Kenku (lack of) creative spark - What does it mean?

[BiPolar]

Sparked by a discussion on another website, the description of the player race Kenku in Volo's Guide presents an interesting roleplaying problem: the lack of a creative spark.

The curse is explained as "the spark of creativity was torn from their souls" and is followed up with phrases such as these throughout the descriptive text:

"As a result of their lack of creativity, kenku function comfortably as minions of a powerful master."

"They fail at effective planning or crafting long-term schemes"

"Kenku have no ability to invent new ideas or create new things."

"A kenku who learns of clever schemes and plans devised by other creatures can put them to use"

"The Kenku lack the talent to improvise or alter a plan, but a wise Master sets multiple plans in motion at once, confident that underlings can follow orders to the letter."

However, they're also excellent spies, lookouts, bandits and can pursue rediscovering the secrets of flight, magic, etc.

How does someone roleplay a race that seems like it can't participate in planning, scheming or potentially even improvise if a plan goes south?

[Temperjoke]

Well, it's not as difficult as you might think. You know that old adage, "Simpsons did it"? The real truth behind it is that every idea that someone has, someone else has likely already had it. How this works for a Kenku is that while you can't come up with a new idea, you read about a solution in a book for this exact same thing. So, metaOOC you, the player, are being creative, however, your character is just doing what someone else did when they were in this situation. Selective copying replaces creativity for your character.

[War_lord]

Simple, the rest of the party does the planning. Kenku are followers, not leaders.

[BiPolar]

Well, it's not as difficult as you might think. You know that old adage, "Simpsons did it"? The real truth behind it is that every idea that someone has, someone else has likely already had it. How this works for a Kenku is that while you can't come up with a new idea, you read about a solution in a book for this exact same thing. So, metaOOC you, the player, are being creative, however, your character is just doing what someone else did when they were in this situation. Selective copying replaces creativity for your character.

I'm not a fan of the handwaive limitations approach, personally. It's not a bad approach to simplify and given player agency, but it's also a shortcut. A druid could wildshape into whatever Beast they want, but the Wildshape rules require having seen it before. If the DM wants to allow any viable beast for the Druid, then the player saying "oh, i saw that when i was a kid" works. If the DM wants to limit it to what the character has experienced at the table, that's reasonable as well and gives some impetus to explore.


Simple, the rest of the party does the planning. Kenku are followers, not leaders.

This is where I see it going mostly, but that's kind of a bummer for the PC and possibly the player. In addition, when plans go south (and they usually do) the Kenku could become an anchor on the team. Roleplaying could be interesting like that, but it could also be very frustrating for everyone.

[Temperjoke]

I'm not a fan of the handwaive limitations approach, personally. It's not a bad approach to simplify and given player agency, but it's also a shortcut. A druid could wildshape into whatever Beast they want, but the Wildshape rules require having seen it before. If the DM wants to allow any viable beast for the Druid, then the player saying "oh, i saw that when i was a kid" works. If the DM wants to limit it to what the character has experienced at the table, that's reasonable as well and gives some impetus to explore.


But that's something that you and the DM should establish ahead of time. I agree, I'm not a fan of handwaving that much, but at the same time, there are lots of plausible ways to explain how a Kenku knows certain things. For example, a Kenku that is in a situation where they are surrounded by books, such as a cleric or wizard, undoubtedly reads a lot, and training books (or heck even teachers) will always have examples of when to use certain things. Taverns in fantasy are always full of adventurers and other individuals who love telling their stories to audiences (especially audiences who pay for drinks). Bards are always telling tales and songs of the heroes of old. Yes, it's handwaving, but how much depends on your character.

I don't want to segue into a different discussion, but this is part of why fleshing out a background for your character is important, it helps define what they could plausibly know. It's even more important for a character like a Kenku.

EDIT: I'm also not saying that you have to give the complete plan. For one thing, communication is difficult to be precise for a Kenku. But, let's say the party is trying to figure out where to find a certain person, and your character mimes the voice of a tavern keeper, that might give them the idea to ask at the tavern. Right now, I think you're trying to think how you would talk in character, like you would talk to other party members OOC, when it should be more simplified than that.

[gfishfunk]

Alternative, refluff. Now Kenku are extremely creative to the point of foolhardy but don't have adequate language to express these plans to people.

The entirity of the PHB, MM, DMG, and Volos are all suggestive. If you dislike something - especially fluff - change it.

[Jarlhen]

Personally I think the Kenku is a nearly impossible race for anyone to play if you go by what's written. I seriously doubt anyone is able to effectively play a Kenku without tons of hand-waving and almost entirely ignoring what's written. Not having a creative spark is a massive handicap. I can't think of anything more difficult to play. I do know some players that are observers and they enjoy sitting back and kind of just be part of the party. For a player like that it should work as they won't really contribute with many solutions anyways. But for someone who likes to take a more active approach I genuinely can't see how they could play a Kenku.

