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View Full Version : D&D 5e/Next Arcane Barrier: A New 2nd Level Reaction Spell [PEACH]



Llama513
2017-01-12, 04:50 PM
It is extremely frustrating to be counter spell, whether you are a player or a DM as such I would like to propose a spell to replace counter spell

You attempt to intercept the force of a spell as it is cast. You quickly erect a barrier of arcane energy around one creature within 30 feet of you to absorb the impact of a spell. The creature that you place the barrier around gains either a bonus to their spell saving throw equal to your spell casting modifier or resistance to a damage type chosen when the spell is cast, you can determine the spell being cast with a check using your spellcasting ability modifier DC equal to 10 + the spell's level if sucessful you learn if the spell being cast has a saving throw or not, and what damage type it deals, if you fail the DC by 2 or less you identify the damage type dealt by the spell, if you fail the DC by more than 2 you are not able to figure anything out about the spell. You cast even if you don't pass the DC to get information about the spell.

At Higher Levels. When you cast this spell using a spell slot of 3rd level or higher, you can target one additional creature for each slot level above 2nd. The creatures must be within 30 feet of each other when you target them.

The homebrewery link is here (http://homebrewery.naturalcrit.com/share/r1hnfKH8g)


Thoughts?

GalacticAxekick
2017-01-12, 05:27 PM
I don't see what's frustrating about Counterspell. It's actually one of my favourite spells, thematically and mechanically.

Thematically, snuffing a spell to nothing at all is far—a sorcerer waving her hands in the air, or a bard strumming a lyre in futility—is far cooler to me than simply blocking a fireball or resisting an enchantment.

And mechanically, being able to completely prevent a spell from happening can be devastating. A snuffed attack can mean the difference between a party member's life and death. A snuffed defence or escape, ditto for the enemy. And because it prevents the spell, entirely, it affects anyone the spell would've targeted and not just Counterspell's caster. It's simple, versatile and powerful.

Arcane Barrier, less so.

Llama513
2017-01-12, 05:34 PM
I don't see what's frustrating about Counterspell. It's actually one of my favourite spells, thematically and mechanically.

Thematically, snuffing a spell to nothing at all is far—a sorcerer waving her hands in the air, or a bard strumming a lyre in futility—is far cooler to me than simply blocking a fireball or resisting an enchantment.

And mechanically, being able to completely prevent a spell from happening can be devastating. A snuffed attack can mean the difference between a party member's life and death. A snuffed defence or escape, ditto for the enemy. And because it prevents the spell, entirely, it affects anyone the spell would've targeted and not just Counterspell's caster. It's simple, versatile and powerful.

Arcane Barrier, less so.

My main issue with it is that it ends up making combat between casters anti-climatic and frustrating for both sides, as you can snuff out a bosses 9th level spell completely, just as they could with you. And it ends up becoming who ever can cast the most counter spells is going to win, because they are the person whose spells are going to actually get through, as they cancel out the Counterspell used on them.

But if you like to use Counterspell, I also wouldn't mind getting thoughts on Arcane Barrier as just a spell in general.

Llama513
2017-01-12, 05:52 PM
After looking through the other spells I may just turn this into it's own spell, and realized that spells that grant the same benefits of this spell that last longer or come with bonus damage are 2nd level (Enhance Ability) and 1st level (Absorb Elements) as such I am thinking about lowering the level to 1st or 2nd level but I'm not entirely sure.

SilverStud
2017-01-12, 05:55 PM
I think that Arcane Barrier is a cool idea, but not to replace Counterspell.

On Arcane Barrier itself, though, I think it is too weak for a 3rd-level slot. Think about it. With counterspell, you can UTTERLY PREVENT 8d6 damage from being dealt to a bunch of creatures (Fireball). With Arcane Barrier, you can POTENTIALLY HALVE 8d6 damage to 1 person. That is an absolutely massive step down in power. Huge. With the effects as written, I would say it is a 1st level spell. Even Shield is better than this, because it can completely prevent the attack that triggered it, thus annulling damage.

So, as written, Arcane Barrier should be a 1st level spell, with the same upcast rule.

Llama513
2017-01-12, 06:00 PM
I think that Arcane Barrier is a cool idea, but not to replace Counterspell.

On Arcane Barrier itself, though, I think it is too weak for a 3rd-level slot. Think about it. With counterspell, you can UTTERLY PREVENT 8d6 damage from being dealt to a bunch of creatures (Fireball). With Arcane Barrier, you can POTENTIALLY HALVE 8d6 damage to 1 person. That is an absolutely massive step down in power. Huge. With the effects as written, I would say it is a 1st level spell. Even Shield is better than this, because it can completely prevent the attack that triggered it, thus annulling damage.

So, as written, Arcane Barrier should be a 1st level spell, with the same upcast rule.

I am going to treat it as it's own spell from now on and not worry about replacing counter spell and thank you for clearing up what level the spell should be, do you have any suggestions to bring on par with shield or the other 1st level reaction spells

Steel Mirror
2017-01-12, 06:10 PM
I think it should give both advantage to any saves as well as resistance to any damage dealt. I assume the resistance only applies to the attack itself, and doesn't extend any longer? It would still be quite similar to Shield, just for effects which give saves rather than those which are attacks. Might be more powerful than Shield because of resistance, but I think it could still fit at level 1.

