Scythe Wielder

[Soultpp]

So I asked a while ago here about some TWF help so I decided to ask about another character build that I am revisiting.

It is essentially a THF char that specializes in Scythe wielding and intimidation. I've had advice on this from another forum, but I figured I'd ask here too for some additional/different suggestions.

Here is a reminder of the resources I can use from my previous thread:

Arms & Equipment Guide
City of Splendors: Waterdeep
Complete Adventurer, Arcane, Divine, Warrior
Draconomicon
DMG II
DMG
Epic Level Handbook (another new install)
Expanded Psionics Handbook
Magic of Faerun
MM 1, 2, 3
Player's Guide to Faerun
PHB
Races of Destiny
Races of Faerun
Shining South


Regional feat from PGtoFR
Dreadful Wrath
Others:
Combat Reflexes
Death Blow
Greater Weapon Focus(Scythe)
Improved Critical(Scythe)
Improved Trip
Monkey Grip
Cleave
Combat Expertise
Great Cleave
Greater weapon Specialization (Scythe)
Improved Buckler Defense
Improved Initiative
Power Attack
Weapon Focus(Scythe)
Weapon Specialization (Scythe)

Human - Dreadful Wrath
1 - Able Learner (Pick this up early to get the most benefit)
F1 - Power Attack
F2 - Combat Expertise
3 - WF (Scythe)
F4 - WS (Scythe)
6 - Improved Trip
F6 - Dodge
F8 - GWF (Scythe)
9 - Mobility
F10 - Elusive Target
12 - Combat Reflexes
F12 -GWS (Scythe)
F14 - Improved Init
15 - Open
F16 - Open

Improved Crit, IBD, & Monkey Grip all possibly replaced by magic items.

There were a few other suggestions, but sadly they were from sources I don't have. (Drow of the Underdark, Complete Scoudrel) I'd love to be able to use them, but I would need to find them as etools datasets (if they even exist) to have a chance of DM approval.

Stat numbers are the same as for my TWF build, since the GM just says 'use the same numbers' for backup characters:

18, 18, 18, 17, 16, 15

Also of note, so far in this campaign we have gotten nearly zilch for loot and are all Lv4 already, so that might weigh on the decisions.

The character concept is pretty simple and probably not original: a quiet/taciturn but intimidating 'death-like' fighter or bounty hunter. Doesn't care about taking prisoners, but isn't evil. Wears the 'scary' black hooded cloak, etc. If you remember the part in LotR where the bartender warns the hobbits about 'that scary guy in the corner,' well that is kind of how I envision this character only with a bit more 'cloaked stranger' I guess. The contrast to the 'scary people hunter' is that this is a short-ish human girl/woman.

Also skill suggestions could help, I plan on maxing Intimidate, but otherwise its wide open.

Hope someone can help.

[SangoProduction]

Is there any reason to not play Dread Necromancer for this character? You're level 4, which means you already have level 2 spells and advanced learning and DR, and negative energy burst, and you know all spells on your spell list. And more importantly for your idea is Fear Aura next level.

Just fluff Negative Energy Burst as a vampiric sweep of your scythe to all around you (since you always take Tomb Tainted Soul, or be a Necro...thingy if you're a Dread Necromancer).

Spellcasting is required if you're starved for items, since martials require items to do their job. You can still fluff everything as an act of martial prowess, maybe even artificially limit your own range if you wish.

Then look to fulfilling the prereqs for Dread Witch. If you haven't been hit by a fear effect yet....hit yourself, and willingly fail the save.

Also, ask if you can consider yourself your own worst enemy. It would allow your fear aura to affect you, allowing you to Absorb Fear from Dread Witch.

Of course, neither your fear aura, nor your absorb fear mention the amount of time that they affect you...so theoretically, if you fail your will save against your fear aura, you will be permanently shaken....by your own edginess. You might also just permanently have the +1 bonus from Absorb Fear, even if you save, because it also does not mention a duration.

The bonuses to fear spell DCs don't help your Dread Necromancer's fear aura directly, but hey whatever. Fear effects from different sources stack, so the 2 fear auras, if you move within melee with them (as you seem to plan to) would stack. In addition to the +10 to Intimidate from Dread Witch.

http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?200566-Intimidate-Uses-and-Optimization

Of course, if you get both auras on them, then they immediately bolt, and lose all of their fear (except arguably the shaken from Dread Necro's aura). If you intimidate them as soon as you get in range, and they fail both their will saves, then you effectively disarm them and force them to run for a turn. If you somehow trap them, then they will cower, and basically be out of the fight...for a turn, until Intimidate wears off....if you stay in melee.

