Can monster use ready actions?

[Vectros]

Have an idea for an up coming fight on a ready action a Minotaur Skeleton could use. I believe it's legal by the book. As a follow up, would you consider this a legal ready action:

"If an enemy steps into the entrance to this hallway, Minotaur will run at them (about 20 feet) and attempt the Gore attack"). I'm not sure this would be considered legal since it involved both movement and and attack. I mean, I guess I am the DM and I could rule it legal-but I don't want to pull a move most would see as cheap or illegal. Thoughts?

[Beleriphon]

Have an idea for an up coming fight on a ready action a Minotaur Skeleton could use. I believe it's legal by the book. As a follow up, would you consider this a legal ready action:

"If an enemy steps into the entrance to this hallway, Minotaur will run at them (about 20 feet) and attempt the Gore attack"). I'm not sure this would be considered legal since it involved both movement and and attack. I mean, I guess I am the DM and I could rule it legal-but I don't want to pull a move most would see as cheap or illegal. Thoughts?

Yes monsters can use readied actions. The action provided its a legal action in the rules should be able to be readied.

[Coffee_Dragon]

It is as you say: monsters can use Ready actions for sure, but they should follow the normal rules for those unless you deliberately give them abilities to the contrary.

How about this charge-ready skeleton has an ability to get advantage on its initiative roll, and if it wins, then this charge is pretty much what it does on its first turn?

[Hawkstar]

You cannot use the ready action outside of combat. The minotaur skeleton needs to wait for initiative to be rolled then wait for it's turn before it can ready an action. Readying an action cannot include movement, unless it's a dash or disengage action.

[Vectros]

Ok, that's what I was kind of thinking.
@Dragon well the situation is a little odd. Basically, the group has been traveling with the BBEG for most of the questline. It'll be revealed at this cave who he is, where he'll retreat into a secret passage-with plenty of skeletal warriors and minotaurs waiting. I was wanting to have the minotaur basically wait in the hallway and do a sort of surprise charge when they pursue.

Guess I'll have to think of something else, thanks for the help guys.

[Coffee_Dragon]

Readying an action cannot include movement, unless it's a dash or disengage action.

I think the bolded part is not correct? You can choose an action, or move up to your speed. Dash and Disengage don't involve movement, they just affect movement.

[Mellack]

You may ready an action OR a move, not both. So move and attack is out. Also you can only ready after initiative, or else everything breaks down as all combatants would always just have an action readied.

[RickAllison]

You may ready an action OR a move, not both. So move and attack is out. Also you can only ready after initiative, or else everything breaks down as all combatants would always just have an action readied.

See, I never got the complaint that all combatants would have an action readied. It only works if the person specifically readies an action. THere are weird corner cases, but readied actions do not help with an ambush (they would be surprised and so not have a reaction to spend to use it), they have to have a specific trigger (so yes, charging a defender who sees you coming is a bad idea as they can prepare to strike you. This is realistic) so they have no control over how the action goes without specifically setting an ambush with knowledge, and it allows for things that characters should realistically be able to do, like throwing a Fireball into a room as soon as a friend opens it. How would it cause everything to break down? Please explain it for me.

[Mellack]

Allowing everyone to ready leads to issues. Some examples: PCs are clearing a dungeon, they could easily have weapons out to attack whenever a hostile is spotted. You see some baddies and everyone gets a free shot/throw. When does that happen exactly? A common situation is the PCs opening a door. Unless they were able to stealth (not often in my experience) both sides are ready for each other. Everyone would have readied actions to attack, cast, run, ect. How do you decide order? It seems that is exactly what initative is designed to do. So you are effectively back to acting in initative order and have accomplished nothing.

[MrStabby]

So simple answer is - you are DM, do what you want.

The more useful answer is what would be reasonable/fun.

The way I would run it is that an NPC cant ready an action unless they have a reason to ready an action. Get the Minotaur to make a perception check opposed by a stealth roll to see if he hears people around in order to ready an action.

As for move and attack not being an action - there is no rule that they can't do this. Legendary actions like a dragons wing buffet include an aggressive component and a movement component. All you need to do is give your Minotaur NPC the ability to get a move as part of the attack action - say give them the choice of both a charge attack and a multiattack action and then the rules for the NPC are even consistent with the PC rules whilst you are still doing nothing that unusual for monsters.

