Aragorn in 6 levels.

[Molosse]

A conversation began in the Paizo forums and immediately diverged into building the closest Aragorn equivalent. To that end how would the playground approach it?

Feel free to treat the 6 levels as a guideline and feel free to jump back into 3.5 sources.
Winner get's free internet respect.

[Muggins]

Level 6 seems about right; Lord of the Rings, to me, is almost definitely an E6 environment.

That being said, I can't see Aragorn as being anything more than a Ranger (or a particularly skilled Fighter). He has no interesting capabilities and fights entirely mundanely, so replacing the spells is a must; maybe Skirmisher (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/core-classes/ranger/archetypes/paizo---ranger-archetypes/skirmisher), maybe the Feat Ranger ACF from 3.5e's Complete Warrior.

As long as he can use the Heal and Survival skills, has Knowledge (Nature), and has decent strength/constitution/dexterity/wisdom ability scores (16/14/14/14, for example), I don't see him being particularly hard to stat up. There's just not that much depth to his mechanics. Sorry.

[Sayt]

I tbhink he actually is just a straight Human/Half-elf Ranger.

He doesn't have any splashy magic, but he could plausibly have cast Delay poison on Frodo when escaping to Rivendell, or have been referring to Blend (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic/all-spells/b/blend) when he says (In the movies at least) that he can "pass unseen"(Without actually turning invisible), or have used Tireless Persuit (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic/all-spells/t/tireless-pursuit) when chasing after Merry and Pippin.

We never see Aragorn recognizably cast spells, but that could just mean he doesn't cast/know/have available the flashy ones like shock arrow.

[Blackhawk748]

Ya hes a THW Ranger. I know theres a fighting style for that in a 3rd party book for 3.5 and Aragorn probably does use a few spells (the aforementioned Delay Poison) they just arent obvious, which is a fair amount of the Ranger spells.

[Serafina]

Well, we first have to ask ourselves "what can Aragorn do".

Obviously he's a good combatant. But good is always relative - any 6th-level combat build would get utterly shown up by 12th-level combat build, or a monster with too high CR. That's just the nature of D&D, and therefore Pathfinder.
So we have to look at how he fights more than at how good he is.
He obviously fights with a sword. Occasionally he picks up a shield, and possibly even a second weapon. However, "fight with a sword" is easily to represent - proficiency is automatic with most classes, just add power attack and you're good to go.
But he also fights with a bow. He may not be as good as a dedicated archer (such as Legolas), but he's clearly good enough at it to make it worthwhile. Proficiency should be easy - but he'd also need some feats to actually be good at that, too. This can get complicated due to simply not having enough feats.

He's also a skilled tracker, knows how to survive in the wilderness, can ride and fight off the back of a horse, and is notable for being able to heal wounds that otherwise don't.
Most of which can be represented by skills. He'll need a good number of them, and not be too bad at the relevant ability scores, but it's doable.
We can also throw in some spells, because in the D&D framework a lot of things just work better at spells - and as long as it isn't anything too flashy, it fits well with the subtle magic of Middle Earth.


