes a Bonus Action, and is used before you hit, in which case Lethal Strike is arguably better - except maybe for a Tempest dip.

I was talking about brute strike, the d6 damage can be thunder too, and unlike lethal strike, you can use it after hit. So, when you see a crit, eith tempest cleric 2, you could max the damage. So, at high levels, 6d8 + 14d6 maxed, or 132

[Rysto]

The thing about Lightning Lure is that the range is only 15 feet. Spirit Guardians flit around you out to a distance of 15 feet. Basically, Lightning Lure is grabbing people who are already in range of you. Thorn Whip, on the other hand, has a range of 30 feet.

If you want a really efficient version of this, try Arcana Cleric with Magic Initiate (Shillelagh, Thorn Whip, Find Familiar) using Booming Blade, Spiritual Weapon, and Spirit Guardians. Adding War Caster helps too. You get Green-Flame Blade and Booming Blade from the Arcana Domain.

Ah. I was using Sorcerer for Quickened BB, so that you could yank them and hit them with BB on the same round (otherwise the sane thing to do is to run away before you can hit them with BB). I hadn't thought of having Warcaster to allow BB via AoO.

[Arkhios]

I was talking about brute strike, the d6 damage can be thunder too, and unlike lethal strike, you can use it after hit. So, when you see a crit, eith tempest cleric 2, you could max the damage. So, at high levels, 6d8 + 14d6 maxed, or 132

"Brute Strike (1–7 psi). As a bonus action, you gain a bonus to your next damage roll against a target you hit with a melee attack during the current turn."

You use the ability before you know if you hit, not after like divine smite. Of course the next damage roll could be a crit, but the point is that you don't get to choose to use it after you've hit.

[Laserlight]

At least at my table (and I think, via Sage Advice) - using Command won't work.
BB only triggers on willing movement.

Based on the rules for OAs, I'd say that if you use your reaction, action or bonus to move, that's "willing"; if you move because Repelling Blast knocked you back, that's movement but not willing. YMMV.

OTOH Command has no effect if your command is directly harmful to the target. If he knows what BB is, Command is null.

[LudicSavant]

Based on the rules for OAs, I'd say that if you use your reaction, action or bonus to move, that's "willing"

I rule the same way at my table. If the character is doing the action themselves, it counts as willing. This seems to be strongly implied by the rules on Opportunity Attacks on page 195 of the PHB.

[joaber]

"Brute Strike (1–7 psi). As a bonus action, you gain a bonus to your next damage roll against a target you hit with a melee attack during the current turn."

You use the ability before you know if you hit, not after like divine smite. Of course the next damage roll could be a crit, but the point is that you don't get to choose to use it after you've hit.

If you check lethal strike or speed dart, you'll see that the text is different than brute strike. The first two you clearly need to spend the psi before attack, brutal strike isn't that clear, only say that is before damage for a hit in the current turn, so technically could be after or before the hit.

[Arkhios]

If you check lethal strike or speed dart, you'll see that the text is different than brute strike. The first two you clearly need to spend the psi before attack, brutal strike isn't that clear, only say that is before damage for a hit in the current turn, so technically could be after or before the hit.

A bit fiddly interpretation, but I guess you could read it that way.

[Specter]

Probably late to this party but...

To get the most out of Booming Blade you should really be a rogue. They have one attack, they can disengage to force the damage and they don't want to stay in melee for long. The perfect combination for BB.

[Crusher]

I know the thread is about the way to get the most out of a BB build, but I'm answering another question: What's the *easiest* way to do a BB build?

High Elf Rogue - take BB as your starting cantrip. When you get Cunning Action at level 2 you're good to go. Obviously Swashbuckler at level 3 works even better, but having the build be fully functional at 2 is pretty nice.

Also, this would require DM discretion, but you could offer to trade Proficiency in one of your many, many starting skills for Proficiency in Whip. Then at level 4 take Spell Sniper. Could do a lot of damage and it has the bonus coolness factor of being one of the relatively few non-caster (more or less) builds that Mix/Maxes better with a race other than vHuman.

[Rub]

Some interesting ideas here but I wanted to clarify something. First, since Booming Blade is technically a spell and not a melee attack, wouldn't it NOT work with the Mobile Feat? Second, could you use a Quasit, Sprite or Imp to cast through if you wanted to cast BB or GFB at a distance beyond 5 feet?

[MeeposFire]

Some interesting ideas here but I wanted to clarify something. First, since Booming Blade is technically a spell and not a melee attack, wouldn't it NOT work with the Mobile Feat? Second, could you use a Quasit, Sprite or Imp to cast through if you wanted to cast BB or GFB at a distance beyond 5 feet?