And the thing with an RP limitation is that you're not supposed to overcome it. You're supposed to use it as an RP hook. As something that defines your character. Same with paladin oaths. They're a strict limitation on your RP. They're also a great RP tool. But if you start treating the RP limitation like a legal document, searching for loopholes, then you've failed. At least in my opinion. Even if you do the hand-waving it means you have to detail the exact situation the solution you heard of was applied. You can't deviate whatsoever, you can't adjust what you heard. You will literally repeat what someone else said. I just don't see how you can overcome that.

[War_lord]

This is where I see it going mostly, but that's kind of a bummer for the PC and possibly the player. In addition, when plans go south (and they usually do) the Kenku could become an anchor on the team. Roleplaying could be interesting like that, but it could also be very frustrating for everyone.

That's just the nature of the Kenku, as a creature they're designed to be Rogues in an urban setting with lots of subterfuge. If it's not that type of game or your in a group that generally looks to you to be the guy who comes up with the plans, you shouldn't roll a Kenku. Like most of the Monster player races, the Kenku is very situational. You have to be in the right type of game with the right kind of players for it to work.

It should be noted however that Kenku can write, read and understand Common and Auran, so you can actually communicate normally with the party so long as you have ink and parchment on you.

[N810]

... Wait, they don't speak common ?
I thought they could imitate any sound they heard,
shouldn't speech be easy for them ?

[MasterMercury]

... Wait, they don't speak common ?
I thought they could imitate any sound they heard,
shouldn't speech be easy for them ?

They can imitate, but can't make their own sentences.
The closest thing would probably be something like Bumblebee from the Transformers movies, using random audio clips from the radio to communicate.

[War_lord]

... Wait, they don't speak common ?
I thought they could imitate any sound they heard,
shouldn't speech be easy for them ?

They can imitate sentences exactly as they heard them, they're not creative enough to string that into a working language due to the curse, it's just sounds to them. From the guide, on how a player should communicate as a Kenku:


Snapper makes the noise of a hammer slowly and rhythmically tapping a stone to show how bored he is. He plays with his dagger and studies the Lords' Alliance agent sitting at the bar.

[Temperjoke]

... Wait, they don't speak common ?
I thought they could imitate any sound they heard,
shouldn't speech be easy for them ?

Not necessarily, we speak because we can formulate all the words and sentences directly. Kenku would have to mentally search through a mental sound archive for the sounds of each individual word being said by all the various people they've heard, mentally string all of those sounds together in hopes of forming a intelligible sentence.

Much easier to hold up a damaged weapon to a blacksmith and make the pinging sound of a hammer hitting metal, instead of trying to ask for his weapon to be repaired.

[CursedRhubarb]

Kenku can be fun but, yeah, they can (ironically) take some planning before diving into them.

I've found a good way to wrap my mind around their curse is to think of them as a program or a machine. They can not make their own programming but when given programming they can execute it practically flawlessly. The downside is you have to go in and look at what you want to accomplish and figure a way for it to work with a bunch of; IF, AND, OR, NOR, XOR, XNOR programming type orders.

For example, let's take a Kenku martial type like a Fighter or Barbarian. On their own they can defend themselves with a weapon just fine, but have them train with a master swordsman that can show them how to use a weapon and goes into detail of fighting styles like; if they to x, then do y; but for almost any situation or type of attacks. Then they will be able to copy the moves of the Master Swordsman almost exactly and be able to fight with the same moves. The lack of muscle memory makes the gap but as they grow stronger the Kenku would become equal to the Swordmaster in those moves.

A slower way would be to watch Glatiator Games and the Kenku can learn to fight in various environments and against many types or number of foes.

Confusion can come from thinking lack of creativity means they aren't smart. They can be crazy smart, they just have to filter things differently.

About not being able to adjust plans on the fly; they can't go in with a single plan and adapt if things start to go wrong, but they can go in with a main plan and multiple "If this happens, then do this" plans and switch when criteria is met. Using Basic programming logic you can craft a multiplane monstrosity to cover all bases you can think of, but it must be done before the Kenku begins the plan. They can always ask the dreaded "what if" question if they think there might be a hole or a situation left out.

So with enough micro plans a Kenku could appear to be creative and adapting on the go. But this will take a while so observing everything you can, reading whatever they can, and asking questions as often as possible will let them broaden what they can do. To start, you might not be able to do many things, but after adventuring with a party, if you were watching and listening to them, then you will be able to apply what they've done or said to your needs.

[War_lord]

Oddly enough the way the Kenku mentality is described reminds me of my own Asperger syndrome. I wonder how intentional the parallels are?

[CaptainSarathai]

Kenku can be fun but, yeah, they can (ironically) take some planning before diving into them.

I've found a good way to wrap my mind around their curse is to think of them as a program or a machine. They can not make their own programming but when given programming they can execute it practically flawlessly. The downside is you have to go in and look at what you want to accomplish and figure a way for it to work with a bunch of; IF, AND, OR, NOR, XOR, XNOR programming type orders.

