Half-Black Dragon Half-Iron Golem War Troll?

[danielxcutter]

I read somewhere on TvTropes that the titular monster - a War Troll with the Half-Golem(Iron Golem) and Half-Dragon(Black Dragon) templates is a game breaker. I think this is because the templates grant immunity to the two main ways to negate a War Troll's regeneration - fire and acid - but I could be wrong. And even if I'm not, are there any real benefits to applying those templates besides "u cant kill me lmao"? What would it's stats be, anyway?

Btw, are there any ways to do something similar with other monsters? I hear that Fire Giant Skeletons are immune to fire and cold damage, but that's about it.

[danielxcutter]

Bump. Nothing?

[Swaoeaeieu]

just take it even further, unstoppable killing machines! (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?101587-D-amp-D-3-5-The-Emerald-Legion-Mass-Producing-Ikea-Tarrasques)

[Naez]

War trolls are only vulnerable to Acid.

"Unlike with their lesser cousins, acid (not fire) deals normal damage to a war troll."

You only need the half-dragon. the half golem is pretty wasted and makes it slower, lowers its AC, and makes it vulnerable to rust. The only thing you really get out if it is magic immunity but seeing as war trolls have built in SR that seems unnecessary to me, and there are tons of spells that don't allow for spell resist.

[Inevitability]

just take it even further, unstoppable killing machines! (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?101587-D-amp-D-3-5-The-Emerald-Legion-Mass-Producing-Ikea-Tarrasques)

Beat me to it.

Seriously though, read this. It's a great resource.

[The Glyphstone]

War trolls are only vulnerable to Acid.

"Unlike with their lesser cousins, acid (not fire) deals normal damage to a war troll."

You only need the half-dragon. the half golem is pretty wasted and makes it slower, lowers its AC, and makes it vulnerable to rust. The only thing you really get out if it is magic immunity but seeing as war trolls have built in SR that seems unnecessary to me, and there are tons of spells that don't allow for spell resist.

The magic immunity protects it from stuff like the Greymantle spell, which would shut off the regen. SR is not a reliable defense at higher levels, so if you can get outright Magical Immunity (especially the Half-Golem text version), it shields you from a great deal of stuff.

[Remuko]

I assumed the half golem template was there for immunity to non-lethal damage. half black dragon gives immunity to acid making everything non-lethal then half golem makes you immune to non-lethal, making you 100% immune to damage period.

[Naez]

I assumed the half golem template was there for immunity to non-lethal damage. half black dragon gives immunity to acid making everything non-lethal then half golem makes you immune to non-lethal, making you 100% immune to damage period.
The half golem only gains the non-lethal damage immunity if it fails the will save and becomes a construct. however doing so would give it a con of -, meaning it no longer has regeneration.

[danielxcutter]

So I take it that the titular monster is pretty much unkillable sans very specific methods?

[unseenmage]

The half golem only gains the non-lethal damage immunity if it fails the will save and becomes a construct. however doing so would give it a con of -, meaning it no longer has regeneration.

Where exactly do the rules take Regen off of creatures with Con "--"?
I'd never heard that before.

[The Glyphstone]

Where exactly do the rules take Regen off of creatures with Con "--"?
I'd never heard that before.


From the SRD:

Regeneration

-Creatures with this extraordinary ability recover from wounds quickly and can even regrow or reattach severed body parts. Damage dealt to the creature is treated as nonlethal damage, and the creature automatically cures itself of nonlethal damage at a fixed rate per round, as given in the creature’s entry.
-Certain attack forms, typically fire and acid, deal damage to the creature normally; that sort of damage doesn’t convert to nonlethal damage and so doesn’t go away. The creature’s description includes the details. A regenerating creature that has been rendered unconscious through nonlethal damage can be killed with a coup de grace. The attack cannot be of a type that automatically converts to nonlethal damage.
-Creatures with regeneration can regrow lost portions of their bodies and can reattach severed limbs or body parts. Severed parts die if they are not reattached.
-Regeneration does not restore hit points lost from starvation, thirst, or suffocation.
-Attack forms that don’t deal hit point damage ignore regeneration
-An attack that can cause instant death only threatens the creature with death if it is delivered by weapons that deal it lethal damage.
-A creature must have a Constitution score to have the regeneration ability.

