Hunter of Blood

[Beardliest]

Finally getting to be a player in a game that I'm not asked to help DM. Feels fantastic. Got too many good ideas, but I figured that I wanted to play a character based off of a hypothetical I got after immersing myself in one of my newest video game obsessions: Bloodborne.

I've tried looking high and low, but the closest thing I've found is making a psion-arcane gish, which doesn't seem like it would be a good idea for some reason. I found a book that let me do some fantastic things with ancestry and such, called Bastards and Bloodlines (or B&B from now on), but the only thing that helped me find is that I was basically making a Venerable Dragonwrought Kobold with Illithid and Beholder ancestors so I could get Beholder Mage and Flayerspawn Psychic. I don't think that that's the best option.

Spoilers for if you haven't seen the endings to Bloodborne

So, I humbly ask for some ideas from you awesome people. I am looking to play a melee fighter with full arcane and/or psionic casting by level 20. My idea is to be "an infant Great One, lifting humanity into its next childhood." I imagine that my hunter would be a strange, otherworldy being, still humanoid but using the magical arts that many of the bosses had before in combination with my melee weapons. As far as I was told, all sources for 3.5 are ok already, homebrew is under DM discretion and Pathfinder is not liked, but is still possible. (don't ask, they never completely explained why Pathfinder isn't looked upon highly)

Any constructive input is helpful and thank you in advance

[Flickerdart]

How do you feel about the half-fey template? Fey are pretty dang otherworldly, and for a mere +2 LA you get a laundry list of SLAs that scales as you level up. Phrenic is the same thing but a psionic creature, and it's a toss-up which one is stronger since PLAs are automatically augmented to maximum. You could slap either template on a regular melee character and do quite well.

[Azoth]

In that same vein, it is possible to be Phrenic and after buying off the LA then take 2 levels of Half Fey savage Progression. If you want to take the regional feat, Magic in the Blood, all your SLAs and PLAs go from 1/day to 3/day. You have to take the feat at level 1 though, and it has some race restrictions. The combination gives several good combat, social, and utility abilities. Ends up with I think 27-28 SLA/PLA all usable 3/day. Basically, Sorcerers eat your hearts out.

As for gishing a Mystic Wildshape Ranger with Sword of the Arcane Order gets 5th level spells at level 10 and then can easily go Master of Many Forms to be a gnarly shape changer.

[Rizban]

If you go half-fey, I suggest the feytouched savage progression without taking the optional +1 LA. Then you can take the 1 level feytouched to half-fey transition class and get almost everything you want from half-fey for only +1 LA. Feytouched is a pretty good base race too.

If you want a more illithid feel, there's always the illithid heritage feats from complete psionic.

[Matrota]

If you're looking for a melee fighter who has really good spellcasting, one obvious choice is to play a spellsword. Grab the practiced spellcaster feat to help boost your CL. I recommend fighter 2, wizard/sorcerer 4, spellsword 14. Due to the true mage ability spellswords get at 12th level, this will put your caster level at 20 at 20th level.

[Tiri]

If you're looking for a melee fighter who has really good spellcasting, one obvious choice is to play a spellsword. Grab the practiced spellcaster feat to help boost your CL. I recommend fighter 2, wizard/sorcerer 4, spellsword 14. Due to the true mage ability spellswords get at 12th level, this will put your caster level at 20 at 20th level.

Spellsword is a horrible class for this. You lose too many caster levels if you take it to level 10.

Also, you can't take epic prestige classes before level 20, and even if you could, there is no such True Mage ability.

[Beardliest]

Alright. Back from a lot of work after 2 days. Now, I can further expand on some things that have come up or weren't fully explained due to time constraints.

The reason that I asked for full casting progression is because it seemed the easiest way to use some abilities I wanted. I wasn't looking at using every move in the game, but I had a list I was looking at trying to get, but I can understand making sacrifices or changes:

Paarl's Electric Nova (basically an AoE electric sphere that expands from me)
Paarl's Electric Breath (electric breath weapon, not difficult to get)
The First Hunter's Wind Gust (ranged wind attack)
Micolash's Augur of Ebrietas (a tentacle attack, maybe similar to Evard's Black Tentacles)
Micolash's A Call Beyond (many homing magical projectiles)
The One Reborn's Discharge (basically a large acid floor effect)
The One Reborn's Vein Shot (projectile with high damage)
Lady Maria's...Fire Whip (unsure about the name, but she swings her swords and has 5 foot extra reach in fire)
Living Failure's Meteor Swarm (it's just Meteor Swarm)
Mergo's Wet Nurse Nightmare Veil (it's just high level Darkness)
Rom's Ranged Ice Barrage (shooting ice at my enemies)
Rom's Upward Ice Barrage (bringing icebergs or ice spikes out of the ground)
Rom's...Spider Summon (no name I can find, but it just summons a bunch of spiders)
Amygdala's Exploding Laser (single laser shooting from the head)
The Moon Presence's Blood Moon Orb (blood rain, debuffs enemies)

The last major thing sticking point I had was the cooperation item. In game, you have a bell that can summon players to help you and I was wondering if there was something that might summon a spirit or someone to help you that wasn't a party member maybe 1/day.