Does it add fun to the fight? Will having a sudden surprise minotaur in the face make the encounter more or less fun for the players? If it enhances fun at the table then do it.

[Contrast]

Ok, that's what I was kind of thinking.
@Dragon well the situation is a little odd. Basically, the group has been traveling with the BBEG for most of the questline. It'll be revealed at this cave who he is, where he'll retreat into a secret passage-with plenty of skeletal warriors and minotaurs waiting. I was wanting to have the minotaur basically wait in the hallway and do a sort of surprise charge when they pursue.

Guess I'll have to think of something else, thanks for the help guys.

Simple solution would be to see what the PCs do. If they charge head first round the corner with no caution then you get a surprise round to pull off your (surprise) charge. If they approach it more cautiously then you may not get your surprise but the villian will have more time to get away.

Or set it up more sneakily to give you a better chance of getting the surprise round. The skeleton is hidden inside a fake statue of a minotaur and bursts out as they/when they have walked past for example.

[coredump]

Forget ready action.

Just decide the Minotaur Suprises them. Then he gets the mice and attack.

[Squiddish]

It can use this if it has a feature that lets it automatically attack on moving.

[Malifice]

I think the bolded part is not correct? You can choose an action, or move up to your speed. Dash and Disengage don't involve movement, they just affect movement.

The Dash action (when you take it) lets you move your speed. Its perfectly legal to ready.

'If the Wizard drops, I'll run [dash] over to him'. If the wizard drops, your readied action [the dash action] is triggered, and you move your speed to the prone Wizard.

A lot of people mistakenly think the dash action doubles your speed. It doesnt. It just lets you move your speed as an action.

The disengage action could be readied, but its kind of pointless to do so. You'd be much better off readying the dodge action.

[Malifice]

Allowing everyone to ready leads to issues. Some examples: PCs are clearing a dungeon, they could easily have weapons out to attack whenever a hostile is spotted. You see some baddies and everyone gets a free shot/throw. When does that happen exactly? A common situation is the PCs opening a door. Unless they were able to stealth (not often in my experience) both sides are ready for each other. Everyone would have readied actions to attack, cast, run, ect. How do you decide order? It seems that is exactly what initative is designed to do. So you are effectively back to acting in initative order and have accomplished nothing.

Thats why you cant ready 'outside' of combat. Ready only exists to deal with issues arising from the abstraction of initiative determined turn based cyclical combat.

It requires the presence of an initiative count and turns, and these things only exist during the combat sequence, not during exploration.

The assumption is everyone is ready for combat all the time. For those times that you are not ready, the surprise rules kick in.

[RickAllison]

I can see the arguments for not using the formalized Ready action outside of combat. I still think characters should be able to reasonably have an equivalent for when they are preparing to do something. As a DM, I reserve the right for the ambushing NPCs to fire a volley of arrows into the doorway when it opens. By that same token, the players should be able to throw a Fireball in with a preset destination. Settle debates with the initiative bonus.

[Mellack]

If they can surprise, then the PCs get to do what they want during that round. If they do not, then the initiative decides if the bad guys get to react and interrupt what the PCs planned to do. For your fireball example, the wizard may plan to shoot that fireball in as soon as the fighter opens the door. If they didn't get surprise, then an orc might react faster and shoot the wizard before he gets his spell off. That is the purpose of having initiative, to decide order. As the old maxim goes, no plan survives contact with the enemy.

As to the OP, monsters do not use player rules. Give them a power that you think makes it most interesting. Just realize they are powers and adjust the difficulty accordingly.

[coredump]

The Dash action (when you take it) lets you move your speed. Its perfectly legal to ready.

'If the Wizard drops, I'll run [dash] over to him'. If the wizard drops, your readied action [the dash action] is triggered, and you move your speed to the prone Wizard.

A lot of people mistakenly think the dash action doubles your speed. It doesnt. It just lets you move your speed as an action.

The disengage action could be readied, but its kind of pointless to do so. You'd be much better off readying the dodge action.

Nope. It increases your allowed movement. It doesn't include actually moving.

[Malifice]

I can see the arguments for not using the formalized Ready action outside of combat. I still think characters should be able to reasonably have an equivalent for when they are preparing to do something.

