V and her genre Battle :)

[Demitel]

Well i believe V is a woman..If u check script 122 they are talking about these 2 gemstones with Haley...And everyone misunderstands..Meaning they already know she is a woman.Still its not clear :(.So i would like some help on what do u guys think..?

PS. I love V when she starts explaining xD

[Scarab83]

V isn't in comic 122.

[Demitel]

V isn't in comic 122.

my bad.i meant 123 :p.

[Voodzik]

I've always been a flip flopper when it comes to V. I guess I kind of want him to be a girl, but it's not like I'd flip out.

And it's also totally certain that the group has no idea what gender varsuvious is. I don't know numbers, but during the lizard incident Belkar, if you'll remember, tried to figure it out by looking at V's lizard genitals, but failed.

Hey, I just used Likard Genitals in a serious sentence.:smallbiggrin:

[Scarab83]

I've always seen V as masculine. A very masculine hermaphrodite.

[Constantinople]

Genre? What, can't you decide if s/he's fantasy or not? Perhaps s/he's horror or romance? :smallyuk:

"Gender".

[Emperor Ing]

female, no man does their hair like that :smallyuk:

[Heavenfall]

Great... now I can't stop thinking about it.

Either way, V certainly is a-sexual.

[I'm da Rogue!]

Why I think V's a "he"

-If s/he's a woman, why isn't he called Vaarsuvia? Vaarsuvius is a male name, isn't it?

-In the strip where V became an elf again and was hiding naked behind the dragon's tail, s/he may look female because his/her hair are different. But looking at the body carefully, it's not a female body.

But:
.......I think Belkar knows about V. By the scent, yes. If this is true, then:

-Belkar knows that V's a guy and pretends he doesn't know, to make his life hard just as he did when Roy was a woman. But that's too much even for the chaotic halfling to keep it secret.

-Belkar know V's a woman and likes that "I hate you/ you hate me" affair. They do their best making each other suffer. It's hot.
Remember when Belkar kissed V? He was really drunk, and that's the only way he could express his feelings. There's no way he'd do that if he knew V was male.

For that reasons, I think there's great possibility that V's a woman.



female, no man does their hair like that :smallyuk:

-Elves have different taste :smalltongue:

[AslanCross]

V's theory is that Belkar's brain is so primitive that he can only experience two emotions: lust and hate. Since V saved Belkar's life and Belkar could not lust him, he was trying to repress it until the alcohol that fateful New Year's eve removed his inhibitions and caused the lust to come out. I totally think V's a guy.

Also I agree with the Vaarsuvius/Vaarsuvia thing.

[Emperor Ing]

The whole alcohol thing, its very well known that when drunk, you tend to romance anything that moves, so v's gender has little or nothing to do with that

and im still convinced that even elven guys dont do their hair like that.

[Capt'n Ironbrow]

Gender doesn't really seem to matter to Vaarsuvius... but I do think it's female, despite it's masculine name... why does it always shared tavern rooms with Haley? Because she's the other lady in the party... albeit not very distinctly so...
Maybe she makes sure her gender remains unknown so she doesn't get hit on or get treated differently because she's a woman? She's a wizard first and foremost and with her arcane powers, gender becomes trivial.

[RAGE KING!]

I dont know. I dont care. V is fine the way 'e is, and i dont see any reason for that to change. Sure i wonder, but i dont really care that much. There's enough argument for both sides. And in the tavern room, they were interested for the obvious reason, and also 'cuz it revealed V's gender.

In text, dont call V it. Call V, V. Or call V 'e. Which is the dwarven accent version of either he or she.

[Regneva]

Judging by the facts that He/She didn't recognize Roy changing gender, OR didn't care what gender the oracle was. I'm pretty sure V hirself does not have any idea about hir gender.

How can WE, a pile of mere forum threading weasels, opening new threads about V day after day, ever HOPE to understand or even comprehend the obscure puzzle of finding out V's true gender, while the greatest arcane masterminds of our time and the bearer of magnificent knowledge that is V, avoids dwelling on the subject entirely?

[Yeril]

I beleive V' to be male.

Mainly because he looks male.

Every other character in the comic has all had the same body type, all human females have the same curves, heck even the dwarf has a figure that you could see through fullplate armour.

If V were a female, he would look more like this..
http://i133.photobucket.com/albums/q70/Yerileikre/FemaleV-atar.jpg

[Ethdred]

female, no man does their hair like that :smallyuk:


You obviously weren't around for hair metal in the 80s.

[LordCaelvan]

In regard to V's name. Yes, ending with "us" is masculine as far as the elven language is concerned, but I wouldn't call that a deciding factor. Names can cross genderal boundries at times.

In regard to the hair. I don't know where you guys all live, but up here, hair is no longer dependant upon gender (except maybe for those really short crew-cuts, those are still male). Elves, I think, care even less about gender when deciding hair style.

As for which ever gender I think V is. I've always pictured him/her as a female. I didn't even realize the joke until way after I was done with the whole string of comics.

[TroyXavier]

Long before I ever read the forums, I decided V was female. She just seemed that way to me. Personally, I hope Rich never reveals the "true" gender though. It's better this way as V can be whatever people like including having no gender at all.

[factotum]

I beleive V' to be male.

Mainly because he looks male.


While I agree that V is male, I disagree with your reasoning. The problem is that V is the only elf we've ever seen in OotS*, so him having a similar body style to the other characters (none of whom are elves) is irrelevant. When we eventually meet V's mate, she might look exactly the same as V himself!

* ignoring Lirian, who was drawn in the Scribble style and therefore doesn't really count.

