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View Full Version : Player Help ST is a Friend - and a Poor ST



Kesnit
2017-02-20, 01:37 PM
I came again to a realization with my gaming group last night. (I say "again," because I realized the same thing this particular ST ran a game a few years ago.)

My gaming group are all friends outside of game.
JG: The host. Was the best man in my wedding. Went to school with VB. Is best friends with JE.
VB: The ST in question. Was the maid of honor in my wedding. Married to JE.
JE: VB's husband.
JH: Worked with my wife for several years.
KH: JE's sister.
LH: A long-time member of the group. Due to RL restrictions, she has had to back out of game temporarily.

The group (except KH, who just joined us) has been playing together for about 8 years. I played with them 8 years ago, then moved out of state for 3 years. When I came back, I picked up with them again. In that time, we've gone through several games in multiple systems. Right now, we are playing 2 games, both in the HERO system. JG runs the second game.

VB wanted to run a superheros game.
JG: A vampire based on Alucard.
JE: He can see and talk to ghosts. He is semi-possessed by the ghost of a 1920's hero with similarities to The Shadow, and uses that hero's old gear
JH: Ninja, who is suspected to be part demon
KH: The daughter of Zeus, and the only PC who does not have a secret identity
LH: Uses luck-based/curse magic, and has a cat who is also believed to be a demon.
Me: Former gang member who left the gang, and now has buffing/debuffing and healing powers.

VB has set up an interesting world, and the party has figured out how to work together. The only in-character drama is what would be expected, given the varying backgrounds and outlooks of the party. IC drama stays IC.

It hit me at our last game that VB is really bad at "the first rule of running a game" - ST plans only last until they encounter the players. My wife (who is not in this game, but was a member of the gaming group for a while) put it very well. "VB runs her games like she is writing a story. She has everything planned out. When the PCs don't do what she expects, she does not know how to react." She is also not very good at running with plot hooks provided by the players. (I gave her one at out last game - wanting to investigate if there are links between the criminal group we have been fighting and the major multi-national gangs like my PC used to be in. She wrote it down, then went on to what the next PC wants to investigate.) Although to her credit, she had given JH's ninja a plot hook at last game and the party moved on to that.

She gave JE (her husband) a major plot hook / character development previously, and all the NPCs are really into that. (The ghost he is possessed by worked out of the same field office we now work for. The True Fae who is the spirit of the office knew the ghost in life, and adored him.) VB also spends time in every game session RP-ing with KH (her sister in law) about KH's PC's latest advertising campaign/photo shoot/etc.

So far, the game is still fun (mostly). But I can see issues developing with the way she is running the game. I do not (currently) want to quit this game, as we are all friends, and I enjoy spending time with everyone. What I am looking for is some advise on how to stop my frustration before it gets to the point of me wanting to quit.

JeenLeen
2017-02-22, 04:58 PM
From what I'm reading, it sounds like your main fear is that some players are being shown favoritism, at least in the sense of more time in the spotlight. Is that right?
The 'telling a story and not reacting to surprises' bit is also alarming, but I don't see it too much in your post.

I think the general advice of talking to the ST, but trying to do so in a calm, rational "not blaming you" way. That last part can be hard, but it's important not to put the ST on the defensive. Maybe include statements like asking what you can do to invoke more plot hooks or if she has any ideas about your actions that could help.

Possibly also find some good forum posts on how to GM/ST and share them. It can be hard to share advice without seeming too critical, but I know I've welcomed what I've read, and I shared some posts here with a new DM (albeit not one whose group I was in) and he welcomed it.
She may honestly not realize what's happening or that it's a problem.

Also, I feel I should note that she might still incorporate your plot hook, or there might be good reasons the answer is (if it is) "nope, no connection to your old gang".

Kesnit
2017-02-23, 06:07 PM
From what I'm reading, it sounds like your main fear is that some players are being shown favoritism, at least in the sense of more time in the spotlight. Is that right?

In large part, yes. I can understand one or two PCs getting the spotlight for a game or two, then moving on to others for a while. Just as an example, here is what has happened in three recent game sessions...

SESSION 1
VB: So what does each of your PCs want to work on? Let's start with JE.
JE: I'd like to look into (event that happened in previous game)
VB: OK. (Story develops and we spend the rest of the session doing that).

