Making Harry Dresden

[digiman619]

For my own edification, could someone help me build Harry Dresden, circa Dead Beat, using Pathfinder? 3rd party is fine, but I'd like some idea on how best to make him.

[Lord Raziere]

I'd use Spheres of Power.

choose Thaumaturge as his class, Charisma or Wisdom as casting stat because he is both, his smarts are more about street smarts or being a likable personality as well as convincing people to go along with what he has in mind rather than straight book smarts.

Mostly go into the Destruction and Divination Spheres, some Protection Sphere as well.

try to give him the following skills:
Diplomacy, Intimidate, Spellcraft, Use Magic Device, Sense Motive, Knowledges relating to his job (Arcana probably), perhaps Profession (Private Eye), and that'll probably model him well.

[stack]

SoP is best here.

Thaumaturge, of course, because Harry Wears himself out by overcharging his spells and has a fairly limited set of abilities.

Focus casting drawback modified to have different focuses for different spheres (and for destruction even for talents within a sphere sometimes). Ritual master feat for his non-combat stuff (using a bit of blood or hair to divine direction plays out more like a ritual or incantation in there series. Verbal and somatic drawbacks too. Custom drawback for screwing with tech in a modern setting. Maybe overcharge boon?

Destruction (fire blast) is tied to the blasting rod. Soulfire feat or soulfire master archetype help simulate hellfire/soulfire. Because I totally did not get the idea for that from the series.

Forzare is trickier, since the wind can do some limited fine manipulation but also push great distances. Telekinesis or air blast, though the first gives more capability and the later lacks fine control, but either way those are tied to his staff.

Protection for barrier, tied to bracelet.

Rings are a magic item (based on air blast most likely), as is the duster (deflection AC since it helps against firearms, maybe DR).

Second Sight is more like a feat or special racial or class ability really, but could use divination for that. Dresdenverse wizards seem to have a template, so maybe grant that and the healing/longevity that way.

Earth magic he uses in one scene is probably an incantation since it is slow and he never does it again. Opening portals to the Nevernever is probably also a ritual or incantation.

Why yes, I was reading the series when I discovered SoP, why do you ask?

[CharonsHelper]

Earth magic he uses in one scene is probably an incantation since it is slow and he never does it again.

I'll just pop in to say that in addition to book 12, he used a smaller version of that move before that in a short story when he had snuck up on something and had time to use it.

[Eldonauran]

Probably make a case for the Occultist from Occult Adventures. It fits thematically but does not exactly mimic all of his abilities.

[khadgar567]

sop is for his magic but occultist is nearly perfect for his core mechanics so what you want basicly spheres of power version of occultist to build dresden for all of his glory

[digiman619]

SoP is best here.

Thaumaturge, of course, because Harry Wears himself out by overcharging his spells and has a fairly limited set of abilities.

Focus casting drawback modified to have different focuses for different spheres (and for destruction even for talents within a sphere sometimes). Ritual master feat for his non-combat stuff (using a bit of blood or hair to divine direction plays out more like a ritual or incantation in there series. Verbal and somatic drawbacks too. Custom drawback for screwing with tech in a modern setting. Maybe overcharge boon?

Destruction (fire blast) is tied to the blasting rod. Soulfire feat or soulfire master archetype help simulate hellfire/soulfire. Because I totally did not get the idea for that from the series.

Forzare is trickier, since the wind can do some limited fine manipulation but also push great distances. Telekinesis or air blast, though the first gives more capability and the later lacks fine control, but either way those are tied to his staff.

Protection for barrier, tied to bracelet.

Rings are a magic item (based on air blast most likely), as is the duster (deflection AC since it helps against firearms, maybe DR).

Second Sight is more like a feat or special racial or class ability really, but could use divination for that. Dresdenverse wizards seem to have a template, so maybe grant that and the healing/longevity that way.

Earth magic he uses in one scene is probably an incantation since it is slow and he never does it again. Opening portals to the Nevernever is probably also a ritual or incantation.

Why yes, I was reading the series when I discovered SoP, why do you ask?
The Soulfire feat was kind of a hint, yes.


Probably make a case for the Occultist from Occult Adventures. It fits thematically but does not exactly mimic all of his abilities.

sop is for his magic but occultist is nearly perfect for his core mechanics so what you want basicly spheres of power version of occultist to build dresden for all of his glory
Good idea, but there's just one problem: There isn't a sphere archetype for the Occultist, at least not as far as I can see on the wiki.

Also, what level should Dead Beat era Dresden be? What level is he at the end of Skin Game (the most recent book)?