Thank you all for everything you've been saying so far about this. I do have one last comment that I wanted to bring up that the 2 DM's they switch between have had: as I have come into the last 2 games in the latter portion LA hasn't been a problem, but at least one of them isn't a fan of it as he doesn't quite understand it. I can try to explain it, but it may be an uphill battle on that, so I would probably not have buyoff.

On the bright side, all of them love Cheese as long as it isn't becoming a god, i.e. Pun-Pun. One of them is letting me play as an Incarnate Warforged Dragonborn Time Seer Dark Arcane Heirophant. He said the math added up to 0 LA. So, ridiculous or crazy combos are welcomed, I just want to be close to my original idea

[The Viscount]

Bloodborne's quite a difficult feat to replicate for D&D since so much is in the fluff rather than the crunch but we can certainly try.

Warlock certainly has some linkages for a Hunter of the dream, as pacts with creatures from the Far Realms is a presented option for Warlock, and it gives at will abilities. It even has UMD for your Hunter's Tools. Some of these could be nabbed from the dragonfire adept list via infernal adept, like scalding gust. A number of these are pretty normal evocation type effects, Call Beyond is Magic Missile for example. You could even get away with some of these as maneuvers. Lady Maria's for example, is burning brand through and through.

[Beardliest]

Bloodborne's quite a difficult feat to replicate for D&D since so much is in the fluff rather than the crunch but we can certainly try.

Warlock certainly has some linkages for a Hunter of the dream, as pacts with creatures from the Far Realms is a presented option for Warlock, and it gives at will abilities. It even has UMD for your Hunter's Tools. Some of these could be nabbed from the dragonfire adept list via infernal adept, like scalding gust. A number of these are pretty normal evocation type effects, Call Beyond is Magic Missile for example. You could even get away with some of these as maneuvers. Lady Maria's for example, is burning brand through and through.

I have gotten Warlock as a suggestion before. Thank you for bringing it back up. I found some good approximations as listed here:

Scalding gusts - (Wind Gust)
Darkness - (Nightmare Veil)
Sudden Swarm - (Spider Summon)
Vitriolic Blast - (Vein Shot)
Caustic Mire - (Discharge)
Eldritch Cone - (Exploding Laser)
Eldritch Doom - (A Call Beyond)

Combined with gaining Burning Brand using either Martial Study or using Jade Pheonix Mage if a DM will let me (which will give an ability close to Electric Nova), that only leaves a few abilities left:

Paarl's Electric Breath
Micolash's Augur of Ebrietas
Living Failure's Meteor Swarm
Rom's Ranged Ice Barrage
Rom's Upward Ice Barrage
The Moon Presence's Blood Moon Orb

I already was going in under the assumption that I wouldn't get Meteor Swarm, so I am ok without that. Unfortunately, the Augur was one of the first abilities I was looking at getting and can't find a way to get that as an ability to use. I can't find how to gain the others any more than an eternal wand or something equally expensive and limited

[The Viscount]

You might consider either Dragonborn of Bahamut or 2+ levels of dragonfire adept, either will give you lightning breath, Dragonborn's advances easily, DFA doesn't lock down race/alignment.

Rom's upward ice blast could be mimicked by sudden stalagmite if you want it as an attack, or wall of ice if you want more of a barrier thing. Ice barrage could easily be hellrime blast.

If you really do want Augur of Ebrietas to function like Evard's Black Tentacles, then Warlock has the Chilling Tentacles invocation. If you want it to be more like the quick attack it is in the game with some stunning, bracers of the entangling blast should prove useful.

The meteor swarm is indeed the hardest to replicate, I can't really think of much besides just a scroll of the spell and some good old UMD.

I had mentioned some initiators before, and I realize that sudden leap or the shadow hand maneuvers that teleport are a good way to represent dodging with the Old Hunter Bone.

[Beardliest]

You might consider either Dragonborn of Bahamut or 2+ levels of dragonfire adept, either will give you lightning breath, Dragonborn's advances easily, DFA doesn't lock down race/alignment.