SESSION 2
VB: Representatives from (in-world company that makes superhero costumes) are here to talk to you about what you want. Oh, and they think it would be a great idea if everyone had the same colors.
Me: (looking at the vampire across the table, who is a goth. Looks at the curse-based character whose magic - and costume - is purple. Looks at my character sheet, and my PC who gets his power from the Archangel Raphael.) Uh, I'm not sure that's going to work. JG is in black. LH is in purple, and I see my character in white and gold.
VB: (sad puppy)
The rest of the session was us discussing our costumes

SESSION 3
VB: OK (Me), since we started on the other side of the table before, what does your character want to look into?
Me: Well, since we're going up against what seems to be an international group, I want to look into if there are any connections between this group and the multi-national gang he used to run with.
VB: OK, how are you going to do that?
Me: Give me a minute.
VB: OK, we'll come back to you. KH, what does your character want to do.
KH: She's going to call her agent to see if there's any new advertising jobs.
VB and KH spend the next 30 minutes RP-ing the call to the agent and describing the commercial KH's character is in.
VB: OK, JH, now, what does your character want to do?
That's when we followed up on the (interesting) plot hook VB has provided him before, which took the rest of the session. Except she didn't take the PCs abilities into account when designing. We were approaching a village of ninja, so obviously there were traps. Deadly traps, that would kill most of the PCs if we had gotten unlucky. (JG did get hit by a trap, but has enough regen that he didn't die. Because it was a drain, not damage, my healing didn't help.)


I think the general advice of talking to the ST, but trying to do so in a calm, rational "not blaming you" way. That last part can be hard, but it's important not to put the ST on the defensive. Maybe include statements like asking what you can do to invoke more plot hooks or if she has any ideas about your actions that could help.

Putting it as "what can I do to make things work better for you" would probably help.


Possibly also find some good forum posts on how to GM/ST and share them. It can be hard to share advice without seeming too critical, but I know I've welcomed what I've read, and I shared some posts here with a new DM (albeit not one whose group I was in) and he welcomed it.

The major issue is that I am likely the only one who thinks VB is a poor ST. JE and KH are her family, and she has known JG for a really long time. JH is a friend, but not much of an RP-er, and does not do well when the spotlight is on him. If I did speak up, I'd be outvoted. (I'm actually a little worried about posting here, as I know JG reads these forums.)


Also, I feel I should note that she might still incorporate your plot hook, or there might be good reasons the answer is (if it is) "nope, no connection to your old gang".

To her credit, I did ask her to give me a moment to think of how to investigate if there are ties to my old gang, and she did move on to a pre-existing plot hook. She may come back to the gang connection once she has time to think how to do it. (But this comes back to "can't think on her feet" and run with things provided by players.)

dps
2017-02-25, 01:30 PM
Look at it this way: what if you had a friend who likes to cook, but isn't very good at it? Would you eat meals that the friend prepared for you anyway, for the sake of your friendship? (I'm assuming here that the friend's cooking is merely unappealing, not downright inedible or even poisonous.) If the answer is "Yes", you put up with the poor ST skills in the same manner; if the answer is "No" you beg out of playing in their game.

Honest Tiefling
2017-02-25, 01:48 PM
So...If I am reading this right, you have a husband, a best friend AND a sister-in-law of the ST. Can you talk to one of them about how to gently broach the issue? Heck, one of them saying "Hey, you're doing great, but I think it's time to focus on another character now." might nudge things to be a bit more fair. If they react badly, I'd start looking for a gentle excuse to get out of there.

(Also, uniforms, if done right, can have many colors. Go with a white/gold/purple/black theme. I believe in your ability to pull it off.)

Red Fel
2017-02-25, 09:21 PM
To be fair, "Nope" goes both ways. The costume example you gave is a good illustration - the ST came in with an idea, and you shut her down with, "I don't think that's going to work." True, that's not a plot hook aimed specifically at your character, but it doesn't exactly show your cooperative spirit either, is my point.

I'd suggest talking to her, as a friend and as a player who is still having fun. Acknowledge that perhaps you haven't been as receptive to her plot points, but suggest that maybe she should offer hooks to people other than those first two. She might surprise you and say that she has some in reserve, but hasn't gotten to them yet. Or she might not have even realized what she was doing, and try to fix things.

Do not do this during a session. Do not make this an "us versus you" thing. Be clear - this is all you. Everyone else is having fun. It's okay to have a personal concern. Own that. Be conversational, not confrontational about it; approach it from (as mentioned) a "how can I help" angle. It sounds like it hasn't become un-fun for you yet. Point out that you're still enjoying, you just want to help make it more enjoyable.

Bottom line, you have an ST who can't think on her feet. That's unlikely to change unless you're willing to find someone to tutor her on being more flexible. But if you discuss the problem in more detail, she may just plan out some things you might enjoy.