[The Vorpal Tribble]

Dear Diary,
They're at it again. Yup, the third V's Gender thread this week and 87th this year. I don't know why they do it except to use up GITP bandwidth. I wonder if I wrote up a sarcastic post they'd stop, and V's genitals would finally be at peace? Here's hoping.

In other news, I'm getting my first illithid graft today...

[Spiryt]

Dear Diary,....


Damn, I was just thinking how to respond to this thread...

Why I can't come up with something that funny? :smallwink:


Anyway I think that even Vorpal's diary is tired with those threads.

[I'm da Rogue!]

When we eventually meet V's mate, she might look exactly the same as V himself!


Omagad.
That's it.
We're gonna meet V's mate, and 'e look as androgynous as V.... that's Rich's evil plan

[Capt'n Ironbrow]

While I agree that V is male, I disagree with your reasoning. The problem is that V is the only elf we've ever seen in OotS*, so him having a similar body style to the other characters (none of whom are elves) is irrelevant. When we eventually meet V's mate, she might look exactly the same as V himself!

* ignoring Lirian, who was drawn in the Scribble style and therefore doesn't really count.

Zz'driti was an (dark) elf... a photonegative of V, male? female? unknown...

[Jimorian]

I'm sure this has been pointed out many times in previous threads on the subject, but in http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0009.html Roy is pretty clearly implying one answer over another.

However, this could probably be retconned by saying that Roy made an assumption when he originally hired V, and that subsequent interactions has created doubt in his and everybody else's minds.

Ipso Facto Absurdo Redacto: Nothing has changed. :smallwink:

[Strengfellow]

You obviously weren't around for hair metal in the 80s.


Also Fabio.

[WarlockBeast]

well.......maybe vaarsuvius is another gender completly? not male female or any mix of the two but intirely diffrent? think about that. Cause 'Vaarsuvius' the name could be masculine or feminine. 'Vaarsuvius' isnt too masculine so it could also be feminine in elven language, yet at the same time masculine like the name 'Chris' or 'Sam'


P.S rich: if you were going to put this into the comic and since i posted your not sorry for making life harder for you :smalleek:

[factotum]

Zz'driti was an (dark) elf... a photonegative of V, male? female? unknown...

Well, we can always assume that Zz'dtri is male since he was "a violation of a certain fantasy author's copyright", and the "original" was definitely male!

[Dalenthas]

I think V is a man.
SoD spoilers!
All the female elves (and there are several) in SoD have curves like the human elf females. Some not as pronounced, but they're still there. One's even wearing a robe very similar to V's robe.

[Ave]

I think V is a man.
SoD spoilers!
All the female elves (and there are several) in SoD have curves like the human elf females. Some not as pronounced, but they're still there. One's even wearing a robe very similar to V's robe.

What is a human elf female?

Btw, Elan is sharing the room with Haley now, so the room sharing argument is moot.

[Protagonist]

I've always seen V as a very feminine-looking male. In fact, until I'd read at least 300 strips and started looking at the forums, I didn't even realise there was any thought that he was a woman.

There's no real reason I initially presumed him male, I just did. And I would find it very hard indeed to imagine him being female, even if Rich eventually reveals that to be the case.

[Fishybugs]

I think V is a man for two reasons:

1. Rich stated that he knew V's gender from the beginning and was quite shocked to read the debates on the forums regarding this issue.

2. V is referred to as male by Roy in strip 9. Now, after the debates began, Rich stated that anyone that uses a pronoun regarding V is using the one that they ASSUME applies to him. Being early in the strip, and being that Rich knew what he was and the gender debates had not yet started, I believe this is the answer.

[Chronos]

I don't see why there's any debate about this. V's genre is clearly Epic High Fantasy.


...What? That's what the OP asked.

[Hranat]

I think V is female to make a balance in the team, otherwise they're all male 'cept Haley. I also believe we still get to see V's partner, and her/his gender turnes out to be a mystery too.
And the 4 magical words are 'I am a woman'

[Yeril]

I think V is female to make a balance in the team, otherwise they're all male 'cept Haley. I also believe we still get to see V's partner, and her/his gender turnes out to be a mystery too.
And the 4 magical words are 'I am a woman'

"I am a man"

[Castaras]

V is neither.

V is the product of a metagaming player who cares more about the numbers than the roleplaying itself.

Therefore, V's gender is whichever is most convenient for the player at the time. :smallwink:

[blademaster42]

V has no gender! How you ask? Simple! 10% of gender changing belts actually remove gender! he must have been tricked into putting one on in his youth.

[fangthane]

With apologies to VT's poor, beleaguered diary...

V was initially meant to be male without equivocation, but Rich (and he posted somewhere about this too) saw the discussion sprouting up and decided to go with it, making all subsequent references ambiguous deliberately to feed the conflagration.

You have to figure though, that if the roaches were paying attention to the hot dwarf-on-dwarf action, the ones which used V as a balcony for the Dorukan fight should have been able to <ahem> recognise the landscape. And they called V a he, too. Since then, though, Rich has unabashedly been keeping the gender ball in the air without letting it land on either side of the net.

[Yeril]

V has no gender! How you ask? Simple! 10% of gender changing belts actually remove gender! he must have been tricked into putting one on in his youth.

or you know, he could be a guy? anyone ever consider that?

Seriosly people if you hear hooves think horse not zebra.

[titan_monarch]

It's time for me to bring out my favourite (overused) hypothesis!