Rom's upward ice blast could be mimicked by sudden stalagmite if you want it as an attack, or wall of ice if you want more of a barrier thing. Ice barrage could easily be hellrime blast.

If you really do want Augur of Ebrietas to function like Evard's Black Tentacles, then Warlock has the Chilling Tentacles invocation. If you want it to be more like the quick attack it is in the game with some stunning, bracers of the entangling blast should prove useful.

The meteor swarm is indeed the hardest to replicate, I can't really think of much besides just a scroll of the spell and some good old UMD.

I had mentioned some initiators before, and I realize that sudden leap or the shadow hand maneuvers that teleport are a good way to represent dodging with the Old Hunter Bone.

I forgot to mention that the Lightning Breath was the other one was ok forgoing as I can probably find a way to get bolt paper and fire paper, but I like the idea. Maybe for another build or abilities I will do that. I also concede that I have no idea what it takes to do Blood Moon Orb. Blocking healing would be kinda iffy in a heated battle and I have no idea what the setting for this hypothetical character would be.

I like the bracers idea. Maybe bind them with soulmeld or chakras or something.

Well, Sudden Stalagmite is a Druid 4 spell, which requires 9 levels of a class that I lose 11 in Warlock. One of my Invocations is Dark, which requires that I have at least a 16th level Warlock Casting.

Initiator levels might be good if I have some extra things somewhere, or just do Jade Phoenix

Also, race and templates at this point are kinda moot. I've decided on a +1 LA fix with math that, though ridiculous and cheesy, has flown with this party before. So, that leaves class build and money. I also decided on the Holy Moonlight Blade for a sword, but can't figure out how to shoot the beam it does. I mostly chose it for simplicity, but that seems to have been thrown out the window with the beam

[Beardliest]

I may have found a good Holy Moonlight Blade. I was thinking a +2 Holy Bastard Sword enchanted to have Blast of Force on use activated for the beam attack

[The Viscount]

Oh for sudden Stalagmite i had just assumed you'd make a wand of it.

For the Moonlight Blade if you want to focus more on the damaging aspect of the blast, you could sort of do it with Throwing and Returning, though it wouldn't visibly be a blast of arcane magic. You might be able to replicate it with a select Shadow Hand or Desert Wind maneuver (there are good items for these if you don't want to spend levels). Or would you prefer that the blast be inherent for the sword?

[CozJa]

I forgot to mention that the Lightning Breath was the other one was ok forgoing as I can probably find a way to get bolt paper and fire paper, but I like the idea. Maybe for another build or abilities I will do that. I also concede that I have no idea what it takes to do Blood Moon Orb. Blocking healing would be kinda iffy in a heated battle and I have no idea what the setting for this hypothetical character would be.

I like the bracers idea. Maybe bind them with soulmeld or chakras or something.

Well, Sudden Stalagmite is a Druid 4 spell, which requires 9 levels of a class that I lose 11 in Warlock. One of my Invocations is Dark, which requires that I have at least a 16th level Warlock Casting.

Initiator levels might be good if I have some extra things somewhere, or just do Jade Phoenix

Also, race and templates at this point are kinda moot. I've decided on a +1 LA fix with math that, though ridiculous and cheesy, has flown with this party before. So, that leaves class build and money. I also decided on the Holy Moonlight Blade for a sword, but can't figure out how to shoot the beam it does. I mostly chose it for simplicity, but that seems to have been thrown out the window with the beam

Mh... besides quoting exactly the post in which you say that race is kinda moot... have you thought about the Daelkyr Half-blood and the Impure Prince prestige class, plus the symbionts? Sure, they are not amazingly powerful, but they seem to mesh well with fluff and some of them could give you what you are searching for: the Winter Cyst actually shoots Ice, while the Stormstalks shoots lighting. The tentacle whip could be useful (not sure about the tentacle attack). The Throwing Scarab and Tongue Worm could help you in projectile vomiting acid attacks. Plus, otherworldly surge from Impure Prince may be somewhat similar to Blood Moon orb (emphasis on "may")
Probably a druid entry would be better, but Impure Prince can advance *any* spellcasting, therefore with a Ranger level you'd be ok.

[Beardliest]

Mh... besides quoting exactly the post in which you say that race is kinda moot... have you thought about the Daelkyr Half-blood and the Impure Prince prestige class, plus the symbionts? Sure, they are not amazingly powerful, but they seem to mesh well with fluff and some of them could give you what you are searching for: the Winter Cyst actually shoots Ice, while the Stormstalks shoots lighting. The tentacle whip could be useful (not sure about the tentacle attack). The Throwing Scarab and Tongue Worm could help you in projectile vomiting acid attacks. Plus, otherworldly surge from Impure Prince may be somewhat similar to Blood Moon orb (emphasis on "may")
Probably a druid entry would be better, but Impure Prince can advance *any* spellcasting, therefore with a Ranger level you'd be ok.