They can - Its called surprise.


As a DM, I reserve the right for the ambushing NPCs to fire a volley of arrows into the doorway when it opens.

Surprise. Combat starts when the PCs open the door. Initiative is rolled. As the PCs were unaware of the enemy on the other side of the door prior to opening it (and the DM devlaring the combat sequence has started), they cant act on turn one.

They get shot by the volley of arrows. Maybe if one of them had the Alert feat he might be able to duck for cover before getting shot (assuming a good enough initiative check).

If both sides were aware of each other, both sides are equally ready for combat. It then boils down to initiative.

[RickAllison]

They can - Its called surprise.



Surprise. Combat starts when the PCs open the door. Initiative is rolled. As the PCs were unaware of the enemy on the other side of the door prior to opening it (and the DM devlaring the combat sequence has started), they cant act on turn one.

They get shot by the volley of arrows. Maybe if one of them had the Alert feat he might be able to duck for cover before getting shot (assuming a good enough initiative check).

If both sides were aware of each other, both sides are equally ready for combat. It then boils down to initiative.

I don't think surprise covers it. Both sides can know the other group is on the other side of the door. They aren't evaluating the scene when the door is open, they are firing whenever it shows movement. You can attribute it to surprise, but you are decreasing the theatric opportunities in your games. A more open style rewards innovation and creates much more enjoyable games.

[Potato_Priest]

Forget ready action.

Just decide the Minotaur Suprises them. Then he gets the mice and attack.

This seems like the best thing to do in the scenario, because the effect is essentially the same. The players will have no time to react while the prepared minotaur charges them.

I still think that ready can be used out of combat, because otherwise it gives an incredible advantage in a combat-turned-peace-turned-combat to whomever starts it again, when the other side would presumably be well prepared.

[Cybren]

I don't think surprise covers it. Both sides can know the other group is on the other side of the door. They aren't evaluating the scene when the door is open, they are firing whenever it shows movement. You can attribute it to surprise, but you are decreasing the theatric opportunities in your games. A more open style rewards innovation and creates much more enjoyable games.

Yeah. The "readied actions only work in initiative" argument seems to hinge on initiative both being an abstraction of in game events and also a distinct event in and of itself.

While the mechanics of the ready action only function in initiative order the concept still has uses outside it- you're giving up other specific actions to do something contingent on something else. That has broad non-combat applicability, and while you can use initiative outside combat, non-combat scenes often don't have so many actors that that would be necessary.

[Malifice]

I don't think surprise covers it. Both sides can know the other group is on the other side of the door.

Two hostile sides, both aware of each other? Sounds like initiative time. Having a door between them doesnt matter. Why would it?

If your bad guys win they can use the ready action ready a shot for when a PC opens the door. If the PCs win, they get the door open as your bad guys scramble for their weapons and storm in and slay them.

If one of the sides is not aware of the other, its surprise. On round one your PCs can kick in the door, and slay everything in there on round 1 with impunity, or your Bad guys quietly ready bows.

Unaware PCs:

PC: I sneak up to the door.
DM: Roll your Stealth mate.
PC: (rolls) 14.
DM: Rolls perception for the guards behind screen, scores a total of 15. Awesome. Now what?
PC: I listen at the door.
DM: Whats your perception bonus?
PC: +5
DM: Rolls behind his screen for the PC, rolling a 3 for a total of 8. Notes that the Guards Stealth check result was 12. (Bluffing) You rolled well! You hear nothing mate.
PC: OK; I open the door.
DM: On the other side of the door, are 3 Guards wih bows drawn, arrows nocked. They heard you! Roll initiative, you're surprised on round one.

Aware PCs:

PC: I listen at the door.
DM: Notes the PCs perception beats the stealth score of the Guards by 5; decides that this not only hears the guards, but gives some information on what they are doing as well You hear whispering on the other side of the door, and the sound of mail clad boots scraping on the cobblestones. You guess there are around 3-4 humanoids on the other side of the door. One of them is quietly directing the others to get their bows in the Common tongue. Roll initiative, both sides are aware of each other now.


They aren't evaluating the scene when the door is open, they are firing whenever it shows movement. You can attribute it to surprise, but you are decreasing the theatric opportunities in your games. A more open style rewards innovation and creates much more enjoyable games.