V's Character Sheet

Name: Vaarsuvius
Race: Elf
Profession: Wizard
Gender: True Neutral
Alignment: Male

[maitreyi]

V is not asexual because V is married. I think that the hermaphrodite choice is a cop out. I prefer the male/female argument. It would be nice if the Giant would at least tell us that V is not a hermaphrodite.:smallmad:

[Lira]

-In the strip where V became an elf again and was hiding naked behind the dragon's tail, s/he may look female because his/her hair are different. But looking at the body carefully, it's not a female body.
Yes, I agree, that's definitely one of the better arguments for determining V's gender. But I don't think it's conclusive, it may just be that V's flat, or a drawing mistake.

But:
.......I think Belkar knows about V. By the scent, yes. If this is true, then:

-Belkar knows that V's a guy and pretends he doesn't know, to make his life hard just as he did when Roy was a woman. But that's too much even for the chaotic halfling to keep it secret.
How would Belkar know if V is a male by scent? He can't identify genders by scent, he identifies people by scent.


Gender doesn't really seem to matter to Vaarsuvius... but I do think it's female, despite it's masculine name... why does it always shared tavern rooms with Haley? Because she's the other lady in the party... albeit not very distinctly so...
I think the reason they share a room is because they're friends. Haley, being the female, gets her own room right? But she's probably too cheap to pay for one herself, so she rooms with V. She can trust V, since she knows V's married and isn't interested in Haley unlike the rest of the party is. (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0035.html)

Every other character in the comic has all had the same body type, all human females have the same curves, heck even the dwarf has a figure that you could see through fullplate armour.
Yeah, but if Rich was trying to make someone androgynous, then he obviously wouldn't draw them with a curve.


While I agree that V is male, I disagree with your reasoning. The problem is that V is the only elf we've ever seen in OotS*, so him having a similar body style to the other characters (none of whom are elves) is irrelevant. When we eventually meet V's mate, she might look exactly the same as V himself!

* ignoring Lirian, who was drawn in the Scribble style and therefore doesn't really count.
Lirian was drawn normal OOTS style in this comic, and she looks very female. (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0196.html)

Zz'driti was an (dark) elf... a photonegative of V, male? female? unknown...
Male I think. V called Zz'dtri "Mr. Zz'dtri" (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0049.html).

I think V is a man for two reasons:

1. Rich stated that he knew V's gender from the beginning and was quite shocked to read the debates on the forums regarding this issue.

2. V is referred to as male by Roy in strip 9. Now, after the debates began, Rich stated that anyone that uses a pronoun regarding V is using the one that they ASSUME applies to him. Being early in the strip, and being that Rich knew what he was and the gender debates had not yet started, I believe this is the answer.
That doesn't really prove anything though. I agree with you that it seems likely that V was intended to be male, but Rich decided to make V androgynous after people started questioning V's gender. It's still just as possible that V could be female too.


V is not asexual because V is married. I think that the hermaphrodite choice is a cop out. I prefer the male/female argument. It would be nice if the Giant would at least tell us that V is not a hermaphrodite.:smallmad:
Yeah, I agree.

[Selv]

VT, I ardently respect and admire you.

OP, your writing style hurts me. On the inside.

And I love the fact that V shares my tendency to think that sex (the act and its enabling architecture) is less important than most other people seem to consider it.
(OoPCs quote):vaarsuvius: I suppose of all the inane inquiries on your application, it is fortunate for you that it was a question for which the answer is so unnecessary.
Oh, and I guess I may as say it while the Man/Woman train is in the station: V's sex is what you're interested in. V's gender (http://andromeda.rutgers.edu/~jlynch/cgi-bin/writing.cgi?query=gender) is clearly neuter.

... and now I've demonstrated that I also share some of V's less charming personality quirks too. Oh well.

[Dalenthas]

What is a human elf female?

A typo. Not to be confused with a half-elf female, which is not.

[Neek]

Dear Diary,
They're at it again. Yup, the third V's Gender thread this week and 87th this year. I don't know why they do it except to use up GITP bandwidth. I wonder if I wrote up a sarcastic post they'd stop, and V's genitals would finally be at peace? Here's hoping.

In other news, I'm getting my first illithid graft today...

You win this thread.


Why I think V's a "he"

-If s/he's a woman, why isn't he called Vaarsuvia? Vaarsuvius is a male name, isn't it?

By the same reasoning, Venus is a man.

-If she's a woman, why isn't she called Vena? Venus is a male name, isn't it?

Don't let your preconceived notion of language fool you: Just because Latin has -a/-us as feminine/masculine gender does not mean that -a will always mean feminine, and -us always mean masculine.

Everyone else who said it is right: V's gender is purposefully made ambiguous to deceive us. There are other things to worry about in OotS than this possible "It's Pat!" skit.

[Arnen]

female, no man does their hair like that :smallyuk:

My boyfriend had his hair long and straight like that for a while, sans the circlet, until his mom bugged him about it so much that he shaved it all off. :smalleek:

Anyway, who's to say that the revalation of V's mate - even if his/her gender were clear - would say anything about V's gender? S/he could be gay.

[Belkar's Left Foot]

I will always and forever be a V is a guy fan, simply because of what Belkar says in panel 6. (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0028.html)

[Scarab83]

Plus, you know.. the whole lack of boobs thing. Yes, yes, there's always an exception, but have you seen one yet? All females in the OotS world have boobs. Even in robes.

[Querzis]

Plus, you know.. the whole lack of boobs thing. Yes, yes, there's always an exception, but have you seen one yet? All females in the OotS world have boobs. Even in robes.

