Looking for roguish healer builds

[EldritchWeaver]

I'm in need of a character which can cover both rogue and dedicated healer. From the top of my head I can think only of some kind of cleric build, but considering dozens of classes and archetypes I'm surely missing some options. So I'm hoping that you help me out there. My detailed wishlist:



Can scout unseen, find and disable traps and open locks
Can heal hp damage, status effects and eventually raise dead
Using UMD is fine, but preferably healing is class-based (less costly after all)
Dealing damage is a secondary concern. Edit: Debuffing is preferred, as the primary blaster is a bit OP compared to the others and I don't need to step on others' toes there.
Race needs to be either small or medium, although shapeshifting like kitsune is ok. Preferably no racial HD and not more powerful than core races.
9th level build + suggestions for further leveling
Paizo only. Edit: SoP is now also allowed.


I prefer overall ease of running the character over power, as long the character can still hold on his own where they can't count on support (e.g. stealthing around). In case, some space for another niche is left, I'd be interested in rounding out the capabilities, but that is purely gravy.

[Elricaltovilla]

Give the Inquisitor class a look.

[Geddy2112]

A ratfolk chirougen alchemist is a very good healer, and gets breath of life(not quite raise dead but close) at level 10. At level 16 you can get the elixir of life extract to cast true ressurection on people.

Likewise, you get all your cure spells to act as infusions, and skill focus-heal at level 5. Ratfolk are small and have a dex bonus for good stealth, and being an alchemist gives you tons of stealth boosting stuff. You can get stealth as a class skill through a trait.

And done!

[Serafina]

Well, it's sadly not on the PFSRD yet, but the Alchemist gets a new archetype in the Healers Handbook called the Wasteland Blightbreaker.

I've written a bit about it here (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?512497-Alchemist-the-new-Oradin-like-Healer-(Optimization)). Essentially, you get to use Touch Injection (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic/all-spells/t/touch-injection) on healing extracts a unlimited amount of times per day - and as a swift action to boot. Get a bit of reach for your touch-attacks, and you'll be better at in-combat healing than a Cleric. At 8th-level, you even get to use a free-action Break Enchantment whenever an ally gets a benefit from one of your extracts.

You might be interested in taking the Chirurgeon (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/base-classes/alchemist/archetypes/paizo---alchemist-archetypes/chirurgeon) archetype, which grants Breath of Life as a known extract - it's not the ability to raise people long after they've died, but it's still handy.
Alternatively or additionally, the Sacrament Alchemist (also in the Healers Handbook) trades Mutagen for a cognaton (so, same duration and all) that gives -2 to Dexterity, but for it's duration gives you access to a domain. Abilities only, no spells - but the Resurrection subdomain (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/core-classes/cleric/domains/paizo---domains/healing-domain/resurrection) grants a temporary resurrection to an ally who has died within the last minute. It's only for a few rounds - but once they die again, you can simply use Breath of Life right thereafter. Oh, and the archetype also comes with a flexible discovery at fourth level, which is pretty neat.

Since all you really need for good stealth is good Dexterity and the skill, you can easily do that with the Alchemist too. You get Invisibility too, so you're actually better at it than the Rogue. You can also take the Chameleon (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/races/other-races/uncommon-races/arg-grippli/bogborn-alchemist-alchemist-grippli/chameleon-su) discovery if you just want to be extra-good at Stealth.

If you want the classic "sneak attack" build, that's also perfectly viable with the Vivisectionist (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/base-classes/alchemist/archetypes/paizo---alchemist-archetypes/vivisectionist) archetype. You trade out Bombs (which admittedly work well with a high dexterity) for sneak attack, with the same progression as the Rogue.

For trap-finding, you can either take a one-level dip into Unchained Rogue, take the Trap Finder (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/traits/campaign-traits/mummy-s-mask/trap-finder) trait, or take the not-so-great Crypt Breaker (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/base-classes/alchemist/archetypes/paizo---alchemist-archetypes/crypt-breaker) archetype.

[Giegue]

If you want a divine rogue with fullcasting instead of a half-caster like the bard or inquisitor or pseudo-caster like the alchemist then Oracle with the Seeker
Archetype is your best bet. Unlike the cleric, it gets a healthy 4+Int skills, which while no rogue, is better than the cleric's 2+Int. Additionally, the Seeker archetype gives you trapfinding like a rogue, as well as disable device as a auto class skill and bonuses to it.

If you want to maximum healing power, the ability to substitute for a rogue and don't care about damage I'd go with the life mystery and Seeker archetype on an oracle over the half-caster options. However, if you want to trade some healing power (but still be able to heal) for strong damage and more skills, inquisitor, bard and alchemist are all valid options too. Cleric sadly isn't though.

[Psyren]

Bards can be sneaky healers too

[GreyBlack]

Simple solution: Cleric VMC Rogue.

[CasualViking]

but the Resurrection subdomain (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/core-classes/cleric/domains/paizo---domains/healing-domain/resurrection) grants a temporary resurrection to an ally who has died within the last minute. It's only for a few rounds - but once they die again, you can simply use Breath of Life right thereafter.

Heh, that's a neat loophole. Whoever wrote BoL used the special case of "death by HP loss" as the general case.

[Serafina]

Simple solution: Cleric VMC Rogue.VMC Rogue basically does nothing what the OP actually wants, other than giving trapfinding. And even that it does poorly since the Cleric is still stuck with 2+Int skill points. That's barely enough to get Stealth and Disable Device, never mind stuff like Acrobatics, Perception or other things.