They can have Fast Healing, but no Regeneration.

[unseenmage]

From the SRD:


They can have Fast Healing, but no Regeneration.

Thank you. Was news to me.

[torrasque666]

Where exactly do the rules take Regen off of creatures with Con "--"?
I'd never heard that before.
Last line of the ability definition in the glossary, MM1 page 314.

[Inevitability]

So I take it that the titular monster is pretty much unkillable sans very specific methods?

Pretty much. There are some ways, but getting those should be an adventure in itself.

Of course, that doesn't mean the legion can't be stopped. Forcecage still takes them out for several hours, and works even against the ones wearing antimagic shackles. In fact, the ones wearing antimagic shackles are probably the better targets for such a strategy, as they can't rely on their mind flayer masters to break them out.

[danielxcutter]

Pretty much. There are some ways, but getting those should be an adventure in itself.

Of course, that doesn't mean the legion can't be stopped. Forcecage still takes them out for several hours, and works even against the ones wearing antimagic shackles. In fact, the ones wearing antimagic shackles are probably the better targets for such a strategy, as they can't rely on their mind flayer masters to break them out.

So, what ways are the ones you mentioned?

And what about the original templated monster I mentioned in the OP? Is it pretty much the same or does it have some differences?

And finally, where can I find the Half-Golem template again? AFB right now.

[Inevitability]

So, what ways are the ones you mentioned?

And what about the original templated monster I mentioned in the OP? Is it pretty much the same or does it have some differences?

And finally, where can I find the Half-Golem template again? AFB right now.

They're listed in the linked post. It's stuff like sending a sphere of annihilation towards them, removing their regeneration with a supernatural Graymantle or Trait Removal. Note that these spells must be somehow made supernatural (Dweomerkeeper is the usual way, I believe) as normal versions of the magic will always fail against them.

Even then, their mind flayer masters could just intervene. A Sphere of Annihilation could be countered with a Gate, for example.


The original templated monster is mostly far more simple. The emerald legion starts with half-clay golem war trolls, then proceeds to fill their heads with psionic slime, infect them with lycanthropy, make them breed with their undead kin and some more fun stuff. This makes them immune to a ton of other things, including all damage ever and almost all spells.

Half-Golem is in MM2.

[danielxcutter]

Looked up the Half-Golem template up on the internet and... What? No LA?! How - what in the nine hells?

[Inevitability]

Looked up the Half-Golem template up on the internet and... What? No LA?! How - what in the nine hells?

The MM2 update booklet gave them a LA of —.

On the other hand, the LA — only seems to apply to the original four half-golems. I guess the other ones are playable?

[torrasque666]

The MM2 update booklet gave them a LA of —.

On the other hand, the LA — only seems to apply to the original four half-golems. I guess the other ones are playable?

Should be noted that it said to apply those to the sample characters. The ones that had failed their will saves, as noted in the descriptions.

[erasedisknow]

By common logic, there's no troll left, so the whole thing is moot, anyways.

[The Glyphstone]

By common logic, there's no troll left, so the whole thing is moot, anyways.

Common logic got ejected to the curb to sit and cry long ago.

[danielxcutter]

By common logic, there's no troll left, so the whole thing is moot, anyways.


Common logic got ejected to the curb to sit and cry long ago.

Actually, Half-Golems are just creatures that have replaced one or more limbs with golem parts.

...Wait, were you just kidding?

[Inevitability]

By common logic, there's no troll left, so the whole thing is moot, anyways.

Not if the child's born using this (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mitochondrial_replacement_therapy) technique!