Actually, youre doing this. Youre arbitrarily awarding a side a free rounds worth of actions.

There is no need; the rules already allow for what you're describing.

[Contrast]

Nope. It increases your allowed movement. It doesn't include actually moving.

Normally, you can move up to your speed on your turn. The dash action allows you to gain extra movement equal to your speed for the current turn.

Seems to work perfectly fine as a readied action to me.

[Coffee_Dragon]

Normally, you can move up to your speed on your turn. The dash action allows you to gain extra movement equal to your speed for the current turn.

Seems to work perfectly fine as a readied action to me.

Ready allows you to take an action, or move your speed. If you take an action nothing says you also get access to a movement pool. No general right to move on other people's turns exists.

You could add a house rule to the tune of "If you gain movement when it's not your turn, you get to interrupt that turn and use it." But this would be pointless for Ready, since the option to move your speed already exists.

[Contrast]

Ready allows you to take an action, or move your speed. If you take an action nothing says you also get access to a movement pool. No general right to move on other people's turns exists.

You could add a house rule to the tune of "If you gain movement when it's not your turn, you get to interrupt that turn and use it." But this would be pointless for Ready, since the option to move your speed already exists.

Nothing except the text of the Dash action which I quoted with states that you get movement to use on the current turn?

Nothing says you can't move on someone elses turn. Normally you just don't have any movement available when its not your turn as the movement rules say you get your movement on your turn. The dash action gives you movement on the current turn which, with the use of a ready action, does not necessarily mean your turn.

Edit - Also to clarify there is a rules issue to preparing to dash as a readied action instead of movement. Lets say I move up to a door using all my movement and ready to dash when the door opens. Moving up and then readying to move isn't identical as I have used up some/all of my movement (per the movement rules saying you deduct distance from your move until you have none left or are done moving) and my speed is currently 0 or whatever reduced amount until it gets refreshed at the start of my next turn. That's my understanding anyway, happy to be corrected if you can point me to the relevant section in the rulebook.

Edit 2 - Hmm. Having read through and had another think about it maybe you are right though I still think you wouldn't be able to gain any movement still, only use whatever remaining move you had left. It also occurs to me you can escape someone with sentinel by taking the hit and then readying an action to run away when you see someone else move or attack as it only zeros your speed until the end of the turn rather than round. :smallbiggrin:

[Coffee_Dragon]

Nothing says you can't move on someone elses turn.

There would have to be a rule saying you can, and how it is done (such as using Ready to move your speed when your action triggers). In the absence of such a rule, you can't. The rules for movement in combat describe how you move on your turn. They don't describe a general case for moving on someone else's turn, so we don't even know how that would be handled.

[Hawkstar]

It would be handled the same way as any other off-turn action, except it's about movement. You get to move when your readied movement (Or movement-including action) triggers, repositioning your location on the battlefield up to the allotted speed.

[Coffee_Dragon]

It would be handled the same way as any other off-turn action, except it's about movement.

Is that just how you'd handle it, or do you mean there are rules saying that? I have seen no grounds for the latter.


You get to move when your readied movement (Or movement-including action) triggers, repositioning your location on the battlefield up to the allotted speed.

There is no dispute that this is what happens if you have chosen to move up to your speed in response to the trigger. That's because the rules for Ready explicitly say so. No general rules for off-turn movement are invoked or implied.

[Vogonjeltz]

See, I never got the complaint that all combatants would have an action readied. It only works if the person specifically readies an action. THere are weird corner cases, but readied actions do not help with an ambush (they would be surprised and so not have a reaction to spend to use it), they have to have a specific trigger (so yes, charging a defender who sees you coming is a bad idea as they can prepare to strike you. This is realistic) so they have no control over how the action goes without specifically setting an ambush with knowledge, and it allows for things that characters should realistically be able to do, like throwing a Fireball into a room as soon as a friend opens it. How would it cause everything to break down? Please explain it for me.

Initiative is to determine who recognizes a threat and acts first.

So, if you were like: I want to shoot the first person who comes through that door, before you are aware of a threat, it might be that the opponent sees you first and can react to your presence before you fire off the fireball.

The Ready action is basically contingent on you already having acted before another creature and being, in a literal sense, ready to respond to a thing they might do. If your reaction time is too slow (lower initiative) they get the drop on you.