[khadgar567]

no direct change realy between zombie t rex and leading wild hunt he is kinda same power level with more careful control on his magic and fighting style

[Eldonauran]

On the Occultist note, I would suggest the Haunt Collector archetype, as it can fit the role of Harry's "assistant". Also, gets him access to the Medium spirits for the seance boon instead of implements resonance power (some of those are just asking to be replaced, Conjuration especially).

Otherwise, the Occultist gets 1/2 his level added to his UMD check. If we can determine some way of getting access to scrolls (and other items) we want reliably and cost efficiently, he can fit whatever gap you want.

[stack]

Harry doesn't seem to change much in terms of durability or overall power, though he probably picks up a few feats over the run of the books. Probably retrains brew potion since that stops showing up. Probably level 4 to 6 range?I would probably run the winter knight mantle as either a homebrew template. Cold resistance, ability to ignore fatigue and exhaustion, cold affinity (CL boost on cold effects and granting ice powers (blast types and more importantly the freeze ability from nature sphere)

[CharonsHelper]

Harry doesn't seem to change much in terms of durability or overall power, though he probably picks up a few feats over the run of the books. Probably retrains brew potion since that stops showing up. Probably level 4 to 6 range?[/SPOILER]

He used a few potions in book 12 - though it's pretty sporadic after the first few books.

I'd say that he definitely went up in power, especially over the first 3-5 books. Ex: In book 4 a single ghoul gives him a run for his money, but in book 9 he holds off a dozen or more, killing several in the course of the fight.

But really - Butcher's a great author (for Dresden - I didn't think much of his sword & horse series), but I don't think that he worries too much about having a consistent power level. He's generally powerful enough to make every fight a challenge - with some background fluff about how his power goes up/down with his emotions.

[Eldonauran]

with some background fluff about how his power goes up/down with his emotions.

This screams psychic spellcaster to me.

[Vhaidara]

The screams psychic spellcaster to me.

The problem is that a psychic caster gets hard shut down by emotions. Any fear effect STOPS psychic casting, while Dresden is known for channeling his emotions and fears to make his magic STRONGER. As such, psychic magic is actually a horrible analog for Dresden

[Fizban]

Dresden's power level changes based on a number of factors. He's definitely gained raw combat experience that's worth a significant number of levels in hp alone, but he's also gained and lost tools that make a huge impact on his spellcasting, as well as other abilities not neccesarily part of his class which could very well be added to or lost in the future. SoP is the only 3.p system that really has a chance of modeling it to my knowledge, since you basically need a sphere based system with a mana pool.

Worth noting for anyone unaware, that the Dresden Files RPG is White Wolf IIRC, very similar to Vampire and Mage and whatnot. Once you know a little about the willpower and spellcasting mechanics in those systems you can see it lining up with the style in the books all over the place.

[Eldonauran]

The problem is that a psychic caster gets hard shut down by emotions. Any fear effect STOPS psychic casting, while Dresden is known for channeling his emotions and fears to make his magic STRONGER. As such, psychic magic is actually a horrible analog for Dresden

Yes, well, there is always another way to look at it. Emotions are what drives psychic spellcasting. You have to be in 'the right state of mind' and have focused thoughts in order to achieve completion of a psychic spell. Losing control of your emotions (like being under the effects of an emotion spell) means you can't cast the magic, which matches what I've read (and/or remembered) from Harry's adventures. Someone charmed you? Well, you aren't in control at that point. It is only when you make your will save that you can do something.

Now, let's imagine that Harry's magic is based around BEING in a state of fear or some other emotion. Sure, someone without outside influence can pattern their mind into that state with willpower to cast the spell, but if his fear is REAL and matches the pattern needed for a particular spell, Harry seems to me to be the kind of guy that will use whatever tool he has on hand to resolve the situation. He is already in the state without needing to pattern his mind, so he spends that extra focus on shaping the spell, in turn becoming more in sync with the energies than normal and able to utilize them better than usual.

But, that is jut my opinion on the whole thing. Its not going to match his abilities as well as the Spheres of Power, but then SoP doesn't match it perfectly either.

[thorr-kan]

Worth noting for anyone unaware, that the Dresden Files RPG is White Wolf IIRC, very similar to Vampire and Mage and whatnot. Once you know a little about the willpower and spellcasting mechanics in those systems you can see it lining up with the style in the books all over the place.
Nope.

DFRPG is Fate, by Evil Hat. And they just released Dresden Files Accelerated, based on Fate Accelerated.

Forums at jim-butcher.com. Evil Hat has a small, but regular presence on the board.

[Pyromancer999]

There is the Silksworn Archetype to make the Occultist an Arcane spellcaster. Also gives you access to more schools earlier on, if psychic casting is a hangup.