For example, let's take a Kenku martial type like a Fighter or Barbarian. On their own they can defend themselves with a weapon just fine, but have them train with a master swordsman that can show them how to use a weapon and goes into detail of fighting styles like; if they to x, then do y; but for almost any situation or type of attacks. Then they will be able to copy the moves of the Master Swordsman almost exactly and be able to fight with the same moves. The lack of muscle memory makes the gap but as they grow stronger the Kenku would become equal to the Swordmaster in those moves.

A slower way would be to watch Glatiator Games and the Kenku can learn to fight in various environments and against many types or number of foes.

Confusion can come from thinking lack of creativity means they aren't smart. They can be crazy smart, they just have to filter things differently.

About not being able to adjust plans on the fly; they can't go in with a single plan and adapt if things start to go wrong, but they can go in with a main plan and multiple "If this happens, then do this" plans and switch when criteria is met. Using Basic programming logic you can craft a multiplane monstrosity to cover all bases you can think of, but it must be done before the Kenku begins the plan. They can always ask the dreaded "what if" question if they think there might be a hole or a situation left out.

So with enough micro plans a Kenku could appear to be creative and adapting on the go. But this will take a while so observing everything you can, reading whatever they can, and asking questions as often as possible will let them broaden what they can do. To start, you might not be able to do many things, but after adventuring with a party, if you were watching and listening to them, then you will be able to apply what they've done or said to your needs.

Exactly, and to an extent, this is where Backgrounds for a Kenku become really important - to the point that anyone who doesn't use backgrounds or doesn't allow a background to handwaive certain things is really making Kenku an unplayable race.

If you were playing a Martial kenku, for example, you'd probably want the Soldier background. Arcane/Casters probably want Acolyte or something. Rogues go Criminal, Charlatan, maybe even Urchin. The idea is that you've already been trained for the things that your Kenku will be doing.

In as inoffensive manner as possible, I kind of see them like "Rain Man" characters. You could have a Kenku who is literally the best thief in the world. They learn fast, extremely fast, but only through demonstration. So that Kenku thief can probably pick locks by the time he gets the party, and is probably amazing at it, because he's already seen locks, witnessed lockpicking, and learned everything that it took a master thief a lifetime to master just from watching the guy work a few times. However, if you presented that Kenku with a kind of lock he's never seen before, he's going to be totally useless.

You could do a lot with that, RP-wise. Imagine a Kenku who was a Soldier in some kind of horrible war. If his "soldier senses" start tingling, he's going to launch an assault without mercy - no quarter, no prisoners. He doesn't know that drawing a blade in an inn is something that people do sometimes. To the Kenku, drawing a sword in the chow-hall is entirely forbidden, he's never seen this, and anyone who does this must clearly be an enemy.
Enemies get killed without question or mercy

Or you get a scene like the "my suit is black" joke in 'Borat'. The Kenku knows one joke. He doesn't understand the joke. He doesn't understand why it's funny. So he just wanders around and any time he sees a suit;
"That suit is black. NOT!"
And then probably mimics the sound of laughter. Even if it's the Emperor's suit, even if he's on trial for making the joke 1 too many times already. To the Kenku,
If [suit] : then [joke]

[Mith]

I realize my idea doesn’t work as written, as I do not like the idea of "lack of creativity" when they are based on birds reknown for their cleverness and initiative.

I like the idea that Kenku can read and speak languages they know through mimicry/forgary, but that a Kenku community actually collects and remembers details.

Kenku would be great adaptation for a court transcript keeper. Combine the with a Pen of Dictation, and you are gold.

[Sigreid]

Take the History skill. It's an excellent justification for having heard an idea before.

More seriously, there really aren't that many ideas, strategies and tactics that are truly new or innovative.

[Cespenar]

Wouldn't "creativity" logically include stuff like deduction and induction?

[Temperjoke]

Wouldn't "creativity" logically include stuff like deduction and induction?

Yes and no. It depends on what it's based on. For example, the Kenku observed a person handing a copper to a street vendor, and receiving a bag of nuts. Thus he knows that if he hands a copper to the vendor, he will receive a bag of nuts. It would take creativity to know that, vendors in general give goods in exchange for currency.

So when a Kenku gets to a new town, it would be in-character to spend hours wandering and observing people to know who sells what. This can be skipped if the Kenku has copied a voice asking for a particular vendor, or a way to make a sound that signifies that vendor (like a blacksmith hammering metal). They also know how to read and write, so they can learn. Their creativity and speaking were taken away, but the two are not directly connected, so the Kenku could write what he needs, or read written signs.

[Herobizkit]

With today's technology, making a character who communicates in sound bites would be feasible and HILARIOUS if done well - appropriately and hilariously annoying if done poorly.

Maybe the Kenku can swap fluff with the Warforged...? ^_^