Anyway, since the OP asked for a build:
The Shadow Apothecary (https://hydra-media.cursecdn.com/hearthstone.gamepedia.com/9/94/Kabal_Chemist_full.jpg?version=2c5bcb50240afc7387f 83793822cc94c)
Race&Racial Traits: Elf. Blended View (Low-Light Vision & Darkvision 60 feet), Elven Immunities, Keen Senses (+2 Perception), Silent Hunter (no penalty for stealth while moving, -20 penalty while running), Weapon Familiarity (Longbows, Longswords, Rapiers, Shortswords, treat Elven weapons as martial)
Ability Scores (25 PB): Strength 13, Dexterity 16, Constitution 12, Intelligence 20, Wisdom 12, Charisma 10 (both increases went into Intelligence)
Classes&Archetypes: Alchemist 9 (Chirugeon, Sacrament Alchemist, Wasteland Blightbreaker), Sorcerer Variant Multiclass (Aberrant)
Traits: Trap Finder, Pragmatic Activator
Feats: Point-Blank Shot, Precise Shot, Lunging Spell Touch, Bonus Feat: Skill Focus (Heal)
Skills: You get 9 skill points per level. Max out Craft (Alchemy), Disable Device, Perception, Stealth and Use Magic Device. Some points in heal are appropriate, you need 6 ranks in Spellcraft, you can spend the rest as you like
Discoveries: Infusion, Explosive Missile, Chameleon, Fast Bombs
Equipment: an Admixture Vial (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic-items/wondrous-items/wondrous-items/a-b/admixture-vial) would be nice. Tangleshot Arrows (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/equipment---final/weapons/weapon-descriptions/ammunition/ammunition-bow-arrow-tanglefoot) and Raining Arrows (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/equipment---final/weapons/weapon-descriptions/ammunition/ammunition-bow-arrow-raining) fit very well too, as do other alchemical arrows.

This character can administer healing-infusions to any character within 15 feet as a swift action, provided they used touch injection on it before combat. If you use an Admixture Vial, these infusions can even contain buffs too. Using Enlarge Person increases that reach, and it'll go up by 5 feet at 11th and 17th level.
In combat, you're a decent-ish archer (though you're hardly great), the real danger comes from either your alchemical arrows or of course your bombs. You can shoot bombs with your longbow as a standard action, which can provide some decent long-range damage. You also have a discovery you can change once per day - during downtime, this enables a great many options, but if you go adventuring I'd recommend frost bombs or something similar.

The character also worships a deity, and needs to be within one alignment step of it. You get one the powers of one domain when you imbibe your sacramental cognatogen, but not it's spells or such. Honestly, you can pick whatever fits your character, but if you pick a deity with the Resurrection-subdomain (http://archivesofnethys.com/DomainDisplay.aspx?ItemName=Healing), and once per day you can help up an ally who just went down. At 10th level, you can make sure they stay up via Breath of Life. Note that this window is long enough that you can imbibe the cognatogen after an ally goes down, to avoid the -2 penalty. And there's probably some nice things you can take instead whenever you don't expect combat during that day.

For skills, you've got the whole Rogue-package, and can actually sneak pretty quickly thanks to being an elf. Invisibility and other extracts help a lot too, of course. Actually you're just great at Stealth, with good Dexterity, light armor, and a +4 bonus from the Chameleon discovery.

[EldritchWeaver]

Thanks for the various suggestions, I appreciate your help!:smallsmile:


Give the Inquisitor class a look.

Reading the class doesn't really give me an impression, how I could build it towards my needs. :smallfrown:


A ratfolk chirougen alchemist is a very good healer, and gets breath of life(not quite raise dead but close) at level 10. At level 16 you can get the elixir of life extract to cast true ressurection on people.

Likewise, you get all your cure spells to act as infusions, and skill focus-heal at level 5. Ratfolk are small and have a dex bonus for good stealth, and being an alchemist gives you tons of stealth boosting stuff. You can get stealth as a class skill through a trait.

And done!

Sounds like a simple enough build. I'll include it on my list of candidates.


Well, it's sadly not on the PFSRD yet, but the Alchemist gets a new archetype in the Healers Handbook called the Wasteland Blightbreaker.

I've written a bit about it here (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?512497-Alchemist-the-new-Oradin-like-Healer-(Optimization)). Essentially, you get to use Touch Injection (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic/all-spells/t/touch-injection) on healing extracts a unlimited amount of times per day - and as a swift action to boot. Get a bit of reach for your touch-attacks, and you'll be better at in-combat healing than a Cleric. At 8th-level, you even get to use a free-action Break Enchantment whenever an ally gets a benefit from one of your extracts.

You might be interested in taking the Chirurgeon (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/base-classes/alchemist/archetypes/paizo---alchemist-archetypes/chirurgeon) archetype, which grants Breath of Life as a known extract - it's not the ability to raise people long after they've died, but it's still handy.
Alternatively or additionally, the Sacrament Alchemist (also in the Healers Handbook) trades Mutagen for a cognaton (so, same duration and all) that gives -2 to Dexterity, but for it's duration gives you access to a domain. Abilities only, no spells - but the Resurrection subdomain (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/core-classes/cleric/domains/paizo---domains/healing-domain/resurrection) grants a temporary resurrection to an ally who has died within the last minute. It's only for a few rounds - but once they die again, you can simply use Breath of Life right thereafter. Oh, and the archetype also comes with a flexible discovery at fourth level, which is pretty neat.

