your favorite monk multiclass?

[Absinthesize]

just wondering, i know in general a lot of people say multiclassing monk is bad as you lose out on things like ki points and such, but i imagine its not all bad if you consider its capstone nothing special really and some of the other later gains as well as a bit more flavor then substance.

my first thought it a druid, in pathfinder i made a gestalted (it was a rediculous campaign) of ape shaman and master of many styles dwarf monk. it was incredibly complicated to play. i dont really want to re-create the complication, but id love for some fun multiclass ideas!

[Nimlouth]

A) Rogue, because rogues... (Expertise and Sneak Attack)
B) Cleric/Druid becuse spellcasting and stuff, wild shape would be a waste tho.
C) Sorcerer. If you didn't dumpd charisma this can be really fun, specially with favored soul or draconic sorcerer. MAGE ARMOR/DRACONIC RESILIENCE + UNARMORED DEFENSE or is kind of valid (and OP) depending on the DM (Because rules are not clear, It could be interpreted like your AC becoming 13+DEX+WIS :3)

Rolling a monk with high WIS, high DEX, Decent CHA, normal CON, Dumping INT and STR would be perfect for monk/sorcerer. Powerful combo and also interesting to RP. "I follow de path of discipline and self illumination to control my inner power/gift." I imagine it could be an excellent Hermit.

[Absinthesize]

A) Rogue, because rogues... (Expertise and Sneak Attack)
B) Cleric/Druid becuse spellcasting and stuff, wild shape would be a waste tho.
C) Sorcerer. If you didn't dumpd charisma this can be really fun, specially with favored soul or draconic sorcerer. MAGE ARMOR/DRACONIC RESILIENCE + UNARMORED DEFENSE or is kind of valid (and OP) depending on the DM (Because rules are not clear, It could be interpreted like your AC becoming 13+DEX+WIS :3)

Rolling a monk with high WIS, high DEX, Decent CHA, normal CON, Dumping INT and STR would be perfect for monk/sorcerer. Powerful combo and also interesting to RP. "I follow de path of discipline and self illumination to control my inner power/gift." I imagine it could be an excellent Hermit.

that does sound cool! too bad wild shape isnt worth it.

[gfishfunk]

Cleric is best. Some healing spells, war cleric for some better fighting, etc.

Mage Armor, Unarmored Defense, and Draconic Resilience does not stack. They are each calculation methods. None say they add to defense.

[Absinthesize]

really mage armor doesnt stack with unarmored defense? seems odd, one is a fighting style the other is a magic spell.

[QUARE]

I found this build while researching Monks the other day. The build isn't optimized by any means and does require some cheese to be good, but it seems really fun.

http://beamfight.com/natures-fist-dd-5e/

[gfishfunk]

The source does not matter. Neither say "add this to your AC." Both instead provide formulas to calculate your AC. You can use either formula, but you cannot combine them.

For contrast, both the shield spell and the shield say they add to AC.

Sorry this is a little short of an explanation. Posting from my phone.

[Absinthesize]

The source does not matter. Neither say "add this to your AC." Both instead provide formulas to calculate your AC. You can use either formula, but you cannot combine them.

For contrast, both the shield spell and the shield say they add to AC.

Sorry this is a little short of an explanation. Posting from my phone.

no problem, if you have any ideas for a monk multiclass/dip that wont leave me gimped feel free to share when you get time!

[Naanomi]

We have a player doing monk/rogue/warlock of some sort that is working alright

[Absinthesize]

im curious if kensai (from the playtest) is as bad as multiclassing.

i know shadowmonk gets some mileage out of multiclassing because its not so ki dependant, i thought kensai didnt seem as ki dependant either.

[Foxhound438]

My favorites are:

shadow monk x / hunter ranger 3

After level 6 with the teleport, pick up 3 levels of hunter ranger (prefferably revised) for dueling style on your shortsword, hunter's mark for your multitude of attacks, and of course colossus slayer. Top end of monk is then opportunist; since it gives you an attack off of your turn, you have the possibility of getting an extra colossus slayer proc every round.


Sun soul x/ warlock 2

Sun soul gives you the great advantage of not needing to ever pick up mobile, and warlock adds damage through hex to your 4 laser beam attacks. It's possible to get away with warlock 1, but the extra spell slot gives a bit more longevity to it, and you can also pick up some invocations to help you out- feindinsh vigor for extra HP every fight comes to mind, as does devil's sight to get around lacking darkvision.

[tkuremento]

I like taking a dip Rogue 1 for Expertise Athletics for grappling. Taking a dip for Warlock as Shadow Monk for Devil's Sight can be pretty cool though, though personally I REALLY like combining all of that together for 13 Shadow Monk/1 Rogue/6 GOO Blade Warlock, taking One With The Shadows Invocation to literally become a Shadow Assassin. With the GOO level 1 you can also be a silent assassin but still communicate with people.

