Fog Cloud for a sorc?

[Dalebert]

What are your thoughts? Is it worth one of my limited and precious "spells known" slots?

My general thought is when there's something really scary, I can disappear into it between turns for cover, just coming out to blast a bit, then go back in. It seems especially nice when gaze attacks are involved and when casters have spells that require LoS.

I took Careful Spell and Twinning. I just got my first 3rd level spell and chose Hypnotic Pattern. Deciding whether to swap Fog Cloud for Lightning Bolt. I don't really have a big dmg spell currently and dmg is not especially a thing for this character. (he doesn't do fireball for personal reasons)

Thoughts?

[Kileonhardt]

What are your thoughts? Is it worth one of my limited and precious "spells known" slots?

My general thought is when there's something really scary, I can disappear into it between turns for cover, just coming out to blast a bit, then go back in. It seems especially nice when gaze attacks are involved and when casters have spells that require LoS.

I took Careful Spell and Twinning. I just got my first 3rd level spell and chose Hypnotic Pattern. Deciding whether to swap Fog Cloud for Lightning Bolt. I don't really have a big dmg spell currently and dmg is not especially a thing for this character. (he doesn't do fireball for personal reasons)

Thoughts?

I don't think it's worth the spells known slot nor your concentration on a sorc. Positioning alone can cover the benefits fog cloud can give you and concentration is usually better spent on twinning haste for your party or a better area control spell.

Stinking cloud is a great alternative for denying enemy casters/archers sight + chance to poison them.

[Jerrykhor]

What are your thoughts? Is it worth one of my limited and precious "spells known" slots?

My general thought is when there's something really scary, I can disappear into it between turns for cover, just coming out to blast a bit, then go back in. It seems especially nice when gaze attacks are involved and when casters have spells that require LoS.

I took Careful Spell and Twinning. I just got my first 3rd level spell and chose Hypnotic Pattern. Deciding whether to swap Fog Cloud for Lightning Bolt. I don't really have a big dmg spell currently and dmg is not especially a thing for this character. (he doesn't do fireball for personal reasons)

Thoughts?

Counterspell is a good one.

[JellyPooga]

Do you think Darkness is a valid choice for a Sorcerer? If yes, then Fog Cloud definitely is, because it's better in almost every respect.

As far as "spells that create an area of concealment" go, Fog Cloud is one of the most efficient as far as spell slot investment, duration and area go. It's also got some glaring weaknesses, like being dispersed by wind, but on the whole it's a pretty good spell for unsubtle stealth (not quite the oxymoron it sounds), running away, debuffing a whole heap of mooks and (best of all) some pretty badass gothic-horror SFX :smallwink:

It's not the best combat spell, but with a little creativity it can be a solid low-level backup/utility spell.

edit: Oh and if you upcast it, it scales really well.

[Kane0]

Its alright. If it doesn't perform well enough for you, maybe trade it in for Web or Stinking Cloud later on?

[Dalebert]

It's great if anyone has blindsight. At this level, that's usually just druids but they love it. Of course, druids can cast it too though.

I already have Web. If you take Careful. you just gotta take Web. And it's already been really useful. In tonight's game, I cast it in three battles and it was great. I can auto-save myself for Web and use it for protection a little bit, but only for melee; not ranged.

It does appear fairly versatile and it is cheap. I can certainly see often wanting my concentration for other spells, but when I really need to not be seen (lots of ranged attackers, gaze attacks, casters), it seems nice.

I'm not sure I can justify Counterspell for a sorcerer. I'm not especially good at it and my spells known slots are just so precious. My arcana sucks if a DM uses that to determine what a spell is so I'd be firing blind. I know many people see it as a staple, but sorcerers can't afford all the "staples" and have much flavor left. I've already got Shield and Misty Step because they feel like requirements.

[Tanarii]

It depends on a bunch of things:
Are you playing a CaW or CaS game?
How often do you have to retreat?
How often do you fight in (relatively) open terrain?
Are you a melee heavy or missile heavy party?
Are your opponents more frequently melee heavy or missile heavy?

[Dalebert]

It depends on a bunch of things:
Are you playing a CaW or CaS game?
How often do you have to retreat?
How often do you fight in (relatively) open terrain?
Are you a melee heavy or missile heavy party?
Are your opponents more frequently melee heavy or missile heavy?

It's AL so practically all those things can change from game to game. That's the thing. If I knew there was going to be a druid in the party on a regular basis, I might just encourage them to prepare it. I have to figure that sometimes there will be and sometimes not.

[Tanarii]

It's AL so practically all those things can change from game to game. That's the thing. If I knew there was going to be a druid in the party on a regular basis, I might just encourage them to prepare it. I have to figure that sometimes there will be and sometimes not.Ah yeah that's tougher. Fog Cloud is a good spell. But IMX a fairly common one among Druids, Wizards (including ATs & EKs), and even Rangers. So yeah, it's definitely a risk of overlap for a Sorcerer to choose it.

Really it comes down to: How often will you use it vs how often do you think you'll use Lightning Bolt, especially given you have Careful Spell for the latter. Taking into account that Lightning Bolt competes for your (very limited) 3rd level slots with Hypnotic Pattern. OTOH Fog Cloud competes with Shield.

[Joe the Rat]

If you are seriously using it on a semi-regular basis, and it is being effective, and you aren't getting complaints from anyone, keep it.

I have a MC sorcerer that has it, mostly because his other half (well 3/4) is rogue, and it makes for quick concealment (to reposition, or reach adjacent cover). Frankly, I think he just wanted it to cover his 10' of flight (storm sorcerer).

[Dalebert]

My sorc is still pretty young so it's hard to say yet if he's getting a lot of out of it. I have used it in one (sort of) beholder encounter. The last fight I used it in, it didn't seem to matter as the tanks seemed to keep the enemies pretty well occupied. Plus I got teleported to the Astral plane for a round right after casting it. We were fighting mostly dumb beasts that game so I got a lot of use out of Careful Web.

It does seem like a lot of AL DMs are a little lazy with maps and terrain and so there are a lot of fights that happen on just a big map with no cover. Against intelligent enemies, I can imagine them targeting casters with ranged attacks or spells and having cover on demand seems very handy for that.

Honestly, it feels a little niche so far and I haven't cast it a lot, but I expect more intelligent enemies and casters going forwrd. he just became tier 2. I'm also recalling a lot of either gaze attacks or effects that require an enemy being able to see you from various AL adventures I've played with other characters.

[BW022]

I will say a definite... Yes.

All casters (especially squishy ones) should have some type of 'get out of jail' or large 'nerf' spell. Sometime over your adventuring career things will go horribly wrong. The party will take damage, they are surprised, etc. and you need to escape, regroup, spend rounds healing, etc. Fog cloud is a great spell for this. It can cover an escape, buy a couple of rounds to heal or put up defensive spells, to nerf ranged heavy attackers at the rear, it causes confusion in groups, etc. A round or two can be more than enough to pull back to a better position, to re-deploy yourselves into better positions, etc. It also non-lethal, so you could use it to quell a bar brawl. It can provide concealment during an attack, so you could put it in a bridge covered by orc archers which you need to run across. It could be used to prevent enemies from easily running away.

I've seen a sorcerer use it. It also functions remarkably well at high levels, especially considering it is only a first level slots.

Definitely a solid choice, even if you hope you don't have to use it as a 'get out of jail' spell. The only time I wouldn't consider taking it would be if another party member could prepare it. A wizard, cleric, or druid typically knows more spells and preparing it doesn't cost them as much.