Since all you really need for good stealth is good Dexterity and the skill, you can easily do that with the Alchemist too. You get Invisibility too, so you're actually better at it than the Rogue. You can also take the Chameleon (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/races/other-races/uncommon-races/arg-grippli/bogborn-alchemist-alchemist-grippli/chameleon-su) discovery if you just want to be extra-good at Stealth.

If you want the classic "sneak attack" build, that's also perfectly viable with the Vivisectionist (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/base-classes/alchemist/archetypes/paizo---alchemist-archetypes/vivisectionist) archetype. You trade out Bombs (which admittedly work well with a high dexterity) for sneak attack, with the same progression as the Rogue.

Thinking about further, being archery is preferred because melee is already used for two other characters. And I've never played a rogue anyway, so sneak attacking and its setup isn't familiar to me.


For trap-finding, you can either take a one-level dip into Unchained Rogue, take the Trap Finder (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/traits/campaign-traits/mummy-s-mask/trap-finder) trait, or take the not-so-great Crypt Breaker (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/base-classes/alchemist/archetypes/paizo---alchemist-archetypes/crypt-breaker) archetype.


Anyway, since the OP asked for a build:
The Shadow Apothecary (https://hydra-media.cursecdn.com/hearthstone.gamepedia.com/9/94/Kabal_Chemist_full.jpg?version=2c5bcb50240afc7387f 83793822cc94c)
Race&Racial Traits: Elf. Blended View (Low-Light Vision & Darkvision 60 feet), Elven Immunities, Keen Senses (+2 Perception), Silent Hunter (no penalty for stealth while moving, -20 penalty while running), Weapon Familiarity (Longbows, Longswords, Rapiers, Shortswords, treat Elven weapons as martial)
Ability Scores (25 PB): Strength 13, Dexterity 16, Constitution 12, Intelligence 20, Wisdom 12, Charisma 10 (both increases went into Intelligence)
Classes&Archetypes: Alchemist 9 (Chirugeon, Sacrament Alchemist, Wasteland Blightbreaker), Sorcerer Variant Multiclass (Aberrant)
Traits: Trap Finder, Pragmatic Activator
Feats: Point-Blank Shot, Precise Shot, Lunging Spell Touch, Bonus Feat: Skill Focus (Heal)
Skills: You get 9 skill points per level. Max out Craft (Alchemy), Disable Device, Perception, Stealth and Use Magic Device. Some points in heal are appropriate, you need 6 ranks in Spellcraft, you can spend the rest as you like
Discoveries: Infusion, Explosive Missile, Chameleon, Fast Bombs
Equipment: an Admixture Vial (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic-items/wondrous-items/wondrous-items/a-b/admixture-vial) would be nice. Tangleshot Arrows (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/equipment---final/weapons/weapon-descriptions/ammunition/ammunition-bow-arrow-tanglefoot) and Raining Arrows (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/equipment---final/weapons/weapon-descriptions/ammunition/ammunition-bow-arrow-raining) fit very well too, as do other alchemical arrows.

This character can administer healing-infusions to any character within 15 feet as a swift action, provided they used touch injection on it before combat. If you use an Admixture Vial, these infusions can even contain buffs too. Using Enlarge Person increases that reach, and it'll go up by 5 feet at 11th and 17th level.
In combat, you're a decent-ish archer (though you're hardly great), the real danger comes from either your alchemical arrows or of course your bombs. You can shoot bombs with your longbow as a standard action, which can provide some decent long-range damage. You also have a discovery you can change once per day - during downtime, this enables a great many options, but if you go adventuring I'd recommend frost bombs or something similar.

The character also worships a deity, and needs to be within one alignment step of it. You get one the powers of one domain when you imbibe your sacramental cognatogen, but not it's spells or such. Honestly, you can pick whatever fits your character, but if you pick a deity with the Resurrection-subdomain (http://archivesofnethys.com/DomainDisplay.aspx?ItemName=Healing), and once per day you can help up an ally who just went down. At 10th level, you can make sure they stay up via Breath of Life. Note that this window is long enough that you can imbibe the cognatogen after an ally goes down, to avoid the -2 penalty. And there's probably some nice things you can take instead whenever you don't expect combat during that day.

For skills, you've got the whole Rogue-package, and can actually sneak pretty quickly thanks to being an elf. Invisibility and other extracts help a lot too, of course. Actually you're just great at Stealth, with good Dexterity, light armor, and a +4 bonus from the Chameleon discovery.

Looking over the build, having reach healing looks nice and seems a better fit than the chirurgeon archetype alone. But I'll have to wait until it hits PFSRD to check this out in detail. As this is a reach build, you based it on a medium race? Is having the bow proficiency important here? Just wondering, if potentially replacing elf with ratfolk might make sense. Having to worship Sarenrae is fine with me. BTW, Blended View trades out Keen Senses, but darkvision is better than +2 to Perception.


If you want a divine rogue with fullcasting instead of a half-caster like the bard or inquisitor or pseudo-caster like the alchemist then Oracle with the Seeker
Archetype is your best bet. Unlike the cleric, it gets a healthy 4+Int skills, which while no rogue, is better than the cleric's 2+Int. Additionally, the Seeker archetype gives you trapfinding like a rogue, as well as disable device as a auto class skill and bonuses to it.