[Absinthesize]

cant help but feel like shadow monk rogue or shadow monk rogue/warlock has potential. tho the latter requires a CHA investment i imagine.

getting the impression outside of maybe a 1 level dip you dont want to multiclass with open hand.

[Naanomi]

cant help but feel like shadow monk rogue or shadow monk rogue/warlock has potential. tho the latter requires a CHA investment i imagine.

getting the impression outside of maybe a 1 level dip you dont want to multiclass with open hand.
Yeah I think the build they are going for in my group is... Monk 6/Warlock 2 (or 6?)/Rogue 12 (or 8?)... they are a half-Elf, and I know they dumped wisdom and use the Mage's armor incantation. Stats are something like 8/16/14/10/14/14?

[Sigreid]

I think the best is shadow monk and warlock 2 for devil's sight since shadow monk can generate darkness but can't see through the darkness they create.

[Quoxis]

This seems weird, but... barbarian.

"Ugh, but that doesn't have any synergy!" - It has, you just have to find it.

Start barbarian (as both kinds of unarmored defense are mutually exclusive and you won't be pushing your wisdom), put your highest stats in Str, Con, Dex (in this order), followed by Wisdom. Dump Cha and Int, you'll be a combat-only prodigy.
Then get monk levels and a few barbarian levels (most likely get up to monk 5 for extra attack asap, but that's up to you); barbarian will stay a dip, maybe just up to three levels. Feel free to take more if you want cool class features like the bonus movement etc.

You now have a guy with higher hp than a pure monk that has access to rage at least 2 times a day, attacks with strength instead of dexterity (which feels counter-intuitive to monks), and can profit from less damage taken while putting out +2 damage per attack that's made with str (and as a monk, you get so many attacks it actually matters, it's like a slightly weaker but more consistent version of hunter's mark/hex); you also have advantage when it comes to grappling and breaking out of grapples, but that's not the core concept.

The downsides:
Low Wisdom. You won't benefit from the wis oriented monk features, which might hurt.
Low AC. You won't be pumping up your DEX too much, so your AC will most likely start at something about 13-14 and slowly get higher, but not significantly. Remember though that you have more hp and resistence to most weapon damage (go bear for "i don't care what damage, i'll just take less of it"), so that hurts less than you might think now.

I played that build once at level 6, a level too low to make it truly shine, but it worked anyway.

For roleplay: Either go Bruce Banner - monk in his everyday life, but when he's getting mad, his rage combined with martial arts make him an unstoppable array of fists and death until he calms down - or fluff the rage to being drunk. The drunken fist style (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zui_quan) is something that really exists in chinese martial arts, and though irl it only copies a drunkard's movements, it was fun to chug down half a bottle of moonshine as a bonus action (=entering rage) and from then on hitting harder and feeling less pain while clubbing orcs to death with my fists of boozed-up stupor.

[Quoxis]

I think the best is shadow monk and warlock 2 for devil's sight since shadow monk can generate darkness but can't see through the darkness they create.

IMO that build is overrated, for a simple reason: YOU can attack freely in this 15ft radius cloud of darkness, but nobody else can - including your party, unless they are also warlocks. It takes out a lot of fun if you're the combat man slaying the enemy while the others are sitting outside the darkness idly playing with their thumbs until you're done.
Don'T get me wrong: It's awesome, but shouldn't be the common strategy you use for every fight.

[djreynolds]

Too true, our warlock does this repeatedly. "Now no one can see"

[Fishyninja]

My favorites are:

shadow monk x / hunter ranger 3

After level 6 with the teleport, pick up 3 levels of hunter ranger (prefferably revised) for dueling style on your shortsword, hunter's mark for your multitude of attacks, and of course colossus slayer. Top end of monk is then opportunist; since it gives you an attack off of your turn, you have the possibility of getting an extra colossus slayer proc every round.
This is my plan for my WOTLD Monk.

[kladams707]

I kind of like cleric. Not close to optimization for either class, but I like the idea of a wood-elf cleric running around the battlefield at greater speed to heal people, especially if the Mobile feat is available.

[djreynolds]

I kind of like cleric. Not close to optimization for either class, but I like the idea of a wood-elf cleric running around the battlefield at greater speed to heal people, especially if the Mobile feat is available.

I do like that as well. Maybe 3 thief for fast hands

I like open hand monk, with some hunter ranger and life cleric... very earthy feel and really helps give that wisdom some oomph.

[Solzak]

This seems weird, but... barbarian.