Exactly. V was obviously meant to be a male. The only possible reasons I can think of why people though he was a female is that 4 guy and 2 girls sounds better then 5 guys and one girl...thats it. I really dont see any other reason to think hes a girl. The tavern things and him sharing a room with Haley sounds really weak, would any girl trust anyone else then V in this party? Beside they were friends long before they joined the party and Haley cant take a room just for herself.

V always acted like a man, he look like a man and he was even refered as a man before the gender debate showed up. But, even if I know hes just andorogynous now because some people on the forum coudnt tell his gender, I decided to go along with it. Even if I know that V was meant to be a male, now he has no gender and I bet his mate will look just like him too.

[ZeroNumerous]

I don't understand why you guys are bothering with this..

V's a wizard of atleast ninth level. His gender can be whatever he feels like (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/alterSelf.htm).

[ImpFireball]

I believe around strip #10, Roy called V 'v-man'. >=D

[Ithekro]

While drinking and having ice cream (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0252.html) Nale calls V a "elf chick" while Sabrine calls V a "elf dude". Thus the questions continue.

[Spiky]

By the same reasoning, Venus is a man.

-If she's a woman, why isn't she called Vena? Venus is a male name, isn't it?

Don't let your preconceived notion of language fool you: Just because Latin has -a/-us as feminine/masculine gender does not mean that -a will always mean feminine, and -us always mean masculine.

That doesn't work, either. Venus is a known female name. Vaarsuvius is a known male name. That whole suffix argument is a dead end in both directions.

[bladewyrm]

Well I am gonna say this, and only this... Haley has a "womenly figure", and every other female in has that same ummm... "shape", except V, what I'm saying is that unlike Haley and every other chick in the comic, YOU CAN'T SEE HER CANS! therefore he's a man!

[Bocc Kob]

That doesn't work, either. Venus is a known female name. Vaarsuvius is a known male name. That whole suffix argument is a dead end in both directions.

Known to who? :smallconfused:

[Neek]

That doesn't work, either. Venus is a known female name. Vaarsuvius is a known male name. That whole suffix argument is a dead end in both directions.

To quote Bocc Kob, "To who?" Vaarsuvius is not a Latin name; were it, it could be masculine, but it does not have to be: Were it a name after a place, it would be feminine, were it of Greek origin, it would be feminine. It could also be a 3rd declension noun with its genitive in -eris. It could also be a 4th declension noun, in which case it's perfectly regular for the name to have an -us (though I can't recall a single proper name that was a 4th declension noun...)

The suffix argument is dead end either way, but not because Vaarsuvius is a known male name. It's not a Latin name. It's not even a real name. It's a name fantasy name that was attributed to a fantasy character whose gender is purposefully masked to taunt us. Any argument for V's gender which is dependent on analyzing the name in relation to its grammatical gender based on Latin will most likely fail--because it's just as likely it could be irregular and be a wonky feminine noun, if a Latin name at all.

[Ishha]

You know before I ever saw this thread I always thought V was a woman.
Or what if Rich makes it so that when(or if ever)we see V's mate it'll be a man and a woman making out so that when V gets furious:smallfurious: , the both make a run for it of the screen,before V zappzs them:yuk: .So that we'll never find out the truth!Mwahaahaahaa!

:elan: +:haley: =Fo Eva

[Fire_Heart]

I beleive V' to be male.

Mainly because he looks male.

Every other character in the comic has all had the same body type, all human females have the same curves, heck even the dwarf has a figure that you could see through fullplate armour.

If V were a female, he would look more like this..
http://i133.photobucket.com/albums/q70/Yerileikre/FemaleV-atar.jpg

But that's why V has such a long robe... But why he/she don't tell it??

[slipper]

I think V is a man for two reasons:

1. Rich stated that he knew V's gender from the beginning and was quite shocked to read the debates on the forums regarding this issue.

2. V is referred to as male by Roy in strip 9. Now, after the debates began, Rich stated that anyone that uses a pronoun regarding V is using the one that they ASSUME applies to him. Being early in the strip, and being that Rich knew what he was and the gender debates had not yet started, I believe this is the answer.

QFMFT

STRIP #9=TRUTH

[triad38]

Hmm... Failed to see V's lizard genetals, yet unable to see his/her cans... A hard one. maybe both?:smallconfused: i dont know. so i say... Female!:smallbiggrin:


By the way, where do i join the :elan: fanclub?

[Emperor Ing]

i think female, all the fanart of V makes her look like an old woman, a really really badass old woman! :smallcool:

2nd, just put "<insert custom title here> of the :elan: fanclub

[Yeril]

Also another Male point, if you look at their faces you can tell, Female characters eyes are on the Middle line, and mouths just below the quater line, however males eyes are above the middle line and on the quater line.

V's eyes are above the middle line and mouth is on the quater line.

Thus V is more than defintly drawn as a man.

Go down 2 posts

[Emperor Ing]

uhh yeril, ya just proved that V is a FEMALE!!! :smalleek:

[Yeril]

Right, Ill go over it again and make sure I dont say the wrong thing...

Males eyes and mouth are Higher than females eyes and mouth, V's eyes and mouth are the same hieght as Male characters eyes and mouth thus

V's face = male face

As you can see the redline is the middle line and all the males (including V)'s eyes are above it.

And you can see that their mouths are just above the green line. Wheras Hayleys eyes are on the red and green line.


http://i133.photobucket.com/albums/q70/Yerileikre/IMPROTANTFjieghbeag.jpg

[Chronos]

That's been pointed out before... V's eyes are higher on es face than the female characters' are, but they're lower than the male characters' are. So if anything, that's just more evidence for the "True Neutral" position.