If you want to maximum healing power, the ability to substitute for a rogue and don't care about damage I'd go with the life mystery and Seeker archetype on an oracle over the half-caster options. However, if you want to trade some healing power (but still be able to heal) for strong damage and more skills, inquisitor, bard and alchemist are all valid options too. Cleric sadly isn't though.

Oracle sounds interesting considering it is a spontaneous caster. Less headache in choosing spells compared to a cleric. Any recommendation regarding a curse? Should I take one which does not really impact my character or is there a good option hidden in the list?


Bards can be sneaky healers too

Sadly that is too close to the semi-bard of the group. I really don't want to step on anyone's toes.


Simple solution: Cleric VMC Rogue.


VMC Rogue basically does nothing what the OP actually wants, other than giving trapfinding. And even that it does poorly since the Cleric is still stuck with 2+Int skill points. That's barely enough to get Stealth and Disable Device, never mind stuff like Acrobatics, Perception or other things.

Also cleric is too burdened with prepared casting for my tastes. :smallfrown:

[legomaster00156]

It's something of a strange choice, but have you considered a Spheres of Power Hedgewitch (http://spheresofpower.wikidot.com/hedgewitch)? You can grab the Charlatanism and Herbology traditions, paired with a Life sphere focus.

[Gnaeus]

Another possibility might be mesmerist. It would need UMD for healing HP damage, but it's pretty solid at healing/avoiding conditions and preventing damage, and it fills the skillmonkey role well without overlapping too much with your bard.

[Serafina]

Sure, you can swap out the race as much as you like. You can even go small - it hurts your ability to use Enlarge Person, but not any other means of getting reach.

The Bow-Proficiency is not strictly necessary.
I'd recommend a Launching Crossbow (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/equipment---final/weapons/weapon-descriptions/crossbow-launching), but that requires Crossbow Mastery (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/feats/combat-feats/crossbow-mastery-combat) to work well and you're a bit feat-starved with taking Variant Multiclass and Lunging Spell-Touch for your reach-increase.
You can just mostly use your bombs, and use a regular light crossbow as a backup weapon. It's not quite as effective due to the need to reload, but it's still pretty decent.
Alternatively, you can just use splash weapons in case you run out of bombs - you can craft them cheaply, some have nice effects, but their damage will eventually fall quite a bit behind so I would recommend having a weapon either way.

Ratfolk do actually make excellent Alchemists, with perfect ability scores if you don't want to go into melee, and the perfect favored class bonus.
You'll have to deal with just the Alchemists weapon proficiencies, but as mentioned above that can be quite alright.

For higher levels, you'll probably want to continue picking up ranged combat feats, though really your build is "complete" pretty soon and you can just take other things. There's always useful stuff like Improved Initiative or Iron Will, both of which you can also pick as a bonus feat from your VMC at 11th level.

As for Discoveries, you might like Healing Touch (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/base-classes/alchemist/discoveries/paizo---alchemist-discoveries/healing-touch-ex). A 12th-level Alchemist could heal 60 hit points per day with it, which is about 11 cure light wounds. Actually it's mostly good for out-of combat healing, except the prerequisite spontaneous healing discovery is pretty great at keeping you alive in combat.
A Tumor Familiar is always great because, well, familiars are great and it's just one discovery away. Make it a figment, and it can even scout very safely.
Combine Extracts usually sucks - but you get great action economy out of it. Specifically, if you combine a non-healing extract with a healing-extract, it's still eligible for your unlimited touch injection - and as such, you can deliver it at range via a swift action, or as a swift action to yourself. That's actually worth the two-level increase
Alchemical Simulacrum could be great if you want to cover more area with healing, effectively allowing you to be in two places at once. Well, the greater version at least is good.
You'll probably want Elixir of Life (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/base-classes/alchemist/discoveries/paizo---alchemist-discoveries/elixir-of-life) once you hit level 16, at least if you want to bring back people who have been dead for more than a minute. It's even effective protection against a lot of TPKs.

The Sacrament Alchemist replaces your Mutagen and prevents you from taking the Mutagen and Cognatogen discoveries - but NOT (probably due to an oversight) the Inspiring Cognatogen (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/base-classes/alchemist/discoveries/paizo---alchemist-discoveries/inspiring-cognatogen-su) discovery. It's a nice booster for skills and saves, though really it's probably best for out-of-combat uses, such as for disabling traps, or during downtime. With the upgrades, you basically turn into a veritable scholar and smooth-talker too, though it really ruins your combat effectiveness in a lot of ways.

It's worth remembering that you can "once per day while preparing extracts, for a period of 24 hours, gain an alchemist discovery for which you qualify" (from the Sacrament Alchemist archetype). That's excellent for trying out some of the weirder infusions, or just use Inspiring Cognatogen during your non-adventuring time or the like where you don't need it to upgrade your bombs.

[stack]

It's something of a strange choice, but have you considered a Spheres of Power Hedgewitch (http://spheresofpower.wikidot.com/hedgewitch)? You can grab the Charlatanism and Herbology traditions, paired with a Life sphere focus.

No 3pp specified in the OP. EldritchWeaver is very familiar with SoP.

Though on that build I would drop herbalism and take either the triple goddess archetype for full life CL or spiritualism to pick up niche life talents on the fly. Triple goddess would want to get spiritualism via secrets.

[EldritchWeaver]

It's something of a strange choice, but have you considered a Spheres of Power Hedgewitch (http://spheresofpower.wikidot.com/hedgewitch)? You can grab the Charlatanism and Herbology traditions, paired with a Life sphere focus.