Use Advanced Learning to learn an illusion spell or 2 and take 1 level (maybe 2) in Nightmare Spinner. Gain bonus spells per day (illusions only), a 30ft fear...as a standard action. And outright immunity to fear. That means hit yourself with your best stuff to gain a permanent +3 to caster level from Absorb Fear, at no risk to yourself.

[Soultpp]

Thanks for the suggestions. Dread Necromancer could be an interesting class to play but it would not fit this particular character, the flavor of the class is not right. It is also a little too evil sounding (the whole turning into a lich thing) for this character. For a different character plan, it could work but not this one I am afraid.

Also there is the fact that I don't have access to the source in a manner that our DM would accept right now. Maybe for a future campaign he could, but since this one is already started the allowable sources are already established and can't be changed. Its a rule he had to make to keep power gamers from pulling random books out of nowhere to deliberately break the game (as has happened to him before.)

[SangoProduction]

Thanks for the suggestions. Dread Necromancer could be an interesting class to play but it would not fit this particular character, the flavor of the class is not right. It is also a little too evil sounding (the whole turning into a lich thing) for this character. For a different character plan, it could work but not this one I am afraid.

Also there is the fact that I don't have access to the source in a manner that our DM would accept right now. Maybe for a future campaign he could, but since this one is already started the allowable sources are already established and can't be changed. Its a rule he had to make to keep power gamers from pulling random books out of nowhere to deliberately break the game (as has happened to him before.)

Didn't see you had a sources list. But, Dread Necromancer doesn't have to be Evil, simply Nongood. Hell, you don't even have to mess with undead for your concept.

Regardless, you can just play Cleric, and basically do everything better. You are only 1 BAB off a fighter, and have full casting and no ACF problems. Buff yourself and your intimidate, past anything a fighter could hope for. Devote yourself to a scarecrow, maybe one named Fiddlesticks. Pick War domain, since Fiddlesticks's favored weapon would be a Scythe. Then take Strength Domain because Enlarge Person is good, as well as the daily +4 to Str as a free action (potentially +20 to strength daily, if you don't prestige out).

Else, just check out the link I gave in my last post.

[Remuko]

Didn't see you had a sources list. But, Dread Necromancer doesn't have to be Evil, simply Nongood. Hell, you don't even have to mess with undead for your concept.

Regardless, you can just play Cleric, and basically do everything better. You are only 1 BAB off a fighter, and have full casting and no ACF problems. Buff yourself and your intimidate, past anything a fighter could hope for. Devote yourself to a scarecrow, maybe one named Fiddlesticks. Pick War domain, since Fiddlesticks's favored weapon would be a Scythe. Then take Strength Domain because Enlarge Person is good, as well as the daily +4 to Str as a free action (potentially +20 to strength daily, if you don't prestige out).

Else, just check out the link I gave in my last post.

Idk if Fiddlesticks would have the War Domain or Strength Domain. Also he wields what in D&D is a sickle not a scythe. Also CAWCAWCAW.

[SangoProduction]

Idk if Fiddlesticks would have the War Domain or Strength Domain. Also he wields what in D&D is a sickle not a scythe. Also CAWCAWCAW.

Well, he basically live(s/d) at the Institute of War to be used at a summoner's whim. Might have a point with Strength Domain. But there's no fear or crow domain, so...eh.

[Tohsaka Rin]

http://vignette4.wikia.nocookie.net/rwby/images/2/22/Qrow_Scythe.png/revision/latest/scale-to-width-down/310?cb=20160207161746

Since you've access to Arms and Equipment Guide, I suggest putting the Balanced enchantment on your scythe, and save yourself a feat from Monkey Grip. Points for style, and all that.

[Remuko]

Well, he basically live(s/d) at the Institute of War to be used at a summoner's whim. Might have a point with Strength Domain. But there's no fear or crow domain, so...eh.

Yeah its a shame that all got retconned. I wonder if he will become a Shadow Isles champ? I'm surprised there's no fear domain. Death would likely be a domain of his though, maybe trickery too.

[ShurikVch]

List of allowed books missed all the good stuff.
Firstly, any project of "<Weapon> Wielder" build should start from either Weapon Master PrC (Sword and Fist), or Psychic Weapon Master (http://archive.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/psm/20040827d) (but neither psionics nor online sources aren't on the list too)
Since scythe isn't exotic weapon, you couldn't use it with Trip Attack of Exotic Weapon Master PrC... That is - unless you make it of Kaorti resin (http://archive.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/re/20031014a)
Also, because they are not on the list, you don't have access to:
Initiator classes, maneuvers and stances of Sublime Way (Tome of Battle: The Book of Nine Swords)
War Hulk PrC (Miniatures Handbook)
Half-Minotaur and Half-Ogre templates (Dragon magazines)

[Tohsaka Rin]