As Mellack said, otherwise everyone's readied action would just be: Whatever I would do 6 seconds prior to seeing an enemy.
So it would defeat the sole purpose of initiative, to determine who acts and in what order.


I can see the arguments for not using the formalized Ready action outside of combat. I still think characters should be able to reasonably have an equivalent for when they are preparing to do something. As a DM, I reserve the right for the ambushing NPCs to fire a volley of arrows into the doorway when it opens. By that same token, the players should be able to throw a Fireball in with a preset destination. Settle debates with the initiative bonus.

Have the entire party use hide, if the enemy doesn't notice them as the door opens, and they win initiative, they get surprise.

Or just straight up say that, because the party planned for it before combat was happening, they get surprise on anyone whose initiative they beat.

Either way works fine.

Bleh, Malifice got it.


I don't think surprise covers it. Both sides can know the other group is on the other side of the door. They aren't evaluating the scene when the door is open, they are firing whenever it shows movement. You can attribute it to surprise, but you are decreasing the theatric opportunities in your games. A more open style rewards innovation and creates much more enjoyable games.

Initiative gets rolled as soon as the DM determines that opposing sides could notice each other. Meaning, if the players hear Orcs and want to combat, roll initiative (even if the Orcs don't hear the players in return). Then they can ready an action.

[RickAllison]

Initiative gets rolled as soon as the DM determines that opposing sides could notice each other. Meaning, if the players hear Orcs and want to combat, roll initiative (even if the Orcs don't hear the players in return). Then they can ready an action.

Okay, so rather than deciding that the Ready action cannot be taken outside of combat, the argument is that they have entered the timeframe of combat already. So rather than Ready being available outside of combat, Readying is entering combat structure and just using those rules. Which works, same essential result as Readying outside of combat other than already having intiative rolled.

[BeefGood]

Initiative gets rolled as soon as the DM determines that opposing sides could notice each other.
I'm not saying that this is wrong or that I disagree, but I don't think it's in the rulebooks. I don't think that the rulebooks tell you when to roll initiative. If I'm wrong please let me know!



Meaning, if the players hear Orcs and want to combat, roll initiative (even if the Orcs don't hear the players in return). Then they can ready an action.
OK, but what would the Orcs do? Because they are now in a state of combat--though they don't know it--they'd have to choose from the menu of actions. it seems weird to have one side be in combat and the other side is also in combat, but they don't realize it. Actually it's even weirder if you turn the situation around. The orcs are aware of the players, the players are not aware of the orcs. The orcs want to ready actions, so the DM tells everyone (orcs and players) to roll initiative. No, that would tip off the players that there's something going on. The DM rolls initiative for the orcs and the players. On the orcs' initiative, they ready their actions--okay. On the players' initiative counts, the DM tells them "you must choose from the combat options, but I won't tell you why." This is weird.

[Vogonjeltz]

I'm not saying that this is wrong or that I disagree, but I don't think it's in the rulebooks. I don't think that the rulebooks tell you when to roll initiative. If I'm wrong please let me know!


OK, but what would the Orcs do? Because they are now in a state of combat--though they don't know it--they'd have to choose from the menu of actions. it seems weird to have one side be in combat and the other side is also in combat, but they don't realize it. Actually it's even weirder if you turn the situation around. The orcs are aware of the players, the players are not aware of the orcs. The orcs want to ready actions, so the DM tells everyone (orcs and players) to roll initiative. No, that would tip off the players that there's something going on. The DM rolls initiative for the orcs and the players. On the orcs' initiative, they ready their actions--okay. On the players' initiative counts, the DM tells them "you must choose from the combat options, but I won't tell you why." This is weird.

Initiative rules are in the combat section of the PHB and the encounters section of the DMG.

[EvilAnagram]

It's a surprise attack. Use the surprise rules.

[BeefGood]

Initiative rules are in the combat section of the PHB and the encounters section of the DMG.

In the DMG, I didn't find a rule for when to roll initiative. I did see some variant ways to handle initiative.

PHB p. 189 it says something like this: When combat begins, participants roll Dexterity to determine their place in the initiative order.
This more or less implies that you roll initiative when combat begins. (Which is somewhat circular, seeing that Combat can be viewed as the-situation-governed-by-initiative.) If anyone can find anything clearer I would be much appreciative.