So how do we do this?
The simplest way to do this is just to go with the Ranger. Not my most favorite class, but such is fate.
Human is the obvious choice for race. Technically we could also try Half-Elf to represent his heritage, and of course being Numenoran-descendant can also be a custom race, but that's houserules.
25 Ability Point Buy works well, giving his exceptional abilities. That's enough to go for a 14/14/14/13/14/12 array, where we use the score bonus to push one of the physical stats to 16. Alternatively, we can reduce Intelligence and Charisma to 10 and instead push one physical score to 18, or two to 16.
For our combat style, we pick Archery. At 2nd level we pick Rapid Shot (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/feats/combat-feats/rapid-shot-combat---final), at 6th level we pick Improved Precise Shot (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/feats/combat-feats/improved-precise-shot-combat---final). Two of the most important ranged feats, reasonably early and skipping their prerequisites. Add Deadly Aim to taste (or not), and we're good to go.
Favored Enemy obviously goes to Orks, with the second going to Monstrous Humanoid. It's one of my least favorite class features though, being so heavily campaign-dependent.
Hunters Bond goes towards companions. It's not good leadership, but it's decent enough for our purpose - he can make allies, especially small groups, better at fighting.
We only get four Feats. We take the obligatory Power Attack so that he can dish out more melee damage. We also take Signature Skill (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/feats/general-feats/signature-skill-general) (Heal (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/skills/heal)) - this allows him to very effectively heal people via mundane treatment, especially with Battlefield Surgeon. Quick Draw (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/feats/combat-feats/quick-draw-combat---final) works especially well with switch hitters, which we're building for. And finally, we can take Combat Stamina (if it's not gained for free), or Barroom Brawler (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/feats/combat-feats/barroom-brawler-combat) for a 1/day flexible combat feat - though you could also go for some other feat. Cornugon Smash (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/feats/combat-feats/cornugon-smash-combat) is nice for a power attacker, or you can go for a more mobile fighting style and go for Vital Strike (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/feats/combat-feats/vital-strike-combat---final).
For Traits, we take Battlefield Surgeon (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/traits/religion-traits/battlefield-surgeon). This allows him to heal twice a characters leve in hitpoints twice per day, and four points of ability damage per creature per day. The other trait can go to any good one you like.
And for Skills, we have 8 skill points per level. Maximizing Acrobatics, Heal, Perception, Survival and Stealth is easy, and leaves us with a total of 18 skill points to spend on Knowledge skills, Climb, Swim and the like.

Alternatively, we can do the whole thing with a Slayer too. No favored enemy (which I like), no Hunters Bond (so no ability to lead people, however small) and no spells - but instead, studied target (sadly with a move action), 2D6 sneak attack and a slayer talent. The other two slayer talents would be spent on Ranger Combat Style (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/hybrid-classes/slayer/slayer-talents/paizo---slayer-talents/ranger-combat-style). The fourth feat can be spent on an extra slayer talent too.
For some leadership, there's the Vanguard (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/hybrid-classes/slayer/archetypes/paizo---slayer-archetypes/vanguard) - but you'd have to select teamwork feats with your normal feats, in addition to spending a feat on your second ranger style - here, you'd basically have to drop power attack, and of course you'd need to choose a nice teamwork feat for this.


Either way, our end result is skilled with blade and bow and at survival, tracking and healing.

[Afgncaap5]

I've seen this come up before, and there's one outlying ability that was brought up once that feels like a good point to me: his ability to "chase off" the Ring Wraiths with little more than a torch.

That's *really* tricky to account for if you assume a straight reading of rules, especially if you limit yourself to first party 3.5 and Pathfinder sources. The easiest way to do it would be to assume it's a kind of intimidate check and that the Ring Wraiths would be spooked enough to not try again all night, which seems unlikely but it's possible. Someone else said that it might have been the "mundane equivalent of a Turning check" which feels more likely; Tolkien didn't know at the time that Aragorn was the king while he was writing it, but maybe some sort of divine right/nobility thing kicked in. Would there be any templates, archetypes, ACFs, or really easy prestige classes that could grant a ranger some sort of turning ability, or should we just assume that element of surprise worked for him really well that night?

[Âmesang]

I've also seen him with a dip in Paladin to represent abilities to embolden the hearts of those around him and resist fear, though I am more familiar with 3.5 than Pathfinder so I know not what an ordinary ranger could have to replicate that (besides Charisma which my own Pathfinder ranger lacked).

At the very least being 6th-level would let him nab Leadership. :smalltongue:

Honestly I find Sauron more of a pain 'cause I believe he'd have to be a minimum 15th-level wizard in order to qualify for the Craft Artifact salient divine ability (though he might be doable at a slightly lower level via artificer).

[Serafina]

No, that's really much better explained by being a property of the Ringwraits themselves.
The popular theory there is that while they can not themselves be killed by it, their physical bodies can be - and that getting new ones would have required long travel. Hence, if they had gotten destroyed at that point, the chase would have been off. Hence, they beat a tactical retreat.

The same goes for his ability to heal the wounds by the cursed blade of the Ringwraiths: That's a setting-specific thing.
If you want in-game representation, you can make it a trait.
Alternatively, you just go with what I outlined above, and treat those cursed blades as a nasty poison, disease, or curse that lasts for a certain time. Then you figure in his maximized heal-skill and his ability to treat ability score damage via Heal, and to do so twice a day per person at that. If the affliction does Constitution-damage, at a rate where it'll kill you before it runs it's course, then his healing (otherwise not available in the relatively low-magic setting) just saves your life until you're better.