No 3pp specified in the OP. EldritchWeaver is very familiar with SoP.

Though on that build I would drop herbalism and take either the triple goddess archetype for full life CL or spiritualism to pick up niche life talents on the fly. Triple goddess would want to get spiritualism via secrets.

Actually, regarding no SoP: When I wanted to answer why no SoP, I couldn't remember why exactly my GM banned that choice, so I talked about it with him. So the actual reason is that the other players need to buy in as well. Which means that I can at least collect SoP builds, too. I'll amend the original post. Considering Life benefits from full CL, the triple goddess is a nice choice. But what about Covenant as an alternative/addition to Spiritualism (which grants flexibility)? Channeling seems to be an alternative here.

Just thought of it: Does the Life handbook something interesting? Haven't looked at it for months.


Another possibility might be mesmerist. It would need UMD for healing HP damage, but it's pretty solid at healing/avoiding conditions and preventing damage, and it fills the skillmonkey role well without overlapping too much with your bard.

Reading mesmerist, I'm not really enamored with this class. I prefer the mechanics of SoP's Eliciter here, but I don't know if that class is working as healer, considering that only Mind is getting a full caster level.

[stack]

Well, hedgewitch, so 'all of the above' is an option via secrets.

I'd have to look at life again to remember if anything stands out for a hedgewitch, but it's not in open playtest yet so might be a hard sell regardless.

[Serafina]

It's worth noting that if you go for the Alchemist build, but don't want to play an Elf or Half-Elf, it might be worth getting Longbow proficiency via trait.
Hunter's Eye (http://www.pfsdb.com/traits/hunters-eye) was once a trait for Pathfinder Society, but is no longer available there and not on either the PFSRD or Archives of Nethys. Still, worth asking the GM about because it's better and more importantly creates less hassle than
Heirloom Weapon (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/traits/equipment-traits/heirloom-weapon). You'll eventually need a spellcaster to cast masterwork transformation on it so that it can be turned into a magical weapon, and you could lose the proficiency if you lose the weapon. Unless you get around that by retraining the trait into itself - which actually makes fluff-sense (you're training until you're proficient with the new weapon), but lacks due to there no being official rules for retraining traits. So either you pick up Heirloom Weapon via the Extra Traits feat (not necessarily a bad idea) and then retrain that, or you just pay the cost for retraining and set it somewhere between retraining a feat and half a feat.

[EldritchWeaver]

Thanks for showing me where Hunter's Eye can be found. I was looking for it once as I saw it in an alchemist guide. I've been thinking about using it for the Hedgewitch, too, but with the Triple Goddess archetype I get full CL to Death as well, which is a medium range debuff sphere. Something which is quite useful in my group as there isn't anyone else doing it.

That at least clarified for me, what I exactly need from this character: Skills, ranged healing and debuffing preferred over straight damage. Looking over the inquisitor guides, healing falls behind other options. So at least I have one choice less to worry about. I'm going to create the builds for the other classes to see how they compare to the detailed one from Serafina. It would be too bad if the stuff I need doesn't come online early enough or can't be done thanks to a lack resources and I'd only notice after committing to that particular class.

[Serafina]

Ranged healing is sadly WAY too hard to do. At least outside of 3rd party material that specifically fixes the issue.
You either get a familiar to deliver touch spells - which either takes a few feats, or playing a Shaman or Witch.
Or you can use Life Link via Oracle (VMC or not), but that only heals 5 hitpoints per turn - great to prolong an allies durability or to prevent them from dying, insufficient for a big heal.
Or you could use Reach Spell metamagic, but that increases spell level and thus isn't that desirable.

Then you have the problem that anything but "prevent an ally from dying", "heal a debilitating condition" or "use the Heal-spell" is better done after combat, simply due to your Standard-action being put to better use.
So far, there were only two ways to get around that:
Either Spell Perfection on Heal combined with metamagic reduction, which could give you a Quickened Reach Heal. At 15th-level, for the cost of three feats and two traits.
Or some class abilities, mostly Paladins Lay on Hands or Warpriests Fervor - those only healed yourself when used as a swift action, so you needed Life Link to heal allies with it.

That's why I'm rather excited about the Wasteland Blightbreaker, because if built the right way you get ranged healing, as a swift action, even with a free-action unlimited/day Break Enchantment. That's basically the perfect combination of things - and on an archetype that can be combined with a lot of others, on a class that isn't too overpowered.

[EldritchWeaver]

I agree with ranged healing being problematic. At least SoP has a talent which mitigates this at no further cost at casting time. Considering that the Oracle has an SoP archetype, that would provide me with a workaround. Assuming I can use SoP. Otherwise having to wait until level 15 before having ranged healing down is quite a long time IRL, considering that I start with level 9.

[EldritchWeaver]

I'm still busy with building the various classes, but I noticed something interesting. The Ectoplasm bloodline does grant a kind of reach spell at no cost and unlimited to boot. Only disadvantage is the slow scaling and that you need invest three feats at least.

[Serafina]

I'm still busy with building the various classes, but I noticed something interesting. The Ectoplasm bloodline does grant a kind of reach spell at no cost and unlimited to boot. Only disadvantage is the slow scaling and that you need invest three feats at least.That's the exact same effect than with the Aberrant Bloodline I was referring to in my build - both grant +5/10/15 feet to your reach for touch-attacks only.