[Tanarii]

It's a surprise attack. Use the surprise rules.Agreed. That's what this is. An attempt to achieve surprise. It may or may not work.


In the DMG, I didn't find a rule for when to roll initiative. I did see some variant ways to handle initiative.

PHB p. 189 it says something like this: When combat begins, participants roll Dexterity to determine their place in the initiative order.
This more or less implies that you roll initiative when combat begins. (Which is somewhat circular, seeing that Combat can be viewed as the-situation-governed-by-initiative.) If anyone can find anything clearer I would be much appreciative.You've got it. Under Initiative, the PHB says to roll initiative when combat begins. You don't roll it before combat. You don't start combat without it.

Of course, defining when 'combat' has begun is somewhat nebulous. But generally speaking, if you're trying to take a combat related action, that's a pretty good indicator you're trying to initiate combat.

Vogonjeltz is technically not correct, in that an encounter can begin before the combat part of it begins. But be careful of doubling up on checks. In other words, there's already a stealth vs perception for surprise, so perception checks vs stealth to become aware of an enemy attempting to ambush are already handled. OTOH that doesn't mean there might not be a perception vs static DC check prior to that point if they enemy isn't trying to be stealthy just to notice them at long distance, which would then enable the choice to set up an ambush situation. (The latter probably wouldn't apply in the OP situation.)

Edit:
OK, but what would the Orcs do? Because they are now in a state of combat--though they don't know it--they'd have to choose from the menu of actions. it seems weird to have one side be in combat and the other side is also in combat, but they don't realize it. Actually it's even weirder if you turn the situation around. The orcs are aware of the players, the players are not aware of the orcs. The orcs want to ready actions, so the DM tells everyone (orcs and players) to roll initiative. No, that would tip off the players that there's something going on. The DM rolls initiative for the orcs and the players. On the orcs' initiative, they ready their actions--okay. On the players' initiative counts, the DM tells them "you must choose from the combat options, but I won't tell you why." This is weird.
The orcs attempt to sneak up on the PCs is handled by the surprise check. Combat is starting when they attack and give away their position. So the players will automatically be aware of any orc that doesn't choose to attack Hide. Those that don't attack still need to take the Hide action and make a Stealth vs Passive check on their turn not to give away their position. (IMO it'd totally make sense for the DM to rule the surprise check stealth check is the value of this stealth check, no extra roll needed.) If none of the orcs chose to attack take actions other than Hide, you shouldn't have started combat. For example if they take the Ready action, that's their surprise round action instead of the Hide action, so the PCs can respond appropriately on their turn.

[Vogonjeltz]

In the DMG, I didn't find a rule for when to roll initiative. I did see some variant ways to handle initiative.

PHB p. 189 it says something like this: When combat begins, participants roll Dexterity to determine their place in the initiative order.
This more or less implies that you roll initiative when combat begins. (Which is somewhat circular, seeing that Combat can be viewed as the-situation-governed-by-initiative.) If anyone can find anything clearer I would be much appreciative.

Yes, it's two parts together:
PHB 189, rules for combat writ large (initiative is step 3).
DMG 243, rules for noticing other creatures (which is what determines when the combat encounter begins).

Rolling initiative is step 3 of a combat encounter, step 1 is where the DM determines surprise, which is covered by the rules for noticing other creatures (DMG 243/PHB 189).

[coredump]

Taking a step back and looking at the rules, shows that Ready is meant as a short-term trigger action. It is a hyper-aware state with a 'hair' trigger waiting to happen. You just can't reliably keep this up for an extended time. In game, in combat, it lasts for at most 3-4 seconds. When you try and extend this to out of combat, you are assuming you can maintain this level of readiness for a lot longer.

Imagine a sprinter in his blocks, "On your marks" "Get Set"...now wait 25 seconds before saying "Go"..... its almost impossible to stay 'that' ready for that long.

Now, there is another mechanic that people tend to overlook that could be very helpful here..... advantage and/or disadvantage on the initiative roll.

If you are waiting for someone to enter the room, you may not get Surprise, but you still have an advantage.... you may not get a 'free' attack, but you are more likely to get the first attack.

