So...L Red Dragon...and our party is about bingo on consumables...suggestions?

[Rerednaw]

Situation: party in enclosed area with lava and dissolving isles of rock.
Have to jump over lava as the areas crumble.
Every round save reflex 16 or fall prone.
Everyone make fort save or -2 to all (perm sickened state)
L4 human melee fighter.
L5 goliath barbarian melee
L6 human barbarian archer.
L5 human true necromancer
L6 human wizard (me)
L6 dragonfire adept. only flier in party.

npc 5th adept
npc 5th cleric (sun, healing)
npc ? orc barbarian. (ce hasn't stabbed us yet but not much help either)...all npcs do not fight.

Most characters save for the archer are not optimized.

No consumables such as potions of fire resistance, fly, not even alchemicals (save for me, I bought some). No healing save a few potions (no one bought wand of clw). Npc healer out of spells because no one picked up flight so several got hit by lava when they slipped/fell.

Because the dragonfire adept had to taxi 3 npcs she was out of the fight. Not her fault, other party members insisted on bringing 2 of them along and the third decided on her own to follow. She does carry a wondrous custom item of lesser vigor so if we have downtime we can heal. But shock in combat healing is no-go.

My character is the only one who has levelled from L1. By level 5 his total wealth was 300 gp. We finally came into wealth but then there wasn't anywhere to get gear. My wiz picked up crafting, but if he crafts each day the end of the world gets closer or another invasion hits, etc...so it has been a bit challenging. He typically gets 3 days every couple of months to craft.

After 3 waves of EL+2 encounters non stop we dashed into the tunnels to recover the macguffin. That's when we had 2 more waves of EL+2 in lava land.

And that's where the dragon was. The archer immediately shot at it, and the necromancer use spectral hand to inflict wounds.

My wiz is out of spells because he blew his slots dealing with the previous encounters and by summoning flyers to ferry the PCs back and forth. Didn't have enough to get everyone, hence the jumps and bellyflops into lava.

So how would you fight this beast? I am thinking withdrawl is the best option. The dragon is chained but his can easily reach the entire cavern with his 8d10 breath (assuming theDM didn't bump him up which he likes to do with monsters). If we can find a good snipe point our archer could whittle him down I suppose. The DFA could risk a few flyby attacks since she has cold breath weapons.

Normally by this level my casters pick up energy resist but since spells are not available I have been getting other spells (glitterdust, etc) first on level ups with situational buff spells as a 'wish list'.

Any suggestions welcome.

[Zanos]

Party is depleted, underequiped and split up in unfavorable terrain against a monster with significantly higher CR than the average party level. And it's a dragon to boot with a breath weapon that could easily one shot some of your party members.

Yeah, I would run.

[OldTrees1]

Did you mention the Dragon was chained?

I agree with Zanos, do not fight the dragon in your condition.

[Calthropstu]

Remember, you don't have to outrun the dragon, just outrun everyone else.

[Malroth]

No level six should be responsible for world ending prophecies wither he crafts or not. This is starting to sound like a bad DM getting off torturing his players, if this continues to be a problem an out of character discussion or leaving the group might become the better option.

[weckar]

So your party initiated combat but were severely outgunned from round 1?

...

Parley?

[Starbuck_II]

Situation: party in enclosed area with lava and dissolving isles of rock.
Have to jump over lava as the areas crumble.
Every round save reflex 16 or fall prone.
Everyone make fort save or -2 to all (perm sickened state)
L4 human melee fighter.
L5 goliath barbarian melee
L6 human barbarian archer.
L5 human true necromancer
L6 human wizard (me)
L6 dragonfire adept. only flier in party.

npc 5th adept
npc 5th cleric (sun, healing)
npc ? orc barbarian. (ce hasn't stabbed us yet but not much help either)...all npcs do not fight.

Most characters save for the archer are not optimized.

No consumables such as potions of fire resistance, fly, not even alchemicals (save for me, I bought some). No healing save a few potions (no one bought wand of clw). Npc healer out of spells because no one picked up flight so several got hit by lava when they slipped/fell.

Because the dragonfire adept had to taxi 3 npcs she was out of the fight. Not her fault, other party members insisted on bringing 2 of them along and the third decided on her own to follow. She does carry a wondrous custom item of lesser vigor so if we have downtime we can heal. But shock in combat healing is no-go.

My character is the only one who has levelled from L1. By level 5 his total wealth was 300 gp. We finally came into wealth but then there wasn't anywhere to get gear. My wiz picked up crafting, but if he crafts each day the end of the world gets closer or another invasion hits, etc...so it has been a bit challenging. He typically gets 3 days every couple of months to craft.

After 3 waves of EL+2 encounters non stop we dashed into the tunnels to recover the macguffin. That's when we had 2 more waves of EL+2 in lava land.

And that's where the dragon was. The archer immediately shot at it, and the necromancer use spectral hand to inflict wounds.

