Need Advice to Kill Boss

[kyle2270]

My first post, I will ask for forgiveness up front for any mistakes I may make. Please bear with me.
Need advice on killing the Boss, (actually 2nd in command) He has a magic item that sucks up spells cast upon him, at least 75 levels, he has another magic item that sucks up any hp that is dealt to him, 100+. We fought him once and this is how I know. And to top it off, not sure what it is but he was dead but did not have his soul in him and is now back. He pretty much cut up a 30th level fighter into 5 pieces in one attack at another encounter we witnessed at lower levels.
My group consists of Cleric 20th lvl, druid 23 lvl, wizard 14, paladin 13, monk 13, dwarven fighter 23, Rogue/Sorcerer 10/13.
We pretty much play core spells in 3.5 rule set.
Keep in mind, I am fairly new to this game played 25 yrs ago. I have never been this high level.
The question is what is best course of action to slay him if and when he is confronted face to face. Is it cast anti-magic field and just gang tackle to eliminate those powerful magic items??
Thanks ahead of time for any and all advice given

[Eldariel]

75 levels? That sounds excessive. Then again, without epic rules that doesn't really amount to much more than bigger numbers. That level spread in the party is also quite ridiculous. Either way, items like that tend to have limits on how many spell levels/HP they can drain. Most items can be disabled through the use of targeted Dispel Magic so disabling them would be an option for killing him. Note, targeting the item not the caster means the spell won't be absorbed, at least by a default Rod of Absorption. Trying to get them into an Antimagic Field might work too - however, there are numerous ways for them to avoid that. However, it might be the items are above and beyond that power level - if the enemy is really level 75, owning such artifacts would be to be expected.

Sadly you lack level 9 arcane spells. Perhaps you could get a Simulacrum of some sufficiently powerful Dragon or whatever to acquire those? Disjunction is a convenient way to get rid of any non-epic buffs. Then Dispels to disable the protective items and then just send your Gated monsters to rip it apart. Shapechange, Disjunction, Gate, Miracle, Simulacrum and Planar Binding should give you the necessary tools.

[Inevitability]

If this enemy is a melee character, there's a ton of ways to incapacitate him without actually fighting him.

For one, a Forcecage doesn't actually target him yet imprisons him for over a day (assuming the wizard casts it). If the villain still needs to breathe, the air within the cage should run out eventually. It doesn't even allow a save or SR!

[kyle2270]

If this enemy is a melee character, there's a ton of ways to incapacitate him without actually fighting him.

For one, a Forcecage doesn't actually target him yet imprisons him for over a day (assuming the wizard casts it). If the villain still needs to breathe, the air within the cage should run out eventually. It doesn't even allow a save or SR!


Can one teleport, DD, gate, plane shift out of a force cage??

[Eldariel]

Can one teleport, DD, gate, plane shift out of a force cage??

Yes, but not with the standard issue Time Stop > Forcecage + Dimensional Lock. That also removes any chances of responding to it. However, Forcecage is vulnerable to any number of magical effects and items as is Dimensional Lock.

[kyle2270]

75 levels? That sounds excessive. Then again, without epic rules that doesn't really amount to much more than bigger numbers. That level spread in the party is also quite ridiculous. Either way, items like that tend to have limits on how many spell levels/HP they can drain. Most items can be disabled through the use of targeted Dispel Magic so disabling them would be an option for killing him. Note, targeting the item not the caster means the spell won't be absorbed, at least by a default Rod of Absorption. Trying to get them into an Antimagic Field might work too - however, there are numerous ways for them to avoid that. However, it might be the items are above and beyond that power level - if the enemy is really level 75, owning such artifacts would be to be expected.

Sadly you lack level 9 arcane spells. Perhaps you could get a Simulacrum of some sufficiently powerful Dragon or whatever to acquire those? Disjunction is a convenient way to get rid of any non-epic buffs. Then Dispels to disable the protective items and then just send your Gated monsters to rip it apart. Shapechange, Disjunction, Gate, Miracle, Simulacrum and Planar Binding should give you the necessary tools.

Thanks for the info. Is it possible for wizard to cast disjunction scroll at her level??

[Inevitability]

Thanks for the info. Is it possible for wizard to cast disjunction scroll at her level??

It is, assuming she's got 19 intelligence and can make a DC 18 caster level check.

[Bad Wolf]

Chain gate solars. Use a gate spell to summon Asmodeus or Demogorgon. They don't have to go through the gate, but they'll probably be mad at being annoyed and kill everything around them. Or summon the Tarrasque and lure it over with food or something.

Get a Parrot that constantly screams 'Orcus', if that still works.

Summon Pazuzu and have fun.

[kyle2270]

Chain gate solars. Use a gate spell to summon Asmodeus or Demogorgon. They don't have to go through the gate, but they'll probably be mad at being annoyed and kill everything around them. Or summon the Tarrasque and lure it over with food or something.

Get a Parrot that constantly screams 'Orcus', if that still works.

Summon Pazuzu and have fun.



There is a war going on in the heavens so I am not sure if DM would go for us calling on a Solar. Asmodeus would probably high 5 the guy then kill us.
The parrot maybe better off screaming "omaha".

[Vizzerdrix]

If this enemy is a melee character, there's a ton of ways to incapacitate him without actually fighting him.