[Vaz]

Within reason, I'd suggest not. This is a Skeleton. Not really within its intelligence profile i think.

[Cybren]

Within reason, I'd suggest not. This is a Skeleton. Not really within its intelligence profile i think.

Skeletons have INT 6. PCs using the default ability score generation method could have that score.

[Vaz]

Read 'Obedient Servants'.

"able to accomplish a variety of relatively complex tasks... Fight with weapons... Catapult... Siege ladders.... However must recieve careful instructions explaining how such tasks are accomplished."

Suggests otherwise. If they need careful instruction in how to climb a ladder, Readied Actions (especially considering 'Habitual Behaviours') seem a bit out of the ordinary considering its effects.

It is entirely under the concept of what readied action you are having it do. 'Charge whatever opens the door' is less complex than say 'Hold your attack until whatever is is using Blink returns'

Edit; wpuld also question a PC using overly cerebral tactics.

[Cybren]

I don't think anything a jungle cat or dog is capable of in a fight qualifies as overly cerebral

[Vaz]

Jungle Cats hold actions to attack Blinking Wizards. TIL.

[Cybren]

I'm speaking in the abstract to use ready at all, not the specific case. I agree with your assertion that there are limits to what is and isn't appopriate, I'm saying ready should not be taken off the table whole cloth

[Coffee_Dragon]

Within reason, I'd suggest not. This is a Skeleton. Not really within its intelligence profile i think.

Keep in mind that Ready is also a way for the game to model some "normal" sequences of events that wouldn't be possible in a strict "I go, you go" turn abstraction. Intelligence arguably doesn't enter into it because nobody in the game is thinking, "Hehe, I'm going to act off-turn, they'll never see that coming." It seems to me the OP is trying to model a quite simple action and just wondering what's the best way to do it mechanically (and here it wasn't Ready, but for other reasons).

[Vaz]

Suggests otherwise. If they need careful instruction in how to climb a ladder, Readied Actions (especially considering 'Habitual Behaviours') seem a bit out of the ordinary considering its effects.

It is entirely under the concept of what readied action you are having it do. 'Charge whatever opens the door' is less complex than say 'Hold your attack until whatever is is using Blink returns'

I appreciate that :) While I understand that they can use their weaponry, I'd be surprised if tactical nuance is something they'd manage without direct guidance.

I mean, It's DMs purview. Yes monsters can ready.

I'm questioning of a Skeleton is capable of pulling off such actions without someone ordering them what to do.

[Coffee_Dragon]

A minotaur skeleton's generic to do list probably just contains the items "buy milk" and "charge people".

[Quickblade]

What you describe is an instruction( command) to attack anything that comes through the door, not a readied action. I believe an animated skeleton is incapable of free thought so can't have readied actions as this requires an intelligence beyond low level undead. Upon seeing an intruder surprise/ initiative rules start applying.

[Cybren]

What you describe is an instruction( command) to attack anything that comes through the door, not a readied action. I believe an animated skeleton is incapable of free thought so can't have readied actions as this requires an intelligence beyond low level undead. Upon seeing an intruder surprise/ initiative rules start applying.

again- they have an int of 6. PCs can have an int of 3 and still take readied actions. Animals tensing up and standing their ground ready to attack could very reasonably be resolved as having taken the readied action "pounce on the first thing that moves"

[Quickblade]

So you can have a readied action for an indefinite period of time then? Rubbish

[Vaz]

again- they have an int of 6. PCs can have an int of 3 and still take readied actions. Animals tensing up and standing their ground ready to attack could very reasonably be resolved as having taken the readied action "pounce on the first thing that moves"

Which completely ignores what the entry on the skeleton says, in that they require commands to fulfil complex actions like climb a ladder.

[Quickblade]

Humans are capable of free thought skeletons aren't. An animal ready to pounce on anything that moves cannot sustain this for long periods of time and is a natual procedure of attack not a readied action in my belief

[Potato_Priest]

So you can have a readied action for an indefinite period of time then? Rubbish

I think a skeleton could, if instructed to do so, given their mindless nature.

[Cybren]

Which completely ignores what the entry on the skeleton says, in that they require commands to fulfil complex actions like climb a ladder.

That is not at all what the entry for skeleton says.

[Vaz]

Um, yes it does.