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Mongobear
2017-02-20, 04:05 PM
As the title says, I am wondering which of the existing D&D Demon Princes, Devil Lords, etc. are the most martially focused.

And by martially focused, I mean if they had class levels in a certain edition, the majority of them were in some flavor of fighter, barbarian or other similar "i make stuff dead with my sword" type of class. If hailing from an edition where monsters didnt really have class levels, which of them had the most comparatively strong weapon attacks or other abilities to make it so that their preferred form of combat was right up in the thick of it.

And I want to know the answer to be ACTUAL martial capabilities, not theoretical strength just because of access to higher level spells which can temporarily grant a combat boost. I'm looking for one of these beings which is likely to be at the forefront of the vanguard of a massive war, duels a dozen lesser demons at a time without breaking a sweat, or causes even the strongest Paladins to quiver in their boots when the thought of fighting them in a battle of steel crosses their minds.

TheCountAlucard
2017-02-20, 06:00 PM
Well, at least for D&D 3e, Demogorgon was the top demon prince in terms of direct fighting prowess; the ability to act independently twice a round would be pretty solid even divorced of his solid combat stats, flesh-rotting touch, or spellcasting.

As for the devils, Asmodeus is on the top, because of course he is.

Mongobear
2017-02-21, 02:04 PM
...Demogorgon...

...Asmodeus is on the top, because of course he is...

I mean, I should have expected this, but it's not what I actually was looking for.

I want the ones who are ACTUALLY highly focused in martial combat, not the ones who just so happen to be good at it simply because they're a super high challenge rating compared to the rest.

Sure, Demogorgon and Asmodeus are good at fighting because they're much stronger by comparison, but that doesn't mean their repertoire is actually focused on martial combat, they're just better at it due to the way BAB and stuff works in older editions.

I'm looking for the ones that are ACTUALLY story/fluff/built to be great warriors, fighters, militairy tacticians, etc. Like Grazzt has a huge greatsword that can bathe its victims in acid, Koetschimoge(not even gonna try and spell that right) is a literal Demonic Giant that is a hulking rage monster, Baphomet is a Berserk Minotaur Demon, Levistus seems to be fluffed and a master duelist, that sort of thing.

Which ones of the above, plus others I am obviously missing since there are so many would be the most focused on martial combat?

Red Fel
2017-02-21, 02:15 PM
Much as I'm a fan of Big A, I'm going to have to give you the D.

Dispater, that is. He has a class dedicated to him in BoVD which is pretty solidly martial, and includes:
All of the proficiencies
Attack bonuses
Rusting Grasp, Summon Monster (Erinyes only), Stoneskin, and Iron Body as (Sp) abilities
Attack and damage bonus, plus crit range expansion
With the exception of Rusting Grasp and Summon Monster, these abilities are solidly martial. The expanded crit range is a particularly unique option. Additionally, the 10-level PrC includes full BAB and good saves across the board. In short, it's pretty solid.

The whole premise? A stoic warrior in service to Dispater, the cold martial badass of the Pits.

Segev
2017-02-21, 02:25 PM
For Demon Princes, I have to stick with Demogorgan. He is all about beating things up with that three-headed flail of his, and his entire ruling style is "I'm biggest and strongest and I know who to hit, so make sure you're not high on that list!" Orcus might have a signature rod, and it might act as a mace, but he's more about the ritual magic and minionmancy than he is about personally wading in. Demogorgan is going to walk right in and attack you multiple times over.

He is the biggest and baddest in a martial contest.

Pronounceable
2017-02-21, 02:58 PM
all about beating things up with that three-headed flail of his
Except that's Yeenoghu. Other than that, yes, DoubleD and Asmo are the biggest baddies of lower planes on account of ridiculously high cr. That's what happens when we bring mechanics and stats into it, this is how DnD works.

I'm guessing our poster here is more interested in the martial warriory themes instead of silly numbers. So what we got for that is good ol' Bel. He might be a lightweight far as bigname fiends go but his whole thing is fighting the Blood War and is the guy when you're looking for warriorness. He even ascended on martial prowess. Strangely Abyssal princes are all about corruption and scheming, even the most savage and beastly ones like Yeenoghu and Baphomet do a whole bunch of underhanded skullduggery to increase their power.

TheCountAlucard
2017-02-21, 03:14 PM
You say that like underhandedness can't be something a military takes part in; skullduggery is absolutely a part of good strategy.

Segev
2017-02-21, 03:22 PM
Except that's Yeenoghu.

You're quite right. Curse my memory and failure to have read my 1e monster manual in years. (I know, he's in 3.5e too, but I don't even know what book that version of him is in.)

So I revise my statement: Yeenoghu is the most martially-focused demon prince.

Coventry
2017-02-21, 10:20 PM
I have to put in a vote for the big hammer wielding thug: Kostchtchie.

Mongobear
2017-02-21, 11:55 PM
Koetschimoge(not even gonna try and spell that right) is a literal Demonic Giant that is a hulking rage monster


I have to put in a vote for the big hammer wielding thug: Kostchtchie.

I guess I get like, a C+ for effort? Sort of have a few of the right letters, and a whole bunch of the wrong ones too.

Kane0
2017-02-22, 01:22 AM
I'm going to be slightly unorthodox for Archdevils and choose Levistus.
According to the lore he was a duelist first and foremost, unlike those like Dospater and Mephistopheles that have neat powers that happen to add into their melee prowess. Levistus was locked in ice because that was the harshest punishment big A could hand out aside from demotion or destruction, knowing full well that Levy had comparatively little that could be leveraged while immobile, unlike the lords of other layers.

Eldan
2017-02-22, 01:44 AM
I'm going to be slightly unorthodox for Archdevils and choose Levistus.
According to the lore he was a duelist first and foremost, unlike those like Dospater and Mephistopheles that have neat powers that happen to add into their melee prowess. Levistus was locked in ice because that was the harshest punishment big A could hand out aside from demotion or destruction, knowing full well that Levy had comparatively little that could be leveraged while immobile, unlike the lords of other layers.

Levistus absolutely for hand to hand combat.
Bel for strategy.
Tiamat has been named lord of the first too, in some publications. I'd give it to her for sheer physical migth.

For demon lords, it's hard to say. Almost all of them have some physical strength component. Baphomet, Yeenoghu and Kostchtchie (wow, that spelling) are all up there.