And really, a ton of fictional characters just have much broader abilities than a D&D/Pathfinder class can provide. This goes especially for combat-related activities.
Consider combat maneuvers - it's fairly common to see someone disarm, trip or shove someone in combat. In D&D, you'd normally need to invest several feats for that to be not very risky (specifically, provoke an AoO and more likely to fail than not against equal opponents). It's just the wrong system to represent this sort of opportunistic advantage over an opponent.
Likewise, consider characters using unarmed attacks of any sort. Most characters don't come with Improved Unarmed Strike - and even when they do, there's little reason to attack an enemy with quick elbow strike rather than a weapon attack, going by the rules. This is so not true for real combat, where you just use whatever opportunity you have. You can sort off wave that away with "the system abstracts it away", but still.
Then you have two-weapon fighting - again, in PF you specialize in that or not, while in fiction it's often done spontaneous to get a momentary advantage. In real life, it's mostly good for improving your defense - in D&D, it instead grants higher offense.
And then you get into supernatural effects. D&D spell lists are just soo different than what you get in most fiction, as is the whole vancian cating system.

Bottom line: Most fictional characters can only be approximated in D&D/Pathfinder. Sometimes, you just have to use house-rules or other adjustments if you want to get closer, and many more times you are just using the wrong system for the thing you want.



That being said - Pathfinder doesn't have Turn Undead, it has Channel Energy. Which is much more useful for healing your group most of the time. Not that it matters, because there's no Ranger archetype that grants it anyway. Variant multiclassing can, but only at level 7 and then only a very small amount.

[Afgncaap5]

No, that's really much better explained by being a property of the Ringwraits themselves.
The popular theory there is that while they can not themselves be killed by it, their physical bodies can be - and that getting new ones would have required long travel. Hence, if they had gotten destroyed at that point, the chase would have been off. Hence, they beat a tactical retreat.

Ahhh. Yes, that'd do it.


And really, a ton of fictional characters just have much broader abilities than a D&D/Pathfinder class can provide. This goes especially for combat-related activities.

Bottom line: Most fictional characters can only be approximated in D&D/Pathfinder. Sometimes, you just have to use house-rules or other adjustments if you want to get closer, and many more times you are just using the wrong system for the thing you want.

True. I think the closest you could get for many characters would be to classify different classes (ie., Batman doesn't have X levels of fighter and X levels of Monk, he's actually got X levels of Batman.) That can lead to characters with a crazy number of feats, some of which are situational rather than "always on", though.



That being said - Pathfinder doesn't have Turn Undead, it has Channel Energy. Which is much more useful for healing your group most of the time. Not that it matters, because there's no Ranger archetype that grants it anyway. Variant multiclassing can, but only at level 7 and then only a very small amount.

Ooh, I'd forgotten that. That's why the Cleric I've wanted to play for three years can't be replicated in Pathfinder, actually.

[Serafina]

I've also seen him with a dip in Paladin to represent abilities to embolden the hearts of those around him and resist fear, though I am more familiar with 3.5 than Pathfinder so I know not what an ordinary ranger could have to replicate that (besides Charisma which my own Pathfinder ranger lacked).

At the very least being 6th-level would let him nab Leadership. :smalltongue:

Honestly I find Sauron more of a pain 'cause I believe he'd have to be a minimum 15th-level wizard in order to qualify for the Craft Artifact salient divine ability (though he might be doable at a slightly lower level via artificer).This is a great point to start talking about Mythic rules (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/mythic).
For those who don't know, Mythic is a system where characters advance in mythic tiers in addition to their level. One can in theory have a Level 1/Mythic Tier 10 character, though in practice the progression does of course look different. Each mythic tier grants some hit points, as well as a mythic path ability that can often do things that you can not otherwise do - and even better, let you do things your class can not otherwise do. Every two levels, you also (alternatingly) gain a (mythic) feat and an ability score increase. Most abilities are fueled by mythic power, of which you have (3 plus two per tier), and it can also be used to just add 1D6 (later more) to any dice roll.