I like the Impure Prince a lot. I don't know how well any Daelkyr Half-Blood would work because most of those symbionts would be detrimental to the build. I do enjoy the idea a lot, but it doesn't have too many practical applications that counter a -3 Intelligence or whatnot

[The Viscount]

I like the Impure Prince a lot. I don't know how well any Daelkyr Half-Blood would work because most of those symbionts would be detrimental to the build. I do enjoy the idea a lot, but it doesn't have too many practical applications that counter a -3 Intelligence or whatnot

I'm not sure which symbionts you're looking at, because the Daeklyr Half-Blood's list is all good ones. If nothing else, with enough levels the tongueworm gives immunity to poison. There's nothing to penalize your Int, so the only downside is not having human's skills and feat.

[CozJa]

so the only downside is not having human's skills and feat.

... and being creepy as hell! But that's not necessarily a downside

[Beardliest]

... and being creepy as hell! But that's not necessarily a downside

Creepy isn't a problem for this. I probably look like the craziest thing in all the realms.


I'm not sure which symbionts you're looking at, because the Daeklyr Half-Blood's list is all good ones. If nothing else, with enough levels the tongueworm gives immunity to poison. There's nothing to penalize your Int, so the only downside is not having human's skills and feat.

Oops. I saw the damage they do...and just didn't read that they say "attaching or removing" deals damage. Silly me.

Alright, so that is open now, but we have a few things we can't do.

For one, The Tentacle Whip. My group has gun rules, so I want one, but I can't wield anything in my off hand and have the Whip unless I have 3 or more arms (not opposed to that idea, maybe have the Obah-Blessed Template). I think I'd still prefer the Bracers of Entangling.

Throwing Scarab might be good in certain situations. I'd need to put away my sword in combat or throw them before combat, but I think it could work.

The Tongueworm attack is a bit situational, but I like the immunity to poison. However, I already have that.

Winter's Cyst and Stormstalk sounds really cool for this, especially the extra eyes which fits very well into lore.


For the Moonlight Blade if you want to focus more on the damaging aspect of the blast, you could sort of do it with Throwing and Returning, though it wouldn't visibly be a blast of arcane magic. You might be able to replicate it with a select Shadow Hand or Desert Wind maneuver (there are good items for these if you don't want to spend levels). Or would you prefer that the blast be inherent for the sword?

I was originally thinking of making it a +2 Holy Bastard Sword with Blast of Force as a Use Activated ability on it

[CozJa]

For one, The Tentacle Whip. My group has gun rules, so I want one, but I can't wield anything in my off hand and have the Whip unless I have 3 or more arms (not opposed to that idea, maybe have the Obah-Blessed Template). I think I'd still prefer the Bracers of Entangling.


Well... that's completely a DM call, since rules are not amazingly clear on it: fact is that fluff says that the tentacle whip attaches to the forearm and that the WIELDER cannot use another weapon or shield when he WIELDS it (basically it is saying it acts as a weapon). But the tentacle whip has two exclusive "modes", described in its rules: 1) you can wield it as a weapon, gaining all the benefits described or 2) you can have it attack on his own as an extra entity. I'd argue that when 2 happens, you are not actually "wielding" it, and I can see a character using a weapon in his hand (I can imagine a gun with a lesser crystal of return). I'd surely permit it in a game (after all having it act on his own is one rare case of extra action that may not be so beneficial to the player), but as I said, it's a DM call.

[Beardliest]

Well... that's completely a DM call, since rules are not amazingly clear on it: fact is that fluff says that the tentacle whip attaches to the forearm and that the WIELDER cannot use another weapon or shield when he WIELDS it (basically it is saying it acts as a weapon). But the tentacle whip has two exclusive "modes", described in its rules: 1) you can wield it as a weapon, gaining all the benefits described or 2) you can have it attack on his own as an extra entity. I'd argue that when 2 happens, you are not actually "wielding" it, and I can see a character using a weapon in his hand (I can imagine a gun with a lesser crystal of return). I'd surely permit it in a game (after all having it act on his own is one rare case of extra action that may not be so beneficial to the player), but as I said, it's a DM call.

I love all of you guys so much. These ideas and small bits of minutiae are really interesting.

On the comment, that does make sense. Thanks. I'll have to keep that in mind when it's introduced to a DM