For one, a Forcecage doesn't actually target him yet imprisons him for over a day (assuming the wizard casts it). If the villain still needs to breathe, the air within the cage should run out eventually. It doesn't even allow a save or SR!

The space inside is less than or equal to that of a bag of holding so it should take about 10 mins for the air to run out.

May be you could:
Steal his goodies during combat.
Atempt to sunder them.
Try lots of poison.
Charm a few rust monsters into helping you.
Obtain some templates for your weaker members.
Summon a minion and have it read a book filled with explosive runes next to him.
Summon a minion and have it stick a portable hole into a handy haversack next to him.
Fill a book full of exploding runes, toss in into the bbegs square, and fail at dispelling it.

[Calthropstu]

The space inside is less than or equal to that of a bag of holding so it should take about 10 mins for the air to run out.

May be you could:
Steal his goodies during combat.
Atempt to sunder them.
Try lots of poison.
Charm a few rust monsters into helping you.
Obtain some templates for your weaker members.
Summon a minion and have it read a book filled with explosive runes next to him.
Summon a minion and have it stick a portable hole into a handy haversack next to him.
Fill a book full of exploding runes, toss in into the bbegs square, and fail at dispelling it.

The book would have to be immune to fire. The first triggering of the runes destroys the work otherwise and no more can be triggered.

[Inevitability]

The book would have to be immune to fire. The first triggering of the runes destroys the work otherwise and no more can be triggered.

1. Explosive Runes deals force damage, not fire.

2. The usual way to detonate a book involves all runes being triggered at exactly the same time.

[Calthropstu]

1. Explosive Runes deals force damage, not fire.

2. The usual way to detonate a book involves all runes being triggered at exactly the same time.

Which can't work. No matter what you do, unless you have different people read the book at different spots all simultaneously (which is impossible thanks to how turn order works via RAW), one will trigger and destroy the book before the rest can trigger. I thought it dealt fire damage, but you are correct it is force.

Which means that book is screwed the moment someone reads the first explosive rune.

Edit: now if you could put a timed delay on it like delayed blast fireball, that's another story.

[Inevitability]

Which can't work. No matter what you do, unless you have different people read the book at different spots all simultaneously (which is impossible thanks to how turn order works via RAW), one will trigger and destroy the book before the rest can trigger. I thought it dealt fire damage, but you are correct it is force.

Which means that book is screwed the moment someone reads the first explosive rune.

Edit: now if you could put a timed delay on it like delayed blast fireball, that's another story.

The 'usual way to detonate' I was talking about involves an area dispel, which attempts to dispel all runes at the same time, therefore triggering all it fails to dispel simultaneously.

[Eldariel]

Which can't work. No matter what you do, unless you have different people read the book at different spots all simultaneously (which is impossible thanks to how turn order works via RAW), one will trigger and destroy the book before the rest can trigger. I thought it dealt fire damage, but you are correct it is force.

Which means that book is screwed the moment someone reads the first explosive rune.

Edit: now if you could put a timed delay on it like delayed blast fireball, that's another story.

Explosive Runes don't only trigger when read, they also trigger when someone attempts to Dispel them and fails. That's what's being used here.

[Calthropstu]

Explosive Runes don't only trigger when read, they also trigger when someone attempts to Dispel them and fails. That's what's being used here.


For each creature within the area that is the subject of one or more spells, you make a dispel check against the spell with the highest caster level. If that check fails, you make dispel checks against progressively weaker spells until you dispel one spell (which discharges the dispel magic spell so far as that target is concerned) or until you fail all your checks. The creature’s magic items are not affected.

For each object within the area that is the target of one or more spells, you make dispel checks as with creatures. Magic items are not affected by an area dispel.

Even area dispel only gets one.

I suppose you could have a large number of separate castings on a large number of separate objects, but you would need to throw each item individually.

Edit: you would have to hit the book with a targeted dispel, not an area. Hmmm.

Looking at it closer, a targeted dispel on the book would get each one, but it does not look like it is simultaneous, rather a series of progressive checks. That I guess is up for debate. Personally, I don't allow cheese, and this smells like cheese. The moment the object was destroyed the dispel would stop trying to work because the magic would be gone.

Also, if YOU were the one that cast the explosive runes in the first place, I would say your dispel checks are all automatically effective. In short: either you succeed on all the checks or trigger the book once. At least the way I am reading this.

[Inevitability]

Even area dispel only gets one.

I suppose you could have a large number of separate castings on a large number of separate objects, but you would need to throw each item individually.

Edit: you would have to hit the book with a targeted dispel, not an area. Hmmm.

Looking at it closer, a targeted dispel on the book would get each one, but it does not look like it is simultaneous, rather a series of progressive checks. That I guess is up for debate. Personally, I don't allow cheese, and this smells like cheese. The moment the object was destroyed the dispel would stop trying to work because the magic would be gone.

Also, if YOU were the one that cast the explosive runes in the first place, I would say your dispel checks are all automatically effective. In short: either you succeed on all the checks or trigger the book once. At least the way I am reading this.

The fact that rolls are separate doesn't mean the things they represent are. Even if two people ready attacks to trigger off the same event, they won't be rolling their attacks at the exact same time, will they?