[basilisk 89]

Always looked at V as a she. Thought it was a she up until I learned they didn't know hir gender, from which I still it was a she.

[Gwyn chan 'r Gwyll]

simple. Either Race: Female, Gender: elf, or race elf, gender coffee smudge.

[Scarab83]

simple. Either Race: Female, Gender: elf, or race elf, gender coffee smudge.

That's a syntactical nightmare.

[Gwyn chan 'r Gwyll]

What does that word mean?

[basilisk 89]

What does that word mean?

Syntactical or nightmare?

[RAGE KING!]

Syntactical is a word that means (Look it up online).
A nightmare is an evil, black, female horse, that kills people during the night.

[BloodyAngel]

V is a man. Or at least, he was... The giant even said so somewhere that the "Confused gender" thing wasn't originally going to be in the comic until a ways after he started writing it... though I can't remember exactly where I read that. The earlier comics are pretty telling... V was originally a man.

However now that it's become such a fun running joke and topic to gripe about on the forums... V's gender has faded into muddled confusion, and will remain that way. My personal theory is that V's charisma is so low but magical potency so high that he/she has transcended gender into a new form altogether... V exists now entirely as a being of pure pompousness and long-winded conjecture. And we all love him/her for it.

[Yeril]

V is a male elf, Slightly effeminet.

Like all elfs he gets a circumstance +4 to charisma when naked (dont ask why but it has somthing to do with half orcs)

[Emperor Ing]

YERIL!! Ya proved V is a female again! Whats the yellow line on V's head? 2nd, i dun think that the eye line is in the middle of V's head.

[Abardam]

The yellow line is V's circlet or headband or whatever it is.

[Emperor Ing]

its confusing! :smalltongue:
But the shape of V's head and her hair make the actual locations of the line very decieving. Ive looked at some more recent OOTS (the ones with V) and it looks like the eyes are on the line to me. Female! :smallbiggrin:

[dungeon_munky]

From the getgo I had always believed Vaarsuvius to be male, for a variety of reasons; stereotypical fantasy roleplaying is male dominated, no curves, V-Man etc. Shock and appal ensued when I came on the forums and discovered the ambiguity. This is how I see it now.

WARNING! Stereotyping of the elvish race. Male elves are femanine. Female elves are more femanine and stunningly gorgeous. I think that the very fact that there is any doubt of his gender clearly points to him being male.

In regards to the Sabine vs Nale conversation, I think that Sabine, a Succubus like being, would probably have a better idea of genders than Nale would. It`s not only her job, but her life to seduce people, and if she cant tell the difference, she is no better than a dretch. PS She calls him an elf-dude.

[Oberon]

Sorry to get all lawful on y'all, but isnt there an official thread (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=4918) for this topic not that far down the page?

[Yeril]

From the getgo I had always believed Vaarsuvius to be male, for a variety of reasons; stereotypical fantasy roleplaying is male dominated, no curves, V-Man etc. Shock and appal ensued when I came on the forums and discovered the ambiguity. This is how I see it now.

WARNING! Stereotyping of the elvish race. Male elves are femanine. Female elves are more femanine and stunningly gorgeous. I think that the very fact that there is any doubt of his gender clearly points to him being male.

In regards to the Sabine vs Nale conversation, I think that Sabine, a Succubus like being, would probably have a better idea of genders than Nale would. It`s not only her job, but her life to seduce people, and if she cant tell the difference, she is no better than a dretch. PS She calls him an elf-dude.

First of all. Why does she need to tell the difference either way shes gonner have sex with it.

and secondly sabine is not a succubus like being.

Hes an Inuccubus. :smallwink:

Hes about as male as V is female.

the boobs? of their an exeption, Honest, Much like V's male body

[Yeril]

its confusing! :smalltongue:
But the shape of V's head and her hair make the actual locations of the line very decieving. Ive looked at some more recent OOTS (the ones with V) and it looks like the eyes are on the line to me. Female! :smallbiggrin:

Like these comics?

http://i133.photobucket.com/albums/q70/Yerileikre/V.png

Looks male to me

[ag30476]

Right, Ill go over it again and make sure I dont say the wrong thing...

Males eyes and mouth are Higher than females eyes and mouth, V's eyes and mouth are the same hieght as Male characters eyes and mouth thus

V's face = male face


Hmmm....interesting...hadn't noticed before

[BelkarPwnsAll!]

female, no man does their hair like that :smallyuk:



Actually, I'M doing my hair V style, and I'M a man. U A LIAR, RANDOMIZER! Don't say what u dont know, bro...



http://www.wizards.com/magic/images/whatcolor_isgreen.jpgTake the Magic: The Gathering 'What Color Are You?' Quiz. (http://www.wizards.com/magic/playmagic/whatcolorareyou.asp)

[Aristeidis]

I always thought V as a male. The latin "Varsuvius" states it clearly. The way he speaks is definitely male as I see it, but I believe Rich is having a very good laugh watching us trying to figure this out! Chances are he hasn't decided yet!

[Yeril]

V was a defintly male character up until about strip 90 odd with the Bathroom joke.

After that people started saying "Waaait a minute, What gender IS v?" so Rich started writing him as androgonous

Or atleast thats what I think, the first hint of V's possible femminininity is that he doesn't go into either of the bathrooms in strip 87 I think.

Unless ive missed one.

[Ithekro]

There was strip 28 where Belkar question's V's sexual orientation while Haley is talking about Elan's new rapier.