If you want reasonably low-level characters who still stand far above their peers, and also have more diverse abilities, mythic is actually a great system.


Let's take our Aragorn here. At some point, he's clearly a great leader and commander.
If we give him just one mythic tier, he can be a Marshal (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/mythic/mythic-heroes/mythic-paths---paizo-inc/marshal). Now he can grant himself and all within 30 feet allies a bonus move action, or a reroll, or even both! As a swift action, though only five times per day (or rather, it costs mythic power and he only has five, for now).
It also grants him a bonus feat, though he could just spend that to take up Dual Path and be a Champion too. Thatr can grant him swift-action attacks or followers that even get mythic surges from him.
Better yet, there's some very good univeral path abilities too. We can represent Anduril very well by giving him a Legendary Item (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/mythic/mythic-magic-items/legendary-items). Granted, with low tiers it's mostly give the ability to add 1D6 to attack rolls twice per day - or to add that to any check, or to do it four times per day.

If we give Aragorn Mythic Tier 1 once he gets Anduril, I'd represent him like this:
Make him a Marshal, and give him the Rally-ability. This gives him the ability to inspire everyone around him and give them a reroll (including himself). We also give him the Dual Path mythic feat, and make him a Champion with the Sudden Attack power - this is a swift-action attack that is rolled twice (taking the better), adds his tier to damage (so for now just +1), but most importantly ignores all damage reduction. This is perfect to represent Andurils ability to harm near-invulnerable foes.
And of course we take Anduril as a Legendary Item (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/mythic/mythic-magic-items/legendary-items). I'd give it the Perfect Surge ability - now, he can add 1D8 to any check twice per day, which is great for sticky situations.
Finally, he'd also gain 4 hp, and automatically stabilize on hitting 0 HP. Oh, and several effects are more nasty against non-mythic creatures, so now he has special resilience against those as well.

We could give him Mythic Tier 2 upon becoming King of Gondor, or maybe upon taking command of the army of the dead.
First, this gives him +2 to any one ability score, which is always handy. He'd also get two more surges per day, as well as 4 more hp.
Second, it'd make Anduril even stronger. I'd just give it two extra uses for it's surge ability.
Third, we'd get another path ability. I'd give him Crusader from the Champions abilities - effectively giving him Followers as per Leadership (though no cohort), with the score increased by his tier (so by 2). Better yet, all followers within 100 feet can use a mythic surge once per day, making his army that much stronger.
Finally, he'd gain his tier to Initiative.

Finally we could give him a third mytic tier upon becoming King of Gondor (if he didn't gain it from that already, or if we use some other progression).
Two more Surges, 4 more HP, slightly more initiative, slightly more followers.
One more ability for Anduril. We could make it rejuvenating, which allows him to spend one use of the items surge to heal himself for 30 hitpoints, as a standard action.
One more path ability - but now, we have extra options. A lot of them actually - including the ability to get a domain with the spells as spell-like effects, immunity to fear or disease or curses, or a whole slew of other effects. Or you could turn Anduril into an artifact, giving it more abilities still.
This is also the tier where you get the ability to regain hitpoints supernaturally fast from rest - you're fully healed after 8 hours, but can also regain half your hp and daily uses of non-mythic abilities with just one hour of rest.
And finally, an additional mythic feat is pretty neat too. Honestly there's a ton of options I won't go through now.


And of course, you can make monsters mythic (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/mythic/mythic-monsters) too. This is a great way to give them mythic abilities of all sorts.
Since you can actually make custom artifacts via legendary items - so it's a good start for representing Saurons One Ring. Mythic Force Ring (`http://www.d20pfsrd.com/mythic/mythic-feats/mythic-forge-ring-mythic) is third party, but hey, who's counting at this point?

[gorfnab]

I have just the article for you.

Analyzing Aragon from The Alexandrian D&D: Calibrating Your Expectations (http://thealexandrian.net/wordpress/587/roleplaying-games/dd-calibrating-your-expectations-2)



ANALYZING ARAGORN

So what have we learned so far? Almost everyone you have ever met is a 1st level character. The few exceptional people you’ve met are probably 2nd or 3rd level – they’re canny and experienced and can accomplish things that others find difficult or impossible.

