Halfling Cleric

[ArrixGrimm]

It has been a long time since I have played a cleric, my last one being a melee powerhouse in a game that went to level 30....but now I am in a game based more around Roleplay.

I was looking to play a Cleric of Yondalla.

Race is Strong Heart Halfling.

As far as I know, no book is banned

Trying to get by without DMM

We rolled for stats, here are mine

Str: 16
Dex:13
Con:18
Int: 16
Wis:20
Cha:16

And Yes, I am aware my dice love me.

We start at Level 10

[ArrixGrimm]

My Current Build idea is Cleric 3/ Church Inquisitor 5/ Divine Oracle 2, but I have no idea if this is good or bad.

Our Party is a Spellsword, a bard, and a fighter.

[noce]

You have the chance to do something very flavourful here, although I don't know if you like that flavour for this character. Anyways, Halfling Whistler (http://archive.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/prc/20061121a) is a very nice prestige class.

You trade Ref for Fort, and you're down a bit on HD (but with your stats you don't care much). In exchange, you get flavour, SLAs and a lot of skill points. The capstone is hilariously good.

[ArrixGrimm]

Wow, that Capstone is amazing, and I do find it a bit funny though for my build. I was gonna be running around in Full Plate, the whistling just adds to the fun!

Though, how would I reach the Requirements as a Cleric?

[GilesTheCleric]

It looks like you want Church Inquisitor 5 in order to gain the immunity to compulsions? That's a good defense to have. However, you could also get it without a 5-level investment by instead keeping Mind Blank or Circle of Protection up. True Seeing will also give you the "pierce illusion" and "pierce disguise" features of the Church Inquisitor. That said, it does have more class features than the base Cleric, and you have enough int that investing in k(arcana) and k(religion) isn't a problem for you, so there's no reason not to take it. Divine Oracle is a great class, especially when you take it to 10. I do recommend prioritising Divine Oracle over Church Inquisitor (so Clr 3/ CI 2/ DO 5 to start).

What direction did you want to take your Cleric?

[ArrixGrimm]

I was thinking of Grabbing Zen Archery, as the idea of a ranged character in Full Plate is fun. I was going to go with a Sling, but there is no way to reload it as a free action. I was thinking of dropping CI to only 2 levels, as Charms tend to come up more in my groups games the compulsions, plus my Will save is pretty high already.

[GilesTheCleric]

Archery is always fun. How familiar are you with standard archery builds, and what op level is your table? Clerics are definitely very good at resisting mental control. And, don't forget that Protection/ Magic Circle will both also protect you from charm spells, and don't require any PrC investments.

I believe there's one or two item enchantments you could apply to your sling (IIRC, "Self-Loading" is one), but I'm AFB so I can't check for you right now. If you want to be cheeky, you could also instead just have 20-30 pre-loaded slings in your Ehlonna's Quiver/ Glove of Storing/ what-have-you, and then draw a new one for each iterative rather than reloading. Since you're probably enchanting the ammunition and not the slings in the first place, it doesn't matter if they're all mundane slings.

[ArrixGrimm]

I know a few of the archery feats, not all are to my liking and my Dex is to low for some. I did have an idea to use a morning star and heavy sheild, but our party is very melee heavy

[noce]

Though, how would I reach the Requirements as a Cleric?

Knowledge (nature) 8 ranks: this is the trickiest part. Here's a list of things that will do:


Cloisered Cleric gets every Knowledge skill as class skills
Knowledge Devotion feat gives you a Knowledge skill as class skill
Apprentice (woodsman) feat gives you both Knowledge (nature) and Survival as class skills
Education gives you every Knowledge skills as class skills
Yondalla doesn't give you access to them, but Animal and Plant Domains give you Knowledge (nature) as class skill

Any of those will work, depending if you prefer to go Cloistered or to use a feat. If you can get your hands on one of the domains, you're set.

If you get Knowledge (nature) as a class skill, you'll be level 5 by the time you spend 8 ranks in it.
In the meanwhile, putting 4 ranks in both Perform and Survival shouldn't be a problem, even if they're cross class for you.
Keep in mind that Apprentice (woodsman) gives you Survival too, and a minor Track feat. Also, you're allowed to immediately swap this feat with Mentor as soon as you hit level 5.