Ectoplasm is better if you enter via Eldrich Heritage feats, Aberrant if you go for Variant Multiclassing.
Ectoplasm requires Skill Focus (Stealth) instead of Skill Focus (Knowledge (Dungeoneering)) if you enter via feats - a marked advantage. Though entry via feat also has the disadvantage of requiring at least 15 Charisma, which isn't cheap to get.
On the other hand, Aberrant offers better bloodline feats (of which you get one at 11th level if you go for VMC) and while both 1st-level powers are pretty meh, getting a 50% chance to ignore precision damage and criticals and spell resistance is much better than gaseous form and black tentacles as SLAs.

Of course there's also a difference in flavor - Ectoplasms "commune with spirits" fits better for a lot of healers than Abberants heritage does.

[Talieth]

Hi,

Occult Adventures give you the Kineticist. With Aether as first element, and water for expanded element, you can do nearly everything you describe in the OP :
Can scout unseen, find and disable traps and open locks : Aether give you at will/permanent invisibility
Can heal hp damage, status effects and eventually raise dead : kinetic healer (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/occult-adventures/occult-classes/kineticist#TOC-Utility-Wild-Talents#TOC-Kinetic-Healer) cover the HP part. I think there are a few feat/talent that expand on this in the recent healer handbook
Using UMD is fine, but preferably healing is class-based (less costly after all)
Dealing damage is a secondary concern : your kinetic blast is a reliable way to deal some damage
Race needs to be either small or medium, although shapeshifting like kitsune is ok. Preferably no racial HD and not more powerful than core races. : Gnome and Halfling are very good for kineticist.
9th level build + suggestions for further leveling
Paizo only. Edit: SoP is now also allowed.

Lvl 9 Build :

Thommen
Halfling telekineticist 9/rogue* (Pathfinder RPG Occult Adventures 10)
CG Small humanoid (halfling)
Init +6; Senses Perception +14
--------------------
Defense
--------------------
AC 26, touch 17, flat-footed 20 (+5 armor, +6 Dex, +2 natural, +2 shield, +1 size)
hp 119 (9d8+71)
Fort +12, Ref +13, Will +4; +2 vs. fear
Defensive Abilities fortification 15%
--------------------
Offense
--------------------
Speed 30 ft.
Special Attacks kinetic blast, metakinesis (empower, maximize), sneak attack +1d6
Kineticist Wild Talents Known
. . Defense—force ward
. . Infusions—bowling infusion, extended range, foe throw (DC 20), pushing infusion
. . Blasts—aetheric boost (), electric blast (5d6+8 electricity), telekinetic blast (5d6+16)
. . Utility—air shroud, basic aerokinesis, basic telekinesis, kinetic healer, telekinetic finesse, telekinetic haul, telekinetic invisibility
--------------------
Statistics
--------------------
Str 8, Dex 22, Con 21, Int 14, Wis 10, Cha 10
Base Atk +6; CMB +4; CMD 20
Feats Extra Wild Talent[OA], Point-Blank Shot, Precise Shot
Traits dangerously curious, vagabond child (urban)
Skills Disable Device +21, Knowledge (arcana) +4, Knowledge (dungeoneering) +4, Knowledge (nature) +4, Knowledge (planes) +4, Knowledge (religion) +3, Perception +14, Sleight of Hand +18, Stealth +22, Use Magic Device +13; Racial Modifiers +2 Perception
Languages Common, Elven, Goblin, Halfling
SQ burn (3 points/round, max 8), elemental overflow +3, expanded element (air), gather power, infusion specialization 2, internal buffer 1, trapfinding +4
Other Gear +1 mithral shirt, +1 mithral buckler, amulet of natural armor +2, belt of physical might +2 (Dex, Con), 23,895 gp
--------------------
Tracked Resources
--------------------
Burn 3/round (9 nonlethal/burn, 8/day) - 3/8
--------------------
Special Abilities
--------------------
Aetheric Boost (Sp) Level 4; Burn 2
Air Shroud (Su) Constantly under the effects of air bubble.
Bowling Infusion Blast also trips foes.
Burn 3/round (9 nonlethal/burn, 8/day) Burn HP to gain greater effects on your wild talents.
Electric Blast (Sp) Level 4; Burn 0
Elemental Overflow +3/+6 (Max +3, +2 CON, +2 DEX, 15% fortification) (Ex) Gain a bonus to hit and damage with your blast when you use burn.
Expanded Element This is a dummy ability to consolidate the expanded elements into a single entry in the statblock. We can't do this through the normal channels, because both primary and expanded elements are added to the same table on the class.
Extended Range Kinetic blast has range of 120ft.
Fearless +2 bonus to save vs. fear (stacks with halfling luck).
Foe Throw (DC 20) Throw a creature if it fails its save.
Fortification 15% You have a chance to negate critical hits on attacks.
Gather Power (Su) Move: reduce the burn cost of a blast by 1 or Full-round: reduce the burn cost of a blast by 2
Infusion Specialization 2 (Ex) Reduce burn cost of blasts with infusions by 2
Internal Buffer 1 (Su) Store burn for use later
Kinetic Blast (Sp) The kineticist can unleash her kinetic blast at a range of 30 feet at will.
Kinetic Healer (Sp) Heal others equal to your blast damage
Metakinesis (Su) By accepting burn you affect your kinetic blast as if using a metamagic ability.
Point-Blank Shot +1 to attack and damage rolls with ranged weapons at up to 30 feet.
Precise Shot You don't get -4 to hit when shooting or throwing into melee.
Pushing Infusion (CMB +10) Your kinetic blasts makes Bull Rush CMB using Con.
Sneak Attack +1d6 Attacks deal extra dam if flank foe or if foe is flat-footed.
Telekinetic Blast (Sp) Level 4; Burn 0
Telekinetic Finesse (Sp) Use telekinesis to perform Sleight of Hand and Disable Device checks.
Telekinetic Haul (Sp) Move an object that weighs up to 100 lbs. per kineticist level.
Telekinetic Invisibility (Sp) Grants invisibility
Trapfinding +4 Gain a bonus to find or disable traps, including magical ones.