"Ugh, but that doesn't have any synergy!" - It has, you just have to find it.

I really like this combo, but I can't make it work. From my reading, barbarian rage only applies to melee weapon attacks, which the bonus monk attacks aren't....

If I've read it wrong please let me know, because it is the perfect combo from a Drunken Master style character!

[Citan]

just wondering, i know in general a lot of people say multiclassing monk is bad as you lose out on things like ki points and such, but i imagine its not all bad if you consider its capstone nothing special really and some of the other later gains as well as a bit more flavor then substance.

my first thought it a druid, in pathfinder i made a gestalted (it was a rediculous campaign) of ape shaman and master of many styles dwarf monk. it was incredibly complicated to play. i dont really want to re-create the complication, but id love for some fun multiclass ideas!
Hi!

For small dips, confer my answer in this thread: Best 1 level dip for a Monk (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showsinglepost.php?p=21702845&postcount=25).

For full builds, you have some interesting (some online early, some online very late) there, including my own suggestions: The Best Wisdom Gish (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showsinglepost.php?p=21719204&postcount=14).

For a direct answer, beyond the aforementioned suggestions in linked threads, I love...

The Assassin
Shadow Monk / Rogue (Assassin or Trickster): usually 13/7 or 14/6. Use Ki spells paired with Expertise to make your way, then strike and leave, without anyone noticing.

The Warlord
Requires DM allowance of UA for Spellless Ranger.
Battlemaster 3 / Spellless Hunter Ranger 3 / Life Cleric 1 / Druid 1 / Open Hand Monk 12: bolster your allies with Bless or Command enemies to drop, use anticipated Life Goodberries to sustain your troops out of fight, wreak havoc on battlefield with your Shillelagh and Flurry of Blows by shoving or stunning around. Can work with other Monk Ways if you want to keep Ki just for Stunning Strike anyways.

The One Who Never Dies
Tricky if you want to use all class features, works well if you dump either CHA or WIS and select features adapted to that. Also, requires DM authorization.
Shadow Sorcerer 3 / Long Death Monk 14 / Bear Barbarian 3. Usually, you will just survive with Monk's THP and occasional "bonus saving throw" from Sorcerer. In the end, for the biggest fight, you can stack Mirror Image + 18 AC + Rage resistance + THP + Sorcerer's save + Monk's save to avoid dropping to 0 hp.

The Pyromancer
4 Elements Monk 11 / Undying Light Warlock 1 / Draconic Sorcerer 6
Max CHA and DEX first, CON third, WIS last: start Sorcerer if you plan on using Hex/Haste in the end, otherwise who cares. Go Monk 5, then Warlock (Hex), then Sorcerer, finish Monk. You end with powerful short-rest Fireball (ki), short-rest Shield (Warlock), Green Flame Blade when you don't use your bonus action to attack, and bunch of long-rest buffs/debuffs for the biggest fights.

[tkuremento]

IMO that build is overrated, for a simple reason: YOU can attack freely in this 15ft radius cloud of darkness, but nobody else can - including your party, unless they are also warlocks. It takes out a lot of fun if you're the combat man slaying the enemy while the others are sitting outside the darkness idly playing with their thumbs until you're done.
Don'T get me wrong: It's awesome, but shouldn't be the common strategy you use for every fight.

I was thinking of being the guy who starts the battle. You shadow in there and then with the One With the Shadows invocation remain still until a guard comes around and then you go 200% on him.

[Sigreid]

IMO that build is overrated, for a simple reason: YOU can attack freely in this 15ft radius cloud of darkness, but nobody else can - including your party, unless they are also warlocks. It takes out a lot of fun if you're the combat man slaying the enemy while the others are sitting outside the darkness idly playing with their thumbs until you're done.
Don'T get me wrong: It's awesome, but shouldn't be the common strategy you use for every fight.

That depends on how you use your darkness. when fighting groups of enemies it allows you to separate a couple off from the main body to piece meal them while the rest of the party deals with the ones not in darkness.

[gfishfunk]

That depends on how you use your darkness. when fighting groups of enemies it allows you to separate a couple off from the main body to piece meal them while the rest of the party deals with the ones not in darkness.

This.

The only times I've used it, I opened combat by blasting out of magical darkness at folks, and drew in the melee enemies. Then my teammates best down the ranged enemies. Then I drilled darkness.

Very effective for splitting up a group.

[Quoxis]

I really like this combo, but I can't make it work. From my reading, barbarian rage only applies to melee weapon attacks, which the bonus monk attacks aren't....

If I've read it wrong please let me know, because it is the perfect combo from a Drunken Master style character!