Just a point of clarification booming blade is a spell AND a melee attack. As another example there are other spells that are melee attacks such as shocking grasp. Booming blade is also a melee WEAPON attack which is rather unique. If an ability requires a melee attack or melee weapon attack it works with booming blade.

What does not work with booming blade is something that requires the attack action because it does not do that. One example is that by RAW you cannot use two weapon fighting with booming blade because it requires the attack action.

[Lockles]

I got my BB from Magic Initiate on my human variant Champion fighter, and I've been getting tons of mileage out of it. Mostly thanks to my glaive weapon.

Run somewhat past baddy#1, so you can just hit it with your reach. Boom that bugger!
Run to baddy#2 and make your second (third, polearm master bonus) attack on his face.

Baddy#1 is either going to stand there like a doofus, afraid to get hurt a little.
Or he's going to get BOOMed trying to help his buddy.

Also, if you do go with a magic initiate champion human variant: Get the Jump spell. I know, hex seems appealing with all the extra attacks, but for mobility, get that jump. Leap all over the battlefield with a STR mod + STR mod * 3 (with 20 STR that's 5*2*3 = 30 ft long jumps with 10 ft of movement per jump. Allowing you to move 10+30+10+30+10+30 ft per turn. Easily punting 3 guys in the face with extra attacks.
Make that 3x booming blade attacks.
Now the 3 thicko's who didn't bring a bow are standing there with their thumbs tucked down the back of their loincloth.

And if you want to be like me and get more mileage out of that polearm; polearm master, the guy you ended your turn 10 ft away from, stepped 5 ft forward, gets boomed, and now you get an attack of opportunity.
Lets... I dunno, BOOM IT!

[solidork]

I got my BB from Magic Initiate on my human variant Champion fighter, and I've been getting tons of mileage out of it. Mostly thanks to my glaive weapon.

Glad you're having fun with it.

To others who might be thinking about doing this in their game, keep in mind that RAW:
- You can't usually use booming blade with a reach weapon because it has a 5ft range. You can surmount this problem with the Spell Sniper feat or the Sorcerer distant spell metamagic.
- While Booming Blade is a melee attack, it isn't the same thing as using the attack action. If you have the Extra Attack feature, you wont be able to use the second attack from that feature. Additionally, most bonus action attacks (including Polearm Master) also require you to take the attack action in order to use the bonus action attack.

I would also like to note that my DM lets me use the bonus action attack granted by being a War Cleric even if I cast Booming Blade. It can be important to understand how the rules work as written, but absolute adherence to them is pretty rare.

[MeeposFire]

I got my BB from Magic Initiate on my human variant Champion fighter, and I've been getting tons of mileage out of it. Mostly thanks to my glaive weapon.

Run somewhat past baddy#1, so you can just hit it with your reach. Boom that bugger!
Run to baddy#2 and make your second (third, polearm master bonus) attack on his face.

Baddy#1 is either going to stand there like a doofus, afraid to get hurt a little.
Or he's going to get BOOMed trying to help his buddy.

Also, if you do go with a magic initiate champion human variant: Get the Jump spell. I know, hex seems appealing with all the extra attacks, but for mobility, get that jump. Leap all over the battlefield with a STR mod + STR mod * 3 (with 20 STR that's 5*2*3 = 30 ft long jumps with 10 ft of movement per jump. Allowing you to move 10+30+10+30+10+30 ft per turn. Easily punting 3 guys in the face with extra attacks.
Make that 3x booming blade attacks.
Now the 3 thicko's who didn't bring a bow are standing there with their thumbs tucked down the back of their loincloth.

And if you want to be like me and get more mileage out of that polearm; polearm master, the guy you ended your turn 10 ft away from, stepped 5 ft forward, gets boomed, and now you get an attack of opportunity.
Lets... I dunno, BOOM IT!

I hate to tell you but your game is allowing you a bunch of things that are against the standard rules.

1. Booming blade is an action as is the attack action. They are not the same so you either get your multiple attacks OR you get to use booming blade.

2. Since you are not using the attack action you cannot use the bonus action attack from polearm master if you use booming blade.

3. Since booming blade requires its own action to use each attack you get from an attack action would not be each a booming blade.

4. Booming blade has a range of 5 feet NOT the reach of your weapon. This means you need the spell sniper feat to use booming blade at your 10 feet of reach.

5. You cannot use a spell for an opportunity attack unless you have war caster which you do not claim to have.

[Desteplo]

Someone mentioned. Whip and getting the spell sniper feat to increase the range of the BB so you can use with reach