This build use VMC rogue which is good, because the kineticist doesn't have many "prerequisite" feats (here is Point-Blank Shot and precise Shot, but you could swap them for Toughness and Iron Will, or Iron Will and the feat that give you a familiar...)
Another way to go, if your DM accept it, is to take the trapfinder trait : you don't need rogue VMC anymore and can get two more feat (or another VMC)

[NamelessNPC]

A possessed shaman (life spirit) gets 7 ranks per level (3 of those use wisdom instead of their normal ability score), full casting, a familiar to deliver touch spells and healing and condition removal a plenty. Trapfinding is a trait away.
If you want a small race, gripplis get +2 to wis and dex, -2 str and the FCB lets them add a druid spell to the spell list.

[EldritchWeaver]

Hi,

Occult Adventures give you the Kineticist. With Aether as first element, and water for expanded element, you can do nearly everything you describe in the OP :
Can scout unseen, find and disable traps and open locks : Aether give you at will/permanent invisibility
Can heal hp damage, status effects and eventually raise dead : kinetic healer (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/occult-adventures/occult-classes/kineticist#TOC-Utility-Wild-Talents#TOC-Kinetic-Healer) cover the HP part. I think there are a few feat/talent that expand on this in the recent healer handbook
Using UMD is fine, but preferably healing is class-based (less costly after all)
Dealing damage is a secondary concern : your kinetic blast is a reliable way to deal some damage
Race needs to be either small or medium, although shapeshifting like kitsune is ok. Preferably no racial HD and not more powerful than core races. : Gnome and Halfling are very good for kineticist.
9th level build + suggestions for further leveling
Paizo only. Edit: SoP is now also allowed.

Lvl 9 Build :

Thommen
Halfling telekineticist 9/rogue* (Pathfinder RPG Occult Adventures 10)
CG Small humanoid (halfling)
Init +6; Senses Perception +14
--------------------
Defense
--------------------
AC 26, touch 17, flat-footed 20 (+5 armor, +6 Dex, +2 natural, +2 shield, +1 size)
hp 119 (9d8+71)
Fort +12, Ref +13, Will +4; +2 vs. fear
Defensive Abilities fortification 15%
--------------------
Offense
--------------------
Speed 30 ft.
Special Attacks kinetic blast, metakinesis (empower, maximize), sneak attack +1d6
Kineticist Wild Talents Known
. . Defense—force ward
. . Infusions—bowling infusion, extended range, foe throw (DC 20), pushing infusion
. . Blasts—aetheric boost (), electric blast (5d6+8 electricity), telekinetic blast (5d6+16)
. . Utility—air shroud, basic aerokinesis, basic telekinesis, kinetic healer, telekinetic finesse, telekinetic haul, telekinetic invisibility
--------------------
Statistics
--------------------
Str 8, Dex 22, Con 21, Int 14, Wis 10, Cha 10
Base Atk +6; CMB +4; CMD 20
Feats Extra Wild Talent[OA], Point-Blank Shot, Precise Shot
Traits dangerously curious, vagabond child (urban)
Skills Disable Device +21, Knowledge (arcana) +4, Knowledge (dungeoneering) +4, Knowledge (nature) +4, Knowledge (planes) +4, Knowledge (religion) +3, Perception +14, Sleight of Hand +18, Stealth +22, Use Magic Device +13; Racial Modifiers +2 Perception
Languages Common, Elven, Goblin, Halfling
SQ burn (3 points/round, max 8), elemental overflow +3, expanded element (air), gather power, infusion specialization 2, internal buffer 1, trapfinding +4
Other Gear +1 mithral shirt, +1 mithral buckler, amulet of natural armor +2, belt of physical might +2 (Dex, Con), 23,895 gp
--------------------
Tracked Resources
--------------------
Burn 3/round (9 nonlethal/burn, 8/day) - 3/8
--------------------
Special Abilities
--------------------
Aetheric Boost (Sp) Level 4; Burn 2
Air Shroud (Su) Constantly under the effects of air bubble.
Bowling Infusion Blast also trips foes.
Burn 3/round (9 nonlethal/burn, 8/day) Burn HP to gain greater effects on your wild talents.
Electric Blast (Sp) Level 4; Burn 0
Elemental Overflow +3/+6 (Max +3, +2 CON, +2 DEX, 15% fortification) (Ex) Gain a bonus to hit and damage with your blast when you use burn.
Expanded Element This is a dummy ability to consolidate the expanded elements into a single entry in the statblock. We can't do this through the normal channels, because both primary and expanded elements are added to the same table on the class.
Extended Range Kinetic blast has range of 120ft.
Fearless +2 bonus to save vs. fear (stacks with halfling luck).
Foe Throw (DC 20) Throw a creature if it fails its save.
Fortification 15% You have a chance to negate critical hits on attacks.
Gather Power (Su) Move: reduce the burn cost of a blast by 1 or Full-round: reduce the burn cost of a blast by 2
Infusion Specialization 2 (Ex) Reduce burn cost of blasts with infusions by 2
Internal Buffer 1 (Su) Store burn for use later
Kinetic Blast (Sp) The kineticist can unleash her kinetic blast at a range of 30 feet at will.
Kinetic Healer (Sp) Heal others equal to your blast damage
Metakinesis (Su) By accepting burn you affect your kinetic blast as if using a metamagic ability.
Point-Blank Shot +1 to attack and damage rolls with ranged weapons at up to 30 feet.
Precise Shot You don't get -4 to hit when shooting or throwing into melee.
Pushing Infusion (CMB +10) Your kinetic blasts makes Bull Rush CMB using Con.
Sneak Attack +1d6 Attacks deal extra dam if flank foe or if foe is flat-footed.
Telekinetic Blast (Sp) Level 4; Burn 0
Telekinetic Finesse (Sp) Use telekinesis to perform Sleight of Hand and Disable Device checks.
Telekinetic Haul (Sp) Move an object that weighs up to 100 lbs. per kineticist level.
Telekinetic Invisibility (Sp) Grants invisibility
Trapfinding +4 Gain a bonus to find or disable traps, including magical ones.