[InuSaga]

There was strip 28 where Belkar question's V's sexual orientation while Haley is talking about Elan's new rapier.

I always that to mean that Belkar suspected V was gay, not really a female.

Okay, I'll throw in my two cents. V is male, and here's why.

1. In strip #9, Roy called Vaarsuvius "V-Man." This was when the strip was new and didn't have many viewers. As such, there was little to no debate over gender at the time.

2. V has no boobies. Every female character in this strip has breasts. V does not.

3. Haley gets along with him. Haley is extraordinarily catty to other women.

4. V and Haley share rooms in inns and the like because they have a preexisting friendship, and because he's married, and therefor she knows he's not going to crawl into her bed in the middle of the night.

5. V does not bother to correct anyone when they make assumptions about his gender because to do so would be beneath him.

6. Vaarsuvius is a guy's name.

There were more, but I can't think of them right now. I've never thought V was anything but male, with all the traits listed above, not to mention the reasons "supporting" his femininity were often sexist. Things like he never stops talking, so he's female. Rude and uncalled for.

[David Argall]

There was strip 28 where Belkar question's V's sexual orientation while Haley is talking about Elan's new rapier.

We might also consider
http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0003.html
where Haley and V have a conversation that sounds like two women, or at least what a male might think two women would sound like. We of course can insist that V was taking a male role of listening just enough not to be caught not listening and making a comment that was likely to fit the conversation no matter what she had said, but the easier reading is that it is two girls talking.

However, we can be pretty safe in thinking V's sex was indefinite well before the bathroom scenes.

[T.Titan]

In regards to the Sabine vs Nale conversation, I think that Sabine, a Succubus like being, would probably have a better idea of genders than Nale would. It`s not only her job, but her life to seduce people, and if she cant tell the difference, she is no better than a dretch. PS She calls him an elf-dude.

And yet she calls V "sister" here: http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0385.html

[David Argall]

Looking into the archives, which may not be complete, I find the debate starting on 11-03-03, Issue #9, where it is clear people already had definite, and different, ideas about which sex V was.

Some of the comments of the time...

The Giant:
I have no problem with Vaarsuvius' sex being ambiguous. He/she is an elf, after all.

All you can infer from the last strip is that *Roy* thinks Vaarsuvious is male. ;)

11-04-2003, 06:57 AM #52
Ashlock
Quote:
It's just a matter of looking for Rich's carefully added in features. (usually a bit of cleavage, long hair, or showing of the belly button)

Hey! As a long-haired guy, I resent that! &gt;:( ;)


11-04-2003, 01:53 PM #56
The Giant
Quote:
Originally Posted by Daveric
It's not that hard to figure out which of the characters are male and female (although some are tricky). It's just a matter of looking for Rich's carefully added in features. (usually a bit of cleavage, long hair, or showing of the belly button) ;)

Daveric, I would point out that your OWN AVATAR has long hair. So :P.
__________________
Rich Burlew

11-04-2003, 01:57 PM #57
RawBearNYC

Sorry, Bogotter, I don't know if Rich was using these when you guys played years ago, but he's been using stick figure minis against us for a while, and i've come to learn that all of his female avatars have apparent breasts.

If you take a gander at http://www.giantitp.com/cgi-bin/yabb...num=1060497491 you'll notice this. Even the Dwarven Female in full plate has them :) Varsuvvius has a rectangular torso, he's a dude :P
__________________

11-04-2003, 02:03 PM #58
The Giant

You don't know that. You are only drawing that conclusion based on previous examples. For all you know, I deliberately decided to create a sexually-ambiguous elf; in such a circumstance, I would clearly break my own &quot;rules&quot; on how I drew them. :P
__________________
Rich Burlew

[Duaneyo1]

I have always thought of the V-ster as an androgynous male. Kind of like David Bowie in the 70's, this also explains the purple hair. I always thought his personality was more male because of all the chest thumping and bravado that the Giant puts in his /her dialogues.

On other observations, V's mate would be an equally androgynous life-partner. I don't think V ever confirmed that he / she was married simply that he had a mate. The belt of feminity / masculinity wouldn't have done any thing noticeable to V. And he doesn't give a rip what gender he really is so why should we.

[dark-sage 95]

I always thought V a female, like most people I dident even know there was a debate untill I read the forums. But the eyes, the look the name the attitude it all adds up and as much as i hate to admit it *sigh* V sounds like he's a male.

[mockingbyrd7]

I always that to mean that Belkar suspected V was gay, not really a female.

Okay, I'll throw in my two cents. V is male, and here's why.

1. In strip #9, Roy called Vaarsuvius "V-Man." This was when the strip was new and didn't have many viewers. As such, there was little to no debate over gender at the time.

2. V has no boobies. Every female character in this strip has breasts. V does not.

3. Haley gets along with him. Haley is extraordinarily catty to other women.

4. V and Haley share rooms in inns and the like because they have a preexisting friendship, and because he's married, and therefor she knows he's not going to crawl into her bed in the middle of the night.

5. V does not bother to correct anyone when they make assumptions about his gender because to do so would be beneath him.

6. Vaarsuvius is a guy's name.

There were more, but I can't think of them right now. I've never thought V was anything but male, with all the traits listed above, not to mention the reasons "supporting" his femininity were often sexist. Things like he never stops talking, so he's female. Rude and uncalled for.

I agree 100% with this post. You make very convincing points.

I'd like to elaborate with my thoughts: I kind of think of Vaarsuvius as male but doesn't care one way or another about gender. He considers love and even sexuality as an almost exclusively emotional thing, rather than a physical thing, and therefore finds it not at all odd for the same gender to like the same gender, etc. He doesn't find gender to be a deciding factor in emotional attraction.