List of allowed books missed all the good stuff.
Firstly, any project of "<Weapon> Wielder" build should start from either Weapon Master PrC (Sword and Fist), or Psychic Weapon Master (http://archive.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/psm/20040827d) (but neither psionics nor online sources aren't on the list too)
Since scythe isn't exotic weapon, you couldn't use it with Trip Attack of Exotic Weapon Master PrC... That is - unless you make it of Kaorti resin (http://archive.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/re/20031014a)
Also, because they are not on the list, you don't have access to:
Initiator classes, maneuvers and stances of Sublime Way (Tome of Battle: The Book of Nine Swords)
War Hulk PrC (Miniatures Handbook)
Gloves of the titan's grip (Magic Item Compendium or Expanded Psionics Handbook)
Half-Minotaur and Half-Ogre templates (Dragon magazines)

Not to be rude or anything, but how does telling the OP what they don't have access to help them?

[Particle_Man]

I wonder if there is a way to get yourself more access to using Coup de Grace in more situations, or more easily? Maybe a feat or something? Because a x4 crit weapon would be pretty sweet for that.

[ShurikVch]

Not to be rude or anything, but how does telling the OP what they don't have access to help them?On the off chance DM would approve them
Seriously, listed sources are so bare!
Even Pounce from Lion Spiritual Totem is unavailable for Barbarian, because Complete Champion isn't on the list too! :smallannoyed:
Even the "heavy metal" weapon from Magic of Faerûn is of no use - because scythe, apparently, isn't "metal" enough

EDIT:
I wonder if there is a way to get yourself more access to using Coup de Grace in more situations, or more easily? Maybe a feat or something? Because a x4 crit weapon would be pretty sweet for that.Death Blow feat (Complete Adventurer) - CdG as a Standard Action

[SangoProduction]

I wonder if there is a way to get yourself more access to using Coup de Grace in more situations, or more easily? Maybe a feat or something? Because a x4 crit weapon would be pretty sweet for that.

If you're in a situation where you can Coup de Grace, and it's not a super short duration debuff, then you've already won the fight. Because, they are currently helpless, and you should focus on the things that can kill you. If there's nothing left that can kill you (or at least seriously hamper your objective)...you've won.


On the off chance DM would approve them
Seriously, listed sources are so bare!
Even Pounce from Lion Spiritual Totem is unavailable for Barbarian, because Complete Champion isn't on the list too! :smallannoyed:
Even the "heavy metal" weapon from Magic of Faerûn is of no use - because scythe, apparently, isn't "metal" enough

EDIT:Death Blow feat (Complete Adventurer) - CdG as a Standard Action

Eh. Just make the pole metal as well. Problem solved.

[Soultpp]

Sorry for not replying sooner, health issues and college kept me away.

It is not likely that I will be able to get anything else approved for the list, at least not until a new campaign, so that's out I'm afraid. If the gloves of the titan's grip are in Expanded Psionics, I do have that on the list so I'll look for those. And also balanced. Saving feats is a good thing if we ever get access to such things. The scythe not being 'metal' enough for a heavy metal weapon is something I might be able to get the DM to be lax on though considering the blade is the important bit and all.

[Particle_Man]

If you're in a situation where you can Coup de Grace, and it's not a super short duration debuff, then you've already won the fight. Because, they are currently helpless, and you should focus on the things that can kill you. If there's nothing left that can kill you (or at least seriously hamper your objective)...you've won.

Well personally I have been in campaigns where there been times when Coup de Grace was useful (I guess your classic super short duration debuff situations) so it might also be useful for the OP. Their call, though.

[ShurikVch]

I'm very sorry, but I made a mistake by mentioning a wrong wondrous item: instead "Gloves of the titan's grip" I meant "Strongarm Bracers, Magic Item Compendium pg. 139. It's 6,000 gp to wield a weapon as if you were a size larger without penalties."

[Soultpp]

So, is there any advice other than "get more source" that can be offered then? Or is the best I can do with what I have already covered in the initially shown feat distribution suggestion?

[ShurikVch]

There are the few things I managed to scrape from the listed sources:
Dervish PrC (Complete Warrior): Dervish Dance works with slashing weapon, thus Scythe is OK
Lion’s Pounce - [wild] feat in Complete Divine: gives Pounce (but, like all [wild] feats, spends daily uses of Wild Shape)
Geomancer PrC (Complete Divine): at 7th level, you may get Pounce for the 1st round of combat, but that PrC required both Arcane and Divine casting to enter
Crinti Shadow Marauder PrC (Shining South): one of the 2 classes with Shadow Pounce; if you have decent access to tactical teleportation...

[Soultpp]

The Crinti Shadow Marauder PrC sounds interesting, I'll look at it in more detail. It may actually feed into the base concept, it may not, but at least I can look at it, thanks.