This build use VMC rogue which is good, because the kineticist doesn't have many "prerequisite" feats (here is Point-Blank Shot and precise Shot, but you could swap them for Toughness and Iron Will, or Iron Will and the feat that give you a familiar...)
Another way to go, if your DM accept it, is to take the trapfinder trait : you don't need rogue VMC anymore and can get two more feat (or another VMC)

I missed to edit to the OP previously, but having a way to debuff enemies is preferred. That avoids stepping on the others' characters toes best. I haven't read the Kineticist yet, so I don't know if that can be covered, too.


A possessed shaman (life spirit) gets 7 ranks per level (3 of those use wisdom instead of their normal ability score), full casting, a familiar to deliver touch spells and healing and condition removal a plenty. Trapfinding is a trait away.
If you want a small race, gripplis get +2 to wis and dex, -2 str and the FCB lets them add a druid spell to the spell list.

I'll have to check out this class later as well.

[Talieth]

I missed to edit to the OP previously, but having a way to debuff enemies is preferred. That avoids stepping on the others' characters toes best. I haven't read the Kineticist yet, so I don't know if that can be covered, too.

Kineticist can do that, too. But not as well as a dedicated control wizard or maneuver fighter.

Just in the build I provided : Pushing Infusion and Bowling Infusion allow you respectively to bull rush and trip your kinetic blast target. Telekinetic Haul allow you to move an object that weighs up to 100 lbs/lvl. If i am not mistaken (I use metric system), at lvl9 that make you able to move something like an adult cow without burn, at will while invisible to act like a mobile cover, bridge, obstacle ... and last but not least, you got the Foe Throw infusion which allow you to launch a foe at your target, which could be another foe, the wall nearby, or someplace not on the narrow mountain path you're fighting on.

Then there are other infusions for your kinetic blast : thundering infusion can deafen, the "wall" one act like the spells : make a wall with your element.

And the disable trap part ? you do it from a distance, while invisible so even in case of critical failure, you may not even be in the area of effect.

But then, I am really in love with the kineticist, and the other build and ideas looks all very interesting :D

[EldritchWeaver]

I have built the healer's handbook alchemist with HeroLab now and noticed two issues with the suggestion. The minor one is that I get only 3 discoveries, maybe an additional is traded away due the archetypes. The bigger one is that I can't see where the unlimited healing is supposed to come from. Touch Injection seems to only grant one use of this ability, swift healing infusions is based on this and still requires to be charged separately for each use. So what do I miss?

[Serafina]

I have built the healer's handbook alchemist with HeroLab now and noticed two issues with the suggestion. The minor one is that I get only 3 discoveries, maybe an additional is traded away due the archetypes. The bigger one is that I can't see where the unlimited healing is supposed to come from. Touch Injection seems to only grant one use of this ability, swift healing infusions is based on this and still requires to be charged separately for each use. So what do I miss?You don't get unlimited healing. You get your normal amount of extracts, and at most some extra healing via the right discoveries.

What you DO get is multiple uses of touch injection - in fact, you get unlimited uses per day, on [healing] subschool extracts only. And there is no stated limit on the amount of touch injections one can have absorbed at any one time (though you an only deliver one per action).
So you charge up before combat by absorbing every (or almost every, if you want to hand some out to allies) healing infusion you have.


Life Link DOES offer unlimited healing per day once you have a way to get regeneration/fast healing on yourself - you absorb all the damage from allies, then slowly regenerate it out of combat. This usually requires an item, and several minutes or more to restore everyones health. If you want that, it's a possible option via VMC or a 1-level dip into Oracle (go for the latter) and Boots of the Earth which cost 5000 gp and give fast healing 1 if you spend an action and don't move.

But unlimited out-of-combat healing is certainly nice, but also available via wands of cure light wounds - which cost 375 gp on the market (half that to craft) and heal an average of 225 HP. You can afford 22 of those for the price of Boots of the Earth, and while you can safe money with those in the long run they're actually slower with their healing too.


That's why, when I think "Healer" I don't think of a specific class, because really anyone with some money and some ranks in UMD can do it. Instead, you'd want someone who can heal allies in combat - and I already explained the challenges there, and how to (mostly) overcome them.