Long story short: Bisexual male.

[Hallavast]

V's gender is obviously and by definition niether male nor female. V's sex is harder (and by that i mean impossible) to determine. Anything found in the Oots Comic Strip that hints about V's sex is, has been, or will be put there to fuel the endless debate of V's sex. Any argument for V's gender (whether for male or female) is ludicrous since it has been expressed emphatically through the unending confusion that V has no gender at all. Any conclusions drawn concerning V's sex is, of course, a guess (and no better than anyone else's at this point).

Carry on.

[dungeon_munky]

And yet she calls V "sister" here: http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0385.html

Notice how drunk she is. She made the earlier assumption with a clear head. Also note that it isn't even clear if she knows that V is a member of OOtS, or that she has met him before.

[Selv]

Notice how drunk she is. She made the earlier assumption with a clear head. Also note that it isn't even clear if she knows that V is a member of OOtS, or that she has met him before.

I hate to breathe life into this thread, but that's not the case. She has recognised V as a member of OOTS at least-as we see a few minutes later (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0394.html).

[TheKnifeofTrust]

V is a DUDE...GET OVER IT!
Seriously, not to mention the Giant said no one will ever know.

Excellent arguements from...
Originally Posted by InuSaga

I always that to mean that Belkar suspected V was gay, not really a female.

Okay, I'll throw in my two cents. V is male, and here's why.

1. In strip #9, Roy called Vaarsuvius "V-Man." This was when the strip was new and didn't have many viewers. As such, there was little to no debate over gender at the time.

2. V has no boobies. Every female character in this strip has breasts. V does not.

3. Haley gets along with him. Haley is extraordinarily catty to other women.

4. V and Haley share rooms in inns and the like because they have a preexisting friendship, and because he's married, and therefor she knows he's not going to crawl into her bed in the middle of the night.

5. V does not bother to correct anyone when they make assumptions about his gender because to do so would be beneath him.

6. Vaarsuvius is a guy's name.

There were more, but I can't think of them right now. I've never thought V was anything but male, with all the traits listed above, not to mention the reasons "supporting" his femininity were often sexist. Things like he never stops talking, so he's female. Rude and uncalled for.

[Lira]

V is a DUDE...GET OVER IT!
*Sigh*
I've read through every V gender thread on this forum, and all these arguments have only proven that we cannot tell V's gender and we won't know until it's actually given to us.

Seriously, not to mention the Giant said no one will ever know.
He said that in the FAQ, correct? That was written quite some time ago, and the Giant may have changed his ideas since then. So there's still a small possibility that we will know V's gender one day.

Excellent arguements from...
Originally Posted by InuSaga
They're not excellent by any means, they're the same arguments from every other gender thread.

I always that to mean that Belkar suspected V was gay, not really a female.
Huh? You didn't word that very well...
So you say Belkar suspected V was gay? We know already that other character's perceptions of V can be completely wrong, so that proves nothing. By that comic, V's gender was androgynous, since questions were raised about whether V was male or female by at least comic 9.

Okay, I'll throw in my two cents. V is male, and here's why.

1. In strip #9, Roy called Vaarsuvius "V-Man." This was when the strip was new and didn't have many viewers. As such, there was little to no debate over gender at the time.
Yeah, IIRC, the gender debate started after comic nine posted. Someone asked if V was a male or female, since they thought female but the "V-man" thing threw them off. Rich then replied:

I have no problem with Vaarsuvius' sex being ambiguous. He/she is an elf, after all.

All you can infer from the last strip is that *Roy* thinks Vaarsuvious is male. ;)
So even though the Giant may have intended to make V a male, he decided to make V's gender ambiguous. But that doesn't mean if V's gender is revealed, V will be male. No, no, no. It means that the Giant changed a fact in his story, and since he has never outright said V is male or V is female, he could easily choose to make V female, or other. :smalltongue:

2. V has no boobies. Every female character in this strip has breasts. V does not.
Hmm, let me counter that with a quote from the Giant:

Men have rectangle bodies; women have curvy bodies, elven wizards wear robes.

3. Haley gets along with him. Haley is extraordinarily catty to other women.
She is? I know she hated Sabine and Miko, but she has other reasons she could hate them too, besides the fact that they are women. Miko basically took control over their group, treated them like dirt, and Roy followed her because he liked her. For Sabine, it could be that Haley was more perceptive than the rest of the group, and/or used her sense motive skill to see that the LG was up to something.

4. V and Haley share rooms in inns and the like because they have a preexisting friendship, and because he's married, and therefor she knows he's not going to crawl into her bed in the middle of the night.
Or, because V could be female. Either way, it works. The fact that they room together proves nothing.

5. V does not bother to correct anyone when they make assumptions about his gender because to do so would be beneath him.
Most of the time when they say something about V's gender, V is preoccupied with something else. And even if V's a female, V could also "not bother to correct anyone when they make assumptions about her gender because to do so would be beneath her."

6. Vaarsuvius is a guy's name.
You're saying that because with Latin names, male names end with -us, right? Now, I've no clue what thread it was, but I remember someone saying that names ending with -ius in Latin are gender neutral or something to that effect...
But, for arguments sake, let's say that "Vaarsuvius" would be a male name in Latin. This is a different world that the Order lives in, who says they follow the same rules for names? Even if they did, V could have been named after a famous elf or something, and his/her family didn't feel that if mattered that V was a different gender.
So really, the names proves nothing.