If you know someone who’s 4th level, then you’re privileged to know one of the most talented people around: They’re a professional sports player. Or a brain surgeon. Or a rocket scientist.

If you know someone who’s 5th level, then you have the honor of knowing someone that will probably be written about in history books. Walter Payton. Michael Jordan. Albert Einstein. Isaac Newton. Miyamoto Musashi. William Shakespeare.

So when your D&D character hits 6th level, it means they’re literally superhuman: They are capable of achieving things that no human being has ever been capable of achieving. They have transcended the mortal plane and become a mythic hero.

This requires a shift of perception for some people, but I’ve found it valuable, when crafting my own campaigns, to keep it in mind: Even though the PCs inhabit a world where there are many higher level characters, once they’ve gotten past 5th level or so, they are truly special individuals. They will be noticed. Their accomplishments will be (and should be) things which would enshrine them in the legends of our world. It’s OK for them to excel.

To help put this in further perspective, let me pop another popular canard:

People love to stat up their favorite heroes from fantasy literature as 20th level juggernauts. Fafhrd? 20th level. Elric? 20th level. Conan? 20th level. Aragorn? 20th level Luke Skywalker? 20th level.

I mean, they must be 20th level, right? They’re the biggest, bestest heroes ever! They’re the greatest warriors in a generation! Some of them are reputedly the greatest swordsmen who ever lived in any universe EVAH!

But when you stop and analyze what these characters are actually described as achieving, it’s rare to find anything which actually requires a 20th level build.

Take Aragorn, for example. He’s clearly described as one of the best warriors in Middle Earth. But what do we actually see him do? Let’s take The Fellowship of the Rings as an example:

He leads the hobbits through the wilderness with great skill. (The highest Survival DC in the core rules is DC 15. A 1st level character can master the skill for non-tracking purposes. Aragorn, as a master tracker, would need to be 5th level, have at least one level of ranger, and have spent one of his feats on Skill Focus (Survival) to achieve all of this.)

He drives off the ringwraiths at Weathertop. (It’s difficult to conclude anything from this because it’s one of the more problematic passages in the book when subjected to analysis. If the ringwraiths are truly impervious to harm from any mortal man, why are they scared off by a guy waving two “flaming brands of wood”? Are they vulnerable to fire in a way that they’re not vulnerable to mortal weapons? The point is, the true strength of the ringwraiths is obscure, so it’s impossible to know how tough Aragorn would need to be in order to accomplish this.)

Aragorn treats Frodo’s wound, unsuccessfully. (The highest Heal DC is 15. As with Survival, Aragorn could have mastered this skill at 1st level.

In Moria (fighting orcs): “Legolas shot two through the throat. Gimli hewed the legs from under another that had sprung up on Balin’s tomb. Boromir and Aragorn slew many. When thirteen had fallen the rest fled shrieking, leaving the defenders unharmed, except for Sam who had a scratch along the scalp. A quick duck had saved him; and he had felled his orc: a sturdy thrust with his Barrow-blade. A fire was smouldering in his brown eyes that would have made Ted Sandyman step backwards, if he had seen it. (Aragorn slays no more than six or seven CR 1/2 orcs in this encounter. A trivial accomplishment for a 5th level character.)

Even if you follow Aragorn all the way through The Two Towers and The Return of the King, you’ll find that this is fairly representative of what he accomplishes. The only other notable ping on the radar is his ability to use athelas, and even if we don’t assume that’s merely an example of him knowing athelas’ properties (with a Knowledge (nature) check), it’s still just one ability.

So what can we conclude form this? Aragorn is about 5th level.

And since Aragorn is one of the most remarkable individuals in all of Middle Earth, this would imply that Middle Earth is a place largely like our own world: People who achieve 5th level are uniquely gifted and come along but once in a generation.

Does that seem like a proper description of Middle Earth? It does. Tolkien was crafting a false mythology – a forgotten epoch of our own world. Thus the people in it are much like the people we know, although they live in a world of heroes and magic.

(For the record, I’d probably model Aragorn as a Rgr1/Ftr1/Pal3. That gives you the tracking, lay on hands, and quantifies his ineffable ability to instill courage in those around him. Use one of the feat selections for Skill Focus (Survival) and you’re still left with another three feat selections for the final tweaking.)

Why do people make the mistake of modeling characters like Aragorn as 20th level characters? I think it arises from several factors.

First, there is the assumption that the fictional world of the novel is a typical D&D world. If someone is described as “the best in the world”, therefore, they must be 20th level. Otherwise there would be people better than them and the description wouldn’t be accurate, right? But the reality is that, in Middle Earth, there aren’t any 20th level characters. (At least, none of mortal stature.) Even the most exceptional of the immortal elves are most likely no more than 8th level or so (and that’s pushing it). Gandalf is a demigod cloaked in mortal form and I’d have difficulty statting him up as even a 10th level character.

Second, people can be thrown off by some contortion required by D&D in order to get a very specific set of abilities. A character is described as having one very specific ability that only a 5th level druid can have and is simultaneously described as having another ability that only a 12th level ranger can have, so clearly they must be a 17th level character, right?

Well, no. Authors don’t design their characters around the class progressions of the core D&D classes. Take, for example, a character who can assume an ethereal state without casting a spell. The only way to do that in D&D, using only the core classes, is to be a 19th level monk. But if that’s the only special ability the character in question has, it would be completely nonsensical to model them as a 19th level monk – they don’t have any of the plethora of other abilities such a monk possesses. What you’re looking at is a character with a unique class progression or possibly a prestige class. Or maybe a racial ability.

Finally, you’ll get into an arms race of expectations which just reinforces the whole thing: Aragorn must be 20th level. So the orcs who posed such a challenge to him must be 15th level or higher. And since those were elite 15th level orcs, Aragorn must have been 20th level in order to face them.

[stanprollyright]

Your quintessential Switch-Hitter Ranger:

Ranger 5/Paladin 1

1 Favored Enemy: Goblinoids, EWP: Bastard Sword (human), Power Attack
2 Point Blank Shot (combat style)
3 Endurance (bonus), Cleave
4 Hunter's Bond (allies)
5 Favored Enemy: Undead, Weapon Focus: bastard sword
6 Paladin 1

Ringwraiths are some kind of undead. Plus there's the whole ghost-army thing and Favored Enemy gives you a bonus to Bluff, Knowledge, and Sense Motive checks.

[grarrrg]

That being said - Pathfinder doesn't have Turn Undead, it has Channel Energy.
Ooh, I'd forgotten that. That's why the Cleric I've wanted to play for three years can't be replicated in Pathfinder, actually.

Ummm...
I'll just leave this (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/feats/general-feats/turn-undead--final) and this (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/feats/general-feats/command-undead---final) here...

[Mechalich]

In addition to his levels Aragorn also gets some templates.

One is Numenorean Lineage. Aragorn is not an ordinary human - he lives to be 210, is taller than normal (his canonical height is 6'6"), and is just generally better off than another class of human in Middle-Earth. You could potentially represent that as something like +2 Con, +2 Cha, +2 Will Saves.

Another one he could have is something like Royal Mandate. It is strongly implied in LotR that Aragorn has certain abilities because he's the king - abilities that his fellow Dunedain don't get. That includes his ability to heal people and his authority over the army of the dead, among others. Not sure how you'd want to represent that mechanically though. Maybe a pile of extra skill points or some customs feats.

[Sayt]

I'd probably represent being a Numenorean with True Azlanti as the race: human, but with +2 All stats, instead of any.

[Afgncaap5]

Ummm...
I'll just leave this (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/feats/general-feats/turn-undead--final) and this (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/feats/general-feats/command-undead---final) here...

Thanks, but that's not actually what I need. The Cleric I want to play is an advocate of both Fire and Earth. In 3.5, those domains would give the ability to turn Water and Air creatures while also giving the ability to command Fire and Earth creatures, no feats required. While I admit I've not extensively poured over Pathfinder's material, to date the closest approximation I could find to that was a feat that allowed you to pick a single element and use channel energy to heal or harm outsiders who have that subtype. So for two to four feats (depending on how devoted to the concept I was) I could attack and/or heal elementals of two to four elements. What I actually want, though, is to be able to turn or command the elemental creatures instead of doing/undoing damage to them. I'd also like it to function on any creature with the subtype, not just outsiders with the subtype.

Now, if there's a new feat that's been introduced that allows this, please let me know. I've not checked in a couple years now.