I'm not sure if I'd ever take it personally, because it's just more fun to do something proactive than it is to blow valuable spell slots on reactions which just help people tank and aren't very flashy, but it would probably be a great trick for more support-minded players. It is a cool concept.

Llama513
2017-01-12, 06:16 PM
I think it should give both advantage to any saves as well as resistance to any damage dealt. I assume the resistance only applies to the attack itself, and doesn't extend any longer? It would still be quite similar to Shield, just for effects which give saves rather than those which are attacks. Might be more powerful than Shield because of resistance, but I think it could still fit at level 1.

I'm not sure if I'd ever take it personally, because it's just more fun to do something proactive than it is to blow valuable spell slots on reactions which just help people tank and aren't very flashy, but it would probably be a great trick for more support-minded players. It is a cool concept.

Thanks, I am mainly designing for a campaign in which we are not allowing counterspell, I realize it doesn't quite fill the hole of counterspell but it's better than nothing

Llama513
2017-01-12, 06:53 PM
Changelog:
- Range is now 30 feet
- Sight of creature casting a spell added
- Added Vocal Component
- Choice between either advantage on save or resistance to damage made when spell is cast

Potato_Priest
2017-01-12, 11:17 PM
Hmmm.

I personally like counterspells, because a lot of boss npcs are generally casters, and I like that there's SOMETHING to prevent them from just walking all over you with wall of force, etc. (Wall of force gives no saving throw, and is only destroyable by a specific spell 1 level higher than it, using an action)

However, I think this is pretty good too. I'd rank it at 2nd level, because otherwise it seems like it steps on the nature cleric's levl 6 feature a bit too much, and because I think that spell level 2 is not a particularly good one compared to lvl 1, and having this at 2nd will help them get excited. Aside from that, I think this is a good spell.

Potato_Priest
2017-01-12, 11:20 PM
After looking through the other spells I may just turn this into it's own spell, and realized that spells that grant the same benefits of this spell that last longer or come with bonus damage are 2nd level (Enhance Ability) and 1st level (Absorb Elements) as such I am thinking about lowering the level to 1st or 2nd level but I'm not entirely sure.

Where are you getting that enhance ability performs a similar function? By RAW, I believe it only gives advantage on ability checks, not saving throws.

Llama513
2017-01-12, 11:21 PM
Hmmm.

I personally like counterspells, because a lot of boss npcs are generally casters, and I like that there's SOMETHING to prevent them from just walking all over you with wall of force, etc. (Wall of force gives no saving throw, and is only destroyable by a specific spell 1 level higher than it, using an action)

However, I think this is pretty good too. I'd rank it at 2nd level, because otherwise it seems like it steps on the nature cleric's levl 6 feature a bit too much, and because I think that spell level 2 is not a particularly good one compared to lvl 1, and having this at 2nd will help them get excited. Aside from that, I think this is a good spell.

Thanks, I forgot to update the text from the edits that I made to the spell

Llama513
2017-01-12, 11:22 PM
Where are you getting that enhance ability performs a similar function? By RAW, I believe it only gives advantage on ability checks, not saving throws.

I misread the spell that's what happened there

Sir cryosin
2017-01-20, 09:43 AM
Ok I like this spell and I like that it 2nd lv. 2nd lv has only one adjuration spell oh sorry you haven't said what school it from but if feel like a abjuration spell. Also I imagine it on the wizards spell list. Also this could cos some problems at lv 18 if a adjuration wizard picked it as one of there spells they can cast at will. It will give a PC bounes and fill the wizards ward.

Hillsy7
2017-01-20, 10:19 AM
The solution here is probably a bit easier than dropping a whole new spell.

Don't tell them what spell the caster is casting - they then have to guess and pick an appropriate spell slot....guess too high and they've wasted a powerful spell slot. Too low, and they've got to roll....Trying to block a lvl 8 spell with a lvl 7 spell still requires a DC 18 check, annoying when a lvl 1 would've done the trick. This gives a risk/reward to spell management. and if you're burning high level spells, then yes, the reward should be a complete negation of the spell.

yuvraj1068
2017-01-21, 01:06 AM
Looking at the spell list as it stands now, you've removed a lot of crowd control in lieu of utility. Now, that utility looks really handy out of combat (especially with full spontaneous access to the spell list), but it looks like the class just became substantially weaker in combat. Are you planning to offset this with a modified chassis and/or class features? With a spell list like that, the class needs to be able to contribute in some other way.

Personally, I'd say leave the CC spells in, because fighting fools is half of what dungeon delving is all about, but that's just me. There are other ways to make the class more effective in combat without CC spells. Looking at that spell list alone, if you simply used a Bard's casting progression (but not spells known), you could possibly bring this all the way up to full BAB and d8 (or d10?) Hit Dice without hurting anything. He'd basically play as an adventurous sort of fighter who happens to have magic to solve a lot of problems that he runs into. It could almost come off as sort of a well-defined factotum, or something.