There were more, but I can't think of them right now. I've never thought V was anything but male, with all the traits listed above, not to mention the reasons "supporting" his femininity were often sexist. Things like he never stops talking, so he's female. Rude and uncalled for.
Yeah, but the reasons for being male can be disproved, so I think we can only come to one conclusion:

V's gender is unknown. S/he could be male, could be female, could be something else entirely. What we do know is that we won't know for sure until it's told to us, whether in the comic itself, or by the Giant in the forums.

I'm looking forward to your counter argument, TheKnifeofTrust. :smallsmile:

[John Campbell]

Vaarsuvius is an elf. They're all girls. Can't a one of 'em grow a beard to save her life.

[PaladinFreak]

Oh god....

I clicked of this thread thinking it would be something, anything, OTHER than a "V's Gender" thread. Oh well.

In response to this:

V is a DUDE...GET OVER IT!
I say: V is ANDROGYNOUS... There are no arguments either way that cannot be countered by an argument going the other way.


GET OVER IT!

[Rettu Skcollob]

Rettu thinks that we should stop thinking about this.

It's just a matter of Plumbing, in the end.

And by plumbing, Rettu means; the place down south.

And by the place down south, Rettu means; The Nether Regions.

And by The Nether Regions, Rettu means; .... Rettu is sure you must 'get the drift', by now.

[Ravenatog]

I like to think he is a male but i suppose he could be female just to cloudy sometimes.

[Surfing HalfOrc]

The REAL Answer...

V was originally a male, but has shifted to androgynous because of fan interest.

Who says the Giant doesn't read/respond to the board?

Has anyone done a running tally of gender clues? X=Male/Y=Female.
X: Roy calls V: V-Man
Y: Haley shares a room with V a la Velma and Daphne in Scooby-Doo.

One of the Obsessive/Compulsive types probably has done it somewhere...

[Hyrael]

There is no concrete evidence for either side in this discussion. I tend to thin of V as female, but that isnt backed up by much more than my first impression.

The explaination for V rooming with haley is simple: V doesnt want to room with the rest of the party for obvious reasons (coarseness, idiocy, odor, elf haughtiness, ect) and haley's room has only one other occupant. and Haley trusts V not to oggle and whatnot because V simply doesnt do that sort of thing, at all, regardless of gender. It's an arrangement that works, and results in the order paying for two rooms rather than three.

[JasonDoomsblade]

My fellow forumers I have the answer to the age old question

Vaarsuvius the Elf is infact a................

SHEMALE!

[Vitriolic Tonic]

This is obviously what Vaarsuvius would have looked like as a young 'un. (http://img260.imageshack.us/img260/4332/f1id8.jpg)

That character is female.

THIS IS INDISPUTABLE PROOF.

[JasonDoomsblade]

This is obviously what Vaarsuvius would have looked like as a young 'un. (http://img260.imageshack.us/img260/4332/f1id8.jpg)

That character is female.

THIS IS INDISPUTABLE PROOF.

Dude, did you draw that? Thats, awesome!

[littlechicory]

... Would it get me shot fireballed maimed to mention my opinion that Vaarsuvius is a eunuch (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eunuch)? :smalleek:

[Gitman00]

Ah, yes. A perennial favorite in the Playground; V's gender. I am thoroughly convinced that V, as originally conceived, was male. Evidence follows.

In Dungeon Crawlin' Fools, Rich makes the following comment regarding Vaarsuvius: "The character's gender ambiguity was not planned, but after seeing debates among the fans on either side of the issue, I decided to take that particular ball and run with it." We can deduce from this that V's gender was, at one point, concrete. Therefore, we must look to the earliest strips for our evidence.

What do we find? V's eyes are drawn in the upper half of his/her head, like the other males (note that Haley's eyes are in the middle). V is also drawn without breasts. I'm sure that someone will make the argument that they're concealed by his/her robes, but that's pretty weak IMHO, since every other female we see is clearly drawn with breasts; even Hilgya in plate armor.

The strongest piece of evidence, however, is comic #9 (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0009.html). I can't find the link right now, but it's possible to look up the archived GITP forums. Back in the day, the fan base was small enough that there was one thread for the entire comic, and The Giant would respond personally to most posts. Reading that thread, we find that it was after comic #9 was posted that V's gender debate appeared for the first time on the forum. Someone said, in essence, "Roy called Vaarsuvius V-man... I always thought V was female." Someone else responded with, "I had always assumed V was male, myself." The Giant chimed in almost immediately with, "I'm okay with V's gender being ambiguous. He/she IS an elf, after all. And by the way, all you can really infer from Roy's comment is that HE thinks V is male. :smallsmile:"

That tells me that Rich had made V male originally. Roy's comment in #9 is based on this, and it sparked the debate that made the character what he/she is today!

[Accountant]

To the mods:

Could someone please correct the name this thread? I don't know how any particular V's gender thread could stick around for a month like this one has anyway, but I guess if it's going to...

Genre battle? That doesn't even kinda make sense.

Sorry if this post was a little random.

[Lira]

Gitman00, did you either not read the entire thread or are you just repeating old points for the heck of it?

That's been pointed out before. Take a look at my other post on this page. Here's a snippet about that part:

So even though the Giant may have intended to make V a male, he decided to make V's gender ambiguous. But that doesn't mean if V's gender is revealed, V will be male. No, no, no. It means that the Giant changed a fact in his story, and since he has never outright said V is male or V is female, he could easily choose to make V female, or other.
So could you please counter my argument instead of repeating old ones? :smalltongue: