Advice on the next moves for my level 4 Vengence Pallly

[Mikey P]

Pretty much what the title says... Var. Human, rolled beautiful stats...
16-16-16-13-13-16

Just reached Level 4. Probably will wait until 6th to multiclass, unless I get better advice in this thread.

DM allowed me to take Tunnel Fighter for a fighting stye, and I took the feats Polearm Master and now Sentinel for the 4th level goodness.

I am strongly considering slipping in a pair of Warlock levels for devils sight, a short rest smite fun, and the notion of combining the reliable advantage of Vow of Enmity with a devastating volley of Eldritch blasts.

If I go that route, at level 8 he'll be Pally 6 / Warlock 2... Then decide if I want Pally 11 for improved smite, or if I'm crazy enough to go Sorcerer for Shield, more smites, and eventual meta-magic...


Advice?

[djreynolds]

You know 2-3 levels of bard, maybe 4. Could be worth it. Even just for Jack of all Trades

[Gignere]

Pretty much what the title says... Var. Human, rolled beautiful stats...
16-16-16-13-13-16

Just reached Level 4. Probably will wait until 6th to multiclass, unless I get better advice in this thread.

DM allowed me to take Tunnel Fighter for a fighting stye, and I took the feats Polearm Master and now Sentinel for the 4th level goodness.

I am strongly considering slipping in a pair of Warlock levels for devils sight, a short rest smite fun, and the notion of combining the reliable advantage of Vow of Enmity with a devastating volley of Eldritch blasts.

If I go that route, at level 8 he'll be Pally 6 / Warlock 2... Then decide if I want Pally 11 for improved smite, or if I'm crazy enough to go Sorcerer for Shield, more smites, and eventual meta-magic...


Advice?

Since your DM is allowing UA with tunnel fighter maybe he will allow Shadow Sorcerer. If it is available I would just go into Shadow Sorcerer after level 6. This will get you the darkness/see in darkness combo, you won't have short rest smites but you will have more spell slots and access to meta magic..

[gfishfunk]

Definitely hit level 5 before multiclassing to get in your second attack. Then grab fighter for that second fighting style. Of you have tunnel fighter, grab great weapon master. Vice versa.

[Arkhios]

You know, this could be a great chance to experiment with a naked Barbarian/Paladin! Your unarmored defense would be already at 16; not too shabby at all!

[Captain Panda]

After 6, realize that your ancestor was a dragon and go sorcerer to 20. Make sure to pick up green flame blade and booming blade, along with some fire and utility spells. Hit things twice, then quicken a green flame blade on them. :D

[Arkhios]

After 6, realize that your ancestor was a dragon and go sorcerer to 20. Make sure to pick up green flame blade and booming blade, along with some fire and utility spells. Hit things twice, then quicken a green flame blade on them. :D

Gold Dragon would be particularly paladinish for this, by the way. Seconded!

[Specter]

If you're going for TunnelFighter and Sentinel, don't multiclassbefore level 7. That oath ability is pretty much tailor-made for abusing that.

[Mikey P]

After 6, realize that your ancestor was a dragon and go sorcerer to 20. Make sure to pick up green flame blade and booming blade, along with some fire and utility spells. Hit things twice, then quicken a green flame blade on them. :D
The polearm build I have already has allot of competition for my bonus action and I would need to use metamagic just to GFB at reach... It has possibilities, but this seems more like a sword and board build choice.

You know, this could be a great chance to experiment with a naked Barbarian/Paladin! Your unarmored defense would be already at 16; not too shabby at all!

Give up my half plate AC 17 for unarmored AC 16... I don't know, Reckless Attack seems redundant with Vow of Enmity... And since I'm using a pole-arm, I can't add a shield to the mix to improve that...


If you're going for TunnelFighter and Sentinel, don't multiclassbefore level 7. That oath ability is pretty much tailor-made for abusing that.

Wouldn't movement force you to give up the benefits of the defensive stance? Seems like a lemon to me... Maybe I shouldn't try and insert logic into the way these traits work when things are not implicitly stated.

[Arkhios]

Give up my half plate AC 17 for unarmored AC 16... I don't know, Reckless Attack seems redundant with Vow of Enmity... And since I'm using a pole-arm, I can't add a shield to the mix to improve that...

Yes, I know how it seems. However, you seem to not see the big picture.

Reckless attack is not redundant, you can use it whenever you want. Vow of Enmity is usable only once per rest and lasts for 1 minute. While in theory it might seem ok to have a short rest after each fight, in practice a short rest takes 1 hour by default, and it's more likely you'll have more than one encounter between rests. Use Vow of Enmity in one, and reckless attack when VoE is unavailable.

Increasing con to 18 you could have same AC as with half-plate, and with con 20 you'd have AC equal to Plate (and an impressive amount of hit points), but since half-plate is medium, it works with rage, so you could just take Medium Armor Master for AC 18 in half-plate and forget the nakedness. The real treat of the deal is, however, Rage and the reduced damage you take if/when you're hit while raging. You can also use Divine Smite while raging, because it's not a spell. And, while not raging, you can increase your AC by casting Shield of Faith.

[Mikey P]

Yes, I know how it seems. However, you seem to not see the big picture.

Reckless attack is not redundant, you can use it whenever you want. Vow of Enmity is usable only once per rest and lasts for 1 minute. While in theory it might seem ok to have a short rest after each fight, in practice a short rest takes 1 hour by default, and it's more likely you'll have more than one encounter between rests. Use Vow of Enmity in one, and reckless attack when VoE is unavailable.

Increasing con to 18 you could have same AC as with half-plate, and with con 20 you'd have AC equal to Plate (and an impressive amount of hit points), but since half-plate is medium, it works with rage, so you could just take Medium Armor Master for AC 18 in half-plate and forget the nakedness. The real treat of the deal is, however, Rage and the reduced damage you take if/when you're hit while raging. You can also use Divine Smite while raging, because it's not a spell. And, while not raging, you can increase your AC by casting Shield of Faith.

I do not think that I missed "the big picture" as you put it, if the big picture is that Rage gives you some damage resistances. I am aware you can smite while raging. That alone does not point to allot of synergy with these classes... and pumping CON for AC when my primary class stats are all 16 seems crazy to me, especially when you factor in the likelihood of magic armor being found and rendering the "I caught up to if I actually wore armor" a fair distance form your magic plate AC. Also, I am not a fan of Reckless Attack, give absolutely all attack rolls against you advantage for having advantage yourself is not that good a deal, especially if you're naked and don't use a shield.

I think I would stick single class Paladin before going Barbarian.