You also have to train an animal that chatters. This can be accomplished with Handle Animal on any bird.

[ArrixGrimm]

Very possible, I also need to know of feats, was going to take Zen archery and Yondalla sense

[GilesTheCleric]

Going into archery usually means getting some means of extra damage to your attacks, since the damage dealt by your x/bow doesn't scale well. For most folks, that means adding magic (eg. Splitting enchantment), extra dice (eg. sneak attack/ skirmish/ smite), multipliers (Power attack via IIRC Cragtop Archer (or was it Order of the Bow Initiate? I can't remember) You can also ask your GM for the pathfinder ranged power attack feat) or size increases so that you're using a larger weapon.


Yondalla doesn't give you access to them, but Animal and Plant Domains give you Knowledge (nature) as class skill

Actually, with all books allowed, Yondalla grants: Community, Courage, Creation, Family, Good, Halfling, Law, Mysticism, Plant, Protection.

CD 109, 119, DaD 58, 97, Drag283 39, PHB 32, 108, CW 148, RotW 51, FaP 141, FRCS 240, LGD 192, LGCS 11

[ArrixGrimm]

Sorry it took me so long get back to this, can only look at it during breaks at work. I figured for my weapons and armor I would go full plate, heavy sheild and then get a war sling with auto loading on it.

[ArrixGrimm]

Alright, so after giving it some thought I was thing of going Cleric 3/ Church Inquisitor 2/ Divine Oracle 2/ Halfling Whistler 3...Is this a good start?

[noce]

Alright, so after giving it some thought I was thing of going Cleric 3/ Church Inquisitor 2/ Divine Oracle 2/ Halfling Whistler 3...Is this a good start?

Two bonus domains, evasion, other goodness, and a very flavourful PRC. It seems good to me!

Just remember to buy a Headband of Conscious Effort for your fortitude saves ;)

[ArrixGrimm]

Two bonus domains, evasion, other goodness, and a very flavourful PRC. It seems good to me!

Just remember to buy a Headband of Conscious Effort for your fortitude saves ;)

Probably going to need something to boost reflex too, sadly getting Wis to reflex is next to impossible

[noce]

You could buy two rings of the Diamond Mind, from Tome of Battle, one with Action Before Thought and one with Mind Over Body. Each costs 3000 gp.

Basically, as an immediate action you can use concentration in place of reflex or fortitude, respectively.

[ArrixGrimm]

What is the refresh on those? Once per day?

[ArrixGrimm]

Well it was a tight squeeze with the skill points, but managed to get everything i needed and maxed out Concentration. Feels weird having skills points scattered around in different numbers

[noce]

What is the refresh on those? Once per day?

It's 1/encounter for characters not having levels in ToB classes. ;)


Well it was a tight squeeze with the skill points, but managed to get everything i needed and maxed out Concentration. Feels weird having skills points scattered around in different numbers

You'll catch up with 6+int. :D

[ArrixGrimm]

I hope so, now the real problem is...Fighting Style. I decided against going the Zen archery route as I just don;t have the dex to meet the requirements of the feats. I was thinking of going TWF since my BaB is so low, but again..no Dex..and we already have two sword and boards.

[noce]

I hope so, now the real problem is...Fighting Style. I decided against going the Zen archery route as I just don;t have the dex to meet the requirements of the feats. I was thinking of going TWF since my BaB is so low, but again..no Dex..and we already have two sword and boards.

I'd suggest you focusing on your spells instead of melee.
Battlefield control, buffs, debuffs, and the occasional Flame Strike.

[ArrixGrimm]

True, but I am not just going to stand there unarmed, even wizard and Sorcerers carry a dagger or staff. I am still clueless of feats, since most people just say "Grab DMM"

[ArrixGrimm]

Also, Since I have four Domains, should I look into the Spontaneous Domain ACF ?

Edit: Noticed that is only works for one domain

[noce]

True, but I am not just going to stand there unarmed, even wizard and Sorcerers carry a dagger or staff. I am still clueless of feats, since most people just say "Grab DMM"

DMM is not only for persisted buffs.
You could take Quicken Spell and DMM(quicken), for example, and cast two spells in a round when need be. I find DMM(quicken) a much more versatile choice than persist.