It's an ago old point of conflict. RAW, your fists count as magic weapons at some point. RAI i don't see why rage makes you hit harder with your weapons, but not with your fists. Talk to your DM, as always when it comes down to this.

[tkuremento]

It's an ago old point of conflict. RAW, your fists count as magic weapons at some point. RAI i don't see why rage makes you hit harder with your weapons, but not with your fists. Talk to your DM, as always when it comes down to this.

http://media.wizards.com/2016/downloads/DND/SA-Compendium.pdf

"For example, an unarmed strike counts as a melee weapon attack, even though the attacker’s body isn’t considered a weapon."

[Solzak]

It's an ago old point of conflict. RAW, your fists count as magic weapons at some point. RAI i don't see why rage makes you hit harder with your weapons, but not with your fists. Talk to your DM, as always when it comes down to this.

I understand, but as it would be an Adventure League character I have to play with RAW :(

[coredump]

Unarmed strike is very explicitly stated as a melee weapon attack. Check the errata.
Does rage require a MWA, or does it require a weapon?

[djreynolds]

Rage damage bonus requires a strength based attack, most monks are going to be dex based.

But barbarian does offer rage itself, which is half-damage for 1 minute.

17 open hand monk/ 3 bear totem ain't too shabby

Yes you will not get the rage bonus if you are attacking with dexterity nor reckless attack... but resistance to all damage but psychic for a non-spell casting monk... that is good... that is worth it.

Monks fist are considered melee weapon attacks.. but most monks attacks will use dex

[Desamir]

Rage damage bonus requires a strength based attack, most monks are going to be dex based.

But barbarian does offer rage itself, which is half-damage for 1 minute.

17 open hand monk/ 3 bear totem ain't too shabby

Yes you will not get the rage bonus if you are attacking with dexterity nor reckless attack... but resistance to all damage but psychic for a non-spell casting monk... that is good... that is worth it.

Hmm, that doesn't really seem worth it. One more level of monk and you get Empty Body, which effectively gives you rage plus Greater Invisibility for 4 ki points.

[Quoxis]

Unarmed strike is very explicitly stated as a melee weapon attack. Check the errata.
Does rage require a MWA, or does it require a weapon?

To quote the PHB:
"When you make a melee weapon attack using Strength, you gain a bonus to the damage roll that increases as you gain levels as a barbarian, as shown in the Rage Damage column of the Barbarian table."

So by RAW and errata, you apply rage bonus damage to unarmed strikes as you make a melee weapon attack, with or without a melee weapon seems to be redundant.

[Quoxis]

Rage damage bonus requires a strength based attack, most monks are going to be dex based.

But barbarian does offer rage itself, which is half-damage for 1 minute.

17 open hand monk/ 3 bear totem ain't too shabby

Yes you will not get the rage bonus if you are attacking with dexterity nor reckless attack... but resistance to all damage but psychic for a non-spell casting monk... that is good... that is worth it.

Monks fist are considered melee weapon attacks.. but most monks attacks will use dex

As i said, go str. It's possible and the only downsides are MADness and lower AC.

[Quoxis]

Hmm, that doesn't really seem worth it. One more level of monk and you get Empty Body, which effectively gives you rage plus Greater Invisibility for 4 ki points.

It might not seem worth it at level 20, but if you start at the lower levels with 1 barb, then go 5-6 monk before taking more barbarian levels...?

[Spacehamster]

im curious if kensai (from the playtest) is as bad as multiclassing.

i know shadowmonk gets some mileage out of multiclassing because its not so ki dependant, i thought kensai didnt seem as ki dependant either.

Kensai is even good as a dip just to get DEX based heavy weapons. :) Like 12 Fighter 4 Kensai 4 Cleric or smthn.

[silveralen]

Rogue dipping monk for a little extra damage and some utility from shadow monk was a thing if I recall. Couldn't go full unarmed because of sneak attack, but shortsword is a monk weapon.

[Naanomi]

There were a few 'monk but still wear armor' builds floating around as well... I think they were Hill Dwarf/Nature Cleric with Monk levels in some ratio

[Lombra]

A single level rogue dip works wonders with the shadow monk (any monk actually)

[Serg515]

Hey so I’m building my first monk class and trying to go a little crazy. I’m basically going for a new badass ninja turtle lol. I picked turtle race covering my ac. I am going str monk way of shadow up to lv 10. Dipping 2 in barbarian for rage and reckless. Dipping 5 for rogue swashbuckler or assasin. Then hitting warlock for additional 5 for invocations and spell versatility. Figured I get good damage off str and unarmed, also benefiting from rage dam off 4 possible hits. On top off sneak dam and easily able to disengage and move when I have 45 movement or teleport to shadows??? Any thoughts or opinions?