My wiz is out of spells because he blew his slots dealing with the previous encounters and by summoning flyers to ferry the PCs back and forth. Didn't have enough to get everyone, hence the jumps and bellyflops into lava.

So how would you fight this beast? I am thinking withdrawl is the best option. The dragon is chained but his can easily reach the entire cavern with his 8d10 breath (assuming theDM didn't bump him up which he likes to do with monsters). If we can find a good snipe point our archer could whittle him down I suppose. The DFA could risk a few flyby attacks since she has cold breath weapons.

Normally by this level my casters pick up energy resist but since spells are not available I have been getting other spells (glitterdust, etc) first on level ups with situational buff spells as a 'wish list'.

Any suggestions welcome.

Um, if wizard out of spell slots, how were you planning to leave?
But yeah, sniping might be only shot I see safely.

[ATHATH]

If one of you has access to both Shivering Touch and Spectral Hand, you could do the classic "one-shot a dragon" trick.

You might have to escape and re-prepare spell slots, though. I recommend pretending to ally with the dragon, then backstabbing it.

[Rerednaw]

Did you mention the Dragon was chained?

I agree with Zanos, do not fight the dragon in your condition.

Yup hence the options of try to snipe outside his range...or withdraw.

FYI we were 'teleported' here via a one-way portal...when we arrived we saw that the way back had been destroyed (think 'Stargate SG-1 when the team arrived and found the gate dialer had been kaput) so while we can withdraw...we're still inside a volcano. The other option is to press on...and face the evil overlords that defeated and bound the dragon.

It's cool we all have alts ready. Just about everyone in the party has died at least once and brought in a new character, some are already on their third one. Kind of reminds me of the halcyon days of Paranoia! :smallsmile:

Update: I thought about talking with the dragon and even though my wizard is not a diplomat we managed to talk our way past it. I thought it was over when as I mentioned 2 in the party immediately tried to trigger a fight. Yes no one in the party is a face. The three high-cha characters were all killed (priest, rogue, sorcerer) before and the players re-rolled into different classes.

[theasl]

So these are already wildly inappropriately high CR encounters, and your DM has a propensity of buffing them? With unoptimized PCs and crafting all but forbidden?

I agree with Malroth, I would talk to them and refuse to play until that's sorted out...

[Blu]

So these are already wildly inappropriately high CR encounters, and your DM has a propensity of buffing them? With unoptimized PCs and crafting all but forbidden?

I agree with Malroth, I would talk to them and refuse to play until that's sorted out...

Normally comes served with railroad plot that low level characters must hurry to save the world and barely have time to breathe.

On the serious side. Dude, a very hard and challenging campaign is fun, a visceral one where at least 1 characters dies every two or so tables is not. You should definitly talk to your DM to tone down or give you guys more resources and time.

[TheifofZ]

At first, when I saw the thread title, I expected to see mention of 8th~ level characters and some decent preparation for an actual dragon fight.
Instead, I see that everything is underleveled, there are a LOT of characters involved, and noone has anything remotely close to the right options for what is a legitimately difficult Boss style encounter when you're prepared and at the appropriate level.

Glad you managed to avoid the party wipe, but perhaps either talk to the party about solving problems with less 'Killing everything' and more talking, since that seems to be a thing, or talk to the DM about less 'horrifically killing everyone in the party at once' types of situations.

[Alcore]

Normally comes served with railroad plot that low level characters must hurry to save the world and barely have time to breathe.

On the serious side. Dude, a very hard and challenging campaign is fun, a visceral one where at least 1 characters dies every two or so tables is not. You should definitly talk to your DM to tone down or give you guys more resources and time.

Breathe? What is this thing "breathe" I don't recall doing such a thing.


I must echo the others; unless the DM really knows what he's doing to make a great story you might want to talk to him. I feel he is intentionally or unintentionally throwing you into a meat grinder.

[Blu]

Breathe? What is this thing "breathe" I don't recall doing such a thing.

It is only possible because it's a free action :smallbiggrin:

Oh, and not to mention the deadweight npc's that don't participate in combat but makes the party waste resources on them.

[Calthropstu]

Breathe? What is this thing "breathe" I don't recall doing such a thing.


I must echo the others; unless the DM really knows what he's doing to make a great story you might want to talk to him. I feel he is intentionally or unintentionally throwing you into a meat grinder.

Maybe he wants to make a PC meat pie? MMMM, delicious!

[Vizzerdrix]

If the DM isnt letting you use your feats, swap them out. A few reserve feats, or some metamagic would serve you a bit better.

Crafting feats are a tricky thing. Too strong if not monitored, worse than useless if not allowed to be used. Far better to have on someone who can do crafting while the party is sleeping, so long as they arent a caster (yes, they are bad on casters)

[Rerednaw]

Thanks all for the feedback and suggestions. DM allows any official 3.5 now. When I made my character he was allowing core only. My wiz through luck and strategy has been doing okay with several close calls.

I have thought about going darkside cheese but so far have resisted temptation. But after last week...going to consider and inquire about retraining options. If it takes game time though it is probably no-go.