You're starting highish level anyway, so you shouldn't have troubles with spells per day.

Other good feats are Devotion feats from Complete Champion. Animal Devotion, for example, lets you fly in addition to other effects, and it also fits your character.

[ArrixGrimm]

Hmm, Might need to look into those. Also, I talked to my DM about taking Zen Archery. He said that I could use my Wis in place of Dex for the requirements for feats....and this also applies to feats such as Crossbow Sniper for damage.

[DEMON]

Going into archery usually means getting some means of extra damage to your attacks, since the damage dealt by your x/bow doesn't scale well. For most folks, that means adding magic (eg. Splitting enchantment), extra dice (eg. sneak attack/ skirmish/ smite), multipliers (Power attack via IIRC Cragtop Archer (or was it Order of the Bow Initiate? I can't remember) You can also ask your GM for the pathfinder ranged power attack feat) or size increases so that you're using a larger weapon.
CD 109, 119, DaD 58, 97, Drag283 39, PHB 32, 108, CW 148, RotW 51, FaP 141, FRCS 240, LGD 192, LGCS 11

Ranged PA is Peerless Archer (Silver Marches).

Knowledge Devotion and Holy Warrior are great ways to up your damage, but I don't suppose War domain is on the table.

[ArrixGrimm]

Nope, took Plant and Travel (DM allowed Travel) as my Domains, so no War. I do have Ranks in 4 knowledge Skills, Arcana, Religion, Nature and Local.

[GilesTheCleric]

True, but I am not just going to stand there unarmed, even wizard and Sorcerers carry a dagger or staff. I am still clueless of feats, since most people just say "Grab DMM"

Luckily if you have Persist (or even just extend), you can solve this with spells. Consider spells which grant you summoned weapons, including but not limited to:

Rainbow Drag321 68
Nails of Luthic Drag342 75
Beblith Blessing DotU
Fang Blade Drag330 71
Boneblade BoVD
Vile Lance SC
Stone Shape PHB
Ice Axe SC
Blade of Pain and Fear SC
Conjure Ice Object Fb
Sunmace Drag346 30
Ice Gauntlet SC

There's a few summoned weapons which grant you wis or cha to damage instead of str, but I can't remember them offhand. I do really recommend Rainbow if you're going for the ranged approach, though it's not too low-level. Ice Axe is a classic for good reason, and Vile Lance doesn't get much play around here, but I think it's underrated.

In terms of fighting, all you need is the "holy trinity" -- Divine Power, Righteous Wrath of the Faithful, and Righteous Might. There's lots of Cleric buffs that make the CoDzilla the CoDzilla, but these are the orthodox picks.

In terms of feats, there's so many decent ones that it's difficult to recommend specific ones. In my opinion, you should take whatever you think will make your character more fun. Clerics play just fine without any feats at all, so having them is gravy. If you want some more all-around suggestions, I have a Cleric Quick-Build guide (https://docs.google.com/document/d/11wxOmk4XSZOi_39LxlOVAff19bzq5bOzzkF7xv-uies/edit?usp=sharing) (WIP, let me know if you'd like to see changes). Dictum Mortuum also has a Cleric Archer guide (http://dictummortuum.blogspot.com/2011/08/quickstart-cleric-archer.html). Other than that, investing in the feat line for your chosen combat style/ PrC pre-reqs will probably eat up most of your feat slots.


Ranged PA is Peerless Archer (Silver Marches).

Thank you for the save!

[ArrixGrimm]

Thank you guys for the help, and I have almost finished with the character. For a weapon I decided to go with a Heavy Crossbow with the Precise and Quickloading enchants, along with a gnome Crossbow sight.

Feats are as followed:
Strong heart Bonus: Yondalla's Sense
1st: Skill Focus: Knowledge Religion
3rd: Zen Archery
6th: Weapon Focus
9th: Crossbow Sniper

For Crossbow Sniper, my DM is allowing Wis to Damage.

All there is left now is to figure out which spells are good to prepare and how to spend my last 9,000 gold.

[ArrixGrimm]

Other than that, investing in the feat line for your chosen combat style/ PrC pre-reqs will probably eat up most of your feat slots.

Actually, my only pre reqs feat was skill focus, so the rest of my feats to level 20 are open